Chelsea 2020/21 - General discussion

CM10 said:
macheda14 said:
I don’t think I’ve ever seen such a first 11 overhaul in my life.

Peresic (og)...... Werner (n).......Ziyech (n)
...............Mount (og) .......Havertz (n)...........
...............................kante (og)
Chilwell (n).. Silva (n) .... Rudiger(og) James(og)
................................. Mendy (n)

And supposedly they still want Declan Rice. That’s currently 6 new first team players and could be 7. It’s crazy.
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Excuse me? :eek:
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Rajiztar said:
Though your front line players are very good they are not elite level players yet. May be they will grow into elite level players but they are very inconsistent to consider in that bracket as of now.

That's why you need some one like Sancho. I consider only Bruno the elite level player in your team not even pogba with his inconsistent performances for you ever since he signed for you.

Your team need upgrade in LB, Pacey CB, winger and if you can one back up or better DM than matic.
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And Pulisic, Werner, Ziyech front line are also not elite as well. Overall your XI isn't better than ours on paper. It's pretty much equal nothing more or less.
 
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macheda14 said:
I don’t think I’ve ever seen such a first 11 overhaul in my life.

Peresic (og)...... Werner (n).......Ziyech (n)
...............Mount (og) .......Havertz (n)...........
...............................kante (og)
Chilwell (n).. Silva (n) .... Rudiger(og) James(og)
................................. Mendy (n)

And supposedly they still want Declan Rice. That’s currently 6 new first team players and could be 7. It’s crazy.
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It's a lot of new faces certainly, although depending on formation most of them will still have to compete for their places. We still have Kovacic to fit in and the likes of RLC and CHO will be pushing hard for their places.
 
macheda14 said:
I don’t think I’ve ever seen such a first 11 overhaul in my life.

Pulisic (og)...... Werner (n).......Ziyech (n)
...............Mount (og) .......Havertz (n)...........
...............................kante (og)
Chilwell (n).. Silva (n) .... Rudiger(og) James(og)
................................. Mendy (n)

And supposedly they still want Declan Rice. That’s currently 6 new first team players and could be 7. It’s crazy.
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Its a rebuild and Frank's got his work cut out to integrate everyone into his chosen system of play.

It won't happen all at once and certain players are not even training with the squad yet. The international break doesn't help either. Liverpool and City will carry over a certain momentum from last season but Chelsea will have to start again.

I don't think Rice will happen.
 
Do people really see Chelsea playing Mount and Havertz together as twin 8s? It seems much more likely to me that you'll typically see two from the Kante/Kovacic/Jorginho/RLC group, then one more attacking central midfielder. The team already has some defensive questions, playing two very attacking oriented central midfielders in a three isn't going to help balance the side.
 
Powderfinger said:
Do people really see Chelsea playing Mount and Havertz together as twin 8s? It seems much more likely to me that you'll typically see two from the Kante/Kovacic/Jorginho/RLC group, then one more attacking central midfielder. The team already has some defensive questions, playing two very attacking oriented central midfielders in a three isn't going to help balance the side.
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That's how we played against City, with a midfield of Mount - Kante - Barkley. Since the restart with everyone fit, more likely than not we've played a 4-3-3.

If we do play 4-2-3-1 then Kovacic / Kante is the likely double pivot, but that has issues (both are at their best when they can either carry / press vertically next to a true sitting midfielder). The other problem is that there's no easy fit for Mount there, and he's by far our most important player from a pressing perspective.
 
Powderfinger said:
Do people really see Chelsea playing Mount and Havertz together as twin 8s? It seems much more likely to me that you'll typically see two from the Kante/Kovacic/Jorginho/RLC group, then one more attacking central midfielder. The team already has some defensive questions, playing two very attacking oriented central midfielders in a three isn't going to help balance the side.
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I do indeed see them playing together quite often. It's pretty well known that Havertz isn't exactly enthusiastic about pressing and defensive work. Mount plays like a pitbull on the other hand and should compliment Kai well.

Probably not in the very biggest games, though, where we'll need a stronger screen for the defense.
 
Orc said:
I do indeed see them playing together quite often. It's pretty well known that Havertz isn't exactly enthusiastic about pressing and defensive work. Mount plays like a pitbull on the other hand and should compliment Kai well.

Probably not in the very biggest games, though, where we'll need a stronger screen for the defense.
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I agree. I think for the bigger games we'll likely see a 4-2-3-1 with Kante/Kovacic at the base and Havertz behind Werner at CAM. Makes us a bit more solid defensively without sacrificing much in attack. Against packed defenses though I think we'll see more of the 4-3-3 with Mount and Havertz as advanced 8s with Kante behind them. Safe to say we'll play on the front foot in most games than not this season so we'll see more of Mount and Havertz together unless one of Barkley or RLC hits a great spell of form/ Kovacic surprisingly becomes more productive in the final third.
 
