It doesn't really say much because we wouldn't be playing with 10 if we hadn't signed him. I expect we'd be slightly worse off, but not to the extreme of finishing 12th
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Season Average Rating
- Appearances
- 38
- Goals
- 24
- Assists
- 3
- Yellow cards
- 9
- Status
Hoping he takes pity on us and stays another year. If ten hag get get us creating chances for him he could easily score 30 goals next season.
The only person embarrassed appears to be you. Excuses and stuttering in full flow. You do you.
If it appears that way to you then you either have to be completely illiterate or too far down the hole to let go of your truly twisted version of moral superiority. If you want to keep digging then suit yourself, I won't be replying since it will most likely get me banned.
Let's see one with Spurs without Kane
You could possibly do with a break from the Caf. By your ramblings it appears you’ve lost the plot.
They basically played half the season without him mate
It's funny isn't it, De Gea makes a couple of basic saves in a game like last weekend and it's "omg we would we be getting relegated without him" as if the alternative was playing with an open goal. Someone posts an actual league table of where we would be without the goals scored by Ronaldo and the responses are "not as if we'd be playing with 10". Place is ridiculous.
Fair point bruvs, could you knock up a visual and have it up by 5
Ronaldo, along with DDG, are the 2 names that go on the team sheet, for me.
I actually can't believe that a 37 yr old can play at the level that he does.
Nobody at our club had scored a hat trick for a long long time. This guy comes in and scores 2 in a single season while getting poor service.
If this guy had good service, it is quite possible that he'd finish top scorer in the EPL.
I actually can't believe that a 37 yr old can play at the level that he does.
Nobody at our club had scored a hat trick for a long long time. This guy comes in and scores 2 in a single season while getting poor service.
If this guy had good service, it is quite possible that he'd finish top scorer in the EPL.
This is the funniest shit I've seen in a while. This table is beyond moronic....
Applying the same logic:
Without Bowen, West Ham would sit on 35 points in 15th.
Without Kane and Son, Spurs would really struggle against relegation....
Without Benzema RM would be cruising midtable, just like Bayern would without Lewa.
It really wouldn't, but it would be better.
His 2 hattricks were great and his goal tally this season is impressive for a 37 year old, but the myth that he doesn't get service needs to die.
He's literally getting the 2nd best service in the league behind Salah. Second most shots per 90 and 3rd highest non penalty expected goals per 90 (Behind Jota and Salah). Miles ahead of every other player in every other club in the PL.
He's still among the best in the business when it comes to movement off the ball, positional/spacial awareness and getting into good scoring positions. His finishing is around average (up from horrible with the 2 hattricks) and his defensive contribution is horrible. The sum of his pres and cons is still a net negative for us.
Dont forget that Liverpool without their 1st XI would be relegated. Overlooked
Sorry! Forgot about that one. Even just without a couple of their attacking players they would struggle to be in any title contention.
Consistently the huge flaw in your argument.
If there was an alternative at the club or if he'd stopped us buying an alternative option, you could argue all day about his pros and cons.
But there isn't. There is literally nobody else. So to say he has a net negative impact is completely wrong.
Keller
Milner
Matip
Gomez
Tikimas
Ox
Henderson
Elliot
Jota
Firmino
Origi
Top half easily
Liverpool have done a good job of increasing the depth of quality in their squad, I wonder what their second XI would have looked like 2 or 3 seasons ago? Much weaker in my mind, though I may be wrong. Wrong thread maybe (definitely) but their key challenge now is how you go about replacing players who probably only have 1, 2 or at a push 3 seasons left at a very high level. It will be very, very expensive and with no guarantee of success.
But that is not how the table that was posted works. The table that was posted just takes out Ronaldo's goals and assumes no one in his place would score a single goal.
Going by the same logic, Liverpool without their first eleven would be sitting on zero points.
Is that Kasey or Helen in goal?
Either way, I don't think either of them is up to the rigours of premier league football anymore.
Technically incorrect, but you are right that those ‘what would have happened’ tables are ridiculous, other than showing if a particular team is reliant on a particular player who is not easily replaced. You finished second last year without Ronaldo, and pretty much every attacking player scored more then than they have this time. So the only valid question for me is does the benefit of Ronaldo’s goals outweigh the cost in terms of what the team used to do but no longer do. And a table will not answer that!
7/8 months ago there was plenty of options. Now there obviously isn't. With Rashford completely out of form, Martial gone, Greenwood gone and Cavani seeing no future here. So, yes, we're stuck with what we got.
It would be interesting to see how the season would have panned out with Cavani, Rashford, Martial and Greenwood rotating in that role all season. Greenwood would probably still be where he is now, but how Rashford, Martial and Cavani would have done is impossible to know. Pretty sure Martial wouldn't be playing in Spain now though.
It should be hard to argue against a claim that the dynamics in how we play has dramatically changed with him in the team. We were playing better and more dynamic football last season both in defensive and when attacking, and Varane/Sancho were nice strenghtening additions to the squad. We created more chances, we conceded fewer chances and our team performed better collectively. It's sad how a team and squad we reallly believed was good enough to really make a good challenge this season, now is completely rubbish......
