Post match comments don't mean he came into the match thinking he'll show Mourinho or anything close to it.
Brentan Rodgers
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Post match comments don't mean he came into the match thinking he'll show Mourinho or anything close to it.
Sigh, so much nonsense being posted about that Chelsea match.
There's enough to criticise Rodgers for without making stuff up. He didn't do anything wrong that time, if we'd played for a draw and been nailed for it like Mourinho has numerous times lately, he'd still have been criticised...
There's enough to criticise Rodgers for without making stuff up. He didn't do anything wrong that time, if we'd played for a draw and been nailed for it like Mourinho has numerous times lately, he'd still have been criticised...
Ya, but you'd be champions now, so I don't think anyone at Liverpool would give a feck (quite rightly).
That's not what I mean. I'm saying if we'd played for a draw and got done on the counter people would still criticise. The way some are going on here you'd think you're 100% certain to pick up a point if you play for a draw, as if it's guaranteed.
Just looking at the stats from the chelsea game. Chelsea only had 4 shots on target. One was from the Gerrard slip and the other was like in the 90th minute for the Willian goal. Liverpool also completely dominated the game (75% possession). Looks like Rodgers would have easily have gotten at least a draw from that game if Gerrard hadn't fell over and then went wild in the second half trying Hollywood shots.
Stampy Starfish at his 'best'.
Looking back, its pretty crazy how the table looked with 3 games left. How did they feck that up?
Man United have FIVE more points now than back then with a few fewer played
And less than a month ago people were still claiming moyes > LVG
He clearly went into that game thinking his "right way" tactic was going to beat whatever Mourinho did. Everyone knew Mourinho was going to stifle the game and try and hit Liverpool on the counter, but Rodgers still went into the game with a high press, which he refused to adapt even when it was clear for 45 minutes that it wasn't working.
Once the game was over, rather than saying something like "we didn't want to move away from a gameplan that has put us top of the league" he basically accused Mourinho of cheating by lining up defensively and waffled on about how he'll never set a team out like that because it's not his way of working. Why have a dig at Mourinho for finding him out by completely distancing himself from Mourinho's tactic, after completely ignoring all of the warning signs about what Mourinho was doing, if he didn't want to out do Mourinho with his "right way" football?
And yet it'd have still been more sensible than pretty much the entire Liverpool team streaming towards Chelsea's box in the third minute of first half stoppage time whilst there was zero cover behind the man in possession if the ball was lost.
Again though, they didn't have to play for a draw, they just should have been more cautious in their attempts at chasing the win.
Chelsea had 5 chances prior to the slip and their first goal. If we're doing shots on target Liverpool managed 8 from 26 shots and Chelsea managed 4 from 11. Chelsea may have only had a few shots on target, but 11 shots for a team apparently parking the bus is quite a lot, especially when they only managed to have the ball a quarter of the time. Liverpool had lots of possession outside of the Chelsea area, with players eventually getting frustrated and attempting long-range shots. Liverpool weren't creating a load of clear-cut chances, and they looked vulnerable to counter-attacks. Rodgers ignored all of this and left them streaming forwards in numbers, leaving them wide open at the back.
Given that Chelsea stifled the game, and Liverpool were having so much of the ball without managing to find space in the dangerous areas, it would have done them no harm to drop back 10-20 yards and ensure there were no huge gaps in and behind the defense. Instead they carried on going gung-ho and it cost them.
You're really committed to your view here. A player can make a mistake if you build your attacks from a deeper position, it just means Demba Ba has less ground to cover before he puts it past Mignolet.
The first half was about as much as a non event you can get in terms of goal mouth action. The idea that Chelsea were constantly catching Liverpool out and it was a matter of time is a complete fabrication. It's a 90 minute game of football, they can't stop the opposition getting near their box completely, they rarely looked stretched or exposed (the last minutes aside whereby they had no choice as they needed an equaliser).
Looking back, its pretty crazy how the table looked with 3 games left. How did they feck that up?
Well, for one that table is a bit misleading because City had 2 games in hand.
City were always one Liverpool feck up away from being in the lead outright. The scousers did get a little too carried away. I remember the Chelsea game was treated like a Championship winning party and the Palace game was dismissed as all but a formality.
But then, considering the run they were on it would have been difficult not to get carried away.
If there's less space between the centre backs and the keeper there's a good chance the keeper can rush out and sweep up if they lose the ball. If the centre backs are deeper, they probably won't be squaring the ball to their central midfielder, but playing it forward to him. At that time of the match, there was simply no need for them to be that high up the pitch, or for everyone else to go streaming forward when Gerrard was given the ball.
The fact that Liverpool were barely creating anything either in the first half should have been reason enough for Rodgers to change it up. Chelsea were never going to create much and stretch Liverpool with their tactic because they were never going to commit enough men forward for that to happen. Despite that, they still managed a good number of shots for a team with little in the way of attacking ambition. Liverpool's ridiculously high line meant that all Chelsea needed to do was wait for a misplaced pass, or in this case a slip, and they'd have been through on goal.
