Canadian Politics

There's no way Charest beats Poilievre in the CPC leadership race, so with Brown out of the way, it seems pretty much a given that Poilievre will win.

I don't think he can win a minority (let alone a majority) government due to his ideas - but his rhetoric and arguments will drag political discussion through the mud and increase polarization, which is already getting bad. It's worrying.

(Telling him to move south is nonsense though. Of course he wants to move the country where he lives in the direction he likes, that's what politicians do.)
 
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Considering that we have seen BoJo resign today after years marred by scandals, dragging into the mud and polarization in the UK, the last thing our country needs is the same crap that has destroyed the political climate in both the US and the UK. Loons of that type should NOT be allowed to run for leadrship at one of the major political parties.

And I thought we had enough with Maxime Bernier being the biggest clown of all already. He was kicked out of the Conservative Party because he was that much radical.
 
Now if we could just oust our own scandal ridden sorry excuse for a Prime Minister.
 
Dr. Dwayne said:
Now if we could just oust our own scandal ridden sorry excuse for a Prime Minister.
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I can't believe what poor leaders we have across the board. He looks, at worst, average when you stack him up against his contemporaries both domestically and internationally.

Our provincial election put up a potato and plain yoghurt against grease and the majority chose to stay home, unsurprisingly.
 
Cheimoon said:
There's no way Charest beats Poilievre in the CPC leadership race, so with Brown out of the way, it seems pretty much a given that Poilievre will win.

I don't think he can win a minority (let alone a majority) government due to his ideas - buy his rhetoric and arguments will drag political discussion through the mud and increase polarization, which is already getting bad. It's worrying.

(Telling him to move south is nonsense though. Of course he wants to move the country where he lives in the direction he likes, that's what politicians do.)
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Don't underestimate what is going on now in a lot of areas.
 
This is in the context of the upcoming provincial election in Quebec. Fecking hell! :mad: :mad: :mad:

'80 per cent of immigrants go to Montreal, don't work, don't speak French': CAQ immigration minister (CTV News)

If you wanted to find a grade A obnoxious cnut in all of Canada, he is the one. People like him bring disgrace and shame upon my home province. Using the pun that goes with his name in French, "boulet" means the ball that goes with chains. In other words, that minister is a dead weight, especially when he fails to explain why the percentage of immigrants with a college degree is considerably higher than for those born in Quebec.
 
RedDevilQuebecois said:
This is in the context of the upcoming provincial election in Quebec. Fecking hell! :mad: :mad: :mad:

'80 per cent of immigrants go to Montreal, don't work, don't speak French': CAQ immigration minister (CTV News)

If you wanted to find a grade A obnoxious cnut in all of Canada, he is the one. People like him bring disgrace and shame upon my home province. Using the pun that goes with his name in French, "boulet" means the ball that goes with chains. In other words, that minister is a dead weight, especially when he fails to explain why the percentage of immigrants with a college degree is considerably higher than for those born in Quebec.
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He also doesn't understand that one of the reasons is the presence of International Civil Aviation Organization and International Air Transport Association in Montreal. Take them away from Montreal and it loses a lot of it's importance.
 
Foxbatt said:
He also doesn't understand that one of the reasons is the presence of International Civil Aviation Organization and International Air Transport Association in Montreal. Take them away from Montreal and it loses a lot of it's importance.
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Indeed. The rest of the province should show a lot more gratitude towards this city for giving international visibility.

My personal feeling is that further negligence and disdain from successive provincial governments towards Montreal will see a growing sentiment of Metropolitan Montrealers wanting the region to become its own province down the road. Let's not kid ourselves: we people in the metropolitan area see and feel a lot of nearly irreconcilable differences with the rest of the province.
 
RedDevilQuebecois said:
This is in the context of the upcoming provincial election in Quebec. Fecking hell! :mad: :mad: :mad:

'80 per cent of immigrants go to Montreal, don't work, don't speak French': CAQ immigration minister (CTV News)

If you wanted to find a grade A obnoxious cnut in all of Canada, he is the one. People like him bring disgrace and shame upon my home province. Using the pun that goes with his name in French, "boulet" means the ball that goes with chains. In other words, that minister is a dead weight, especially when he fails to explain why the percentage of immigrants with a college degree is considerably higher than for those born in Quebec.
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Ha, and then Legault of all people chastises him for saying what he really means! The Legault who the very same day said that allowing more than 50k immigrants into Quebec annually would be 'a bit suicidal' - and earlier directly linked immigration to violence and radicalization. (Each time apologizing afterwards for having poorly expressed his actual thoughts - just like Boulet here.)

