Being Realistic - Where do we go from here?

If we abuse the sponsors enough and they cut ties with the club...it might force the Glazers out

We need to get rid of the Glazers.
 
Attila said:
If we abuse the sponsors enough and they cut ties with the club...it might force the Glazers out

We need to get rid of the Glazers.
Click to expand...
Yeah I guess I'm working with the assumption that this is just a false dream and that realistically, the Glazers aren't selling. Look how long it took Mike Ashley to sell Newcastle, and they were worth a fraction of what we were and there were even more protests and multiple relegations under him. I just don't see the Glazers selling any time soon. So what happens next, with the assumption that they won't leave. Because you can't just will a 4 billion purchase/sale out of nowhere.
 
Going to indulge my inner muppet. But I think the following is achievable between now and the end of the window.

1) Get shot of Ronaldo, mutual termination or Chelsea on a free.
2) Use the salary saved to pay up de Jong's owed wages.
3) Rabiot in
4) Morata in (loan)
5) Max Aarons in.

Off pitch:

Club - Stay the course, be patient, scout tae feck.

Fans - Stay patient, but protests, regularly, home and away.
 
For me the 100% thing we need to do is move Murtough on. For me I would beg Rangnick to come back in at least as a temporary DOF to at least get through this summer.

With Ten Hag we have to support him as best he a great coach but this is obviously a massive challenge and a really steep learning curve between the dutch league and the premier league. However, we obviously need to to take the transfer decisions out of his hands, because this manager lead recruitment has been a disaster so far.
 
Being realistic?
Nowhere. The team and club is what it is.
The squad is filled with bad players with stinky performances that seem to spread easier than covid, and the people who run it as a machine to make money are still decisionmakers. This will not turn around in my lifetime.

I cant see the fanbase drive the owners out of the club and i can't see someone come in and sort the issues.
 
Ideally relegation. It would suck in the short term, but be worth it long term. Most of the these players belong in the Championship anyway. The Premier League wouldn’t be the same without United in it. Maybe the media, fans, and government would finally see how owners like the Glazers are terrible for the sport.
 
Honestly, right now we're showing relegation form. Seven away defeats on the trot scoring something like two goals. A home defeat to Brighton. It's the only thing I envision right now unless there's a big turn.
 
redcucumber said:
Liverpool forced Gillett and Hicks out. I know the situation was slightly more dire as they had plunged Liverpool into serious financial insecurity, but can't we at least try?
Click to expand...
There would have to be a massive campaign to force them out. Barely any fans showing up for games, not buying any United merchandise, boycotting all of United partners products etc. Might still not work though.

Quoting Noel Gallagher "This is what happens when you get involved with Americans"
 
The first thing that needs to happen is to put players in the team who are hungry, are willing to put a shift in and have pride in playing for the club. If that means dropping GOATs and multiple world cup winners etc then so be it. I don't care who you are, if you have no desire to put the effort in then you don't play. Liverpool starting 11 should be:

GK - De Gea
Henderson would have been a better option but he is on loan so we have no option.

LB - Malacia
CB - Martinez
CB - Bailly
RB - Wan Bissaka
Malacia and Martinez need to be given 6 months in the side to give them the opportunity to showcase their ability. Bailly is aggressive and more likely to put a shift in than any of the other CBs. Dalot is a liability so it's time to give Wan Bissaka another run in the team, although i'd much rather get shut of both of them and sign a new RB.

CM - Garner
CM - Van De Beek
CAM - Eriksen
Garner should be given a chance. He has skill and is a good lad. He simply cannot be worse than the McTominay/Fred combination. VDB not ideal but I feel he has never been given a proper chance in the team. Fernandes has been awful for the last 6 months - he needs dropping so Eriksen can play in his preferred role.

LW - Garnacho
RW - Sancho
ST - Elanga
Sancho is probably the only player in recent weeks that we might be able to salvage. Elanga is a good youth product and should start up front. Also time for Garnacho to be given opportunities. Rashford should be nowhere near the team ever again and Ronaldo has no intention of staying so should be sold to anyone interested.

