he's already one of the best ever. Top 20-30Brentan Rodgers
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he's already one of the best ever. Top 20-30He didn't go all out, Chelsea had all their players sitting deep so you either counter their negative football playing more negative or you try to win the match. This football has got them to the top of the league and it was a slip up by Gerrard which cost them.
You're right about the Kalas miss but Liverpool also had one cleared off the line. I think Chelsea did a very good job and deserved it but absolute nonsense to suggest Liverpool got their tactics wrong. On the day Gerrard made a mistake and Chelsea nullified their attacking threat. Just because a team loses doesn't always mean they got their tactics wrong. Very hard to play against teams who just have no intention of getting forward, as your lot showed against Bayern.
Why should they play for a stalemate? They're at home and won the last 11 or 12 games on the trot, of course they're gonna try to win the match. Since when do potential championship winning sides play for draws at home?
Tbf, innovators like Sacchi, Cruyff, Michels, Lobanovskiy are more fondly remembered in history because of their legacy.
Mourinho is more like the Helenio Herrera of this era. He'll still be remembered because of his success but his overall impact on football probably won't be as pronounced as someone like Guardiola.
Mourinho is more like the Helenio Herrera of this era. He'll still be remembered because of his success but his overall impact on football probably won't be as pronounced as someone like Guardiola.
A manager with two European Cup wins will probably be remembered for a long time.
That's what I was trying to say.
Yeah, but you mentioned Wenger.
Not the sole reason, but it has been a big advantage. Liverpool's first team is as good as most sides, especially their attacking quality and you have had your first team available more or less all season. The depth becomes an issue when you have a lot more games to deal with and I think that'll show next season.
Yeah I know he's become somewhat of a joke on here but history will judge him kindly.
He's far from a joke, just not as good a manager as Mourinho.
He's lost to us home and away. He's displaying a real tactical naivity, and if he wants to be a top manager he needs to grow out of it. Liverpool didn't need a win today, they could have sat back a bit more, encouraged us to come out more than we did, and then used their pace to try and get in behind us. We sat back so much, because Liverpool were doing what they always do, and trying to non-stop attack.
Disagree. If Wenger was in Mourninho's situation (huge resources at big clubs) could he have done what Mourinho did? Probably. If Mourinho was in Wenger's situation (trying to keep a team in the Champions League with severely limited spending power) could he have done what Wenger did? Probably not.
The jury is still out on him. Next season will tell all.
I think had Mourinho been in control of Arsenal over the last 10 years, he would have won the league at least one.
When he's retired in 15 years or so he'll probably be regarded as the greatest manager of all time.
Maybe. But he would have also finished out of the top 4 at least once and left the club when things got tough.
I still think he has to actually build a team to be remembered as that. There are a couple aspects missing from his CV in my opinion. But certainly up there by the end of his career, if he isn't already.
Definitely wouldn't have lasted as long in the job by choice or not, no doubt, but he would have brought trophies to the club whereas Wenger hasn't.
And then won something somewhere else. Basically, he tends to win things.
Maybe he'll do that now at Chelsea, they are in the middle of a bit of a rebuilding phase and he has them second in the league and in sight of a CL final without a proper striker. He's the dogs.
Depends on how you define success. Wenger has set up Arsenal to succeed for many years to come.
Mourinho wouldn't stand for rank mediocrity like Wenger and your supporters have. You're right, he'd have left. He's said as much.
But he has managed no real success in the last 10 years, minus the FA Cup. He's had 10 years to set them up and win something, also hasn't really replaced the lost talent of Arsenal old.
rank mediocrityHe's had to deal with a new stadium being built in the process.
Ah the famous peterstorey "10 year plan" argument.
It's a hard argument. He's had 10 years, you don't look as good as the last Arsenal team that won something and you've won nothing in the meantime.
He'll be remembered very kindly for his longevity, commitment to good football and consistency in the league with limited resources, but his trophy haul and success in Europe are not at the level of Fergie or Mourinho and that will always count against him- even if it is slightly unfair given that he's spent so little.
Because we've dealt with
1) building a stadium that cost hundreds of millions
2) the greatest manager of all time backed by more money than we had
3) Not one but two massive spending influxes by foreign investors
Hardly surprising that we haven't won anything.
History won't give a feck about Arsenal's new stadium but it will remember that Wenger won jack all of note for a decade.
Only if history is written by simple minded folk like you. Fortunately, I don't think it will be
Yet you accept had Mourinho been managing Arsenal for the past decade or at least started at 05/06, you probably would have won trophies right?
Yes.
History will remember Arsene as the man who built Arsenal as a major 21st-century club
I don't mean to be harsh, but in the same period Wigan, Portsmouth, Birmingham and Swansea all managed to win something.
Managing Arsenal with our budget? Not a forking chance.
I don't mean to be harsh, but in the same period Wigan, Portsmouth, Birmingham and Swansea all manager to win something.
And where has that gotten them? Only one of those teams is still in the Premier League. It's short termism to focus on that over the obvious achievements of Wenger.
and the third best premier league manager after Fergie and Mourinho
Standard Arsenal mentality. Always about excuses never about trophies in the cabinet
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