Club Sale | It’s done!
- Thread starter JB08
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Probably when he's majority owner? It would make very little sense to do it before then. Besides, you can't just jump into building a new stadium, these things have to be explored properly. It will take years before we start building a new stadium - 3 years at the minimum, more likely 5. Then another 3-4 years for building it.
So essentially, it’s better from Ratcliffe’s POV for the club to not be wildly successful before he has to buy the lot…
Any success he helps facilitate will add the Glazer’s wealth more than his own as they own vastly more of the club than he does, and further still, any success he facilitates will drive up the amount he has to pay for the club!
So he’ll - supposedly - be pumping his own money into an asset, in order to make that asset cost more for himself in the future.
It makes absolutely no sense, and anyone capable of free thought should really not be buying that this is what’s happening.
As I said, it’s a very sus deal.
Picture this -
‘Wanna buy my car?’
‘Yes, 5 grand?’
‘No, I want 8’
‘I can’t afford 8, and, it’s not worth 8’
‘Ok, you can buy a quarter of the car now, but I’ll still own 75% of it.’
‘Go on’
‘Yeah, so you give me 1.5k now, then you pay for the upkeep of the car, you pay to have it fixed up and keep it running, and then, in the future, once it’s actually worth 8k due to the money that you’ve pumped into it, I’ll let you buy it for 8’.
‘Yes, that sounds like a sound deal’.
It’s a completely laughable premise.
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As Mark Kleinman, said.. The confirmation expected in 2 weeks time.
It's time we move on from this.
It's time we move on from this.
It's more money than the Glaziers have put in in over 18 years, surely it's a positive- oh no wait it's not enough Jassim would've put in a billion so feck off Ratcliffe.
Only the caf can turn a positive into a negative I'm sure some prefer us in this mess.
Only the caf can turn a positive into a negative I'm sure some prefer us in this mess.
He did coke out and say his focus would be on investment that solely impacts footballing success. Stadium is a second thought at the moment. 200m can go towards training ground and academy redevelopment that will have a greater impact in long and short term than our stadium.
I doubt any other minority owner has ever put in that much money. Ineos/Jim doing that is a great sign and shows it's very likely they will put in more money upon obtaining majority ownership.
And Mike Keegan reiterates as much that it's a planned start to a majority takeover.
Indeed. It's some good news finally.
And a shrubbery!
some additional sealant for the leaks
When you’ve got someone offering to pay off your entire mortgage AND then renovate your home for free it’s difficult to get excited about someone else offering to paint it and mow the fecking lawn.
Weird article that. The news is like a couple of paragraphs and the rest of the article is basically "if we assume this 245M investment is the only investment Sir Jim will make and all goes just towards the stadium, then that investment is not enough to make material improvements to the stadium"
He definitely seems like that kind of businessman
We stared the plans about 2 years ago we hired the same guys who did Spurs stadium.
Again it’s just a load of shit isn’t it. Glazers staying on, stadium done in what 10 years? are we supposed to be celebrating this crap?
That's definitely the case and probably one of the main reasons as to why negotiations are still taking place. Ratcliffe isn't investing all this money to just be a minority owner, he's seeking guarantees from the Glazers that he will be able to buy them out in a few years.
That's actually pretty great news! I thought all his money would go to the Glazers and he won't invest money in the club at all.
Unfortunately jassim either couldn't afford it or he didn't want to pay we have to move on.
This is good news for once.
It's Mike Keegan so of course he has to put a negative spin on it. It's stated in the Sky News report that Ratcliffe has pledged to invest more in the future.
We will be in championship sooner than in the super league
First step in the Glazers being removed. We should be celebrating, granted it's not an immediate transition and it will take time to get rid of them, but the process has started.
I kind of agree with this.
But if this is a bet from Ratcliffe that he can buy more Glazers shares at a lower price (put and call options), why would he dip into his pocket to the tune of 300mil to improve the infrastructure? Surely, that improves the value of Glazers shares?
As would improved sporting performance, if INEOS start running the football side as soon as the 25% deal is agreed.
That is like me putting a deposit down to buy your house and you letting me pay for new windows and a new roof while you are still living there. You sell me the rest of the house and bump up the price because of the improvements that i paid for.
My personal opinion, Ratcliffe wanted to buy just the Glazer 69% of the shares earlier in the year, leaving the minority shareholders as is. This tells us he has the cash/financing to buy way more than 25%. A lot of those class a shares have been bought by hedge funds and speculators because they felt MUFC would be sold at a premium. When that news broke, as did stories about legal challenges to that deal....
https://www.breakingviews.com/considered-view/man-united-takeover-drama-may-end-up-in-court/
If Jim was to have come in and bought only Glazer stock, then those class A shares would plummet in value.
For me, I believe that the 25% deal is a way to start playacting those minority shareholders. Those shares will be bought at a premium price, the equivalent of what Qatar would have offered.
That then leaves Ratcliffe and The Glazers the room to cut any deal they want for the rest. It was reported that Joel and Avram belive the club could be worth way more in the future, as you said in your post. I believe they will stay and Jim will buy out the rest of the siblings. They would then change the articles of incorporation to allow the shares that INEOS hold to have majority control, because even it he were to hold a higher % than The Glazers, the Glazer class B shares have 10x the voting power. Class B also can only even be owned by someone in the Glazer family. Once sold to someone outside the family, the lose the status.
I must admit I feel guilty for getting sucked into the 'news' that something is going to be said. Half the time it's the last one hears about it and the other half the reality turns out to be different that the predicted.
time value of money and all that. Surprised they just don't take the 6bn or whatever was offered and run. They must really believe it will be a heck of a lot more, and they'll get it, to turn down the other bid.