Before the end of August our number 1 priority should be to sign a central midfielder. Also very high on the priority list should be a RB and a ST.
 
I think if we're being realistic and honest with ourselves, the only way from here is down.

The Glazers will not sell the club and they definitely will not do what's needed to fix the club because that would be very expensive, and is beyond their level of understanding. There will not be a proper DoF, ever. We will not hire world class scouts etc.

The players we have will not be easily moved on, and with the money invested, the Glazers will not allow them to be sold unless they are terrible for many years (as we have seen with others) and even then, only for a good offer, which any club would be crazy to make!

So the fact is that we are stuck with these players for the most part at least, we're stuck with the Glazers for many more years, and by the time they leave, they will have sucked out everything good about the club and we will be in a terrible position.

The only hope is EtH at present. If he can find some super bargain players with the pittance he's given, and somehow make them into a team then maybe we can reach top 4 again in the next couple of years and CL football would make a difference, in the short term at least.

If EtH cannot perform minor miracles however, then I think the best we can hope for is that we solidify ourselves as a mid table side and avoid being dragged into the relegation mess because our players definitely cannot handle that level of pressure!!
 
bosnian_red said:
If we're realistic, the Glazers aren't going to sell. That's a fantasy unfortunately. So where do we go from here? To me it seems clear that the board won't financially support the manager enough to build a squad that he needs, or revamp the squad to at least bring freshness and a new mood in which is necessary right now. That won't happen. Its a few in, a few out. We can't build a Pep style system, a Ten Hag style system without him being backed to change the squad how he wants. So our ceiling is capped if we can't do that. So what happens from here? What is our best route forward with that in mind? What is going to happen this season with the club? The manager won't have a chance without a big last 3 weeks in the window, and a quantity of changes are needed just to change the mood, and I can't see that happening.

You look at a form table, we are in the relegation zone if you look at the past half season of league games. We've been hammered in the past 7 away games with 7 straight defeats, a goal difference of 2-20. The way this season has started... Who is to say this won't continue? We've done feck all in the transfer window and unless we bring in another 3-4 players and ship another 5 out to just change the atmosphere, where is any win going to come from?

I genuinely don't know what to expect from us this season. I can see a scenario where Ten Hag just walks, and in that case, who the feck takes on this job next? If it fails with ten hag, we are genuinely an untouchable job IMO. Maybe/probably being dramatic, but it just feels different this time, and not in a good way.
Click to expand...
There’s your problem, don’t expect anything other than seeing some progress in style/identity as the season progresses. Nothing more, nothing less

people keep saying Ten Hag will walk. He won’t, it’s not logical that he quits his first job at a big club. He’s not a quitter eitherv
 
RedMarcus said:
The first thing that needs to happen is to put players in the team who are hungry, are willing to put a shift in and have pride in playing for the club. If that means dropping GOATs and multiple world cup winners etc then so be it. I don't care who you are, if you have no desire to put the effort in then you don't play. Liverpool starting 11 should be:

GK - De Gea
Henderson would have been a better option but he is on loan so we have no option.

LB - Malacia
CB - Martinez
CB - Bailly
RB - Wan Bissaka
Malacia and Martinez need to be given 6 months in the side to give them the opportunity to showcase their ability. Bailly is aggressive and more likely to put a shift in than any of the other CBs. Dalot is a liability so it's time to give Wan Bissaka another run in the team, although i'd much rather get shut of both of them and sign a new RB.

CM - Garner
CM - Van De Beek
CAM - Eriksen
Garner should be given a chance. He has skill and is a good lad. He simply cannot be worse than the McTominay/Fred combination. VDB not ideal but I feel he has never been given a proper chance in the team. Fernandes has been awful for the last 6 months - he needs dropping so Eriksen can play in his preferred role.

