They're trying to pressure the government to allow them to play home and away, negotiating tactic, threatening to cancel the season?
Don't think it will work, but you never know with the clown show we have in charge these days.
Could they void the PL due to the Coronavirus? | No | Resuming June 17th
- Thread starter Tarrou
- Start date
They're trying to pressure the government to allow them to play home and away, negotiating tactic, threatening to cancel the season?
Don't think it will work, but you never know with the clown show we have in charge these days.
They won't be CL winners though.
What's interesting about some of the liverpool fans here is the seeming concentration on something United fans "have been saying", when 90% of us haven't. Yes most of us think it would be hilarious if Liverpool missed out on the league because of a force majeure, and of course we would laugh at you. However most United fans on here have really made the same argument again and again, similar to be fair to the scousers, for clarity I think this is what both sides have been saying.
Scousers:
1) We have to complete the league at all costs, including abandoning next season if necessary.
Whilst everyone agrees that finishing it is the best scenario, Liverpool fans (and many opposition fans) believe we want to void now to deny Liverpool, and whilst some of our support do want the league to be voided because it would stop Liverpool winning most people actually seem not too if it can be played. Liverpool fans have wanted to do this in the face of all other options at times. Its clear that that is not what the PL/FA thinks, yes they want to finish it any way they can, but not at the cost for example of next season.
2) If we can't complete the league then Liverpool should be given the title.
Liverpool fans, understandably believe that they should be given the title, even if the league is never restarted. Mainly because they are so far ahead. Again understandable logic, and they have often misquoted other leagues, the FA, opinion pieces, etc to justify it. This actually does seem to have some basis with the FA/PL who seem to agree that this season has to be awarded based on this years merit.
United Fans on the other hand:
1) If we can't complete the league it should be nulled and voided.
Early on, without any other league examples this seemed the only option. There seemed to be no other options that were fair, back then the options were seemingly:
a) Null and Void
b) PPG
c) as is
Uefa then came out and said that Europe next year had to be based on merit this year (leading to a lot of mouth frothing by our resident Scousers).
Most United fans didn't think b or c were valid ways to finish the league, and frankly most of us still don't. We could not see how relegating teams based on part of a season works. However the dutch league came along and said they would finish as is, no title and no relegations, assigning european spots on place. I think most of us felt this was the most reasonable solution, partly because it means everyone gets treated the same and relegating teams because of PPG/as is seems ridiculous.
2) If you have a title winner you have to apply the same logic through the leagues.
This was heavily argued against by a lot of scousers, most believed you could either just extend the league or not do relegations. Its starting to look like the PL and FA do not agree, for Liverpool to be given the title then we need to do relegations (which is at least consistent, and completely not what Liverpool fans thought would have to be done). This is what most United fans felt was a particularly bad idea, and most of us didn't believe that the FA would plump for this, I guess most of were actually burying our head in the sand over this. Handing Liverpool the title was always on the cards, again something most of us admitted seemed likely, but I think it seemed incredulous they would burn down for example Villa who could easily escape relegation.
This seems particularly nasty given that next season we are unlikely to see any attended games for a half a season. Villa in the EFL could go completely out of business based on PPG/as is seems to me amazing.
Scousers:
1) We have to complete the league at all costs, including abandoning next season if necessary.
Whilst everyone agrees that finishing it is the best scenario, Liverpool fans (and many opposition fans) believe we want to void now to deny Liverpool, and whilst some of our support do want the league to be voided because it would stop Liverpool winning most people actually seem not too if it can be played. Liverpool fans have wanted to do this in the face of all other options at times. Its clear that that is not what the PL/FA thinks, yes they want to finish it any way they can, but not at the cost for example of next season.
2) If we can't complete the league then Liverpool should be given the title.
Liverpool fans, understandably believe that they should be given the title, even if the league is never restarted. Mainly because they are so far ahead. Again understandable logic, and they have often misquoted other leagues, the FA, opinion pieces, etc to justify it. This actually does seem to have some basis with the FA/PL who seem to agree that this season has to be awarded based on this years merit.
United Fans on the other hand:
1) If we can't complete the league it should be nulled and voided.
