Could they void the PL due to the Coronavirus? | No | Resuming June 17th

[Deleted 112447]

Regarding the "the French have cancelled the league so the PL should follow suit" point, key is the fact that France banned all sporting events until September where the UK haven't. The argument is being made that cancelling the league has to be government-led, else the PL leaves itself open to potential liabilities for cancelling the league before it was actually necessary to do so. It is more difficult for them to act when the UK government's position is that it could potentially still go ahead.

That makes sense. It could be contract issues rather then them being clueless, the FA i mean. Not sure about the UK government being the best it can be in this type of situations though, they are partly at fault imo for the current situation in the UK for how slow they were to act on social distancing issues. I hope they wised up.

 

[11101]

The Dutch and the French had to balls to decide to stop everything this season.
The Italians are not so sure - saying it will start and then last night the Italian chief medical officer is saying it will be difficult to play on.

Leagues in all of Europe should be stopped by UEFA now before the virus will kill any players and other people connected to organising any football match.

The Italian government are seeing how things go with the lockdown. It's been the strictest in Europe and people in some parts are not happy, cancelling Serie A in places like Naples would push them over the edge. I don't see them playing again this season but the government doesn't want to say that until the relaxation measures are in place and people get some freedom back.

 

[redshaw]

UK now has the worst record of all the European countries in relation to Covid-19 deaths.

If you mean adding care home deaths on top for UK we still have that to come for Spain and Italy. UK certainly one of the highest.

 

[Alabaster Codify7]

Of all the potential outcomes here, the least likely outcome is the season being cancelled and Liverpool not being awarded the title.

We are talking about the darlings of English football, who have never won the PL and are currently 20+ points ahead of second place with around 9 games left to play. You must be mental if you think they are taking the title off Liverpool this season, absolute lunatics the lot of you.

If the season is cancelled, they'll still give Liverpool the title. I'm certain of it. It might be done in a completely nonsensical way such as not relegating anyone / promoting anyone but still giving Liverpool the title but they will be given the title.

What is anyone going to do about it, really? Who stops them from doing it?

 

[Rooney24]

Its about time people stopped prioritising this season over next season and vice versa.

The reality probably is that both are seriously jeopardised. WIth other countries now starting to cancel their leagues that tells me that holding games BCD is a non runner for whatever reasons.

Its only natural that this season would fall first but really until a vaccine is found or social distancing is totally abolished (which isnt going to be anytime soon), next Season is in big trouble as well.

It seems to me that the mood of the authorities is to put this Season in the bin first and do everything possible to make sure they can get next Season underway in August/September if they can. Im not even so sure they will be able to do that.

 

[Alabaster Codify7]

That just goes to show how silly is to even think of starting a sporting competition even behind closed doors before a vaccine is available (or at least very good treatment methods).

So basically no sports until around 2022, yeah? Fair enough, no sports ever again then basically. Let's forget about the athletes themselves, and think about the thousands and thousands of people whose jobs involve working within the industry in some shape or form, right the way down to the staff working behind the bars in stadiums and those working in the retail sector.

 

[Pexbo]

Of all the potential outcomes here, the least likely outcome is the season being cancelled and Liverpool not being awarded the title.

We are talking about the darlings of English football, who have never won the PL and are currently 20+ points ahead of second place with around 9 games left to play. You must be mental if you think they are taking the title off Liverpool this season, absolute lunatics the lot of you.

If the season is cancelled, they'll still give Liverpool the title. I'm certain of it. It might be done in a completely nonsensical way such as not relegating anyone / promoting anyone but still giving Liverpool the title but they will be given the title.

What is anyone going to do about it, really? Who stops them from doing it?

You can’t just give a club a title they literally have not won. That’s mental. Yes they probably would have won it, but they didn’t so they can’t be given the title.

 

[djembatheking]

This is precisely the problem with the ridiculous notion of playing BCD and insisting that football will ‘boost morale’ - this disease is not a joke, resuming football now will risk lives.

Footballers are healthy, but some still have underlying health problems especially relating to their respiratory system &/or heart. If 1 player or manager gets infected we’re drawn to a halt.

On top of that what happens if a cleaner, or chef, or groundskeeper catches the virus as a result of being forced to work and passes away? Can their families claim corporate manslaughter?
That’s before you get into the fact that in this country there’s been a lack of testing & PPE for frontline workers, plus there’s a delay between test & result and you can test negative but still carry the disease.
It’s reckless, unnecessary & stinks of greed.

The FA need to focus on finding a way to support the clubs in lower leagues who depend on gate receipts to survive - not trying to force BCD games.