He's not going to be just a shareholder very long. I really don't get people concerns over this. The man is intelligent and won't be doing this unless he is guaranteed he will be the sole owner.
Ratcliffe's PR talk is on point... and also cheap. And who knows, all of it might even be true! But I won't believe it until I see it. Until then, I remain... unconvinced.
That being said, it will go a long way if he immediately sacks the likes of Richard Arnold and John Murtough as soon as this deal is through. And quite possibly Erik ten Hag.
That being said, it will go a long way if he immediately sacks the likes of Richard Arnold and John Murtough as soon as this deal is through. And quite possibly Erik ten Hag.
It is when the guy offering to paint it actually has the money to pay it off whereas the first guy was a bluffer
No...
It's very likely that the deal is structured in a way that enables Ratcliffe to buy shares piece-meal - a series of put-calls. It is reported that the Glazers believe the club will be worth 10- 15bn in 2026. Ratcliffe shaves 25% off the price of purchase now to get his foot in the door and get a deal in place. Next year he adds another 24%. In 2025 Glazers can sell outright or wait for 2026. In 2026 he buys the rest. Anything Ratcliffe invests grows his own share value as well. So he pays 1.5bn now. 2bn next year. A lull in 2025, and then in 2026 he buys them out.
Even with the highest possible valuation (the crazy 15bn some have reported Glazers are looking at) it will end up with Ratcliffe paying 10bn for a 15bn asset, having grown his piece-meal investments considerably as well. If it's at the 10bn valuation he pays 7.5bn for it. Either way the Glazers make considerably more than anything the Qataris were offering, or anyhting that was being offered at this point in time. Not to mention Ratcliffe's profit is significantly higher as well because his shares increase in value too.
I mostly agree but I think the reason they believe the valuation will go up is that there are untapped potential revenue sources (streaming, super league, more consistent CL, raising ticket prices, NFTs, United TV etc.). Their asset went 4x in 15 years? (1.5bn -> 6bn or so). They expect a similar multiple in the next 10 years.
I honestly don't think it's realistic. We had a boom in commercial revenue, amazing PL TV rights deals etc. in an era of free money. Now cost of capital is high, every commercial deal will be under extremely close scrutiny. Kit deals, whoever buys the PL TV rights, any licensing agreements - every single one will be nickel and dimed.
This is all assuming United continue to perform in the sporting department. All signs are that there's additional competition (Spurs, Newcastle) and that extra CL spot to England won't be enough to keep us in the CL.
Absolutely valid question and many others that need answering with this minority deal, but we won't know anything until there is an official announcement and maybe not even then !
Could be some kind of loan structure that converts to shares in the future
Will or will not the Glazers still retain control of United?
Because, all these other journalists have no real info regarding all this sale. So, many will twist words to make stories after getting a hint on a breaking news.
But all in all, at least now, we have concrete news with timelines from the person who broke the news about Man United Board taking a strategic review process.
Let's just pray Mark Will break the news about Ratcliffe road to full ownership, because such news can only come from the board brief, which looks like he has.
We need tangible news about road to full ownership with timelines.
Something along these lines sounds about right
Still some big things to be agreed about sporting control, what happens to the NYSE shareholders etc
Anything other than carrying on 100% under the Glazers is progress.
Did you even bother to read what he wrote? That example tells me no.
I bet £30 billion Jim is kicking himself he didn't come to you for advice
He should invest in having moving seating that goes around old Trafford..slowly, top tier gets nothing..next few levels have moving seating, so the members can get a proper perspective on the shit football. 
What is it with the "Sir Jim" nonsense coming not only from posters, but from a professional journalist repeatedly calling Ratcliffe that in an official news article? Feels thoroughly embarrassing, and also very inappropriately endearing considering the guy is a petrochemical tycoon, mass polluter, political hasardeur and tax fugitive so by all standards a thoroughly horrible person.
Jassim's bid reportedly clocked in at around $6B, but that was using enterprise value, thus baking in the $600M of net debt. Reuters have got Ratcliffe's bid inferring a valuation of roughly $6.5B on the club's equity, meaning you'd have to add the $600M on top of that to make the terms comparable to Jassim's.
It’s started but there’s no saying it will ever end. There’s absolutely no guarantee they go.
#FakeJassim
I can't understand some of the negativity SJR is getting, especially on the mooted €300m investment out of his own back pocket. For all the talk of Sheik Jassim and his billions of investment in the area outside of old Trafford, the City and surrounding area, not a single cent would be going to the glazers so why would they care. Why didn't he reduce investment in the surrounding area and up his bid price to buy the club.
For SJR yeah 25% ownership isn't ideal but surely there will be some agreement on future ownership. For an astute business man like SJR JUST to buy 25% with no future guarantees, I'm not convinced. End of the day, none of us have seen the finer details of the but and neither have most of the press.
If true on the €300m investment that could seriously improve Carrington and possibly parts of the match day experience. Plus it's approximately €300m more than the Glazers have ever invested out of their own back pocket
For SJR yeah 25% ownership isn't ideal but surely there will be some agreement on future ownership. For an astute business man like SJR JUST to buy 25% with no future guarantees, I'm not convinced. End of the day, none of us have seen the finer details of the but and neither have most of the press.
If true on the €300m investment that could seriously improve Carrington and possibly parts of the match day experience. Plus it's approximately €300m more than the Glazers have ever invested out of their own back pocket
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