Club Sale | It’s done!

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Literally everything points towards privet bid. Media engagement in Qatar about the bid, no state funds involved, conservative offers from SJ.

There is zero possibility one of the wealthiest states in the world will lose a bid to a private person for few hundred millions.

It's dressed up that way on purpose. How many people in Qatar have that kind of cash outside the royal family and state? You'd need to have at least 20bn to even contemplate spending 6bn + a few extra bn on a football club.

Sheikh Jassim isn't worth anything close to 20bn either.
 
People cannot be annoyed at Ratcliffe for potentially keeping the Glazers on in a minority ownership when it is likely the only possible route to securing the club.
 
Not going to lie, that's kind of cringe. The Qatari got outbid and outplayed. That's the long and short of it. And I wanted Qatar.

Maybe if he hadn't done a deal with leeches then he wouldn't get so much hate
 
Not going to lie, that's kind of cringe. The Qatari got outbid and outplayed. That's the long and short of it. And I wanted Qatar.
The bids are still in. Whether one is better than the other is subjective. They might feel they getting the Qatar payout now will mean they can invest in opportunities they think will have a better ROI than if they trust INEOS
 
If these figures are to be believed,then it is clear that Sheikh Jassim's bid is far more better than Ratchcliffe's.
This is the breakdown,based on my understanding using the figures you provided:

Ratchcliffe's offer:
Enterprise Value=£ 5.5 billion
Glazers share (69%) = £ 3.795 billion.
Ratchcliffe offers to buy 50.01% of £5.5 billion now = £ 2.75 billion.
Ratchcliffe offers to buy the remaining 19% 3 years later = £ 1.045 billion
Total amount to be paid by Ratchcliffe to the Glazers 69% = £ 3.795 billion
Sharing £ 3.795 billion among the 6 Glazers = £ 3.795 billion÷6 = £ 632,500
Therefore,On the average,each Glazer receives about six hundred and thirty -two million pounds.

Sheikh Jassim's bid:
Enterprise Value=£ 5.2 billion
Glazers share (69%) = £ 3.588 billion.
Sheikh Jassim offers to buy all the 69% owned by the Glazers now = £ 3.588 billion.
The Glazers also own 4.3% class A shares = £ 220 million).
Total amount to be paid by Sheikh Jassim to the Glazers = £ 3.588 billion + £ 220 million = £ 3.808 billion.
Sharing £ 3.808 billion among the 6 Glazers = £ 3.808 billion÷6 = £ 634,666.67 million .
Therefore,On the average,each Glazer receives about six hundred and thirty -five million pounds.

The big difference now is that, the Sheikh' offer is NOW (cash) whereas that of Sir Ratchcliffe's is in installment.

If these figures are to go by,then the Sheikh's offer is far better as the cash received now could be invested which stands the chance of giving the Glazers a far higher reward than Ratchcliffe's offer.

Am not even considering the debt, infrastructure and other investment pledges.

I have said it before and I will repeat that,the Glazers seem to be using SJR to extract more from the Sheikh.
Else, exclusivity could have been given to SJR if his offer was far higher than the Sheikh's since the second or the 3rd round/bids.

But there are a lot of things we (the supporters and the media) don't know yet. So am not believing anything I see or read until an official statement is out.
I see most of the news and tweets in the media as propaganda.
I think your are pretty much on the money, that the two bids are much closer than what’s being rumoured but still no one has answered the most important question?

you can offer an enterprise value per share of say $30 so selling all of their 113m B controlling shares for $3.39bn, Forbes recently valued the club at $6bn which is twice the market cap for a reason. If you buy controlling shares of the club you also take over considerable assets of land around old Trafford which the Glazers have been buying up since 2008, they, the Glazers want a premium ontop of the shares to relinquish their control and allow SJ to build restaurants and hotels or SJR to set up fracking Site(That’s a joke btw!)

