Needs upgrading.
8
Season Average Rating
- Appearances
- 59
- Goals
- 14
- Assists
- 14
- Yellow cards
- 12
- Status
His all-round deficiencies can't be overlooked so easily when he's not scoring a peno, or registering an assist. He's not really good enough, is he?
If the manager has sense he won’t play against City. His lack of care will kill us in midfield.
He will play cos he will press city and can create something out of nothing for rashford / martial
Nah two things can exist. We're also winning games so it's more preferable than fixing a shitty performance in a shitty result. You can win with Bruno but not both.
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Yeah missed today’s match but I guess we’re still waiting for that post-Ronaldo renaissance…
Not his best performance. We need to start looking for a replacement. Or at least someone who can challenge his position.
More than two things can exist....like players of the calibre of Martinez and Casemiro. Or a coach who is miles better than his predecessors. Or winning games that both Bruno and Ronaldo played in, but Bruno was useless and Ronaldo won us the game. Or Bruno being poor before, during and after Ronaldo.
We have other priorities IMO. Sancho (when f and Eriksen can both play his position.
We need a Striker and another midfielder that isn’t the wrong side of 30 as a higher priority.
Bruno has his ups and downs but his overall contribution to the team is undoubtedly positive.
You are correct about us having other priorities.
I don’t agree with Bruno’s contribution being 'undoubtedly’ positive though. Perhaps we say this because we haven’t seen better yet, just like many people defended McTominay’s contribution until Casemiro came along and showed them what was actually possible. We’ve had Lingard, Pereira, VDB.
I think having a 10 that actually gets the team playing, links everything, can operate in the 10 pocket and help us to keep the ball in high areas under pressure will lift us immensely, and also lift the other attackers around him. Bruno is a bit peripheral to me. He has the ability to be fantastically decisive, but when he’s not doing that - the game passes him by. People often say everything good we do goes through him, but for a 10, I don’t think enough goes through him personally. Aside from decisive actions, his next best contributions are without the ball. We quickly move on to his workrate, when there are so many other things required WITH the ball before we get to that which he just isn’t good at.
I find him strange. If we did a spread of his on the ball attributes, most of them would be low to average, with one or two anomalous spikes in key areas. Not many can play some of the passes he is capable of in the final third, but then again few 10s at top level have such little ability aside from that. Ultimately, I see him primarily as part of the middle 3, not the front 3, so decisiveness will always be a less important contribution to the basics of getting us playing well, in control of a football match etc. I expect that first, and then respectable goal contributions after. But goal contributions without high quality midfield basics will always confuse me from a midfield 3 player. He’s not Rashford. Conversely, Antony and Sancho are not Bruno either - so they don’t get a pass for having many 10-like qualities but low goal contributions either. They are the ones who should be racking up goal numbers as they are in the front three, and they don’t do enough.
Not a very huge Bruno fan so this isn't even apologism but the cancerous effects that were observed with Ronaldo are very real. Martinez, Casemiro, ETH were here when our attack would dip. Plus they aren't even attackers so it's even easier to critically isolate his chemistry with Bruno. On a per minute basis Bruno's general play is probably a bit overrated (even without Ronaldo) but he was also negatively affected when playing in that Ronaldo-centric system, as was the entire attack. Those game winning moments that made poor performances easy to stomach became fewer and further between.
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Not sure if it is a form thing or if he just cant get rid of these deficencies
Eriksen’s an upgrade in that #10 role; sell Freddie Mercury, reinvest in De Jong.
He’s an ineffective liability.
And Ronaldo famously barely played.
???
‘The cancerous effects that were observed with Bruno when Ronaldo was here were very real’. Then you listed some players who just joined in the summer. Ronaldo barely played any minutes of note since these players joined us. Bruno is responsible for his own performances and Ronaldo for his own.
Ronaldo started four league games this season but yeah it’s all Ronaldo’s fault. Bruno’s been as inconsistent as ever since Ronaldo left...but obviously it’s still Ronaldos fault.
It can be both, that's the point. His silly decision making can be exacerbated by another negative, in this case to the point where there's even less to redeem. At least Bruno without Ronaldo still drops an influential assist during a 4/10 performance. I'm not a big fan of either version but I prefer the latter.
Fair enough.
From reddit:
Encouraging stuff, maybe we could finally look at him as a long term option there which would be fecking great as he's pretty young and then we would only need an upgrade on eriksen to have a wc midfield.
Encouraging stuff, maybe we could finally look at him as a long term option there which would be fecking great as he's pretty young and then we would only need an upgrade on eriksen to have a wc midfield.
Even by that assessment, there’s an obvious awful lot of football missing. ‘Fewer touches and fewer passes but making more chances and defending more’. This indicates that Bruno is not central to the play, more just there to provide an impact. Surely in his role, you want him to be having the most touches and making the most passes ideally?
