Bluemoon goes into Meltdown

I'm perhaps not quite as apathetic towards the Champions League as the second quote in Gregster's post, but I can relate to it to an extent. Especially the group stages. I was way more annoyed about the draw to Newcastle and the loss to Swansea than I was about the loss to PSV. The group stages are laborious, and rarely produce a good spectacle. It's just about getting through.

I'm sure City fans will start to care when they reach that stage and are tied with an opponent that isn't Barcelona.
 
I can relate to that too, I almost hate European competition, want to be in it but all the cheating and shit referee decisions, fecks me off no end.
 
To be fair, i don't care as much about the Champions League and i'm very much a 'League first' kind of guy. Probably because we have zero chance of winning the Champions League these days, although you could say the same about the league at the moment.
 
@VanGaalEra

is this you mate?
Purple-Flowers-Wallpaper.jpg
 
SteveJ said:
Those two quotes are effectively: "We're probably not going to win, so I've lost interest." Telling.
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It's true though that City fans in general have never warmed to European football for whatever reason, the same applies for me. The 3-2 win over Bayern with a last minute winner last season, for example, did not come close to how I celebrated or felt after Iheanacho scored to win the game against Palace. Don't get me wrong, I'd love City to win the Champions League, however I view it very much as a sideshow to league football. City do not have the history in the competition that other teams do like United, Liverpool, Madrid etc. so it's only to be expected that not all fans are hugely concerned with it.
 
BobbyManc said:
It's true though that City fans in general have never warmed to European football for whatever reason, the same applies for me. The 3-2 win over Bayern with a last minute winner last season, for example, did not come close to how I celebrated or felt after Iheanacho scored to win the game against Palace. Don't get me wrong, I'd love City to win the Champions League, however I view it very much as a sideshow to league football. City do not have the history in the competition that other teams do like United, Liverpool, Madrid etc. so it's only to be expected that not all fans are hugely concerned with it.
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It's because the fecking group stages are somewhat boring, they're still so far away from the actual title. I'm also a lot more excited about beating Mainz in the league than beating City in the CL group stages, because it's a game directly influencing the title. Group games in the CL don't feel like that. It doesn't devalue the competition though, you just haven't experienced (yet?) how a late winner in a CL quarter final feels or a penalty shootout in a semifinal, let alone drama in a final.
 
Their main allegation is, of course, that the whole tournament is corrupt and rigged to prevent them from winning. It's a constant refrain from a certain kind of City fan who is convinced that they have deliberately been put into difficult groups to stop them truely joining the elite. That quote from a City fan upthread is also pretty illuminating:

"It's boring as feck. We've played 5 league games this season and all of them have been top-notch entertainment. We've played 13 CL games at home and just one of them, against Bayern last season, have been any good. Shit refs, corrupt organisation, cheating opposition players, shit performances from us. I'm quite happy spending £100 to go to Spurs because I know I'll see a good game and have a good day out. But I won't spend the money to go 5 miles down the road to watch a CL game."

He's basically saying (along with the paranoia) that in the CL City aren't allowed to play as well as they do against inferior opposition in the EPL therefore he's not going. That's a strange kind of "supporter" in my book.
 
CL is special for me. Always has and always will be. Why i'm not too excited about it this season is I no we are far from the top sides. I know we will get KO once we face any of the top sides. That puts a bit of a downer on it. I would love nothing more than a CL run.
 
It's because they haven't had instant success in it like they thought they would. That's why it's corrupt blah de bloody blah. How long were United in it and how much heartbreak before we won it in 99? And we had the foreigners rule to contend with in the early years. I'm glad they're bottlers in CL because this IS a fact, they'd soon be interested in it if they got to the quarters/semis! Let's see how many of em wouldn't interested in it then! Bunch of helmets that lot. Boo hoo City's billions can't buy them the CL.....YET.
 