They also have future broadcast and merchandising deals in place which are all part of Forbes $6bn evaluation and again the Glazers do not want to relinquish these since they basically have paid their dividends every year bar one of £20m per year for all 6 Siblings. Again they don’t want to relinquish these future deals unless someone compensates them accordingly.

I also thought that both Bids both like you valued at 100% and then the Glazers expected 69% of that value to buy out all of their shares(or 51% in SJR new bid) most fans assumed that this was the amount to be paid to the Glazers to relinquish control yes £6bn to the Glazers as the 100% valuation of the club is not necessarily 100% of shares it also includes Current assets, both short and long term like Player Squad Value and Property owned outright by the clubs , plus more importantly future Broadcasting and Merchandising deals.

I also like you, assumed that the Glazers would only get 69% or 51% of the valuation but the more I dig into this the more it seems that the bids by both parties are to take over the controlling shares and involve much more that a simple purchase and transfer of shares.

So for example SJR bid is £5.4 possibly going up to £6bn for 51% of the Glazer Control including compensatory payments for loss of future broadcasting, merchandise contracts, relinquishing control of the clubs short, mid and long term assets.

So SJR valued the shares at $30 which is 163 million at $30 = $4.89bn (£3.92bn) plus the club debt which must be factored into the bid even though it does not have to be cleared under a merger takeover of $675m(£570m) and then Ineos made an additional payment in lieu of Future assets, Broadcasting and Merchandising of £800m or $1bn This would mean that the Glazers would receive 113m shares at a guaranteed $30 which is $3.390 Billion plus $1bn to relinquish control of the club giving them a guaranteed buy out of $4.39bn (But it could rise to $4.99bn).

The deal from SJR and Ineos would mean 73% of that agreed deal must be paid now and 27% later in a structured put and call layered take over where they payments could go up but never down.

So for clarity SJR woulD have to pay $3.20bn (£2.6bn) now for 51% controlling shares and a minimum of $1.239bn(£1bn) over 4 years but this could also rise to $1.87bn(£1.5bn) dependent on team success.

This is how the £6bn bid is actually being pitched it’s like Sky Reporting we bought A Martial for £58m because it assumes that all the clauses to meet that value will be met.

SJ offer of $6.5/6.6bn might also value the club slightly differently on that ;

1. The debt is paid $675m
2. They value the shares at $29 so 163m 163*29 = $4.72 billion (£3.78bn)
3. Legacy payment to relinquish control $1.1bn(£882m)

Therefore the Glazers would get 113m @29 = $3.277 billion plus $1.1bn legacy plus $220m for selling remaining 4.3% of A shares giving them a total right now of $4.6bn (£3.7bn) cash and tax free right now.

I’m scratching my head right now too as this whole process is so more complicated than a normal merger needs to be.


Conclusion neither bid is accepted by the Glazers as they clearly want £6bn minimum and they want the money upfront and not a penny less !
 
The gall of Jassim to bid lower than the asking price and say 'take it or leave it'. He seems like a bit of a mess this whole time - at least Ineos have seemed somewhat professional.
 
Calling Ratcliffe names it's like a playground in here, I get you don't want him as owner but come on you were all begging him to take over 18 months ago.

This jassim fella what's he ever done?where's his experience of running a football club, a bit of PR I'll invest a billion in infrastructure clear the debt etc has got everyone giddy, just cos Ratcliffe hasn't come out with the same statements he's a Rat.

I'll admit, I've wanted Ratcliffe all along and still do the thought of us being classed the same as City and Newcastle a sportswashing exercise no thanks not for me. Ratcliffe isn't a fool he knows what needs to be done with the club I'm sure we'll here all about it if he wins the bid which,at this stage is still a big if and if it turns out Qatar wins I'll just have to accept it like you lot will if Ratcliffe wins.
 
I think your are pretty much on the money, that the two bids are much closer than what’s being rumoured but still no one has answered the most important question?

you can offer an enterprise value per share of say $30 so selling all of their 113m B controlling shares for $3.39bn, Forbes recently valued the club at $6bn which is twice the market cap for a reason. If you buy controlling shares of the club you also take over considerable assets of land around old Trafford which the Glazers have been buying up since 2008, they, the Glazers want a premium ontop of the shares to relinquish their control and allow SJ to build restaurants and hotels or SJR to set up fracking Site(That’s a joke btw!)