You can't say Rodgers was justified in continuing to play a ridiculously top heavy tactic whilst admitting that the first half was basically devoid of any goal mouth action. Liverpool had one shot from inside the box prior to Chelsea's first goal, and that was a ball coming back out that was hit high by Sakho. Chelsea had managed two. It was clear as day that Liverpool weren't creating anything, yet Rodgers had them persisting with a very risky tactic.
I'm committed to my view because I'm yet to see someone provide a proper explanation for Brendan Rodgers' decision to keep throwing men forward at the expense of leaving literally half a pitch's worth of space in his defense, despite seeing for 45 minutes that his team weren't creating any chances that way.
It's difficult for a manager to change what his team is doing from the sidelines, he had a half time break that was ruined by the fact one of his players made a freak mistake. I'd love to know how they put together a 10 game winning streak when all the opposition had to do was "wait til they misplace a pass and you'll be through on goal". Shame Moyes didn't realise it when they gave us a 3-0 drubbing. He should've just sent the lads out on the pitch and told them to wait for Gerrard to gift them a one on one with the keeper - because after all, it's inevitable apparently.
Are you suggesting the 2nd half they should've committed less men forward in search of the equaliser?
They didn't even look in trouble in the 2nd half either, that's why it took until the 92nd mintue for Chelsea to make it 2-0. Their approach in the 2nd half in terms of attacking play was poor, Gary Neville pointed out that they committed 2 sins in how not to chase a game - shooting from unrealistic distances, and crossing from deep areas when they had no big men in the box. Neither of these had anything to do with being too gung ho or leaving themselves too exposed, just poor decision making in the final 3rd.Summer 2014
Arsenal - £95.6m
Liverpool - £117m
Last 5 seasons
Arsenal - £258.12m
Liverpool - £351.95m
2003 to date
Arsenal - £390.675m
Liverpool - £608.18m
1992 to date
Arsenal - £531.56m
Liverpool - £767.3m
I'm surprised nobody pulls him up on his bullshit.
What the feck does 1992 or 2003 have to do with anything? Arsenal has a much much better squad than Liverpool do.
I was actually defending Arsenal and saying they've assembled a much better squad without spending stupid money but, fair enough.
Well yeah, you're right that Liverpool have spent badly for a long long time. I just don't think that is Rodgers fault. I mean, yeah, some of the recent ones are his fault but nothing in 1993 is.
Think the person I nicked it from was on about since the PL was born.
At the end of the day, Liverpool, for the want of a better phrase, were still on their perch back then and were the kings of English football. Yet, they were wasting money on the likes of Rob Jones, Ovid Leonardson, Stig Inge Bjørnebye, while Arsenal were spending 2 million on the likes of Bergkamp and using their knowledge to pick up bargains like Petit and winning leagues and cups with them, while Liverpool wasted away and no one dared question them
You're not wrong in general - Scales, Dicks, Saunders, et cetera - but leave Rob Jones out of it. 300K for one of the best right (and left) backs in English football until the back and knee injuries. Not bad business at all.
And, if you look at last summer as an example, LFC may have spent 117M - I'll take your word for it - but 75M of that was the Suarez fee. Who did Arsenal sell to fund their 95.6M? I think Vermaelen for $20M? You have to look at P&L before you can make an accurate assessment. Arsenal had 70M less in the bank at the end of the window. Liverpool were out of pocket by 42M.
If it wasn't difficult, perhaps Rodgers should have tried to get his team defending better, rather than let things slip.“It’s not difficult to coach to just get 10 players right on your 18-yard box and it is difficult to break through, but they defended well. I think they got booked for time wasting in the 92nd minute but you could see from the first whistle that the plan was to frustrate but teams work in a different way. We are a team that tries to win in a sporting manner, try to work and initiate the game with the ball."
Rodgers is a good young coach. He can assemble a squad to play in specific formations with specific tactics and setups, and the manner in which he transformed Liverpool this season to adapt to their early season short comings was remarkable. Obviously, he has some worth as a coach of football teams.
On the other hand, he has a pretty lousy eye for talent in the market. I don't really buy the transfer committee nonsense. I don't think he's been very good at getting the right players in. Additionally, I think he is incredibly poor with both the media and the dressing room. He comes out with tripe over and over and over again and he seems a bit dimwitted when speaking on losing performances. His handling of the Suarez situations and the recent Skrtel ban were incredibly poor. And then he comes out with additional soundbites about other teams and other managers that always, without fail, bite him in the ass.
On the other hand, he has a pretty lousy eye for talent in the market. I don't really buy the transfer committee nonsense. I don't think he's been very good at getting the right players in. Additionally, I think he is incredibly poor with both the media and the dressing room. He comes out with tripe over and over and over again and he seems a bit dimwitted when speaking on losing performances. His handling of the Suarez situations and the recent Skrtel ban were incredibly poor. And then he comes out with additional soundbites about other teams and other managers that always, without fail, bite him in the ass.
Exactly!