This season is done, European football next season is likely to be done too.

If Scholes or Fletcher were still playing would they have to self isolate because of medical conditions , there must be some players in that position currently.

 

[Lentwood]

Of all the potential outcomes here, the least likely outcome is the season being cancelled and Liverpool not being awarded the title.

We are talking about the darlings of English football, who have never won the PL and are currently 20+ points ahead of second place with around 9 games left to play. You must be mental if you think they are taking the title off Liverpool this season, absolute lunatics the lot of you.

If the season is cancelled, they'll still give Liverpool the title. I'm certain of it. It might be done in a completely nonsensical way such as not relegating anyone / promoting anyone but still giving Liverpool the title but they will be given the title.

What is anyone going to do about it, really? Who stops them from doing it?

Nah I doubt it, that sets an incredibly dangerous precedent. They haven't mathematically won the title and therefore you can't award it them just because they were probably going to win it.

I think it's looking increasingly nailed on that the season gets cancelled, the results declared void and the focus shifts to getting next season started before the end of the calendar year

 

[Pexbo]

If football does go ahead BCD and a player tests positive, are they out injured or is the game abandoned?

How about 3 players? 11?

 

[Sky1981]

20 club. 10 games per week. 2000 people involved week in week out. A killer virus lurking in the open. What could possibly go wrong.

And that's the epl alone.

 

[Danny Roberts]

Where are they going to fit in the 6 extra games, even if it were to start in August?

I'm not averse to sacking off the play-offs but if they had to be played then make everything one game so only three games per division. Would have to use the bio-secure locations in conjunction with testing.

And would it be a 23-team league on a permanent basis thereafter i.e. would relegation/promotion work as now from next season? Would you relegate six teams rather than three to normalise things?

No, would drop to normal after one season or perhaps phase it over two.

 

[Deleted 112447]

So basically no sports until around 2022, yeah? Fair enough, no sports ever again then basically. Let's forget about the athletes themselves, and think about the thousands and thousands of people whose jobs involve working within the industry in some shape or form, right the way down to the staff working behind the bars in stadiums and those working in the retail sector.

I'm not forgetting, i'm thinking of them. The staff behind bars are better at home on full wages or even reduced, then at risk for themselves and their families because people want to enjoy watching football. The athletes, at the high level, are fine financially, the last people that we should worry about during lock down. Football survived World wars, 6 months to 2 years of hiatus is hardly the fatality you are making it out to be.

 

[Megadrive Man]

You can’t just give a club a title they literally have not won. That’s mental. Yes they probably would have won it, but they didn’t so they can’t be given the title.

Does that mean that Liverpool should be the only team in Europe next season then?

I mean some of those teams would have qualified, but they didn't so can't be given European football.

 

[Sky1981]

If football does go ahead BCD and a player tests positive, are they out injured or is the game abandoned?

How about 3 players? 11?

If a player in a team tested positive the whole team and coach needs a quarantine. They're travelling in the same bus and sharing the same dressing room.

And i suspect asking the players to play football and being in physical touch with other players and getting corona is a ground for a lawsuit.

We're not even talking about human error. Label misplaced. Players missing the test. Faulty test pack. Etc.

I dont think even sponsors would want any parts in that with the potential of bad rep

 

[Tel074]

So basically no sports until around 2022, yeah? Fair enough, no sports ever again then basically. Let's forget about the athletes themselves, and think about the thousands and thousands of people whose jobs involve working within the industry in some shape or form, right the way down to the staff working behind the bars in stadiums and those working in the retail sector.

You can be as sarcastic as you want but that guy is correct . There won't be any normal opening of bars , restaurants , concerts , football matches until a vaccine is found. People living is way more important than any of these. I am a business owner and I have ownership of a restaurant among other things and believe me it's tough but I'm realistic enough to know this won't change until a vaccine is found

 

[Deleted 112447]

If a player in a team tested positive the whole team and coach needs a quarantine. They're travelling in the same bus and sharing the same dressing room.

And i suspect asking the players to play football and being in physical touch with other players and getting corona is a ground for a lawsuit.

We're not even talking about human error. Label misplaced. Players missing the test. Faulty test pack. Etc.

I dont think even sponsors would want any parts in that with the potential of bad rep

There's also the human level. Would players even want to play and expose themselves like that when they have families at home, parents, children? It's not like they are living pay check to pay check and they have too or they do critical work to have society function. It's just not a risk that society or the players would take imo.

Clubs in the PL can afford paying the non playing staff and even if they have problems, they have a bunch of 25-30 young millionaires that could take some pay cuts to compensate. Not ideal but hardly a crime to go from 150k a week to 100k or 50k if it means the rest of the staff can put food on the table during this time.