They also have future broadcast and merchandising deals in place which are all part of Forbes $6bn evaluation and again the Glazers do not want to relinquish these since they basically have paid their dividends every year bar one of £20m per year for all 6 Siblings. Again they don’t want to relinquish these future deals unless someone compensates them accordingly.

I also thought that both Bids both like you valued at 100% and then the Glazers expected 69% of that value to buy out all of their shares(or 51% in SJR new bid) most fans assumed that this was the amount to be paid to the Glazers to relinquish control yes £6bn to the Glazers as the 100% valuation of the club is not necessarily 100% of shares it also includes Current assets, both short and long term like Player Squad Value and Property owned outright by the clubs , plus more importantly future Broadcasting and Merchandising deals.

I also like you, assumed that the Glazers would only get 69% or 51% of the valuation but the more I dig into this the more it seems that the bids by both parties are to take over the controlling shares and involve much more that a simple purchase and transfer of shares.

So for example SJR bid is £5.4 possibly going up to £6bn for 51% of the Glazer Control including compensatory payments for loss of future broadcasting, merchandise contracts, relinquishing control of the clubs short, mid and long term assets.

So SJR valued the shares at $30 which is 163 million at $30 = $4.89bn (£3.92bn) plus the club debt which must be factored into the bid even though it does not have to be cleared under a merger takeover of $675m(£570m) and then Ineos made an additional payment in lieu of Future assets, Broadcasting and Merchandising of £800m or $1bn This would mean that the Glazers would receive 113m shares at a guaranteed $30 which is $3.390 Billion plus $1bn to relinquish control of the club giving them a guaranteed buy out of $4.39bn (But it could rise to $4.99bn).

The deal from SJR and Ineos would mean 73% of that agreed deal must be paid now and 27% later in a structured put and call layered take over where they payments could go up but never down.

So for clarity SJR woulD have to pay $3.20bn (£2.6bn) now for 51% controlling shares and a minimum of $1.239bn(£1bn) over 4 years but this could also rise to $1.87bn(£1.5bn) dependent on team success.

This is how the £6bn bid is actually being pitched it’s like Sky Reporting we bought A Martial for £58m because it assumes that all the clauses to meet that value will be met.

SJ offer of $6.5/6.6bn might also value the club slightly differently on that ;

1. The debt is paid $675m
2. They value the shares at $29 so 163m 163*29 = $4.72 billion (£3.78bn)
3. Legacy payment to relinquish control $1.1bn(£882m)

Therefore the Glazers would get 113m @29 = $3.277 billion plus $1.1bn legacy plus $220m for selling remaining 4.3% of A shares giving them a total right now of $4.6bn (£3.7bn) cash and tax free right now.

I’m scratching my head right now too as this whole process is so more complicated than a normal merger needs to be.


Conclusion neither bid is accepted by the Glazers as they clearly want £6bn minimum and they want the money upfront and not a penny less !

Unfortunately those leeches are seeing that Ratcliffe's EV and Glazer share value is higher than Jassim's. That's why media keep on reporting their bid is higher.
 
The gall of Jassim to bid lower than the asking price and say 'take it or leave it'. He seems like a bit of a mess this whole time - at least Ineos have seemed somewhat professional.

The asking price is £6bn which almost certainly won't get paid. If I have a house worth 100,000 but I'm asking for 300,000 and someone offers 200,000 take it or leave it, that doesn't make them unprofessional. The asking price is usually set higher than what they would be willing to take because it gives room to negotiate
 
Why are all the Ratcliffe fans so certain they will have no input whatsoever. Surely you don't honestly believe they remain silent

Read back I am mostly in support of Qatar I'm just not petulant and blinded like a child in a sweet shop.