This is an expedient rewriting of history that Rodgers himself has promoted by failing to take any responsibility for their poor start. Increasingly, his public statements appear designed to protect his own reputation.
I've noticed that too.
Like most top level managers, he's perfectly comfortable with blatantly lying and rewriting history to his own ends. The problem with that, though, is that usually you eventually stop being successful and the people you were chucking under the bus are lying in wait.
It's a pretty simple argument to counter just by pointing out the United vs City game in the 2011/2012 season. Fergie set out for the draw, playing a horribly negative formation and tactics with Rooney up top on his own with a horribly out of form Park to stifle them as part of a 5 man midfield behind. We lost via a set piece and never looked like scoring a goal because of the negative tactics.
Sometimes you are better off doing what the team and manager know best and living/dying by the result. Chelsea were knocked out of the Champions League this season because of it and were out of the title race too early last season because of it; United lost a few titles (inc. the one mentioned) because of it; Liverpool lost the title last year because of it; Wenger has won one trophy in 10 years partly because of it. However on the flip side Chelsea will win the league this year because of it; Rodgers got Liverpool flying high and into the CL last year because of it; and United win numerous titles under Fergie because of it.
Rodgers playing for the draw would have lead to them getting beat; just as Fergie playing for the draw cost us the title.
Back in December before they started their good run he started talking as if he knew he was weeks away from the sack and started blaming various things and shifting the blame. I'd say it's a similar scenario now, I really wouldn't be surprised if they move him on if he doesn't get fourth. The simple fact is that he lost two first team players and spent £120m on his squad and has gone backwards.
You can give him the excuse of losing Suarez but if you're going to do that then you have to take a lot of the credit for last season away from Rodgers and credit it to Suarez instead. Either way it's a poor reflection of Rodgers.
Even if he doesn't get top 4, he deserves another season IMO. He has shown he can take them forward, which he did with their style of play in his first season and by getting them to challenge for the title last season which was an overachievement. Even with Suarez, that team should not have challenged City, Arsenal and Chelsea for the title. It is true that Chelsea and City stumbled a lot and they were both playing in Europe so they were not at 100% which was a large part of what gave Liverpool the chance but that is what normally happens in these underdog stories in football. Last year Madrid and Barcelona were not at their best (they were 10-13 points off what they normally have been achieving in recent years) but nobody tries to take away from Simeone's achievement and rightly so. It was the same when Benitez won with Valencia (Madrid and Barca were not at their best) and the same when Klopp won two Bundesliga titles in a row (Bayern did not play near the highest level they were capable of).
Not winning the title last year was not a failure in my eyes, it was overachieving. City, Arsenal, Chelsea had better players than them and they finished ahead of Chelsea and Arsenal. I would consider not getting into the CL this year to be disappointing for Liverpool and to be a failure, but I still think that Rodgers deserves another year to see if he can make progress which he has shown that he can before (and it is not like there are any managers available to Liverpool that can guarantee better results than Rodgers has been getting).
Not winning the title last year was not a failure in my eyes, it was overachieving. City, Arsenal, Chelsea had better players than them and they finished ahead of Chelsea and Arsenal. I would consider not getting into the CL this year to be disappointing for Liverpool and to be a failure, but I still think that Rodgers deserves another year to see if he can make progress which he has shown that he can before (and it is not like there are any managers available to Liverpool that can guarantee better results than Rodgers has been getting).
It's a weird one, apparently his job was under serious threat during the bad run before christmas, so although that has been turned around overall since then, Liverpool are still not in the top 4, and at the moment don't look like having a chance of challenging for it.
He probably deserves another year, but Liverpool cannot have a bad transfer window.
He probably deserves another year, but Liverpool cannot have a bad transfer window.
To be fair a lot of dross signings preceded Rodgers. He has been fairly good with the money so far, a few blunders aside, IMO. Lovren, Balotelli and players like Aspas should have never happened but the likes of Sturridge, Can, Moreno, Markovic, maybe Lallana, maybe Allen have all been decent signings. They still lack quality in a clear and distinct way.
Looking back, its pretty crazy how the table looked with 3 games left. How did they feck that up?
Does this give anyone else chills...? Like, proper chills?
Looking back, its pretty crazy how the table looked with 3 games left. How did they feck that up?
I honestly thought it was all over at that time and what a horrible thought it was. Thank you Stevie G.
I'll forever be grateful to Mourinho for that, and stopping Barca retain the CL.
But the point is they needed to get a point against Chelsea to keep thing in their own hands with 2 relatively straight forward fixtures to go.
What made you happy about Jose stopping Barça defending the Champions League in 2010?
I so wanted United to be the first club to retain it in 09 (and we would have if not for that idiot Ovebro), it'd have been very painful to see Barca do it immediately afterwads.
I disagree, they were gash in the first couple of months and with some tactical and formation changes he turned their fortunes around.
Locked himself in his office for days trying to think of some sort of tactical solution. Only came out to ask his coaches in and to get some pizza.
Bloody loves pizza does Brendan
Yes, all praise to Brendan for working out how to escape from the toilet he'd locked himself in.
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