Club ownership | Senior management team talk

It's funny, all this talk about Ratcliffe buying the club to create a legacy.

So far the only legacy he's leaving behind is being the guy who made fans think that Woodward wasn't that bad. In fairness, that's something alright.
 
golden_blunder said:
I wonder had SJR reached the stage yet where he’s questioning ever getting involved in a large, rundown, club like United where it’s bleeding money yet the obvious fix required for the sporting and structure side will need money, lots and lots of it
Click to expand...
He was never rich enough for this project.

Not sure the other option was in reality either, but they at least wanted to buy the whole thing.
 
devilish said:
The only experience INEOS has got is to constantly relegate Lausanne and not making it to CL qualification (Nice FC). It seems that they'll doing their very best to experience the two with Manchester United.
Click to expand...

At least they understand the sport to a degree though. They understand the rules and regulations, they understand business etc. as far as I’m aware Jassim had none of this and he also had much less wealth. Obviously it was probably a state backed bid, but then you’re opening up the ethical vs money argument again and to most people they wouldn’t compromise on their moral beliefs. And it’s not like they could come and pump money into the team anyway due to FFP/PSR. I reckon we’d have been just as much of a circus under them.
 
Nogbadthebad said:
He was never rich enough for this project.

Not sure the other option was in reality either, but they at least wanted to buy the whole thing.
Click to expand...

In terms of personal wealth SJR was wealthier than Jassim, from what was said at the time. Ineos as a whole were far wealthier.

I think initially SJR wanted to buy the whole club but also gave options for partial buyout. It was never even clear that the glazers wanted to sell, and in hindsight that looks to be the case considering they turned down the option. They they also did doubt the bid from Jassim and whether he even had the finances to buy the club, which he apparently failed to prove when asked.
 
Jed I. Knight said:
It's funny, all this talk about Ratcliffe buying the club to create a legacy.

So far the only legacy he's leaving behind is being the guy who made fans think that Woodward wasn't that bad. In fairness, that's something alright.
Click to expand...
He's come in and made the previous incompetent shower look apathetic but in control. I never had high hopes for them as the Sky cycling team they had was successful in spite of him and not because of him. It's also a completely different sport. They've arrogantly thought that with a bit of elbow grease and cost cutting they could make the club a monster again. Right now it doesnt appear they're able to execute on that at all.

Its surreal when you think about it, how they came in and are definitively worse than Woodward, so much so that it's obvious to everyone. And then their PR is a disaster so they draw attention to it even more.
 
pocco said:
At least they understand the sport to a degree though. They understand the rules and regulations, they understand business etc. as far as I’m aware Jassim had none of this and he also had much less wealth. Obviously it was probably a state backed bid, but then you’re opening up the ethical vs money argument again and to most people they wouldn’t compromise on their moral beliefs. And it’s not like they could come and pump money into the team anyway due to FFP/PSR. I reckon we’d have been just as much of a circus under them.
Click to expand...

Most football club owners had never owned a football club before. Also From what we have seen at united, nice and Lausanne they seem quite specialised in failing

Regarding psr/ffp there are ways to play around that. If the debt vanished then United can spend more on transfers. Meanwhile OT (+surrounding area) can be properly developed thus generating additional wealth (infrastructure doesn't fall in the psr/ffp domain). Finally someone like Saudi can buy some of our unwanted players. All we need is a proper plan and an owner whose willing to pump some serious money into the club
 
Jed I. Knight said:
It's funny, all this talk about Ratcliffe buying the club to create a legacy.

So far the only legacy he's leaving behind is being the guy who made fans think that Woodward wasn't that bad. In fairness, that's something alright.
Click to expand...

Fans are responsible for their own behavior.

pocco said:
In terms of personal wealth SJR was wealthier than Jassim, from what was said at the time. Ineos as a whole were far wealthier.

I think initially SJR wanted to buy the whole club but also gave options for partial buyout. It was never even clear that the glazers wanted to sell, and in hindsight that looks to be the case considering they turned down the option. They they also did doubt the bid from Jassim and whether he even had the finances to buy the club, which he apparently failed to prove when asked.
Click to expand...