Why would Ratcliffe pay north of 5bn to let some other fecker have a say, use the brain.
 
The gall of Jassim to bid lower than the asking price and say 'take it or leave it'. He seems like a bit of a mess this whole time - at least Ineos have seemed somewhat professional.

Do you think we should take that approach into transfer negotiations? Just pay whatever asking price they set at the beginning?

Chelsea have said £70m for Mount, should we just pay that or do you think we could get him for less?
 
Maybe if he hadn't done a deal with leeches then he wouldn't get so much hate

I think INEOS will be terrible for the club. But I generally don't have anything against the-end-justifies-the-means approach, even if I ultimately disagree with the specifics. He saw a way to get what he wanted and did that. I admire that.
 
Calling Ratcliffe names it's like a playground in here, I get you don't want him as owner but come on you were all begging him to take over 18 months ago.

This jassim fella what's he ever done?where's his experience of running a football club, a bit of PR I'll invest a billion in infrastructure clear the debt etc has got everyone giddy, just cos Ratcliffe hasn't come out with the same statements he's a Rat.

I'll admit, I've wanted Ratcliffe all along and still do the thought of us being classed the same as City and Newcastle a sportswashing exercise no thanks not for me. Ratcliffe isn't a fool he knows what needs to be done with the club I'm sure we'll here all about it if he wins the bid which,at this stage is still a big if and if it turns out Qatar wins I'll just have to accept it like you lot will if Ratcliffe wins.

Hey I was all for Ratcliffe when he first declared interest,however it then emerged he had no intention of clearing debt.He then committed cardinal sin of offering to keep those leeches in place. That's not even mentioning his lack of clarity on investment too. He better address these issues the minute he gets his hands on this club or expect serious hostility.
 
I think INEOS will be terrible for the club. But I generally don't have anything against the-end-justifies-the-means approach, even if I ultimately disagree with the specifics. He saw a way to get what he wanted and did that. I admire that.

Does that come from how badly they are running NICE or the whole way they plan on how to finance buying the club
 
I think your are pretty much on the money, that the two bids are much closer than what’s being rumoured but still no one has answered the most important question?

you can offer an enterprise value per share of say $30 so selling all of their 113m B controlling shares for $3.39bn, Forbes recently valued the club at $6bn which is twice the market cap for a reason. If you buy controlling shares of the club you also take over considerable assets of land around old Trafford which the Glazers have been buying up since 2008, they, the Glazers want a premium ontop of the shares to relinquish their control and allow SJ to build restaurants and hotels or SJR to set up fracking Site(That’s a joke btw!)

They also have future broadcast and merchandising deals in place which are all part of Forbes $6bn evaluation and again the Glazers do not want to relinquish these since they basically have paid their dividends every year bar one of £20m per year for all 6 Siblings. Again they don’t want to relinquish these future deals unless someone compensates them accordingly.

I also thought that both Bids both like you valued at 100% and then the Glazers expected 69% of that value to buy out all of their shares(or 51% in SJR new bid) most fans assumed that this was the amount to be paid to the Glazers to relinquish control yes £6bn to the Glazers as the 100% valuation of the club is not necessarily 100% of shares it also includes Current assets, both short and long term like Player Squad Value and Property owned outright by the clubs , plus more importantly future Broadcasting and Merchandising deals.

I also like you, assumed that the Glazers would only get 69% or 51% of the valuation but the more I dig into this the more it seems that the bids by both parties are to take over the controlling shares and involve much more that a simple purchase and transfer of shares.

So for example SJR bid is £5.4 possibly going up to £6bn for 51% of the Glazer Control including compensatory payments for loss of future broadcasting, merchandise contracts, relinquishing control of the clubs short, mid and long term assets.

So SJR valued the shares at $30 which is 163 million at $30 = $4.89bn (£3.92bn) plus the club debt which must be factored into the bid even though it does not have to be cleared under a merger takeover of $675m(£570m) and then Ineos made an additional payment in lieu of Future assets, Broadcasting and Merchandising of £800m or $1bn This would mean that the Glazers would receive 113m shares at a guaranteed $30 which is $3.390 Billion plus $1bn to relinquish control of the club giving them a guaranteed buy out of $4.39bn (But it could rise to $4.99bn).