I blaim the managers for making this happen, can't blaim Ronaldo for being Ronaldo (an older, slower and weaker version, but still). He's still a good striker, but not a good fit for us or any team that wants to win the ball back quickly after losing it or isn't already totally dominating every game.
That's not how that table works. There would be 0 players on the pitch for them.
Since earlier in the season?
its exactly how that table works. It’ll be like a ‘league table without Alisson’ and them taking out all his saves and changing them to goal conceded - not taking into account that his replacement would have saved some/most of them too.
Well he always try it from half chances too. He just doesn’t get quality service as compared to other top strikers in the game. And he is still easily the best outfield player we have this season, no matter how negative you want to paint it on him.
To be fair I think we’ve only managed to score less than 2 hattricks over past 5-6 years or so (excluding Ronaldo)
Yep. Only Martial from the post-lockdown session and Bruno against Leeds have scored hat tricks since Ferguson retired.
Edit: except Ronaldo, of course
I agree but there is a difference.
I'm assuming Liverpool have a somewhat adequate replacement for Alisson.
We have no such replacement for Ronaldo.
So while that table isn't correct because there would be another body there instead, I don’t think anyone believes that body would be any use whatsoever.
Except @troylocker who still thinks it would be interesting to see Martial/Rashford rotating there. Which to me is completely baffling. Martial has 5 league goals in two years and doesn't exactly have the hussle to make that drought worthwhile. Rashford since Jan 2021, about 8 league goals I think. Also lazy.
That's literally how people are trying to make out that De Gea is having a good season to be fair.
Indeed. But the post I originally said “nobody had scored a hat trick for a long long time”, which is not true.
He does get quality service: He sits 3rd in the League behind Salah and Jota in expected goals per 90.
He also contributes offensively with some nice 1-2s and other combinations every now and then.
The problem with using him as much as we have, is his lacking defensive contributions, the change in game dynamics playing a striker like him means and the predictability playing a striker like him means to our attacking plan. In short: We create fewer chances and concede more. What effect he's had on the rest of our attackers is unknown, but at least it's hard to say any of them have blossomed with him here.
We are losing to Liverpool and City by 4 goals without him on the pitch with some of our shitest performance, it doesn’t really matter whether he is having enough defensive contribution or not, we are still a joke in defending. It doesn’t make a difference in defending.
You can pull all the analytical stats you like to try to paint a picture of Ronaldo having lots of chances in this team. Truth is, we rarely create quality chances with our lack of structure and disjointed team play. Everyone who watch us played this season knows that, you can’t just use analytical stats to decide our level of quality in attack, you just have to see it in your own eyes in real matches to understand what quality means.
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Given the current situation it's reasonable to say that. But had we never signed him at all we could well be better off given how we performed last season without him.
Regardless of his future with the hag think it's fair ro say after all the agit we want through that he is one of our less demanding concerns, if at all.
While we wait to sign a young modern striker, who can also chase a ball, yes. I believe that was the original plan (Homegrown Greenwood and Cavani was also part of that plan). In general I'm very much against buying old stop gap players and even more against buying old players to be the main man and totally change our game to fit that player.
We came off 3rd and 2nd in the PL the last 2 seasons, now we must fight to secure top 6 and we have a 37 year old former goat who is a guaranteed starter when fit to lead the line. Our other attackers have all fallen off a cliff and we went from being a very attractive destination for any young ambitious striker to the opposite over night with this signing.
You are entitled to your opinion of course, but I can't see how you can make a case for us being at a better place with him than we were before we "impulse" signed him on the last day of the summer window.
Ronaldo is Ronaldo and I respect him and what he's achieved on the pitch, but the 37 year old version of him shouldn't be part of any top clubs future plans. That's a recipe for stagnation.
You really have a hard on for slagging off De Gea every thread you enter
The batterings we have received from Liverpool and City this season with and without him have all been totally depressing to watch. I'm not going to try to make a case there. We've looked disjointed, slow, weak, reactionary, we've made the simplest things look hard and like we've gone into those matches without the ability to follow a plan A, B or C.
I don't think we would have performed better over night by dropping Ronaldo, change in play and style takes time, but I think over a season we would be better as a team, than what we are now. I was very optimistic going into this season after signing Sancho and Varane.
Things are never just black or white though. Maybe Ronaldo can change too....
Me using numbers and analysing tools to make arguments about players and how we play doesn't mean I don't watch matches. I've also played 25 seasons of senior football as a striker, so I shouldn't be totally clueless there either. I believe I get just as frustated with our poor performances and as excited with Ronaldo's goals as the rest of you. I probably get more frustrated than you when I see Bruno sprinting past a walking Ronaldo, waving his arms in frustration over a missed pass, to start the pressing though....
Christ some of you nutters actually think he's the reason our play has gone off the rails don't you.
I mean criticism of his shooting is obviously valid but the rest is just absolute nonsense. Our players are underperforming all by themselves, i actually can't figure out how anyone could arrive at blaming their form on Ronaldo.
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