It's not the biggest electoral issue, but if anyone had any doubt left about xenophobia running rampant in the CAQ - well, not anymore. Of course they'll win a big majority anyway though.

(Although immigration of course should be a huge issue, cause while it can't stop the demographic time bomb of aging, it will help slow down its effects. Basically opting out of that approach is huge for the next few decades.)
 
RedDevilQuebecois said:
Indeed. The rest of the province should show a lot more gratitude towards this city for giving international visibility.

My personal feeling is that further negligence and disdain from successive provincial governments towards Montreal will see a growing sentiment of Metropolitan Montrealers wanting the region to become its own province down the road. Let's not kid ourselves: we people in the metropolitan area see and feel a lot of nearly irreconcilable differences with the rest of the province.
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They already want it as the sentiment is growing more now. Not a province as such but independent from Quebec. Montreal is very upset at the rhetoric from Quebec because they know that they will lose the headquarters of both the International Civil Aviation Organization and International Air Transport Association if Quebec creates problems like this. There have been attempts by other countries to move them and it nearly succeeded but the federal government with the help of other friendly countries managed to avert it. Then that idiot Pauline Marois comes to the General Assembly of ICAO and tells everyone how different Quebec is to all other provinces. All the ministers from the other countries were looking at each other and thinking WTF? Here ICAO was trying to unite everyone and she is trying to divide?

As for immigration, they have their own regulations for immigration that's unlike any other province so I don't know what they are talking about.
 
So, another four year of boomer politics in Quebec after that resounding CAQ win. I mean, their party platform is really just a best of Quebec boomer opinions: fewer non-white immigrants (disguise: protect Quebec's unique identity), less Ottawa, a capitalist view of society, little care for climate change - and that's about it. Sigh.

Most striking actually is how the voting percentages translate into seats. Quebec's parliament has 125 seats, and this is how they are divided:

Party% of votes# of seats% of seats
CAQ41.0%9072.0%
PLQ14.4%2116.8%
QS15.4%118.8%
PQ14.6%32.4%
PCQ12.9%00%

Unsurprisingly, there is now a lot of discussion about the first-past-the-post system that's used throughout Canada - but I don't expect any change. The CAQ was all for change before they got into power, but that largely stopped once they got their big majority, and they won't care any more now, and neither will the PLQ - just as every party that wins the election immediately seems to forget that electoral reform once seemed like a good idea. Short-term power grabs for the win!
 
Cheimoon said:
So, another four year of boomer politics in Quebec after that resounding CAQ win. I mean, their party platform is really just a best of Quebec boomer opinions: fewer non-white immigrants (disguise: protect Quebec's unique identity), less Ottawa, a capitalist view of society, little care for climate change - and that's about it. Sigh.
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Sad days ahead indeed with that CAQ majority.

The PLQ's wins are mostly concentrated within the Metropolitan Montreal area. It may remind our British friends of how the SNP controls Scotland, but it clearly testifies the large disconnection between Montreal and the rest of the province as I wrote the other day about it. Considering that everything that has gone with the PLQ in the last few years (undertones of racism from the outside against the party's leader, a purge of the old and corrupt farts from the Charest/Couillard era, a recent shift from the party to the left, defections from some MPs, etc.), it was a decent night for them and a clear middle finger from Montreal to CAQ.

Meanwhile, QS had their shot before they ended up shooting themselves in the foot in recent times. I think they need someone different and better of a chess player than Gabriel Nadeau-Dubois if they want to eventually gain more than 10-11 seats in the entire province. It's almost like the same mirror problem as the NDP at federal level. Success is not just about words and charisma; there are subtleties to master in the game.

Indeed we can debate a long time about the political system, but we all know the rules before we play the game. So it's up to all parties to learn and adapt. That being said, I only wish Metropolitan Montreal to be far more represented with at least half of the seats if we are to go by proportional representation. Of course, that won't pass because non-urban regions would scream murder as usual as they do everywhere worldwide.