LW - Garnacho
RW - Sancho
ST - Elanga
Sancho is probably the only player in recent weeks that we might be able to salvage. Elanga is a good youth product and should start up front. Also time for Garnacho to be given opportunities. Rashford should be nowhere near the team ever again and Ronaldo has no intention of staying so should be sold to anyone interested.

Before the end of August our number 1 priority should be to sign a central midfielder. Also very high on the priority list should be a RB and a ST.
Click to expand...
You had me going along until elanga as a striker
I think we need a loan even if it’s Alvaro M
 
A Chinese multi billionaire will probably save us eventually. However we are sure going to suffer in the short term until it does.

The daughters of the Glazers are being harassed on social media now apparently. Not that I condone that sort of thing but surely they must be getting the jist now that the game is up. Things might regrettably get uglier too the longer they cling on.
 
After this summer, I genuinely don’t see any hope of progress under the current owners. It was sold as a fresh start in both top management and football side management,, with Arnold and Murtough running things, and instead we have the usual shambolic transfer window. As for what’s next, I would like ETH to give Arnold and Murtough an ultimatum and then, if things aren’t remedied by the end of the window (still too late of course to salvage the season), walking out. Unlike the previous occupant (as permanent manager), ETH has a respected body of work behind him and would not be too damaged by a short stint at what is seen around Europe as a basket case. We’d then be in an even worse mess of course but, by this stage, better shock treatment than death by a thousand cuts.
 
golden_blunder said:
There’s your problem, don’t expect anything other than seeing some progress in style/identity as the season progresses. Nothing more, nothing less

people keep saying Ten Hag will walk. He won’t, it’s not logical that he quits his first job at a big club. He’s not a quitter eitherv
Click to expand...
I hope he doesn't. But he did say before he took the job that he wanted assurances before he took it, and that he wouldn't take a job if he was set up to fail. And now his agents/advisors saying he is furious with the window and he's pleading for transfer activity. Outgoings being blocked by the Glazers. He has a huge reputation and he's a manager who would be wanted by Barca/Madrid/Bayern if they needed a manager right now. Its a worry for me for sure.

But yeah. I guess my expectations this season have to just be see what Ten Hag does over the season with the players we have. Who does he shun and drop. Which young players or bench players does he turn to to at least try and play his system, if not to a top level but to an acceptable level. Because right now it's all shit.
 
You let the club strengthen the squad until the end of the window and then you let Ten Hag work on forming his team.
 
People on here talking about fans needing to ‘continue’ protesting…eh?

Yesterday was NOT protesting! They took out a few banners and weren’t even chanting ‘Glazer Out’!

Piss poor effort!
 
RedMarcus said:
The first thing that needs to happen is to put players in the team who are hungry, are willing to put a shift in and have pride in playing for the club. If that means dropping GOATs and multiple world cup winners etc then so be it. I don't care who you are, if you have no desire to put the effort in then you don't play. Liverpool starting 11 should be:

GK - De Gea
Henderson would have been a better option but he is on loan so we have no option.

LB - Malacia
CB - Martinez
CB - Bailly
RB - Wan Bissaka
Malacia and Martinez need to be given 6 months in the side to give them the opportunity to showcase their ability. Bailly is aggressive and more likely to put a shift in than any of the other CBs. Dalot is a liability so it's time to give Wan Bissaka another run in the team, although i'd much rather get shut of both of them and sign a new RB.

CM - Garner
CM - Van De Beek
CAM - Eriksen
Garner should be given a chance. He has skill and is a good lad. He simply cannot be worse than the McTominay/Fred combination. VDB not ideal but I feel he has never been given a proper chance in the team. Fernandes has been awful for the last 6 months - he needs dropping so Eriksen can play in his preferred role.

LW - Garnacho
RW - Sancho
ST - Elanga
Sancho is probably the only player in recent weeks that we might be able to salvage. Elanga is a good youth product and should start up front. Also time for Garnacho to be given opportunities. Rashford should be nowhere near the team ever again and Ronaldo has no intention of staying so should be sold to anyone interested.

