Club ownership | Senior management team talk

MadDogg said:
From memory there is in the short-term (the first 18 months?), but after that any price will be completely renegotiated. Of course, there's no reason to think that the Glazers would actually accept a significantly lower price just because the team is doing worse.
Click to expand...

This would surely mean they could renegotiate with anyone?

The devaluing the shares thing doesn't stand up really as SJR could end up losing alot of money in the short term if that's the case, maybe it's just more a case of them hammering home just how bad things are, so the Glazers follow through and sell them their remaining shares.
 
Windows been open for a while now and no transfers?! These guys are even more incompetent than I thought. If they don’t get a couple in before Sundays game at anfield, 7-0 will look like a good result.
 
C'est Moi Cantona said:
This would surely mean they could renegotiate with anyone?

The devaluing the shares thing doesn't stand up really as SJR could end up losing alot of money in the short term if that's the case, maybe it's just more a case of them hammering home just how bad things are, so the Glazers follow through and sell them their remaining shares.
Click to expand...
Yes. Going purely by memory, there's a window where only Ratcliffe can buy shares (I think 18 months) and there is probably a price locked into the contract. After that anybody can offer whatever they want for them, but if the Glazers accept the bid from anybody else then Ratcliffe has the right to match that bid and his will be the one accepted. On the flip side, if Ratcliffe does not match that bid then he will be forced to sell all his shares for the same price as the Glazers are getting. Technically a second buyer could probably buy the Glazer shares and not Ratcliffe's if he doesn't want to sell, but that's incredibly unlikely as the current deal of Ratcliffe/INEOS being in control of the football side of things would continue and I can't see anybody paying so much to not get full control. They'll have to buy him out too to get that control.

So basically, the way the deal was set up does indicate that the Glazers likely do want to sell in the future and that Ratcliffe does want to be the one to buy them out. It's no certainty, but it does seem the most likely scenario. How long it takes, and whether it'll be done in one go or in multiple smaller amounts, who knows. The more he gets, the easier it'll be for him to ultimately buy them out and the harder it'll be for any second party to come along and outbid him.

Bear in mind, everything I wrote here is just from memory so I might have a detail or two wrong.

Deliberately devaluing the shares only makes sense if the Glazers are desperate to sell soon, and that nobody else will come in to push the price back up to near where it currently is. So extremely unlikely in theory, and even more unlikely considering INEOS do seem to be trying to do the right thing with the new footballing structure even if some mistakes were made.
 
FlawlessThaw said:
Throw in their affiliation with Team Sky and Mercedes F1 since they got involved with either, you can understand a lack of confidence. Still better than the Glazers
Click to expand...
This is an interesting statement given they’re stooping lower than the Glazers ever have in culling the workforce and generally treating the lowest workers like soap scum to be routinely lopped off like we’re watching The Running Man or Squid Game come to life.

I think my only posts in here before INEOS even showed what they are was to question why anyone would blindly follow them and cheer for them as if they are saviours, especially so when knowing what Brexit Jim is and stands for.

This lot have done what to objectively state they are better than the parasites?
 
Skills said:
Woodward was generally more competent tbh.
Click to expand...
This has to be shot down, 100%.

Woodward is primarily the reason we are in such dire straits right now. The loss of Fergie and Gill at the same point was crippling. Gill was well thought of in European football circles, as a man who could aptly deal with the finance and football sides of the club. Woodward knew nothing about football, he managed to be promoted to CEO because he signed a few sponsorship deals. Crazy days.

You can chart the downfall there -
  1. Unable to acquire the right manager
  2. Unable to acquire the right backroom staff
  3. Inability to land transfer targets in the right age group/wage demands
  4. Neglect of the club training ground and stadium

Jury is still out on INEOS, but they sure do have a huge job on their hands to turn this mess around.
 
  • Like
Reactions: golden_blunder
JediSith said:
Anyone think this is just negotiation bluff. The last thing you want is an Ed Woodward “we can do things other clubs can’t in the market” and then get confused when you pay 50% more players.

But that said one of my fears with Ashworth leaving was the possibility that Ashworth was recommending players outside of INEOS budget
Click to expand...
Definitely not. What makes you think there is money to spend?
 