I accept that part of Bruno’s role is to create, but I also feel he should be the main conductor. Like Grealish was at Villa, creating a lot of chances but also being the guy the play goes through, carrying and circulating the ball all over the pitch.
The above assessment talks about sharing the burden to create, but I do feel that it’s oversimplifying the game. There is just too much more, even with the ball, than the final pass on a football pitch. David Silva had loads of assists for City, but first and foremost, he got them playing. Because he can’t just spend all game assisting, football doesn’t work like that. But he was a major factor as to why City spent all game dominating their opponents, first and foremost, before we even get to the chances created. As a team, City kept the ball well and moved it quickly under pressure. If their 10s didn’t have the skillset to do this, they simply wouldn’t be able to play the same way.
You are correct somewhat and I agree that Bruno isn't exactly capable of being the sort of conductors that has the play flowing through him, I think he lacks in calm and dribbling ability to pull off such a thing, his decision making can be erratic as well at times a further negative but the things is I don't think he necessarily has to be that kind of player and I think Eric thinks the same way the way he's been utilizing Bruno and insists on playing him.
For the sake of comparison let's look at city and their main attacking mid KDB.
Here are KDB's stats.
And here are bruno's:
(Note it's for the past 365 days)
Here as you can see the possession based stats are not that different (Bruno actually has a higher pass completion rate) but where KDB shines is his progressing ability, it's top class and it's evident how pivotal he's at moving the ball from their own half to the oppositions, Bruno is simply not capable of that but I don't think it matters much if and only if we're able to get a CM that's capable of doing this so that way it's not bruno's burden anymore and that's why I assume Erik pursued someone like frenkie so much.
Here are de jong's stats:*
His superiority in possession and dribbling is evident and the eye test from his time under Eric suggests that he's much more comfortable receiving the ball from his own half and progressing it to the opposition's then releasing it so let's assume we get de jong or someone in his mold and in which case we get a midfield off:
Bruno
FDJ* like player casemiro
the roles are than pretty much defined as casemiro does his thing recovers the ball back from the opposition and releases it to the progressive ball carrier who then jump starts the attack by progressing the ball upward and orchestrating it somewhat and I think in that scenario bruno's offensive capabilities along with his more than your avergae AM defensive contributions will shine the most, his shortcomings will no longer be as much of a liability to us either as it's no longer his are of responsibility and by losing the ball in the higher areas of the pitch we'd be less endangered than if he did it otherwise. FDJ* like player casemiro
I think that could be a supremely solid and balanced midfield blueprint which has no noticeable shortcomings either in defence or in the the attack but obviously that's only one way of looking at it and im sure there are other ways available to make it work and im also sure that Eric is aware of it as well so in short I don't think Bruno is necessarily a deterrent to our longterm plans of playing progressive and expansive football it just depends on our approach to the situation.
*also note someone like de jong has terrible defensive numbers , bruno's on the other hand good defensive numbers will be off an advantage then by sharing some of the burden.
It's always the CB, CBs, FBs who will have most touches. Attacking players or players who play higher up the pitch averages less.
I would love to see a midfield of Casemiero and Fred and eriksen as a number 10. Maybe he offers something different to bruno and might bring less chaos to our game in the final third.
Looking busy and making a lot of passes are often not the be all and end all of a no. 10
Looking busy and making a lot of passes are often not the be all and end all of a no. 10
You are correct somewhat and I agree that Bruno isn't exactly capable of being the sort of conductors that has the play flowing through him, I think he lacks in calm and dribbling ability to pull off such a thing, his decision making can be erratic as well at times a further negative but the things is I don't think he necessarily has to be that kind of player and I think Eric thinks the same way the way he's been utilizing Bruno and insists on playing him.
For the sake of comparison let's look at city and their main attacking mid KDB.
Here are KDB's stats.
And here are bruno's:
(Note it's for the past 365 days)
Here as you can see the possession based stats are not that different (Bruno actually has a higher pass completion rate) but where KDB shines is his progressing ability, it's top class and it's evident how pivotal he's at moving the ball from their own half to the oppositions, Bruno is simply not capable of that but I don't think it matters much if and only if we're able to get a CM that's capable of doing this so that way it's not bruno's burden anymore and that's why I assume Erik pursued someone like frenkie so much.
Here are de jong's stats:*
His superiority in possession and dribbling is evident and the eye test from his time under Eric suggests that he's much more comfortable receiving the ball from his own half and progressing it to the opposition's then releasing it so let's assume we get de jong or someone in his mold and in which case we get a midfield off:
Brunothe roles are than pretty much defined as casemiro does his thing recovers the ball back from the opposition and releases it to the progressive ball carrier who then jump starts the attack by progressing the ball upward and orchestrating it somewhat and I think in that scenario bruno's offensive capabilities along with his more than your avergae AM defensive contributions will shine the most, his shortcomings will no longer be as much of a liability to us either as it's no longer his are of responsibility and by losing the ball in the higher areas of the pitch we'd be less endangered than if he did it otherwise.