Balu said:
It's because the fecking group stages are somewhat boring, they're still so far away from the actual title. I'm also a lot more excited about beating Mainz in the league than beating City in the CL group stages, because it's a game directly influencing the title. Group games in the CL don't feel like that. It doesn't devalue the competition though, you just haven't experienced (yet?) how a late winner in a CL quarter final feels or a penalty shootout in a semifinal, let alone drama in a final.
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That's pretty much what I'm saying though. Until that first real buzz and sense of excitement arrives from playing in the competition, many fans will remain indifferent towards it.
 
thegregster said:
Some claim they don't care.



Has to be a United fan wumming.
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Has to be. That can't be serious.

1. How can a Bluemoon poster have "rag mates" (plural!) and
2. He cares more about beating West Ham than Juventus? I can understand people wanting to win the PL more than the CL as it's a league competition but ffs.
 
RetroStu said:
To be fair, i don't care as much about the Champions League and i'm very much a 'League first' kind of guy. Probably because we have zero chance of winning the Champions League these days, although you could say the same about the league at the moment.
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I personally think we'll win the Champions League before we win the Premier League again...
 
Champions league stopped mattering as much to me when it became the Champions and assorted friends money making league, How a team can win it despite possibly not being the champions of their own country the season before or containing the win yet claim to be the best in europe?!? utter balls.
 
Sparky_Hughes said:
Champions league stopped mattering as much to me when it became the Champions and assorted friends money making league, How a team can win it despite possibly not being the champions of their own country the season before or containing the win yet claim to be the best in europe?!? utter balls.
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So you didn't enjoy the CL final in '99 all that much? After all, United became the first club to do just that, win it without being title defenders or league winners the previous season.
 
Sparky_Hughes said:
Champions league stopped mattering as much to me when it became the Champions and assorted friends money making league, How a team can win it despite possibly not being the champions of their own country the season before or containing the win yet claim to be the best in europe?!? utter balls.
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I think there's the odd winner that is clearly below par (*cough* Chelsea) but generally, the best team in Europe does seem to win it.
 
Balu said:
So you didn't enjoy the CL final in '99 all that much? After all, United became the first club to do just that, win it without being title defenders or league winners the previous season.
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I enjoyed it but it means less to me than a league win.
 
Sparky_Hughes said:
I enjoyed it but it means less to me than a league win.
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Fair enough. I do hate the side effects it brought with it and the major role it played in creating the huge gap between the top leagues and the rest of Europe (along with the Bosman ruling). I don't think it's necessarily a bad idea though and we saw amazing CL campaigns that wouldn't have happened otherwise.
 
Balu said:
Fair enough. I do hate the side effects it brought with it and the major role it played in creating the huge gap between the top leagues and the rest of Europe (along with the Bosman ruling). I don't think it's necessarily a bad idea though and we saw amazing CL campaigns that wouldn't have happened otherwise.
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Dont misunderstand me, I enjoy the competition, and the enjoyment it brings, but Im far less gutted by loosing in a CL final than I would be by loosing the league.
 
Andy_Cole said:
Don't believe you. That was the sweetest win of my lifetime. I was 9 years old and still remember it like it was yesterday.
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Again, dont think I didnt enjoy it, it was great, but Id have been far less gutted had we lost that than if we had f'd up against Spurs and lost the league.
 
Sparky_Hughes said:
Dont misunderstand me, I enjoy the competition, and the enjoyment it brings, but Im far less gutted by loosing in a CL final than I would be by loosing the league.
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Yeah, I get that. I just don't get why that would have been different before the creation of the CL. You said the EC/CL stopped mattering to you with the extension to more than just one team from each country. That sounds really odd for a United fan with the most successful and dramatic season ever being so closely related to exactly that extension.
 
Champions League wins I remember more than anything.

The only other league finale that I remember as vividly was the horror of the Aguero one for City.
 
How many times has a CL team that came 2nd in their group gone on to win the tournament, anyone know?
 