The deal from SJR and Ineos would mean 73% of that agreed deal must be paid now and 27% later in a structured put and call layered take over where they payments could go up but never down.

So for clarity SJR woulD have to pay $3.20bn (£2.6bn) now for 51% controlling shares and a minimum of $1.239bn(£1bn) over 4 years but this could also rise to $1.87bn(£1.5bn) dependent on team success.

This is how the £6bn bid is actually being pitched it’s like Sky Reporting we bought A Martial for £58m because it assumes that all the clauses to meet that value will be met.

SJ offer of $6.5/6.6bn might also value the club slightly differently on that ;

1. The debt is paid $675m
2. They value the shares at $29 so 163m 163*29 = $4.72 billion (£3.78bn)
3. Legacy payment to relinquish control $1.1bn(£882m)

Therefore the Glazers would get 113m @29 = $3.277 billion plus $1.1bn legacy plus $220m for selling remaining 4.3% of A shares giving them a total right now of $4.6bn (£3.7bn) cash and tax free right now.

I’m scratching my head right now too as this whole process is so more complicated than a normal merger needs to be.


Conclusion neither bid is accepted by the Glazers as they clearly want £6bn minimum and they want the money upfront and not a penny less !
Thanks for the post but tbh this make my head hurt ...

Anyway I'm so fed up of this mess I don't really care who and who anymore just get this done asap so ETH could start his summer plan. Surely we don't wanna wait till mid Aug to start buying. There's probably nothing left by then.
 
If Ratcliffe wins, majority of pro-Qatar posters will take it on their chins and give Jim some time to come with more detailed explanation of his plans for the club. They will start judging him properly after one complete year under his reign. If Jassim wins, the meltdown of pro-Ratcliffe folks will be epic.
 
Do you think we should take that approach into transfer negotiations? Just pay whatever asking price they set at the beginning?

Chelsea have said £70m for Mount, should we just pay that or do you think we could get him for less?

Nah but if Arsenal had bid £60m, and after a half a year of us talking up Mount and buttering up his fans saying that we'll treat him great and invest lots of money and time into him (ok analogy is getting lost), we then came along with a £58m bid and said take it or leave it, it'd be a bit arrogant at least.

Anyway, I just feel that, based on the admittedly very small amount of actual information we have, Jassim/the Qatari bid has been quite arrogant - I get the feeling they expected to just waltz in and buy the club without issues. Maybe I'm reading it all wrong though.
 
If Ratcliffe wins, majority of pro-Qatar posters will take it on their chins and give Jim some time to come with more detailed explanation of his plans for the club. They will start judging him properly after one complete year under his reign. If Jassim wins, the meltdown of pro-Ratcliffe folks will be epic.
I really wouldn't be so sure. At all.
 
If Ratcliffe wins, majority of pro-Qatar posters will take it on their chins and give Jim some time to come with more detailed explanation of his plans for the club. They will start judging him properly after one complete year under his reign. If Jassim wins, the meltdown of pro-Ratcliffe folks will be epic.

Not when he is keeping those leeches,would have been very different situation if that hadn't happened but it did
 
If Ratcliffe wins, majority of pro-Qatar posters will take it on their chins and give Jim some time to come with more detailed explanation of his plans for the club. They will start judging him properly after one complete year under his reign. If Jassim wins, the meltdown of pro-Ratcliffe folks will be epic.
The pro-Ratcliffe folks are more anti-sportswashing than pro-Ratcliffe.
 
The gall of Jassim to bid lower than the asking price and say 'take it or leave it'. He seems like a bit of a mess this whole time - at least Ineos have seemed somewhat professional.

It's not gone well for him so far. It's also amusing to see the Qataris claim that this is their "final" bid... for the third time. I wonder if the Glazers will believe them.