MadDogg said:
Yes. Going purely by memory, there's a window where only Ratcliffe can buy shares (I think 18 months) and there is probably a price locked into the contract. After that anybody can offer whatever they want for them, but if the Glazers accept the bid from anybody else then Ratcliffe has the right to match that bid and his will be the one accepted. On the flip side, if Ratcliffe does not match that bid then he will be forced to sell all his shares for the same price as the Glazers are getting. Technically a second buyer could probably buy the Glazer shares and not Ratcliffe's if he doesn't want to sell, but that's incredibly unlikely as the current deal of Ratcliffe/INEOS being in control of the football side of things would continue and I can't see anybody paying so much to not get full control. They'll have to buy him out too to get that control.

So basically, the way the deal was set up does indicate that the Glazers likely do want to sell in the future and that Ratcliffe does want to be the one to buy them out. It's no certainty, but it does seem the most likely scenario. How long it takes, and whether it'll be done in one go or in multiple smaller amounts, who knows. The more he gets, the easier it'll be for him to ultimately buy them out and the harder it'll be for any second party to come along and outbid him.

Bear in mind, everything I wrote here is just from memory so I might have a detail or two wrong.

Deliberately devaluing the shares only makes sense if the Glazers are desperate to sell soon, and that nobody else will come in to push the price back up to near where it currently is. So extremely unlikely in theory, and even more unlikely considering INEOS do seem to be trying to do the right thing with the new footballing structure even if some mistakes were made.
Click to expand...

Thanks, that all seems to stack up.

I can't think of a single reason why the Glazers wouldn't want to sell, or why Inoes would want/be able to buy a minority to then take full control, and take all the flak (in some people's eyes) for trying to unpick the mess the Glazers have made of the club, without assurances on both sides that they will buy the Glazers remaining shares in the very near future.

The only way I can see for this not to make sense is if Ineos wanted to make a quick profit and have their shares sold along with the Glazers once the club is back on track, but SJR is no way in it for that imo.

There's no dividends any time soon for the Glazers, no loading more debt on the club, and a long road until we see any benefit from any new stadium, etc, so it's easy to see this 18 month timeframe for Ineos buying them out actually happening, this was always their intention for the leveraged buyout anyway, so why wouldn't it.

Then maybe with alot of the dirty work already done, a new stadium maybe announced, and Amorim hopefully doing better, people will feel alot better about things.
 
The Constant Gardener said:
This has to be shot down, 100%.

Woodward is primarily the reason we are in such dire straits right now. The loss of Fergie and Gill at the same point was crippling. Gill was well thought of in European football circles, as a man who could aptly deal with the finance and football sides of the club. Woodward knew nothing about football, he managed to be promoted to CEO because he signed a few sponsorship deals. Crazy days.

You can chart the downfall there -
  1. Unable to acquire the right manager
  2. Unable to acquire the right backroom staff
  3. Inability to land transfer targets in the right age group/wage demands
  4. Neglect of the club training ground and stadium

Jury is still out on INEOS, but they sure do have a huge job on their hands to turn this mess around.
Click to expand...
It's hard to blame the decline on any one person or factor, but he's definitely one of the main ones. The most dangerous mix of incompetence and hubris this club has ever seen.
 
Fortitude said:
This is an interesting statement given they’re stooping lower than the Glazers ever have in culling the workforce and generally treating the lowest workers like soap scum to be routinely lopped off like we’re watching The Running Man or Squid Game come to life.

I think my only posts in here before INEOS even showed what they are was to question why anyone would blindly follow them and cheer for them as if they are saviours, especially so when knowing what Brexit Jim is and stands for.

This lot have done what to objectively state they are better than the parasites?
Click to expand...
I expect them to actually run us like a business. That comes with the obvious negatives (cost-cutting and treating staff like shit) but I expect in the longer term there will be more focus on actually getting us successful on the pitch (as eventually being successful on the pitch increases revenue more than it increases costs). Whether they can actually do it remains to be seen, but there's a much greater chance than we had previously. Some mistakes in the first 12 months (largely just cleaning up the mess left from the Glazers) doesn't change that.

The Glazers are trust fund babies who had no idea what they were doing and it resulted in incompetence and stagnation throughout the entire club.

It's a shame we couldn't get owners who were good people and respected the staff and fans while also being getting us run properly, but unfortunately the number of people who would do that while being rich enough to actually buy us is incredibly small. Unfortunately pretty much anybody who could afford the club is going to be a prick who uses their power and money to hold others down.
 