Balu said:
Yeah, I get that. I just don't get why that would have been different before the creation of the CL. You said the EC/CL stopped mattering to you with the extension to more than just one team from each country. That sounds really odd for a United fan with the most successful and dramatic season ever being so closely related to exactly that extension.
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It's a silly thing to care about. It that were the case, a team could genuinely be the best team in Europe by far and not even be in the competition. It could also mean that a team that's regressed since last season would be the only club from it's country in the CL (à la Chelsea this season?)
 
TwoSheds said:
How many times has a CL team that came 2nd in their group gone on to win the tournament, anyone know?
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Since 1993 (when it became the Champions League):

1995 had a finalist finish second (Milan) but were beaten by Ajax who topped the same group
1997 was won by Dortmund who finished 2nd in their group (same points as 1st place, but less GD)
1998 had a finalist finish 2nd behind United (Juventus) but lost the final
1999 was won by United who finished 2nd in their group, behind the runner up Bayern
2002 had a finalist finish 2nd (Leverkusen) but lost the final to Madrid
2004 was won by Porto who finished 2nd in their group
2005 was won by Liverpool who finished 2nd in their group
2010 had both finalists finish 2nd in their groups (Bayern and Inter), and Inter won
2015 had a finalist finish 2nd in the group (Juventus) but were beaten by Barca in the final

So it only happened 5 times out of 23 seasons. 9 of the 23 had a finalist who finished 2nd in their group.
 
TwoSheds said:
How many times has a CL team that came 2nd in their group gone on to win the tournament, anyone know?
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Inter 2010, Liverpool 2005 and I think Porto 2004 as well, not 100% sure about that. United 1999 and Dortmund 1997 definitely as well.
 
Raw said:
Since 1993 (when it became the Champions League):

1995 had a finalist finish second (Milan) but were beaten by Ajax who topped the same group
1997 was won by Dortmund who finished 2nd in their group (same points as 1st place, but less GD)
1998 had a finalist finish 2nd behind United (Juventus) but lost the final
1999 was won by United who finished 2nd in their group, behind the runner up Bayern
2002 had a finalist finish 2nd (Leverkusen) but lost the final to Madrid
2004 was won by Porto who finished 2nd in their group
2005 was won by Liverpool who finished 2nd in their group
2010 had both finalists finish 2nd in their groups (Bayern and Inter), and Inter won
2015 had a finalist finish 2nd in the group (Juventus) but were beaten by Barca in the final

So it only happened 4 times out of 23 seasons. 9 of the 23 had a finalist who finished 2nd in their group.
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That's 5, not 4 ;).
 
Raw said:
Since 1993 (when it became the Champions League):

1995 had a finalist finish second (Milan) but were beaten by Ajax who topped the same group
1997 was won by Dortmund who finished 2nd in their group (same points as 1st place, but less GD)
1998 had a finalist finish 2nd behind United (Juventus) but lost the final
1999 was won by United who finished 2nd in their group, behind the runner up Bayern
2002 had a finalist finish 2nd (Leverkusen) but lost the final to Madrid
2004 was won by Porto who finished 2nd in their group
2005 was won by Liverpool who finished 2nd in their group
2010 had both finalists finish 2nd in their groups (Bayern and Inter), and Inter won
2015 had a finalist finish 2nd in the group (Juventus) but were beaten by Barca in the final

So it only happened 5 times out of 23 seasons. 9 of the 23 had a finalist who finished 2nd in their group.
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Top work. Sounds about what you'd expect really I suppose.
 
That 99 final is something I'll never forget for the rest of my life.

In fact, that whole season I will never forget for the rest of my life. GOAT season.
 
Sassy Colin said:
I have to say that winning the 1999 CL final was possibly the highest point in all my years supporting United, well the last few minutes anyway. I have never made so much noise, nor been so happy, watching a game of football before or since.
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I still get chills thinking about it. I'm all tingly right now.
 
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