Qatar's 3rd round 'final' bid on 28th April reportedly valued the club at £4.2bn. They then made another 'final' bid, directly to the Glazers and outside the formal bidding process, on 16th May, this time valuing the club at £4.8bn. Finally, this week they have submitted their 3rd 'final' bid, which reportedly values the club at £5.2bn. Although they are still behind Ineos, the Glazers will surely be minded to hang on couple of weeks to see if Jassim finds another couple of hundred million pounds down the back of his sofa (afterall, the Qataris have pledged an additional £800m on investment on top of the purchase price - the Glazers will be thinking "we'll have a piece of that too, thank you.")
 

Nice???

It's utterly pathetic. He's not even got it yet and still might not either. Not to forget he could make a far better owner than Jassim will for all we know.

I don't want Qatar and have made it perfectly clear but I won't be tweeting Qatar out after 5 seconds if they do win the auction.

The level of intellect we're talking about here on twitter probably says everything though.
 
Does that come from how badly they are running NICE or the whole way they plan on how to finance buying the club

You mean why I think INEOS will be bad owners? Both. I don't trust Ratcliffe to invest or to run the club competently. The way he has ran Nice, for example, is giving me distinct Glazer vibes. And I don't put any stock in the "local lad, boyhood club" to make me think we would be any different. I don't trust him at all.

But the #RatcliffeOut stuff is still quite cringe. Ultimately, he won the bidding process. It is what it is.
 
You mean why I think INEOS will be bad owners? Both. I don't trust Ratcliffe to invest or to run the club competently. The way he has ran Nice, for example, is giving me distinct Glazer vibes. And I don't put any stock in the "local lad, boyhood club" to make me think we would be any different. I don't trust him at all.

But the #RatcliffeOut stuff is still quite cringe.

I wanted him to prove me wrong but then he decided only a deal with the devils is his only way of getting the club. So now feel completely cold on him buying us.
 
You mean why I think INEOS will be bad owners? Both. I don't trust Ratcliffe to invest or to run the club competently. The way he has ran Nice, for example, is giving me distinct Glazer vibes. And I don't put any stock in the "local lad, boyhood club" to make me think we would be any different. I don't trust him at all.

But the #RatcliffeOut stuff is still quite cringe. Ultimately, he won the bidding process. It is what it is.

He did?
 

Enough Tier 1 sources have alluded to INEOS and the Glazers being in the final stages of negotiations to make me believe it's just a matter of time. And the wind has been blowing that way for awhile as well, not the least because of Qatar underestimating the whole thing. But I've already explained my reasoning why believe this latest "offer" is just saving face. You can go back and check it out if you are so inclined.
 
So these are the latest end of year figures for INEOS:

The Group held cash balances of €2,642.8 million at March 31, 2023 and interest-bearing loans and borrowings (net of debt issue costs) of €9,324.3 million at March 31, 2023.31

Can someone explain how INEOS are going to pay back the £5-£6billion they are going to borrow to buy the club? Who is going to be saddled with the interest payments on that debt? What about Utds current debt which is approaching £969mil (ourstandingbtransfer fees included).
 
Calling Ratcliffe names it's like a playground in here, I get you don't want him as owner but come on you were all begging him to take over 18 months ago.

This jassim fella what's he ever done?where's his experience of running a football club, a bit of PR I'll invest a billion in infrastructure clear the debt etc has got everyone giddy, just cos Ratcliffe hasn't come out with the same statements he's a Rat.

I'll admit, I've wanted Ratcliffe all along and still do the thought of us being classed the same as City and Newcastle a sportswashing exercise no thanks not for me. Ratcliffe isn't a fool he knows what needs to be done with the club I'm sure we'll here all about it if he wins the bid which,at this stage is still a big if and if it turns out Qatar wins I'll just have to accept it like you lot will if Ratcliffe wins.

Great post.

Sadly the Mark Goldbridge generation have spoken though. They are very loud but don't have an awful lot to say really other than 'Rat' and 'Brexit Jim'.
 
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