In the midst of the depressing part where CAQ got its majority, the palm for worst miscreants and morons in the world yesterday has to go to the people of Rouyn-Noranda–Témiscamingue and Trois-Rivières. In the case of Rouyn-Noranda–Témiscamingue, they voted for CAQ by electing a former Liberal on a 15-year political hiatus even though that district was clearly neglected by CAQ regarding the highly polluting Horne Smelter and its arsenic emissions. In Trois-Rivières, they voted for that racist cnut of immigration minister who should have been kicked out of the party instead of showing his face as a candidate. What does that say about the people in that county? No need to add on that part, I guess.

We are so, so fecked.
 
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RedDevilQuebecois said:
The PLQ's wins are mostly concentrated within the Metropolitan Montreal area. It may remind our British friends of how the SNP controls Scotland, but it clearly testifies the large disconnection between Montreal and the rest of the province as I wrote the other day about it. Considering that everything that has gone with the PLQ in the last few years (undertones of racism from the outside against the party's leader, a purge of the old and corrupt farts from the Charest/Couillard era, a recent shift from the party to the left, defections from some MPs, etc.), it was a decent night for them and a clear middle finger from Montreal to CAQ.
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It's a lot like Ontario in that the map looks entirely CAQ, until you zoom in on cities and find the non-consetvative vote. Unfortunately for Quebec, though, Quebec City, Trois-Rivières and Gatineau (outside Pontiac - probably because of the many Anglos) also voted CAQ, so you're really just left with Montreal and Sherbrooke for the progressive vote (and one riding around Quebec City). It's quite messed up that SO MUCH of the province goes for capitalist identity politics.
In the midst of the depressing part where CAQ got its majority, the palm for worst miscreants and morons in the world yesterday has to go to the people of Rouyn-Noranda–Témiscamingue and Trois-Rivières. In the case of Rouyn-Noranda–Témiscamingue, they voted for CAQ by electing a former Liberal on a 15-year political hiatus even though that district was clearly neglected by CAQ regarding the highly polluting Horne Smelter and its arsenic emissions. In Trois-Rivières, they voted for that racist cnut of immigration minister who should have been kicked out of the party instead of showing his face as a candidate. What does that say about the peopel in that county? No need to add on that part, I guess.
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The thing with all the xenophobia and racism from the CAQ in this campaign is that many of their voters agree with virtually everything that was said. There was a lot of outrage in the media, and probably in Montreal; but I bet if you polled CAQ voters, they'd just say that Legault and Boulet described reality. Again, very messed up.

I don't know how Quebec can get out of this before the next elections. As I said before, I feel Legault brings to the province to a complete standstill much like Duplessis many decades ago.
 
Anyone from Alberta on the forum? I think there are some, but can't remember who right now. In any case, how do you feel about Danielle Smith taking over? From a distance, I feel like she's a trainwreck in the making, with her health care and sovereignty ideas and climate change denial (focusing on oil and gas won't fly in Ottawa or BC and she can't go without them). Seems to me like she'll get a lot of opposition in the UCP and among Albertans, and might set the stage for another NDP government. But what do the locals think?
 
The Liberals have fecked up certainly in Atlantic Canada. The redrawn boundaries have everyone up in arms. Trudeau is not going to win any seats that's competitive. Lots of anger at him. Not that the conservatives are popular but it's now anything but Trudeau. Just like Harper losing his last election.
 
Foxbatt said:
The Liberals have fecked up certainly in Atlantic Canada. The redrawn boundaries have everyone up in arms. Trudeau is not going to win any seats that's competitive. Lots of anger at him. Not that the conservatives are popular but it's now anything but Trudeau. Just like Harper losing his last election.
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What's the issue then? Politicians don't draw out the ridings though.
 
Foxbatt said:
The Liberals have fecked up certainly in Atlantic Canada. The redrawn boundaries have everyone up in arms. Trudeau is not going to win any seats that's competitive. Lots of anger at him. Not that the conservatives are popular but it's now anything but Trudeau. Just like Harper losing his last election.
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The riding boundaries are set independently. It has nothing to do with the libs. What are you on about?
 