UNITED ACADEMY said:
And Pulisic, Werner, Ziyech front line are also not elite as well. Overall your XI isn't better than ours on paper. It's pretty much equal nothing more or less.
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Friend I am not claiming Chelsea front is better than United front three. In fact Chelsea front 3 not even play single match in PL together. I just thought you are overestimated your front 3.
 
Rajiztar said:
I just thought you are overestimated your front 3.
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I agree with this, alot of Manutd fans overestimate our front 3 and claim we need a CB urgently.

We have a front 3 that is inconsistent. Martial is probably the one over the last season who has claimed to be approaching elite level, the other 2 are no where near elite yet.

Greenwood only started regularly post lockdown and in the last 3/4 matches went missing. He will continue to be in and out of games for another season or two because he is only 18.

Rashford seems to me like he has 0 confidence at the moment. He keeps getting run down to the ground and gets injured.
 
Ziyech is out, Havertz will get his debut vs Brighton and surprisingly, Pulisic is fit again. We were told he would almost certainly miss the start of the season.

 
WeePat said:
Ziyech is out, Havertz will get his debut vs Brighton and surprisingly, Pulisic is fit again. We were told he would almost certainly miss the start of the season.
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Let’s hope they aren’t rushing Pulisic back because Ziyech is out. I don’t want him to ruin his knees.
 
SirReginald said:
Let’s hope they aren’t rushing Pulisic back because Ziyech is out. I don’t want him to ruin his knees.
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I suspect he might just be an insurance policy on the bench, in case we struggle. With Ziyech out and Pulisic not starting, Havertz will most likely start in the front three instead the 8 we've been talking about for so long.
 
Rajiztar said:
Friend I am not claiming Chelsea front is better than United front three. In fact Chelsea front 3 not even play single match in PL together. I just thought you are overestimated your front 3.
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Where do you see the overestimate? Quote it! I don't think you even read the post you replied to.

I only said both Chelsea & United front three are on similar level on paper which you have admitted it yourself by not denying it.
 
Think Havertz will almost certainly start on the right wing then until Ziyech is fit. Thankfully he's well used to playing there so it won't be blunting his effectiveness.

Probably be a front 4 of Werner, Pulisic, Mount, and Havertz.
 
That GK Mendy is probably coming soon but do you expect more signings after him or he's the last one this summer? Question for Chelsea fans of course.
 
BorisManUtd said:
That GK Mendy is probably coming soon but do you expect more signings after him or he's the last one this summer? Question for Chelsea fans of course.
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I would think thats it, but the clubs been linked to rice all summer so maybe that but we should be done.
 
romufc said:
I agree with this, alot of Manutd fans overestimate our front 3 and claim we need a CB urgently.

We have a front 3 that is inconsistent. Martial is probably the one over the last season who has claimed to be approaching elite level, the other 2 are no where near elite yet.

Greenwood only started regularly post lockdown and in the last 3/4 matches went missing. He will continue to be in and out of games for another season or two because he is only 18.

Rashford seems to me like he has 0 confidence at the moment. He keeps getting run down to the ground and gets injured.
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Yes. I didn't try to say they are bad. Actually they have great potential but just can't play whole season as they are very young. So why I particularly think you need one or two wingers two compliment the three strikers.
 
Orc said:
Think Havertz will almost certainly start on the right wing then until Ziyech is fit. Thankfully he's well used to playing there so it won't be blunting his effectiveness.

Probably be a front 4 of Werner, Pulisic, Mount, and Havertz.
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I would be surprised if Pulisic starts. if I'm honest. I think we can expect some variation of a CHO Werner Havertz front three.
 
BorisManUtd said:
That GK Mendy is probably coming soon but do you expect more signings after him or he's the last one this summer? Question for Chelsea fans of course.
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Can't see any more after Mendy personally, but then again I don't think any of us expected such a massive window anyway, so who knows?
 
Only 5 players to go. Then chelsea will have whole new 11s.
 
TheMagicFoolBus said:
Word is we've reached personal terms with Mendy - seems that this transfer is a matter of when not if at this point:

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I don't know an awful lot about him, but this one strikes me as a stop-gap until we can have a proper go at someone like Donnarumma next summer.
 
WeePat said:
I don't know an awful lot about him, but this one strikes me as a stop-gap until we can have a proper go at someone like Donnarumma next summer.
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He's a good all-around goalkeeper. I'd be hard-pressed to call him elite in any category aside from cross collection, but he's an above average shot stopper (9th in the top 5 leagues in save percentage last year) with very decent distribution numbers. I don't think he's likely to win too many matches on his own, but unlike Kepa he's equally unlikely to cost us.

He may still have potential to improve despite his age given how few seasons he's been playing top tier football, but even if he doesn't as you say he's a more than adequate backup and certainly a monumental upgrade on Kepa for this year.
 
