There's no better description of that place.
Club Sale | It’s done!
- Thread starter JB08
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Starting to feel like Glazers were using the Qataris to bait SJR into making a better offer all along
Many feel it's the other way round,however the constant confident noises from British media around Ratcliffe bid says otherwise
Have faith, croads, have faith.
Presume when INEOS take over then we are going to hear about taking on the debt is a huge tax relief. They will put out some PR fluff about that's why they aren't clearing it
Why would you care. INEOS is Sir Jim and he is INEOS. If he puts the debt on INEOS what does that matter to you?
It won't affect United in any way
Good description!
I am not an expert on this, but even if it’s larger orders than usual — the total order for calls at 25 is of $1,400 — right? The total order book for calls on the range from $21-32 is like $10,000. So in that perspective it’s peanuts.
But at the same time, they are offering to pay a fair amount for those calls, right? A Black & Scholes valuation of the calls would give a value of like at most 1c instead of 70c (and that is est. a 60% volatility). But I have zero experience from working with these type of traded short-term calls, maybe you have to pay that type of premium for them?
Royal addressbook wasn't updated :/
Can any of the posters in here who are still bullish that Qatar are going to win care to give some reasoning for that confidence.
I do think there could be some merit in the thinking that the British media are going with INEOS winning due to no leaks from Qatar.
I do think there could be some merit in the thinking that the British media are going with INEOS winning due to no leaks from Qatar.
I think this is a legit point and I also tweeted about it earlier. Thinking it through — I don’t buy that Jassim would put in an offer that couldn’t even be argued to be competitive. There are some moving parts, so it won’t be entire black and white. It must be probable that it is in the same ball park at least.
I don’t buy the following two notions, on which much of the speculation is based on:
(a) “Jassim makes a bid to save face and will then pull out.”
Conspiracy theory level. And in relation to who would he save face? Teenage MUFC fans? In business circles he would look like a clown. These are professional business people, you don’t put in an offer that isn’t serious.
A Saudi group made a bid for CFC, it didn’t even make it to the second round of bids.
Where is this coming from? Business is all about choosing the right business opportunity. To never overpay. If you have access to a billion pounds — how many investments opportunities can you chose between? 100,000? A million? If anything — I bet he is more concerned from a reputational point of view of winning the auction, since an investment like MUFC always is seen as a bit of a vanity project that you must overpay for to get.
A Saudi group made a bid for CFC, it didn’t even make it to the second round of bids.
Nah, the only reasonable thing to assume is that Jassim has put in a competitive offer. Sure, it could be a bit of a long shot. And as far as I can tell, it looks low. But I would say that given the reports we have, its “too close to call” this race.
I think people are buying stock because firstly it’s at its lowest and secondly it is the end game. Either buyer should be booming the stock price.
Well INEOS offered the Glazers what they want apparently, which is investment with 2 of them keeping their shares in the club so I think it makes sense the reason they haven't accepted it is they were just dragging it on to get more money from Sheikh Jassim
Might just be because we're so used to the way the Glazers do things but I don't believe INEOS will just take on the debt without taking money out of the club to pay it off
Trouble is he still hasn't matched Ratcliffe's overall bid,therefore until that happens I don't see the needle moving in Jassim's favour.
I'm sure there's a lot of detail to be discussed and negotiated by lawyers etc. It could easily be the case that they're going to accept SJRs bid after the third round of bidding, but it's currently going through due diligence. For me it's quite telling that they've apparently never spoke to Jassim after his bid and this talk about them being dubious about him and his funding.
What figure do you think he's willing to reach
Seems a long time since that third bid went in from Ratcliffe to still be going through due diligence. Then again I still cannot get my head around why Jassim seems to have zero intention of matching offer. Suggests to me someone who isn't serious about wanting the club which is odd.
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In my opinion, Qatar is gone. The latest 'take it or leave it' offer was more like a decent farewell by who knows he will lose the battle. I hope I'm wrong though.
I don't think all 6 Glazer siblings are going to agree on any of Ratcliffe's proposals due to the structures. There is a "lack of cohesion" among them, as the Financial Times put it. That works massively in Jassim's favour.
If reports are to be trusted, I think Jassim's valuation is now close enough to Ratcliffe's that the Glazers will be receptive to negotiating with him and the final valuation will end up at or above Ratcliffe's. If Jassim can just hit the right number and take it all now, that is the easiest solution and the one most likely to result in all 6 agreeing. Some will try to tell you that number is £6B or nothing. I don't believe that for a minute.
I can't fathom why the proposed structure of Ratcliffe's bid keeps changing, other than difficulty in getting all of the siblings on board. It went from the full Glazer stake (69%), to 4 now and Joel and Avram later, to now where FT are saying the focus is on a structure where all 6 sell down in phases. I don't think Ratcliffe's valuation of the club in his 69% bid would beat the Sheikh's valuation of the club in his latest bid, otherwise the reporting on these other structures makes little sense to me.
It looks like he's reached it now with this final offer, just depends now on the Glazers actually making a decision
What do you think is the magic number that they want Jassim to hit out of interest
So you don't believe there's room to negotiate
It's hard to confirm how much either of them have actually bid because we keep seeing varying reports. But if its true Ratcliffe has bid more plus he's willing to let the Glazers keep a stake in the club then why are they still dragging it on, the deadline they set was ages ago
Hopefully if the Glazers can actually decide what they want and negotiate, it seems like they're still too busy arguing between themselves because 4 of them want a full sale and 2 don't
If I had to guess, I would say in the range of £5.4-5.5B. Only each Glazer would know their own price, but £6B is pure fantasy. The reports don't even have Ratcliffe's phased structure at that valuation.
SJR or SJ. No one is going to spend 6bn and don't give it every chance to succeed.
We will have a good investment budget with either owner that's for sure.
People are concerned with lack of details from SJR camp and rightly so but that's mean its going to be bad. May be he has a way to get rid of the debt and invest in stadium and that thing will become clear as things progress.
I am not concerned with Glazers staying in non controlling position (genuinely who cares if they are not running the show) and slowly completely bought out.
A perfect scenario is SJR winning the bid, no ethical dramas or labelling we will get with Saudi (rightly or wrongly) and him having a plan for success.
We will have a good investment budget with either owner that's for sure.
People are concerned with lack of details from SJR camp and rightly so but that's mean its going to be bad. May be he has a way to get rid of the debt and invest in stadium and that thing will become clear as things progress.
I am not concerned with Glazers staying in non controlling position (genuinely who cares if they are not running the show) and slowly completely bought out.
A perfect scenario is SJR winning the bid, no ethical dramas or labelling we will get with Saudi (rightly or wrongly) and him having a plan for success.
Damn, I missed the dessert discussion…it’s blueberry pie ftw.
It actually started as puddings, not specifically desserts, was kinda my fault, it just morphed
Yeah there is clearly a split in the family
Big day is here and awaiting a Romano ‘here we go’ YouTube post
Big day is here and awaiting a Romano ‘here we go’ YouTube post
Come back on August/September
Agreed
Erik will be off then
You do understand that if INEOS ‘take on the debt’ it’s the same effect to the club as clearing it? It’s just a different method of dealing with it. The club will effectively be free of the debt.
INEOS will take on the new debt (incurred to buy the controlling stake). They aren't clearing the existing debt, that will still be on the books of the club.
Its like an old Scimica.Agreed
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Precisely, you beat me to it
Agreed
The new Lexus GX unveiled today on the other hand...
Can you explain how that works with the change of control clause on the current debt then?
It’s like a ropey kit car version of an old Defender, which is basically what it is.
For now. Most likely dependant on how well the new Grenadier sells.
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