Twisted_Woody said:
The riding boundaries are set independently. It has nothing to do with the libs. What are you on about?
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Also, anyone voting for Poilievre out of spite has a couple of screws missing. At least vote for the NDP then. Poilievre would really feck things up for the country if he had his way.
 
Twisted_Woody said:
The riding boundaries are set independently. It has nothing to do with the libs. What are you on about?
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Officially they don't. But that's what they did. Adding French communities into the ridings where they are weak. The Acadians normally vote Liberal. It's also a ridiculous way to redraw the ridings because the newly incorporated communities have nothing in common. Then the Liberal mayors have been having meetings with the public trying to explain what it means. It's certainly political and not independent.
By the way it's the same in the Provincial redrawing too. This time it's Provincial Conservative Party that's trying that stunt. It has still not officially announced yet in the Provincial one yet.
 
Foxbatt said:
Officially they don't. But that's what they did. Adding French communities into the ridings where they are weak. The Acadians normally vote Liberal. It's also a ridiculous way to redraw the ridings because the newly incorporated communities have nothing in common. Then the Liberal mayors have been having meetings with the public trying to explain what it means. It's certainly political and not independent.
By the way it's the same in the Provincial redrawing too. This time it's Provincial Conservative Party that's trying that stunt. It has still not officially announced yet in the Provincial one yet.
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So how will they have done that? Cause it's an independent committee that redraws ridings based on a complex set of rules. Where do the Liberals come into that?

The process is described here btw, if anyone is interested: https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/electoral-boundaries-redistribution-analysis-wherry-1.6560821
 
Foxbatt said:
Officially they don't. But that's what they did. Adding French communities into the ridings where they are weak. The Acadians normally vote Liberal. It's also a ridiculous way to redraw the ridings because the newly incorporated communities have nothing in common. Then the Liberal mayors have been having meetings with the public trying to explain what it means. It's certainly political and not independent.
By the way it's the same in the Provincial redrawing too. This time it's Provincial Conservative Party that's trying that stunt. It has still not officially announced yet in the Provincial one yet.
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They are the same boundaries. The provincial boundaries hold federally as well.

I'm sorry but nothing you have said makes any sense. What meetings are you talking about?
 
Twisted_Woody said:
They are the same boundaries. The provincial boundaries hold federally as well.
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No, that's not true everywhere. Ontario decided to do that not too long ago, but e.g. New Brunswick has 10 seats in Ottawa and 49 in Fredericton.
 
Twisted_Woody said:
They are the same boundaries. The provincial boundaries hold federally as well.

I'm sorry but nothing you have said makes any sense. What meetings are you talking about?
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Cheimoon is correct. Federal and Provincial boundaries are not the same. Officially they are supposed to be neutral but in practice certainly in The Maritimes it's not.
The meetings the Liberal Mayors attended to explain to the public why the redrawn boundaries are good for the province. It's pure BS. The fact that people are even talking about Poilievre could be the next PM is scary enough.
 
Foxbatt said:
Cheimoon is correct. Federal and Provincial boundaries are not the same. Officially they are supposed to be neutral but in practice certainly in The Maritimes it's not.
The meetings the Liberal Mayors attended to explain to the public why the redrawn boundaries are good for the province. It's pure BS. The fact that people are even talking about Poilievre could be the next PM is scary enough.
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Fair enough. I'm unfamiliar with East coast politics, but I've found across the spectrum we seem to be lacking leadership. The whole thing is really quite scary.
 
Foxbatt said:
Cheimoon is correct. Federal and Provincial boundaries are not the same. Officially they are supposed to be neutral but in practice certainly in The Maritimes it's not.
The meetings the Liberal Mayors attended to explain to the public why the redrawn boundaries are good for the province. It's pure BS.
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I suppose it might not help that scales are smaller in the Maritimes and people have closer connections to communities. The bigger the jurisdiction, the easier it is to have properly independent and qualified people for things like the electoral boundaries committee, but I suppose in the smaller provinces, it's not as clear-cut.