The Constant Gardener said:
This has to be shot down, 100%.

Woodward is primarily the reason we are in such dire straits right now. The loss of Fergie and Gill at the same point was crippling. Gill was well thought of in European football circles, as a man who could aptly deal with the finance and football sides of the club. Woodward knew nothing about football, he managed to be promoted to CEO because he signed a few sponsorship deals. Crazy days.

You can chart the downfall there -
  1. Unable to acquire the right manager
  2. Unable to acquire the right backroom staff
  3. Inability to land transfer targets in the right age group/wage demands
  4. Neglect of the club training ground and stadium

Jury is still out on INEOS, but they sure do have a huge job on their hands to turn this mess around.
Click to expand...
While you are generally right Woodward still seemed to have a better understanding about when the end of a road was reached. There is no way he would have kept EtH in the summer.

But as you say after the right call he would probably have messed up the following appointment. Nonetheless I think overall last summer wouldn't have been worse with him in charge.
 
pocco said:
I’d still make the same decision. I wouldn’t be surprised if we were as much or more of a shit show under the Qataris anyway. They have even less experience in football and apparently he didn’t even have much money to his name relatively speaking in terms of buying a club (~$6b net worth was it?). They’d have been hamstrung by the PSR/FFP rules anyway even if they did have the money.
Click to expand...
The only experience INEOS has got is to constantly relegate Lausanne and not making it to CL qualification (Nice FC). It seems that they'll doing their very best to experience the two with Manchester United.
 
We are only 6 weeks away from the Glazers being allowed to listen to offers from parties wanting to buy Man Utd.
You forget that we're only part way through the sale process and that there is likely plenty more drama/turmoil before the start of next season.
 
SouthernRedDev said:
We are only 6 weeks away from the Glazers being allowed to listen to offers from parties wanting to buy Man Utd.
You forget that we're only part way through the sale process and that there is likely plenty more drama/turmoil before the start of next season.
Click to expand...

Ronaldo's comments makes me think the Saudis are gearing up for something with him as their front man.
 
Laurencio said:
Ronaldo's comments makes me think the Saudis are gearing up for something with him as their front man.
Click to expand...

Worse then the Qatar/Beckham axis. It'd be funny if Saudi did and discarded the Geordie sellouts, albeit briefly.

Is it something up with previous number 7s?

Bestie's miserable descent into an early grave, Robbo caught advising some real scumbags, Beckham hocking himself to Qatar. The WC winning di Maria still being Angel di Maria. Cantona doing gambling ads (he's still cool af).

Have Ineos used Mason Mount as the face of their bid?

Judas said:
Of course they can, you think they couldn’t bend the rules like they did with the Newcastle takeover? Not that I believe there’s anything in it, but the system is broken.
Click to expand...

Nope, they would not get off with it. It's United.

Anyway, Ireland is getting a sovereign wealth fund going, so maybe they'll buy out the Glazers and put Gerry Adams in as our chief executive. We could all wear balaclavas to celebrate.

Crazier things...
 
I wonder had SJR reached the stage yet where he’s questioning ever getting involved in a large, rundown, club like United where it’s bleeding money yet the obvious fix required for the sporting and structure side will need money, lots and lots of it
 
MadDogg said:
Yes. Going purely by memory, there's a window where only Ratcliffe can buy shares (I think 18 months) and there is probably a price locked into the contract. After that anybody can offer whatever they want for them, but if the Glazers accept the bid from anybody else then Ratcliffe has the right to match that bid and his will be the one accepted. On the flip side, if Ratcliffe does not match that bid then he will be forced to sell all his shares for the same price as the Glazers are getting. Technically a second buyer could probably buy the Glazer shares and not Ratcliffe's if he doesn't want to sell, but that's incredibly unlikely as the current deal of Ratcliffe/INEOS being in control of the football side of things would continue and I can't see anybody paying so much to not get full control. They'll have to buy him out too to get that control.

So basically, the way the deal was set up does indicate that the Glazers likely do want to sell in the future and that Ratcliffe does want to be the one to buy them out. It's no certainty, but it does seem the most likely scenario. How long it takes, and whether it'll be done in one go or in multiple smaller amounts, who knows. The more he gets, the easier it'll be for him to ultimately buy them out and the harder it'll be for any second party to come along and outbid him.

Bear in mind, everything I wrote here is just from memory so I might have a detail or two wrong.