Before the end of August our number 1 priority should be to sign a central midfielder. Also very high on the priority list should be a RB and a ST.
Click to expand...
Ok if we play Martinez next to Malacia who incidentally is 5’5/6 next to a 5’8/9 CB we will concede an average of 2/3 goals every game which is what we are currently conceding against mid table to lower table opposition, if ETH is that stupid he will be sacked after 6/7 games with 1/2 points and his reputation in tatters.
Right now against Liverpool we shut up shop and try and play counter attacking football. I would for this game only go with 352 formation with D De Gea, AWB, Bailey, Varanne, Lindelof, Shaw, J Garner, DVB, Eriksen, Rashford and Ronaldo not because this is our best team but because those players deserve to either sink or swim; I had have Heaton, Maguire, Dalot, Malacia, Martinez, Sancho, Bruno, Garnaucho, IQbal on the bench
Our priority right now is to stop shipping goals Nunez and Salah would destroy Mallacia and Fernandez on our left side.

I mean we currently have 6 CBs and 1 recognised CF we should play to our strengths.
 
Whilst I don’t want to see it, I feel a season of complete mediocrity of shite play, languishing in the bottom half of the table is what we need.
Shirt sponsor coming up for renewal….that will be a poor deal if we are still shite.
The PL will shit their pants if there is a question of us getting relegated. A TV deal with Sky and worldwide audiences will take a huge hit if United aren’t in the league. You can already sense Sky view to the Glazers changing with the interviews this last week. They aren’t stupid.
Overpaid players will be pushed out at Co tract renewal time. DDG, Shaw, Martial, Rashford and Co won’t stay - they are the problem on the pitch and need to feck off too.
We seriously can’t rebuild and move forward with the Glazers in charge, so this needs to change for us to do this. A proper tumescent season and they will sell because the cost of everything is getting ridiculous. Americans can’t get their heads around relegation, hence their hard on the the ESL.
I’d actually take relegation if they were to sell.
 
Hire a sporting director and a competent back room staff. Make an actual plan: what are our long term goals, what style/formation are will we utilise going forward? Then buy players that actually fit this overall plan. If Ten Hag (or a future manager) is fired, we need to replace him with a manager whose philosophy matches the club's plan and the players bought to fit this style. That way we may actually see progression and avoid having to make a complete squad overhaul every 2-3 years.

First of all we need to get rid of the players who are clearly not good enough and don't have the right mentality. Ironically (?) this means most of our British players: Rashford, Maguire, Shaw, McTominay, Jones, Williams, Wan-Bissaka and Tuanzebe. De Gea, van de Beek, Bailly, Dalot, Martial, and Bruno need to be shifted sooner or later as well. Obviously, these changes have to be made over a few windows/years. As part of this generational change I think we should give our young players/academy players as much playing time as possible to evaluate who we should move on and who we should keep - especially as this season is likely going to be a transitional and without any chance of top 4. We shouldn't have players like Chong in our squad.

As a part of this squad overhaul we need to change our wage structure and stop paying silly wages to shitty players and stop giving desperate bumper contracts left and right. We should also stop buying old players like Cavani, Ronaldo, Schweinsteiger, Ibrahimovc etc. as stopgaps to our problems, and instead focus on buying younger, hungry players who have a future.

Oh, and we should get new owners...
 