 

[Dancfc]

If a player in a team tested positive the whole team and coach needs a quarantine. They're travelling in the same bus and sharing the same dressing room.

And i suspect asking the players to play football and being in physical touch with other players and getting corona is a ground for a lawsuit.

We're not even talking about human error. Label misplaced. Players missing the test. Faulty test pack. Etc.

I dont think even sponsors would want any parts in that with the potential of bad rep

Does that mean we have to shut every shop once as much as one person gets it? Aswell as shops of any worker who comes into contact with the person in question?

At some point the world will have to coexist with the virus. Dropping everything because of one positive test isn't sustainable in the long run and was only even done initially because we were playing catch up and taking measures to prevent overwhelm of the NHS.

 

[redman5]

Yet again people coming up with the possible pitfalls of playing behind closed doors. So other than cancelling contact sports altogether, what other alternatives are there ? Of course there's going to be risks, we take a risk every time we step foot outside the door. What about the thousands of people who cram themselves onto crowded tube trains every single day ? Where's the government's 'social-distancing' policy there then ? This virus is now a part of our lives. We have to live with it. It ain't gonna go away.

 

[Dave Smith]

There's another angle that people have missed too. If they get played behind closed doors it's inevitable Liverpool fans will flood the streets outside anfield on that big day. They may say they won't now but they won't be able to stop themselves. Waited 30 years and they are all going to stop at home to celebrate?

Can't see it. It's got disaster written all over it.

Yep, this would happen 100%. Then, after they have a outbreak, the fans would then say that it was not their fault but the Government/Boris/Police/PL's because they allowed the season to play out in such conditions and because they didn't enforce martial law to stop them from going out into the streets.

 

[Cait Sith]

You can’t just give a club a title they literally have not won. That’s mental. Yes they probably would have won it, but they didn’t so they can’t be given the title.

You can declare the season as finished and the take the current league table as the end result. We're not talking about 9 games into the season to just go ahead and call everything null and void that has happened in 29 games just because Liverpool was going to win it. Washing off 9 games is far more logical than washing off 29 and it's exactly what's going to happen in the worst case if football isn't resumed anytime soon.

 

[Dancfc]

Yet again people coming up with the possible pitfalls of playing behind closed doors. So other than cancelling contact sports altogether, what other alternatives are there ? Of course there's going to be risks, we take a risk every time we step foot outside the door. What about the thousands of people who cram themselves onto crowded tube trains every single day ? Where's the government's 'social-distancing' policy there then ? This virus is now a part of our lives. We have to live with it. It ain't gonna go away.

Im happy to be proved wrong but I imagine playing BCD in a controlled mass tested environment is technically safer for all involved than when we played full crowds when swine flu was at it's peak.

 

[Tel074]

You can declare the season as finished and the take the current league table as the end result. We're not talking about 9 games into the season to just go ahead and call everything null and void that has happened in 29 games just because Liverpool was going to win it. Washing off 9 games is far more logical than washing off 29 and it's exactly what's going to happen in the worst case if football isn't resumed anytime soon.

So bottom 3 get relegated?

 

[11101]

This is precisely the problem with the ridiculous notion of playing BCD and insisting that football will ‘boost morale’ - this disease is not a joke, resuming football now will risk lives.

Footballers are healthy, but some still have underlying health problems especially relating to their respiratory system &/or heart. If 1 player or manager gets infected we’re drawn to a halt.

On top of that what happens if a cleaner, or chef, or groundskeeper catches the virus as a result of being forced to work and passes away? Can their families claim corporate manslaughter?
That’s before you get into the fact that in this country there’s been a lack of testing & PPE for frontline workers, plus there’s a delay between test & result and you can test negative but still carry the disease.
It’s reckless, unnecessary & stinks of greed.

The FA need to focus on finding a way to support the clubs in lower leagues who depend on gate receipts to survive - not trying to force BCD games.

This season is done, European football next season is likely to be done too.

That and all the other points in this thread are very true, but i think we are underestimating the FA/PL's level of greed and incompetence. I'm certain we will be among the last to cancel and the league will probably push clubs and players to the point where they turn around and force the decision.

For contractual and insurance purposes none of the big leagues are going to cancel unless told to do so by the government. That would open them up to all kinds of lawsuits.

 

[redman5]

Does that mean we have to shut every shop once as much as one person gets it? Aswell as shops of any worker who comes into contact with the person in question?

At some point the world will have to coexist with the virus. Dropping everything because of one positive test isn't sustainable in the long run and was only even done initially because we were playing catch up and taking measures to prevent overwhelm of the NHS.