Deliberately devaluing the shares only makes sense if the Glazers are desperate to sell soon, and that nobody else will come in to push the price back up to near where it currently is. So extremely unlikely in theory, and even more unlikely considering INEOS do seem to be trying to do the right thing with the new footballing structure even if some mistakes were made.
Click to expand...
I think you are basically correct from memory. The fact it’s been reported about the Qatar bid again over the last week or so, makes me wonder about smoke and fire.
 
SJR put the mars bar in his trolley, then on his way to the checkout dropped it on the floor and stamped on it a bit in the hope of getting a nice yellow markdown label
 
stefan92 said:
While you are generally right Woodward still seemed to have a better understanding about when the end of a road was reached. There is no way he would have kept EtH in the summer.

But as you say after the right call he would probably have messed up the following appointment. Nonetheless I think overall last summer wouldn't have been worse with him in charge.
Click to expand...

Ultimately, look at our state when he took over in the middle of 2013 compared with it when he left at the end of 2021. That's all you need to know.
 
Amir said:
Ultimately, look at our state when he took over in the middle of 2013 compared with it when he left at the end of 2021. That's all you need to know.
Click to expand...
Yes absolutely. He never knew how to act, but at least he had a decent understanding of when to act. But that alone doesn't help. It's still better than this summer where the (interim) board neither knew how or when to act on questions like which manager should lead United into this season.
 
golden_blunder said:
I wonder had SJR reached the stage yet where he’s questioning ever getting involved in a large, rundown, club like United where it’s bleeding money yet the obvious fix required for the sporting and structure side will need money, lots and lots of it
Click to expand...

Can't see how he wouldn't have factored all of the above beforehand.

A businessman and such. A ruthless one.
 
redNATION said:
Windows been open for a while now and no transfers?! These guys are even more incompetent than I thought. If they don’t get a couple in before Sundays game at anfield, 7-0 will look like a good result.
Click to expand...
Our hands are tied with PSR unless we can convince some mugs to buy some of our shocking players. We could breach it I guess but a points deduction would put us in even more of a relegation battle.
 
Made some good moves initially but I can’t see how they get us out of this mess. The firing of Ashworth, the constant penny pinching and the terrible results on the pitch have made me lose even more confidence in them. I hope they prove me wrong but right now things are looking very bleak.
 
golden_blunder said:
I wonder had SJR reached the stage yet where he’s questioning ever getting involved in a large, rundown, club like United where it’s bleeding money yet the obvious fix required for the sporting and structure side will need money, lots and lots of it
Click to expand...

I highly doubt it. You can't say the guys not business smart enough to look into all this before hand.

Edit: I'll add as well, I think the guys ego wants him to be the savour of Man Utd. His age, his wealth I think its not a problem.
 
Last edited:
golden_blunder said:
I suppose what I’m wondering is did he know the extent of it? Has he been surprised by what he’s found? Is it worse than expected?
Click to expand...
He might not be suprised by it but whether he and his team have the ability to turn things around is highly debatable given how badly they have managed things so far and their record in sports generally
 
astracrazy said:
I highly doubt it. You can't say the guys not business smart enough to look into all this before hand.

Edit: I'll add as well, I think the guys ego wants him to be the savour of Man Utd. His age, his wealth I think its not a problem.
Click to expand...
A shrewd business man knows when he should abandon a sinking ship
 
Laurencio said:
He already has an exit plan in place. If it all gets too much, he can just not buy the rest of the shares and sell it all to some state backed bid.
Click to expand...
I think we are heading there or maybe that was the plan all along
 
What do they have lined up this week .
Strangling a cat ?
Throw water at a homeless person?
Push a old woman down a flight of stairs?
 
golden_blunder said:
I suppose what I’m wondering is did he know the extent of it? Has he been surprised by what he’s found? Is it worse than expected?
Click to expand...
He would have had access to the books and anything he wanted. He knew exactly what he was getting into, he just wanted a piece of United. This is clear by how he went from 100% bid to 50% to 27% etc. Time will tell if he’s made us worse or will improve us.
 
FrankDrebin said:
What do they have lined up this week .
Strangling a cat ?
Throw water at a homeless person?
Push a old woman down a flight of stairs?
Click to expand...
He probably regrets that sir Matt and sir Bobby aren't around anymore so he he can sack them
 
You must log in or register to reply here.