You need to put out a team and formation barely recognisable from the one from last season. Sell Rashford, terminate Ronaldo's contract, whatever it takes. This team and its mentality is broken and some need to go to rebuild it clearly. Target and bring in as many top 6ish players as you can. Shop at Brighton, Brentford, Crystal Palace level. Play youth players. Demand workrate and discipline. Substitute with youth team player willing to run if necessary. Early substitutions.
New keeper is needed, its essential. We need a goalscorer.
Shaw needs dropping till he loses weight and looks like an athlete again.
We need to set a minimum standard of workrate. Play a back 3, go ultra defensive with team selection if necessary and make us hard to beat - like carrick actually
 
Last edited:
All I'm seeing is we're on our own way straight into becoming a midtable club. Even our transfer business is starting to look like that of a club of such stature. The reluctance of the club to make a huge rebuild from scratch will end up with us eventually becoming a persistent midtable team with the occasional top 4 finish.
 
I'm just hoping we can have a season like Arsenal last year which is depressing to say. Something to build on for next season would be a success at this rate and all I expected coming into the season, although losing to Brighton and Brentford was obviously a shock
 
RedMarcus said:
The first thing that needs to happen is to put players in the team who are hungry, are willing to put a shift in and have pride in playing for the club. If that means dropping GOATs and multiple world cup winners etc then so be it. I don't care who you are, if you have no desire to put the effort in then you don't play. Liverpool starting 11 should be:

GK - De Gea
Henderson would have been a better option but he is on loan so we have no option.

LB - Malacia
CB - Martinez
CB - Bailly
RB - Wan Bissaka
Malacia and Martinez need to be given 6 months in the side to give them the opportunity to showcase their ability. Bailly is aggressive and more likely to put a shift in than any of the other CBs. Dalot is a liability so it's time to give Wan Bissaka another run in the team, although i'd much rather get shut of both of them and sign a new RB.

CM - Garner
CM - Van De Beek
CAM - Eriksen
Garner should be given a chance. He has skill and is a good lad. He simply cannot be worse than the McTominay/Fred combination. VDB not ideal but I feel he has never been given a proper chance in the team. Fernandes has been awful for the last 6 months - he needs dropping so Eriksen can play in his preferred role.

LW - Garnacho
RW - Sancho
ST - Elanga
Sancho is probably the only player in recent weeks that we might be able to salvage. Elanga is a good youth product and should start up front. Also time for Garnacho to be given opportunities. Rashford should be nowhere near the team ever again and Ronaldo has no intention of staying so should be sold to anyone interested.

Before the end of August our number 1 priority should be to sign a central midfielder. Also very high on the priority list should be a RB and a ST.
Click to expand...

Wan Bissaka has to go
 
Von Mistelroum said:
I think if we're being realistic and honest with ourselves, the only way from here is down.

The Glazers will not sell the club and they definitely will not do what's needed to fix the club because that would be very expensive, and is beyond their level of understanding. There will not be a proper DoF, ever. We will not hire world class scouts etc.

The players we have will not be easily moved on, and with the money invested, the Glazers will not allow them to be sold unless they are terrible for many years (as we have seen with others) and even then, only for a good offer, which any club would be crazy to make!

So the fact is that we are stuck with these players for the most part at least, we're stuck with the Glazers for many more years, and by the time they leave, they will have sucked out everything good about the club and we will be in a terrible position.

The only hope is EtH at present. If he can find some super bargain players with the pittance he's given, and somehow make them into a team then maybe we can reach top 4 again in the next couple of years and CL football would make a difference, in the short term at least.

If EtH cannot perform minor miracles however, then I think the best we can hope for is that we solidify ourselves as a mid table side and avoid being dragged into the relegation mess because our players definitely cannot handle that level of pressure!!
Click to expand...

Then may as well just throw it in
 
Bruno is the problem, not McFred or Ronaldo. He was so good in the past we have basically become reliant on him. His decrease in output has taken the whole team to the woodshed

I do not know how Bruno will fare under ETH, what the plan is. I think we need another playmaker though.
 
Abraxas said:
It's a difficult problem to solve in terms of long term aims and achieving them. But I think there are 3 main aspects. This window, the manager, and the recruitment moving forward.

The club has to get in at least a couple of signings that the manager wants between now and the end of the window to be able to say they've given him any sort of chance. It is not going to be perfect window as even if we secure some exceptional signings, we have blundered in preparation and now start off on a terrible foot. But it's better than the alternative - no signings or bad ones.