Early on, without any other league examples this seemed the only option. There seemed to be no other options that were fair, back then the options were seemingly:
a) Null and Void
b) PPG
c) as is
Uefa then came out and said that Europe next year had to be based on merit this year (leading to a lot of mouth frothing by our resident Scousers).
Most United fans didn't think b or c were valid ways to finish the league, and frankly most of us still don't. We could not see how relegating teams based on part of a season works. However the dutch league came along and said they would finish as is, no title and no relegations, assigning european spots on place. I think most of us felt this was the most reasonable solution, partly because it means everyone gets treated the same and relegating teams because of PPG/as is seems ridiculous.
2) If you have a title winner you have to apply the same logic through the leagues.
This was heavily argued against by a lot of scousers, most believed you could either just extend the league or not do relegations. Its starting to look like the PL and FA do not agree, for Liverpool to be given the title then we need to do relegations (which is at least consistent, and completely not what Liverpool fans thought would have to be done). This is what most United fans felt was a particularly bad idea, and most of us didn't believe that the FA would plump for this, I guess most of were actually burying our head in the sand over this. Handing Liverpool the title was always on the cards, again something most of us admitted seemed likely, but I think it seemed incredulous they would burn down for example Villa who could easily escape relegation.
This seems particularly nasty given that next season we are unlikely to see any attended games for a half a season. Villa in the EFL could go completely out of business based on PPG/as is seems to me amazing.
I was acknowledging your humour. It actually made me laugh. Not every reply is a barbed jibe.
That's a fair summary I believe.
I've said from the start if they can think of a fair way to end the season now with winners, promotion, relegation across the board do it. What I don't agree with is some half baked idea of a half and half situation as that's not right. All in or all out.
""We have talked about four weeks of training but haven't agreed yet as we haven't agreed to go back to training yet.""
Even now, it is unlikely to be completed before July.
It seems to me the contingency, of curtailment, remains the most viable.
Even now, it is unlikely to be completed before July.
It seems to me the contingency, of curtailment, remains the most viable.
And among the big clubs, Chelsea, Arsenal and City have nothing substantial to gain from resuming either.
“Run out of money”
Only because it’s the Tories do I consider that. Anyone else would borrow what they need. The US are talking about borrowing trillions ffs
I suppose it will make things pretty easy for the strikers, if football returns and the opposing team's defenders have to maintain the requisite two metres of social distancing from them at all times. Marking at corners, in particular, will be hilarious.
Say clubs come to an agreement this week (they won't) and have three weeks training.. that's first week of June.
Lots of clubs have more than 9 games left, United and Chelsea 18/19 with full cup runs. Two games a week could see them to first/second week of August... which is when next season should start.
Ok, delay next season a bit. But can't delay too much as Euros now 2021 so have to end national seasons by May.
So some players would/could go from June 20 to May 22. Not great but international teams aren't bothered about losing star players for the Euros so they're not going to rest them... and while clubs may try to manage position slightly, they pay wages so reluctant to say to Pogba or Rashford or Martial, etc "you've been busy for your country, have a month off for the start of our 21/22 season".
Lots of parties (PL, other leagues, PFA, SKY, national teams) have differing priorities, lots of clubs within a league have differing priorities, then add health on top, then you have a ticking clock and a tight calendar.
The only way I can see it happening is losing national cup comps (this year and maybe next... boo) and/or cramming in games.
I'd say I can't see it but the desperation of a few people in the PL/media may drag football over the line. Well, something that resembles football as we knew it anyway.
Lots of clubs have more than 9 games left, United and Chelsea 18/19 with full cup runs. Two games a week could see them to first/second week of August... which is when next season should start.
Ok, delay next season a bit. But can't delay too much as Euros now 2021 so have to end national seasons by May.
So some players would/could go from June 20 to May 22. Not great but international teams aren't bothered about losing star players for the Euros so they're not going to rest them... and while clubs may try to manage position slightly, they pay wages so reluctant to say to Pogba or Rashford or Martial, etc "you've been busy for your country, have a month off for the start of our 21/22 season".
Lots of parties (PL, other leagues, PFA, SKY, national teams) have differing priorities, lots of clubs within a league have differing priorities, then add health on top, then you have a ticking clock and a tight calendar.