Anyway, I haven't looked into this properly, but if parties have really been meddling with the process, then that's awful and sets a dangerous precedent!
The fact that people are even talking about Poilievre could be the next PM is scary enough.
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I think there's a real chance he'll get most votes. Trudeau will have been in power for quite a while by the time of the next elections, so even if people aren't so much fed up with his direction, they might want to see a fresh face 'just because'. Poilievre has a somewhat similar image now as Trudeau when he first got to power (young, energetic, 'let's change this place'), and that might convince a fair bit of people. (Ironically, Poilievre has actually been in politics longer than Trudeau, and nothing he said is fresh, realistic, or will lead to long-term improvement - but we all know impressions have nothing to do with reality.)

I don't think Poilievre can win a majority though. He's too divisive for that. And if he gets a minority win, I think he'll have to compromise significantly on his ideas to get majority support from anything. After all, that would probably require support from the Bloc (the Liberals and NDP won't ever), and they are centre-right economically but centre-left on social issues - and so they won't go for Poilievre's far-out ideas.
 
Btw, @Foxbatt, do you have links to articles that discuss these issues you're talking about? I was trying to look things up this morning but couldn't find anything except announcements of the process and public hearings. Thanks!
 
Cheimoon said:
Btw, @Foxbatt, do you have links to articles that discuss these issues you're talking about? I was trying to look things up this morning but couldn't find anything except announcements of the process and public hearings. Thanks!
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No I don't except first hand knowledge of this. These kinds of things don't get published in the newspapers. You have to take my word for this one.
As you said even The Liberals don't want Trudeau to run next time. Dominique LeBlanc is not going to run. That leaves Freeland and Mark Carney, who most wanted to run. Not sure if he is going to do it either. Freeland is fairly unpopular among the members too.
As for Poilievre, he is a typical politician who is going to change his tone too. The difference between him and O' Toole is that he has charisma unlike O'Toole. So don't disregard him at all. He is pointing out that he is a Libertarian and his wife is from Venezuela. So he is pro immigration and less red tape etc.
Already he has changed his tone on these things. So it all comes down to perception and he would get a lot of French votes in The Maritimes because another thing he is pointing out that he if French and mix Anglophone as he is adopted.
 
Foxbatt said:
As you said even The Liberals don't want Trudeau to run next time. Dominique LeBlanc is not going to run. That leaves Freeland and Mark Carney, who most wanted to run. Not sure if he is going to do it either. Freeland is fairly unpopular among the members too.
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Did I say that? I suppose voters in general are getting a bit tired of Trudeau, but I have no idea about the Liberals themselves. I think Freeland is awesome and I hope she replaces Trudeau when it's time, but I have no idea where things actually stand on that.
As for Poilievre, he is a typical politician who is going to change his tone too. The difference between him and O' Toole is that he has charisma unlike O'Toole. So don't disregard him at all. He is pointing out that he is a Libertarian and his wife is from Venezuela. So he is pro immigration and less red tape etc.
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And pro-oil, and pro-bitcoin, etc. Plenty to hit him with for his opponents. He doesn't seem the type to me who'll shift so much to the centre that he will be sufficiently widely acceptable for people to win a majority.
Already he has changed his tone on these things. So it all comes down to perception and he would get a lot of French votes in The Maritimes because another thing he is pointing out that he if French and mix Anglophone as he is adopted.
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Being part of the French community, I have never seen anything from him suggesting he cares about francophones in any meaningful way. He doesn't represent a francophone riding here in the Ottawa area either (and there are plenty). But just being able to speak French well will already give him an advantage over previous CPC leaders like Sheer and O'Toole.
 
Cheimoon said:
Did I say that? I suppose voters in general are getting a bit tired of Trudeau, but I have no idea about the Liberals themselves. I think Freeland is awesome and I hope she replaces Trudeau when it's time, but I have no idea where things actually stand on that.

And pro-oil, and pro-bitcoin, etc. Plenty to hit him with for his opponents. He doesn't seem the type to me who'll shift so much to the centre that he will be sufficiently widely acceptable for people to win a majority.

Being part of the French community, I have never seen anything from him suggesting he cares about francophones in any meaningful way. He doesn't represent a francophone riding here in the Ottawa area either (and there are plenty). But just being able to speak French well will already give him an advantage over previous CPC leaders like Sheer and O'Toole.
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They need to get a fair bit of seats in The Maritimes to over turn The Liberals. Then there are Liberal ridings no matter what. He is not going to get them. But there are ridings he can over turn and he is working on these. He has already started the turn around on immigration. Now I don't know if he is going to keep his word or not but he is saying the right things to a lot of people who voted liberal. The liberal party is in a mess at least in The Maritimes right now. No one has a good word for them anymore. The MPs certainly have let a lot of people down. They don't elect the right MPs and even in Provincial by-election they lost seats to The Conservatives. These were safe Liberal seat.
 