The manager has to learn, and pretty damn quickly. That's coaching, you have to get a tune out of what you've got or you face consequences. He needs to realise what the PL demands and who he is most likely to be able to rely on. Quite simply, he has to find a formula that works enough to start building some kind of platform, even if it's not utopian football or ending in a great season. We can't keep getting battered.

This season the recruitment department and the hierarchy need to sort it out, and very quickly. We need to be going into future windows with profiles that are required, lists of players of all age brackets, ideally with a preference for players desperate to come that are potential improvers. We need some joined up thinking.
Click to expand...

We need MINIMUM of FOUR
 
croadyman said:
We need MINIMUM of FOUR
Click to expand...
Probably, if we hope to reverse our current form and complete for the top four.

But if you look at what we would have provided, Eriksen, Martinez, Malacia (all ETH choices) plus two more I don't think he could complain. Only so much is realistically possible in one summer. But obviously even this depends on the next few weeks.
 
Should of had the signings we so desperately need then we might not of lost the first 2 games. I see 2 of our targets had good games over the weekend… dumfries and Antony. Those 2 would improve us massively.
 
Nani Nana said:
Bruno is the problem, not McFred or Ronaldo. He was so good in the past we have basically become reliant on him. His decrease in output has taken the whole team to the woodshed

I do not know how Bruno will fare under ETH, what the plan is. I think we need another playmaker though.
Click to expand...
I think he just needs dropping, you’ll be surprised how dropping players can make them perform when they next play. I’d say play rabiot and de Jong as the double if we manage to get them and then play eriksen as number 10.
 
Abraxas said:
Probably, if we hope to reverse our current form and complete for the top four.

But if you look at what we would have provided, Eriksen, Martinez, Malacia (all ETH choices) plus two more I don't think he could complain. Only so much is realistically possible in one summer. But obviously even this depends on the next few weeks.
Click to expand...
They are all ETH choices but I think we’ve got the signings in the wrong order and prioritised the wrong positions. A CM should of been signed before a LB, even a RB should of been signed before a LB seen as though he ain’t starting the new LB. CM and a ST should of been the first 2 signings… then bring In the others.
 
The club will rise only when it starts losing money and I mean really losing it that it will make Glazers sell it.
 
DJ_21 said:
They are all ETH choices but I think we’ve got the signings in the wrong order and prioritised the wrong positions. A CM should of been signed before a LB, even a RB should of been signed before a LB seen as though he ain’t starting the new LB. CM and a ST should of been the first 2 signings… then bring In the others.
Click to expand...
So who takes responsibility for that?

It's hard to say. The manager has to get his point across and stress what the priorities are. He's the only one with the acumen to do that considering we don't have a proper structure and ultimately he takes the hit for the sporting operation failing.

But if he's a lame duck and Murtough and co are doing whatever they want in whatever order they want, that's also a problem. But that seems incredibly unlikely to me, would Murtough really sign off a transfer without the managers backing?

I don't know what's going on, I don't think the club even knows. That's the problem and why I said we have to get a structure and organisation in place. We should know months out what the budget is, what the priorities are, what the key targets by position are, what the exact profiles are. It's really not that difficult, it's formulating a plan of attack for a transfer window. But we don't seem to do it, we just flop around in the market.
 
It will be interesting to see how the team reacts once Ronaldo is gone.

The group needs to become closer together and fight for every point, they are better than they are showing.
 
Abraxas said:
Probably, if we hope to reverse our current form and complete for the top four.

But if you look at what we would have provided, Eriksen, Martinez, Malacia (all ETH choices) plus two more I don't think he could complain. Only so much is realistically possible in one summer. But obviously even this depends on the next few weeks.
Click to expand...

5 nowhere near enough because none of them were priority signings whatsoever
 
You must log in or register to reply here.