We've had at least 6 people in our place of work test positive for it. They've obviously had to self-isolate, but our company hasn't shut down because of it. Like I say, it's part of our lives now we have to learn to adapt & live with it, & that includes those ever so 'precious' football players.

 

[Tel074]

Yet again people coming up with the possible pitfalls of playing behind closed doors. So other than cancelling contact sports altogether, what other alternatives are there ? Of course there's going to be risks, we take a risk every time we step foot outside the door. What about the thousands of people who cram themselves onto crowded tube trains every single day ? Where's the government's 'social-distancing' policy there then ? This virus is now a part of our lives. We have to live with it. It ain't gonna go away.

It's not going to go away when people are not sticking to the guidelines . Yes it still will take time but when people are going about their daily routines as if everything is normal then this virus will keep spreading and people will keep dying .

 

[Dancfc]

It's not going to go away when people are not sticking to the guidelines . Yes it still will take time but when people are going about their daily routines as if everything is normal then this virus will keep spreading and people will keep dying .

Only that isn't happening.

Ofcourse there's a few people (yhat was always going to be the case) but the vast majority are sticking to the rules, infact I'd guess there's more going too far the other way than there is people actively flouting.

 

[TwoSheds]

Until there's a test that can give you credible results within the hour this is a complete non-starter. Even if only the first team squad came in, there'd still have to be coaches, physios, doctors, cleaners, cooks, security etc on site. All of them would have to be tested first thing when they arrive every single day and kept in isolation from the others until they've tested negative. If even one player or staff member tested positive, all the rest of them would have to go home for the day and get tested again next day (and that's assuming you had a wonder test that could almost instantly detect the infection and you didn't have to wait for a significant incubation period).

And if someone tested positive after a match day what would happen? As someone else said you'd have to put both clubs into isolation, test test test, and it would completely disrupt their training for that week or however long. And if anyone died from it well it would really throw into sharp relief the cavalier attitudes of the governments telling people that going to work is OK wouldn't it? The Premier League even with all their resources and their incentive to protect their incredibly valuable staff (valued by capitalism that is) can't protect their people, what the feck can Asda do?

The only other way it can work is to get the entire national situation under control to the point where it's completely manageable by testing, quarantine and contact tracing so that the risk of infection is negligible for the football clubs. There's a chance that will have happened by next season though the UK government are still showing an impressive ability to do feck all about most of the things they ought to be doing until much later than when it's first raised. See the fact that there are still flights going between New York and London, mental!

 

[Rooney24]

Im happy to be proved wrong but I imagine playing BCD in a controlled mass tested environment is technically safer for all involved than when we played full crowds when swine flu was at it's peak.

So why havent the Dutch and French gone for it?

 

[TwoSheds]

Only that isn't happening.

Ofcourse there's a few people (yhat was always going to be the case) but the vast majority are sticking to the rules, infact I'd guess there's more going too far the other way than there is people actively flouting.

There's no such thing as too far the other way though. The more you do, the lower the transmission rate will be and the quicker we will get to some kind of manageable state where testing and contact tracing can keep it all in check.

 

[Cait Sith]

So bottom 3 get relegated?

Why not? It's not any more unfair than calling everything null and void and preventing Leicester from getting CL football or Liverpool the title with 25 points ahead with 9 games remaining.

Of course there could also be a couple of relegation knockout games behind closed doors to determine who gets relegated.

Point being: There are far more possibilities that make sense during extraordinary circumstances than "29 games erased lol".

 

[Dancfc]

There's no such thing as too far the other way though. The more you do, the lower the transmission rate will be and the quicker we will get to some kind of manageable state where testing and contact tracing can keep it all in check.

There is, I'm refering to the people who are basically acting as police/government volunteers and shaming people who aren't actually breaking any rules (and if they technically are certainly not in any damaging way).

Those people may aswell be sending a message to the government that in the long run they can basically be manipulated in any which way they want.

 

[TwoSheds]

There is, I'm refering to the people who are basically acting as police/government volunteers and shaming people who aren't actually breaking any rules (and if they technically are certainly not in any damaging way).

Those people may aswell be sending a message to the government that in the long run they can basically be manipulated in any which way they want.

OK fair enough yeah, they're not worrying about themselves though, they're just being dickheads, same people who snitch on people who put the wrong bin out or whatever I expect. Sad that our society builds those kinds of paranoid mentalities that teach you to hate and fear your neighbours but there you go.

 

[forevrared]

I'm not averse to sacking off the play-offs but if they had to be played then make everything one game so only three games per division. Would have to use the bio-secure locations in conjunction with testing.