Jassim was a plant by Qatar to make it appear he represented private interests and not a state bid.

They had enough money but were played by the Glazers. After Jassim stupidly revealed he wanted to do up Trafford (consent money), the leeches bled him dry.
 
pocco said:
In terms of personal wealth SJR was wealthier than Jassim, from what was said at the time. Ineos as a whole were far wealthier.

I think initially SJR wanted to buy the whole club but also gave options for partial buyout. It was never even clear that the glazers wanted to sell, and in hindsight that looks to be the case considering they turned down the option. They they also did doubt the bid from Jassim and whether he even had the finances to buy the club, which he apparently failed to prove when asked.
Click to expand...

Jim owns lots of stuff that is worth a lot of money. That is not the same thing as having the kind of funds available to put down 2 billion for a new stadium.

He is not going to liquidate his assets to fund the club, therefore his personal wealth is irrelevant here. He doesn't have the kind of cash needed to do the things he promised.
 
stefan92 said:
Yes absolutely. He never knew how to act, but at least he had a decent understanding of when to act. But that alone doesn't help. It's still better than this summer where the (interim) board neither knew how or when to act on questions like which manager should lead United into this season.
Click to expand...

Did he really? He refused LVG's offer to resign in the middle of his second season, and while we ended up winning the FA Cup, it was an awful season. He kept Mourinho for a third season even though it was obvious it wasn't going anywhere and at the same time seemed not to back him in the transfer market.

And none of those things happened right after he arrived at United with the club still rearranging things at the top like with INEOS.

So no, I would not really portray him as someone who understood when to act.
 
Amir said:
Did he really? He refused LVG's offer to resign in the middle of his second season, and while we ended up winning the FA Cup, it was an awful season. He kept Mourinho for a third season even though it was obvious it wasn't going anywhere and at the same time seemed not to back him in the transfer market.

And none of those things happened right after he arrived at United with the club still rearranging things at the top like with INEOS.

So no, I would not really portray him as someone who understood when to act.
Click to expand...
Mourinho was turning toxic by the end of that season but he had just led us to a 2nd place finish and an FA Cup final. Hardly grounds for sacking someone. In fact, it could be argued that Woodward's failure to properly support Mourinho, that summer, is what pushed him over the edge in the 3rd season.

Admittedly, football was leaving him behind but sacking him that off season wasn't on the cards and Woodward can't be blamed for that.
 
I've caught on to his master plan.

Force the team to be relegated, lowers value massively. Glazers forced to sell at low price, Radcliffe gains 100% control and rebuilds from the Championship.

I mean, its as likely as anything else these days :lol::lol:
 
jasT1981 said:
I've caught on to his master plan.

Force the team to be relegated, lowers value massively. Glazers forced to sell at low price, Radcliffe gains 100% control and rebuilds from the Championship.

I mean, its as likely as anything else these days :lol::lol:
Click to expand...

Not much of a master plan, current stock price is $17, he has to buy at $33, the original price he paid. If anything Glazers will take him to the cleaners.
 
AneRu said:
Mourinho was turning toxic by the end of that season but he had just led us to a 2nd place finish and an FA Cup final. Hardly grounds for sacking someone. In fact, it could be argued that Woodward's failure to properly support Mourinho, that summer, is what pushed him over the edge in the 3rd season.

Admittedly, football was leaving him behind but sacking him that off season wasn't on the cards and Woodward can't be blamed for that.
Click to expand...

Fooball administration with a bit of foresight looks beyond a second place finish and an FA Cup Final. It looks at the fact the team was miles behind the Champions and was never going to close the gap with that sort of football, it looks at the toxic atmosphere already created towards the end of the season, etc.

Most people could see we were going nowhere with Mourinho after the second season. If you can see that and don't sack him, you're not doing your job properly. And if you run and don't see it, maybe it's not the role for you.
 
gulli_G said:
Not much of a master plan, current stock price is $17, he has to buy at $33, the original price he paid. If anything Glazers will take him to the cleaners.
Click to expand...