FDJ* like player casemiro
I think that could be a supremely solid and balanced midfield blueprint which has no noticeable shortcomings either in defence or in the the attack but obviously that's only one way of looking at it and im sure there are other ways available to make it work and im also sure that Eric is aware of it as well so in short I don't think Bruno is necessarily a deterrent to our longterm plans of playing progressive and expansive football it just depends on our approach to the situation.
*also note someone like de jong has terrible defensive numbers , bruno's on the other hand good defensive numbers will be off an advantage then by sharing some of the burden.
This is a fair response, and one that has been made quite a few times on the caf. It rarely takes long before the ‘well Kevin de Bruyne isn’t like Ozil either’ argument is made, but it is not a lie. He isn’t. The difference though, to me, is as you alluded - Kevin de Bruyne is a supreme creator but also while not being Ozil/Silva - he instead is also Gerrard/Vieira. He is physical and can win duels in centre midfield, and can also drive the team forward. In any midfield, especially PL ones - these are also what I’d call ‘basic midfield functions’. Which are absolutely vital for a 10 to have.
De Bruyne is a different type to Silva, but what he cannot be, IMO, is a player with only one-setting which is to swing the ball in behind. There’s just too much else to do on the pitch. So De Bruyne isn’t a classic 10 in many ways, which is no surprise because he never even came up as a 10. But he’s a classic B2B which means he adds so much more to the regular grind of the football match than Bruno does. I don’t think, aside from the chance creation, Bruno adds anything of value with the ball to our team. Which isn’t enough because you can’t simply just create chances.
Fundamentally, with Bruno I think his ‘creativity’ has become something of a ‘party trick’ almost. His first time swing in behind is his ‘thing’, but I think it masks the fact that he’s simply an average footballer. His general handling of a football is not good enough, especially given he’s a 10 and they are generally the best at it. Bar his party trick, I don’t see him as talented a footballer as our left back even. In tougher games where the level of football is raised, where you have top players pressing each other and other top players refusing to succumb to that pressing and instead showing the quality of their ‘football’ by still insisting to hold on to the ball under pressure and find their teammates - this is not a level of football I can say I’ve ever seen Bruno excel at. The City games, Liverpool games. He’s had ‘good games’ against these, typically with humongous workrate - but never seen him rise to that level of football. We play City and Arsenal this month and I don’t expect it again either. He may get an assist or a goal. But he won’t match their football basics is my expectation.
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Perhaps they do. Maybe even goalkeepers statistically have the most touches, who knows - but the point is, the 10 is traditionally someone you want on the ball as much as possible, who you look for to get the team playing. A player who traditionally, if you cannot get enough of the ball then the team’s play is likely to be dysfunctional. Certainly that’s how it’s been watching football growing up for me anyway.
That's in final third and i think they usually do. But overall I'm yet to see a #10 who averages most touches and passes in the team.
Bruno's brilliant, wtf is wrong with people?
I think it's the frustration at how quickly he can go from brilliant to Sunday League.
A bit like opinions on here.
Can you name me some brilliant performances from Bruno this season?
I think 10s would spend as much time in the middle third as the do in the final third? Admittedly, it’s not my favoured leisurely reading so I don’t have figures of average positions - but I see 10s dropping into midfield to link. That said, there are different types of 10s in the game now, not just what I’d call a ‘classic’ 10. A classic 10 for me is not in the team to get 20+ goals a season, but they are certainly, more often than not, the best/most talented footballer in the team. I guess now there is more if a debate as to whether they belong more to the midfield than the attack. I see Rui Costa or Gascoigne as classic 10s, more than say, Roberto Baggio.
Oh absolutely! Bruno is an incredibly frustrating player though. He can have you tearing your hair out for the majority of a game as he messes up the most simple of things, but he is also quite likely to end the match as a key figure in how we won the game.
I’d say that unless it’s a game where he registered x key passes, then it would almost certainly have to be a game where he ‘ran a lot’. Because aside from those two, I don’t think he does much else at all to a particularly high level.
Most of them tbh. His workrate and movement has set the tone for the entire team. Him Casemiro and Varane are the beating heart of everything we do.
Sounds like what people said about Rashford.
Yeah I would agree with that. Both are obviously very good players overall, but they can make the most baffling decisions and lose the ball very cheaply. I think that Rashford seems to be doing this a bit less at the moment though.
Id love to see kdb trying to play in martial when he barely can with lukaku
So has bruno, thats why his game looks more restricted compared to him under ole.
There's less hit and hope from him, but still a lot of sloppiness in his game. Little flicks in the middle of the pitch to nobody in particular, short passes often going astray etc. His work rate is terrific though and we are definitely a better side with him in the team.
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