We would be spending the money we spend on a position we have badly needed a good player in for 4 years.
Bale.... or Willian
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We would be spending the money we spend on a position we have badly needed a good player in for 4 years.
That's the going rate for good players nowadays. If you want a world class player you'll have to fork out £100m+, and if you want a wonderkid that'll cost you around £150m.
We have basically been priced out due to the crazy money City and PSG have thrown into the game without the demand from their fans to match it. City spend £50m+ on any half decent defender and PSG completely changed the market with their double swoop costing £370m.
Chelsea spent £53m on Morata and he has been atrocious for them, that sort of money used to buy you a certified success but now you spend that on speculative buys.
Great, then why not spend it on someone younger who will occupy that problem position for longer?
Because if we sign Willian, Mourinho will feel he's the player he needs to fill in that gap. I share his feeling. Willian is pretty fit, he will be good well into his 30s.
Yes, the market is crazy, bit you make it even crazier by trying to buy a player from your direct rivals. Even in this current market a fee like that for a good if not great 30 year old is crazy. It just is. Given our extensive scouting network I just don't understand how the club constantly seem to resort to these obvious and bloated purchases.
Willian will be good for a few years no doubt but a younger player would be good for longer than that. What's so complicated here?
I'm not against signing Willian, I just think we would be fleeced for him if we did. Fine if you don't care about the cost, it's not our money.
City just bought Mahrez for £60m which is about 70m euros. He has roughly the same attacking output as Willian. It might look ridiculous but the market sets the price of players, not fan sentiment.
Bear in mind that the scouting reports on Chong are very good, and he has been doing very well in the youth setup. Our scouting has been top notch in the academy. If the idea is to buy Willian now, and prepare Chong for that role in 3-4 years then I'm all for it.
Ok. It is your opinion. Personally i am sick of those kind of signings. New rio, new vidic, new ronaldo, future best this, future best that....
I'd take a 27 year old Mahrez over a 30 year old Willian any day of the week. I also think Mahrez is the better player of the two quite comfortably and was annoyed we weren't in for him too, mind.
How many players have actually been bought for 70m plus though? How many for 100m+?
Willian to me is a decent player but never a 70m player. He'd come in and do the Ji Sung Park role but cost ridiculous money. He wasn't even a guaranteed first teamer last season.
Jose is very uninspiring with these targets.
Well that's great that you think that. But by objective measures and the market that's not the case. They have similar end product, Mahrez has some playmaking about him while Willian is very direct. They suit their managers and so have a similar price as well. Mahrez will fit better into City's system of possession play while Willian will fit better in our system of direct counter attacking.
Willian will cost around £60m and many players have gone for that amount. City have just bought 2 players for that amount since January and they aren't world beaters either, they are bought for depth and rotation.
He probably isn't. Good chance someone we missed blows up this season and we'll be left asking ourselves why we weren't in for him. Our transfer scouting is shallow and what you'd expect on a fifa save, especially when it comes to attackers
In this crazy market where Richarlison goes for £50m and Alisson for £70m i am not surprised by the price of Willian.
He might be turning 30 but he is what Mourinho wants and what we need at RW.
I love Willian`s directness when he gets the ball, he goes FORWARD wich i missed the last years.
I love Mata but he is no RW and lacks the pace he is a no 10 so we need Willian.
Great video about Willian from last season:
He might be turning 30 but he is what Mourinho wants and what we need at RW.
I love Willian`s directness when he gets the ball, he goes FORWARD wich i missed the last years.
I love Mata but he is no RW and lacks the pace he is a no 10 so we need Willian.
Great video about Willian from last season:
We don't have their deep pockets. Their players are also young and will give many seasons. Juve bought a 50 goal man for 100 million. How is Willian at 29 a 60 mill player? Mane scored 20 goals last season. That's the level we need, not 6 goal Willian. He's an impact sub at best
FFS. he has such average output its unreal. Prime Valencia would like like Best compared to Willian
So basically what you're saying is Willian and Mahrez are very similar in quality and Willian is 3 years older and will cost £10m more.
So...
No way we need to pay extra in that swap.
Willian starting for Brazil, PL proven, 2 titles, 2 years left in contract, Mourinho rates him highly, didn't show desire publicly to leave.
In the other hand, Martial is not in the French team, not usually in starting 11 in Utd, didn't won anything, 1+1 years left in contract, wants to leave desperately.
He is younger tho, but that's all.
We will use him as number 9, so my question to Utd fans is how is he in that position?
Willian starting for Brazil, PL proven, 2 titles, 2 years left in contract, Mourinho rates him highly, didn't show desire publicly to leave.
In the other hand, Martial is not in the French team, not usually in starting 11 in Utd, didn't won anything, 1+1 years left in contract, wants to leave desperately.
He is younger tho, but that's all.
We will use him as number 9, so my question to Utd fans is how is he in that position?
A couple of points.