I doubt it. He doesn't have that cash for that price for the rest of United. Feckin' Elon had to get financing to buy Twitter.

All these petty cost cutting is a PR activity -- window dressing of sorts for the next round of serious capital injection. External source.

He is showing potential new partners (top 5 richest men in the world or more likely sovereign funds) that he is ruthlessly trimming away the fat within the Club -- to make it more attractive for the next round.. he paid 80million quid for 1% of the club. So we are playing in that 8billion valuation league. There aren't many folks lift in that bracket.

I think he, like Woodward believes that United is a money machine regardless of its on field performance. Both existing revenue streams/model and unlocking future new business models. And reaching the potential 400-600 million GLOBAL United fans. That's his pitch to the uber-billionaires and sovereign funds.
 
Last edited:
Amir said:
So no, I would not really portray him as someone who understood when to act.
Click to expand...
He could have acted more in time sometimes, I agree. Which is why I said he had a decent understanding, not a great one.

After all it was absolutely clear that he demanded CL qualification and didn't accept failure to do so. It was a kind of standard that got lost after he left.

And I feel I should reiterate: everything I write on this topic shouldn't be seen as praising Woodward - he clearly was clueless and made massive mistakes. It's just that in my opinion INEOS made even worse mistakes than he did in regard to manager appointments. They did better than him in some other areas.
 
Crackers said:
He's come in and made the previous incompetent shower look apathetic but in control. I never had high hopes for them as the Sky cycling team they had was successful in spite of him and not because of him. It's also a completely different sport. They've arrogantly thought that with a bit of elbow grease and cost cutting they could make the club a monster again. Right now it doesnt appear they're able to execute on that at all.

Its surreal when you think about it, how they came in and are definitively worse than Woodward, so much so that it's obvious to everyone. And then their PR is a disaster so they draw attention to it even more.
Click to expand...
Its like Todd boehly without the ability to spend a billion on transfers
 
What did people expect from the new board and owners after 11 years of mismanagement, that they will come and fix everything in one summer window. INEOS maybe a failure eventually but to write them off or compare with glazers or compare Wilcox with Murtough and woodward is a joke.

They made a mess not sacking eth which deserves criticism but they did not assemble this pathetic squad. I said it some time back woodward was a clown but Murtough era caused even bigger damage. 500m plus on some dud. Antony, Sancho, Casemiro, Hojlund, Mount, offering new contracts to Shaw and Rashford. Signing Ragnick only to sack him after 6 months and not listening to any of his suggestions.

The mess is huge and it will take more than 2 windows to fix it. They have to be patient and so would the fans unfortunately. It is going to a bad ride. Ineos have to make sure no more mistakes as that would mean we go back by another 3 years.
 
idek2346 said:
They're taking the whole club within the next 12 months.
Click to expand...
Only way I think this can work is via a share swap between Ineos and The Glazers. SJR is not buying out the club at $33 per share. Would be a dumb thing to do given current share price, plus he probably doesn’t have that cash liquidity. He could maybe tempt Glazers by offering them some Ineos shares though in exchange for theirs. Would be a good deal for the Glazers if they could strike the right exchange price. Would need the few Ineos shareholders to agree, but SJR holds all the cards there.
 
Nogbadthebad said:
Jim owns lots of stuff that is worth a lot of money. That is not the same thing as having the kind of funds available to put down 2 billion for a new stadium.

He is not going to liquidate his assets to fund the club, therefore his personal wealth is irrelevant here. He doesn't have the kind of cash needed to do the things he promised.
Click to expand...

Is it just him or INEOS though? Look in the news on any given day and see the amount of money INEOS are spending on things. He/they can afford it if they want.
 
LordSpud said:


Translation: Relegation = dead club
Click to expand...

Not dead but we won't be competitive or relevant again for about 20 years. And we'll have to sign a bunch of shit journeymen players, but hey is that much different to our current squad?
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.