Today saw the release of the report by Commissioner Paul Rouleau. The people who complained about the use of the Emergencies Act to get rid of the occupiers in Ottawa are obviously in the wrong as the report says the Emergencies Act met the highest standards and thresholds for its invocation.

Federal government met the threshold to invoke Emergencies Act: Rouleau

I followed some of the public hearings when they took place. Everything that was said explained a lot of things such as how badly unprepared the Ottawa Police Service were and how the Government of Ontario did next to feck all when they should have (I'm looking at Doug Ford now). Many things could have been avoided, but nothing will ever exonerate the protestors' behavior.

Of course, the major jackass still voicing his voice against the government is Pierre Poilièvre, who openly supported the protests and poured oil on the fire instead of calling for calm. If that is the best the Conservative Party can come up as their leader, then I hope they stay in the gutter for a really long time. Poilièvre is no different from that other yahoo and former Tory minister, Maxime Bernier.
 
Pierre Poilièvre is a cnut. The guy has been attacking CBC since Twitter has added the "Government-funded media" tag to CBC... when anyone aware of Canadian reality knows that it has been the case since the CBC's inception, be it under Liberal or Conservative governments.



Because of PeePee's animosity against the media, here is what Justin Trudeau fired back at him. Most Canadian media are held up by American hedge funds except the CBC, and it speaks volumes about why the CBC is targeted by that four-eyed cnut.



NDP leader Jagmeet Singh was not going to stay silent on that issue either.



In my memory, I don't recall anyone who has been more corrosive to longstanding Canadian institutions and democracy than that parody of Arnold Toht.
 
To be fair Trudeau gave the media some $600 million in grants and subsidies aka a bailout. That's going to buy you a lot of favourable press.
 
Dr. Dwayne said:
To be fair Trudeau gave the media some $600 million in grants and subsidies aka a bailout. That's going to buy you a lot of favourable press.
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The Twitter tag is meaningless though. All media get funding somewhere, and many media adapt their reporting because of that. Singling out governments is irrelevant and it's obvious why Musk would do this. It's equally obvious why Poilièvre thinks it's a good game to be in on. It's got nothing to do with journalistic integrity one way or another, but does lead to further erosion of public trust and polarization.

It's disgusting really.
 
CBC/Radio-Canada decided to go the NPR route. Feck Elmo and feck his vision of Twitter.





Yves-François Blanchet, leader of Bloc Québécois is not happy at all either, especially since any prospect of gutting the CBC would actually mean gutting arts, news and French language in the regions.



Congratulations, you four-eyed idiot (Poilièvre). You managed to unite 3 out of the 4 major federal parties against you.
 
RedDevilQuebecois said:
CBC/Radio-Canada decided to go the NPR route. Feck Elmo and feck his vision of Twitter.





Yves-François Blanchet, leader of Bloc Québécois is not happy at all either, especially since any prospect of gutting the CBC would actually mean gutting arts, news and French language in the regions.



Congratulations, you four-eyed idiot (Poilièvre). You managed to unite 3 out of the 4 major federal parties against you.
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Not sure what the 'four-eyed idiot' part is about. What's wrong with having glasses?

Other than that, Poilièvre has actually defended Radio-Canada in the past. His argument is that CBC is completely unnecessary, as there are plenty of anglophone sources and CBC does not fill any gap in the market; while it's not the same in French and so there is a need for Radio-Canada. It's a stretch in my view, but anyway, he did cover it.

Not sure why he doesn't want the government tag for Radio-Canada though. I can't see any argument for that. I suppose it simply boils down to where he thinks potential votes are. I just hope he alienates enough centrists with all this stuff to make himself sufficiently ineluctable in the next election.
 
If anything, it gives now a lot more incentives for the Liberal-NDP coalition to see it through to the very end of the 4-year term. By 2025, more programs that benefit Canadians will be put forward and, hopefully, Poilièvre will have lost all centrists/independents because of his shenanigans.
 
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