1) Willian will cost £60-65m so roughly the same as Mahrez
2) I think Mahrez is slightly better, but not to the level that would off set other factors such selling to rivals, player contracts, player willingness to leave. Mahrez handed in a transfer request while Willian has publicly stated that he'll stay at Chelsea if they want to keep him and will leave if they want to sell him. Mahrez is coming from Leicester and making a step up while Willian is coming from Chelsea. These will factor into the price.
3) Age is generally irrelevant when deciding fees between a 27 year old and 29 year old (it usually factors in when you are buying a young player). What is much more relevant is the current contract the player is on and the contract the player will recieve when changing clubs. Both Mahrez and Willian had 2 years left on their contract and Mahrez has gotten a 5 year contract. Based on the contract we gave Sanchez, Willian will most likely get a 4+1 contract. So it's not a surprise that they are around the same price.
I would conclude that we are paying a premium of around 10% on Willian due to factors outside of player quality. If we were buying Willian from Leicester we'd probably get him for slightly less than Mahrez.
Is it? I reckon it's more position dependent. Players tend to transition into roles that require less running and speed as they get older.
Willian is a winger. Care to name any good wingers past the age of 32-33 that can still see out a full season on the wing?
Football is a team sport and it is not always about wich team has the most expensive and flashy players but the right balance of players. Willian would bring something to the team wich we lack.
Hard to take you seriously when you mean Valencia was better as a winger.
Willian career stats:
491 Games 84 Goals 110 Assists
Valencia career stats:
422 Games 31 Goals 73 Assists
Great article about Willian and what he adds to United:
http://www.espn.co.uk/football/club...illian-he-is-the-perfect-jose-mourinho-player
Wow. Just, wow. And he made a staggering 7 assists as well. So a total of 18 goals and assists in 49 appearances. Amazing.
In Willian's best season, Chelsea were shit. says a lot. When they won the title under Jose he was fairly unproductive and merely an energetic bunny. Conte wins the league and willian is bit part. In fact he has been bit part for the last 2 seasons. He clearly isn't good enough. He virtually has no clout to be moving to a side who wants to overthrow City. We lack goals already especially in our front 3 and now we are getting another.
He showed strong mentality in one of the worst seasons Chelsea have had in many years.
I still believe he will give United better balance in the team and a strong team mentality wich we have seen Mourinho wants and we saw last season after coming back in games like against Chelsea, Crystal Palace and Man City that it is a good thing to have.
I think Willian would produce higher numbers in United but that is my opinion.
The lack of goals comes down to unbalanced team and not attacking talent. Most teams in the world would want Sanchez and Lukaku in the front line for example.
With Fred in the team we have balance in the midfield wich will elevate players like Pogba but he will also bring creativity and faster transitions the overall attacking play will be better and a fast and direct player like Willian will not hurt having around since we will counter attack much faster.
We would still lack some class on the fullbacks but that is another discussion.
There's no way we're paying £60m+ for a guy who will turn 30 on deadline day.
Ronaldo or Messi maybe, but not Willian.
Ronaldo or Messi maybe, but not Willian.
Ronaldo cost £105m at 33. You'll be looking at considerably more for a 30 year old Ronaldo. Maybe your barometer on transfer fees is a bit wrong?
Swap Martial for Willian, use the spare cash to sign Sandro. Chong will take over from Willian over the next two/three years.
Easy.
Easy.
Peak Valencia was definitely a better winger than Willian. Don't let his decline shroud that.
If Hazard isn't leaving, why would Martial swap one bench for another.
Striker.
Not a chance Chelsea trust him in a role where he's looked utterly hopeless more often than not.
On technical ability alone, this claim is invalid.
Examples?
It's better to buy future potential than present average.
We know Willian, we know what he does on his good days and how completely infrequent they are and we know how bad he is on his bad days. He's a known performance level and it's not good enough.
A Winger that never reached double figure goals in his whole career was better at his peak than a winger that you thought never reached double figure goals but actually did it three times in the last three season.
I am very confident that one could replace Willian with Valencia and nothing would change. If Valencia had played for Chelsea and we were looking to buy him at 30 you'd be saying what you are saying about Willian for Valencia.
He definitely was. Was our POTY too. You must not remember what peak Valencia looked like
I like Willian and Think he would be good for us , along with that Chong getting minutes Right side would be Good for a few years . No matter who we are linked with people will find faults , If he fits the system and Jose finds the balance I'm on board
A peak Valencia would beat a man and then whack a cross in to the defenders shin.
He still excels at one of these things
Peak Valencia was a great crosser. Have you already forgotten that partnership he struck up with Rooney. He didn't win POTY whacking defenders' shins. His crosses were probably among the best in the league
Finally someone who sees the full picture.
Barcelona wanted him, so he cant be all bad.
I mostly remember the days when Rooney would hit a long ball out to the wing and Valencia would smash in a cross and hope for the best
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