WeePat said:
I don't know an awful lot about him, but this one strikes me as a stop-gap until we can have a proper go at someone like Donnarumma next summer.
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Donnaruma should be bought now when he has a year left no chance raiola makes him see it out and leave for free
 
Never really got the hype with Donnarumma, I think the fact he made it through at 16 gives the impression he's better than he actually is. Maybe I've watched him at the wrong times but he seems far too error phrone.

If Mendy is anything from above average I'll rather stick with him until a standout option becomes available or even better, an academy goalkeeper explodes into contention.
 
TheMagicFoolBus said:
He's a good all-around goalkeeper. I'd be hard-pressed to call him elite in any category aside from cross collection, but he's an above average shot stopper (9th in the top 5 leagues in save percentage last year) with very decent distribution numbers. I don't think he's likely to win too many matches on his own, but unlike Kepa he's equally unlikely to cost us.

He may still have potential to improve despite his age given how few seasons he's been playing top tier football, but even if he doesn't as you say he's a more than adequate backup and certainly a monumental upgrade on Kepa for this year.
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We just need him to not lose us games tbh. I watched an analytical video on his attributes. What I got from that was that he's a good shot stopper, a good command of his box, but that he has the occasional brain fart when he's trying to play the ball out, specifically when he rushes out trying to be a sweeper keeper.
 
WeePat said:
We just need him to not lose us games tbh. I watched an analytical video on his attributes. What I got from that was that he's a good shot stopper, a good command of his box, but that he has the occasional brain fart when he's trying to play the ball out, specifically when he rushes out trying to be a sweeper keeper.
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My point of view is that if Cech rates him, that's good enough for me!
 
Dancfc said:
Never really got the hype with Donnarumma, I think the fact he made it through at 16 gives the impression he's better than he actually is. Maybe I've watched him at the wrong times but he seems far too error phrone.

If Mendy is anything from above average I'll rather stick with him until a standout option becomes available or even better, an academy goalkeeper explodes into contention.
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His breakthrough coincided with a terrible era for Milan. He's played in some terrible teams, in fairness to him.

I'm not dead set on him anyway. He was just an example, but you agree with general point anyway - if Mendy turns not to be a disaster, he can hold the fort until the ideal candidate becomes available.
 
TheMagicFoolBus said:
My point of view is that if Cech rates him, that's good enough for me!
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Which is fair enough.

It's the same view I took with Chilwell. I wasn't completely sold on him, especially for the £60+ fees being bandied about, but Lampard really wanted him, so I was cool with it.
 
WeePat said:
Which is fair enough.

It's the same view I took with Chilwell. I wasn't completely sold on him, especially for the £60+ fees being bandied about, but Lampard really wanted him, so I was cool with it.
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Yeah agreed. I'm also firmly ensconced in the "anyone but Alonso / Emerson" and "anyone but Kepa" camps so my view is that anyone who comes in is likely to be an improvement, even if they aren't necessarily world class. Chilwell at 80m was totally unpalatable for me but 45m is a reasonable fee. Seems we'll be negotiating something similarly efficient from a value perspective for Mendy.
 
So apart from ziyech and chilwell every one in the squad will be in contention for season opener. Today press conference will be interesting.

Lampard already quoted "I don't expect any leniency from Chelsea board. I have a good team and it's upto me and my coaching staffs to make them better as a team and challenge the top 2".

Come on Super Frank. It's upto you.
 
James Peril said:
I think I’m too old to be riled up about opposing fans’ take on United-players, it’s kind of the name of the game before a season starts. Even Arsenal-fans have hopes this season, they will be crushed of course.

The guy’s right on Bruno though, he isn’t top tier. In terms of output yes, but there’s a long way to go in terms of dictating matches outside free-kicks, corners and shots. He’s de Bruyne without the last 15%, which makes a very good player still and certainly amongst the best in the league.
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So his amongst the best in the league but not top tier?
 
Brwned said:
Definitely think it's possible and makes sense for both sides
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How low would you go?
£50m, £40m, £30m?

I'm torn. I still like his energy and ability to intercept and head off attacks. He just doesn't seem to do that so much these days. Maybe he needs the team to sit a bit deeper and not persist on the this high press?
 
Brwned said:
Definitely think it's possible and makes sense for both sides
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Utd need another midfielder? Already got McTominay and Matic in this position.

Why would Utd would want another midfielder, totally stacked squad in the middle of the park?

Good to see Lampard comments, I hope we'll manage to fit our academy players in the team still despite all the signings. Ampadu and Tomori look like they'll get experience at other premier league clubs at least. Need give game time to RLC, CHO, Abraham, Gilmour, Mount and Christensen. Given the insane schedule this season should be possible for them all to get lots of minutes.
 
He would walk into the United midfield, but I find it impossible to believe Chelsea would entertain the idea of selling him to United. I understand the concerns about him; he's been injured quite a bit in the last 18 months and he turns 30 this season.

I think we should keep him regardless, but I was willing to entertain a silly offer from a team like PSG. If £50m is the going rate though, please keep him.
 
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