The only way I can see it happening is losing national cup comps (this year and maybe next... boo) and/or cramming in games.
I'd say I can't see it but the desperation of a few people in the PL/media may drag football over the line. Well, something that resembles football as we knew it anyway.
There’s no chance of European games been played.
The only teams that it really affects if the season ended now are the 3 at the bottom since the points and standings being null and voided are off the table. The teams looking for Europe might be upset but can live with it.
Don't most countries have a 2 week quarantine period for foreign travellers? There is no way European competitions are going to be played until air travel is safe.
Ditto for The Reebok (or whatever its called these days)
What about Sheff United? Spurs? Arsenal? United were in for two trophies and a European spot too. Plenty of winners and plenty of losers really. This is why isn't going to fall apart as no one will agree on anything.
I thought it was only being used as an excuse by clubs in the relegation zone?
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I mean, UEFA haven't voided their competitions yet, so until otherwise you're right to assume those games are going to be played.
They were looking at games in August.
I find it quite weird how UEFA have stated leagues must finish this season and not being void. I wonder what will happen if the CL and EL games cannot be played? will they award the CL and EL on sporting merit like they are asking leagues to do so?
I suppose that they could make the argument that with knockout tournaments, appointing a winner prior to completion of the competition, is more problematic than it is in a league format, particularly if one team has built up a significant lead over all others in the table.
Or not happy to risk their health to play football when their safety is not ensured.
I agree in the case of Liverpool but CL places? there is a very good chance that Manutd can catch Chelsea or even Leicester for the CL places, or even SU and Arsenal?
We still have a good part of 9 games to go. It is going to be a sticky one.
I agree that deciding on CL places and relegation, is fraught with difficulties. I don't know how they resolve it fairly, if football cannot be played.
CL it makes more sense to finish this one over starting the next. Not like a lgue in term sof amount of games.
If the UK introduces the 14 day quarantine period for all arrivals, then it effectively rules out any English clubs taking part anyway.
If they cancel the remainder of the FA cup and CL n EL but then still hand out league titles it is an absolute joke. It's either the full season or no season. You can't pick and choose which to prioritise. Like for example with Liverpool so far ahead in the league that's their focus whilst United and City have their eyes on the cups.
Why?
How do you even begin to work that out? Part of the reason why knock out football is so popular is because of its unpredictability. No team can lay valid claim to the whereabouts they'd likely get to a cup tournament.
If it can't be played, it would have to be cancelled or played as a sort of pre-season friendly cup.
*Edit - Actually, I quite like the idea of clubs in these tournaments cancelling pre-season tours in favour of playing Europa/Champions League out instead.
Would you want the league cup taken off City then?
I can't see any reason to cancel the FA Cup, but I do think it will be difficult to finish the European competions due to travel restrictions.
The only way I can see them doing it is if they play out the remaining games in one country at a neutral venue?
Logic says that the CL won’t happen next season . Imagine the most prestigious football event happening with no fans? That’s not even thinking about travel restrictions, quarantines and the like
Look at what happened those poor Spanish fans that came to Liverpool, got sick and went home to infect the rest of Europe.
What if we tell Liverpool you can have the prize money and title is void or you can have the title but you don't get any prize money at all?
Why would that happen? That Competition was played to its completion. Yes it is within this Season, but it got finished.
The other Competitions are ongoing and not complete.
I love it.
What if we tell them "how about we give you nothing and you STFU"
FA cups are the easiest, it's an easy void since there's majority of it aren't even played yet.
A final between A and B is an easy void, because statistically speaking it's a 50-50 chance
A final between A and B is an easy void, because statistically speaking it's a 50-50 chance
Aaaaaand so it begins.
They could probably play a one off game. It's rounds and rounds of games that's the issue
Because the poster seemed to be arguing that different competitions run by different organisations are some how inextricably intertwined and you can't finish one without the other. Which makes no sense, if Europe can't be finished how does that have any relevancy to the league season being finished. And if you're arguing that than surely you're arguing that City's cup run isn't valid because the tournaments it occurs around haven't been completed.
Note: I do believe every competition should be completed, especially because Europe can be held back longer than the league can. However the idea that if one can't finish we should necessarily end all of them is a bit of stretch.