No, I meant in order for a 23 team league to work, there would need to be 44 matches instead of 38. There's no space for them. Fixture congestion is bad enough as is.

 

[Deleted 112447]

Those people may aswell be sending a message to the government that in the long run they can basically be manipulated in any which way they want.

What do you mean by that?

 

[McGrathsipan]

You can’t just give a club a title they literally have not won. That’s mental. Yes they probably would have won it, but they didn’t so they can’t be given the title.

The season needs to finish or be voided. There is no in between. There are 19 other clubs to consider and the ones around relegation and euro places will want to finish it to bring it to its natural outcome or be left to start again from scratch next year. For consistency whatever decision is arrived at needs to treat every club the same way. There can be no awarding of any titles or euro places unless all 20 clubs agree to let the table as it is now stand, and I cant see the clubs around relegation agreeeing to that, nor should United who are still in with a top 4 shout. Well we were based on form etc.

Its finish or void.

 

[Dancfc]

What do you mean by that?

They've had fear drilled into them to the point they're shaming and ranting about people for any little thing. It's scary how easy it has been to get a decent number of the public turning against one another.

Imagine we get a wrongen PM. The right graphs, the correct subtle words at the right time and is it beyond the realms of possibility that those same people are all off a sudden accepting a new Draconian law no question asked?

 

[Redcy]

We've had at least 6 people in our place of work test positive for it. They've obviously had to self-isolate, but our company hasn't shut down because of it. Like I say, it's part of our lives now we have to learn to adapt & live with it, & that includes those ever so 'precious' football players.

The problem with this is that my guess is that the way we are going to resolve this, without a vaccine is through "test, track and trace". We know we are gearing up for lots of ways to do testing, people will then be asked to register for a phone app, and maybe even forced (who knows), at which point when you come into contact with infected cases you will be flagged. If one player gets infected then everyone at that game and everyone they are in contact with gets flagged. Looking at how the asian countries have done this, if you are flagged as a direct close contact you are asked to self isolate, and if you show any symptoms at all and you have to inform via the app.

Now if we get one infection we will get massive bursts of self isolation, or we just pass it to everyone. Now as people have mentioned there are numerous footballers who have had hidden issues Marc-Vivien Foe springs to mind, or those with more obvious issues in the past such as Scholes/Fletcher.

The difference between your work, hopefully, and footballers is that your employer should be providing a suitable workplace where catching coronavirus is a minor risk (distancing, ppe, etc), if this is not possible you should not be doing it. Do I think plenty of employers will shit on their staff for a few quid? Yes, and thats why there are mechanisms to report employers for poor practice in a pandemic. The 300 people attending a game cannot do effective social distancing.

 

[Greck]

Until there's a test that can give you credible results within the hour this is a complete non-starter. Even if only the first team squad came in, there'd still have to be coaches, physios, doctors, cleaners, cooks, security etc on site. All of them would have to be tested first thing when they arrive every single day and kept in isolation from the others until they've tested negative. If even one player or staff member tested positive, all the rest of them would have to go home for the day and get tested again next day (and that's assuming you had a wonder test that could almost instantly detect the infection and you didn't have to wait for a significant incubation period).

And if someone tested positive after a match day what would happen? As someone else said you'd have to put both clubs into isolation, test test test, and it would completely disrupt their training for that week or however long. And if anyone died from it well it would really throw into sharp relief the cavalier attitudes of the governments telling people that going to work is OK wouldn't it? The Premier League even with all their resources and their incentive to protect their incredibly valuable staff (valued by capitalism that is) can't protect their people, what the feck can Asda do?

The only other way it can work is to get the entire national situation under control to the point where it's completely manageable by testing, quarantine and contact tracing so that the risk of infection is negligible for the football clubs. There's a chance that will have happened by next season though the UK government are still showing an impressive ability to do feck all about most of the things they ought to be doing until much later than when it's first raised. See the fact that there are still flights going between New York and London, mental!

Yes the testing is one reason this thing will likely fail to take off. Giving sporting bodies medical priority and all the test kits it will take to make this thing work will be hard to sell to the public.

 

[Danny Roberts]

No, I meant in order for a 23 team league to work, there would need to be 44 matches instead of 38. There's no space for them. Fixture congestion is bad enough as is.

Ah right, gotcha. It would be hard but clearly there is no perfect solution. With some combination of using 5 subs, scrapping one or both cups, no extra time or replays and straight to pens, reduced rounds of cups, starting earlier (if possible) no winter mini-break, possibly not playing all teams twice.