I think Justin Timber at Ajax would make a brilliant defensive midfielder. He is currently playing Center Back for Ajax but in the PL would be a little short to hold this position. But his aggression, movement and passing are better than Rice or Aurelien
Aurelien Tchouameni / Signs for Madrid
- Thread starter Adam-Utd
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He did well in both the West Ham and YB game (and the subs) this season. He was brilliant for Holland against Spain and Italy a year ago.
He can play as an 8 at a reasonably high level was my point. He's not "just a no 10". For Holland it was Wijnaldum De Jong VDB, (which is now Klaassen), for us it could be Bruno DM VDB or Bruno DM Fred. He's disciplined and defensive good enough to do that.
Pogba is gone, mate.
Maybe just a little loss of concentration or a mistake but it's why I see him more as a defensively capable CM than a CDM.
I don't think anybody is expecting him to play as the CDM. He's a box to box midfielder with high defensive stats.
He alongside Fred in midfield would give us great energy and tenacity all over the pitch.
So another Fred? With that combo we will probably be lacking quality on the ball in the middle. Maybe we can get him if he is an upgrade on Fred + also get a DLP type.
Sure but it seems like buying a player for the player than buying one for being the exact thing we need.
Do we really need to think about upgrading our CM when our only CDM is very old and arguably has stopped us playing our more creative CM's like Pogba or VDB in a more free way?
I just don't think he is on the must have section just yet.
And just as much as people question the value of an English player (like Rice) and their cost - I do wonder if some players/midfielders like Ndombele, Schneirderlin, Camavinga, Pogba, Rabiot, Fekir and maybe even Tchouameni get a tad overrated at their first clubs and get a bit found out especially when you see such players at a different club or in a different league. These players except a very few go do it at their clubs and people are then acting like the 40-90million was a bit of a lottery win or something when players like Pogba have straight been a dissapointment for a huge free.
Well it depends on how the team is going to be structured going into the future. Who the next manager will be taking us forward past Rangnick could choose 4-3-3 or 4-2-3-1
Will we need a specialist CDM for the base of a 3? or will we continue playing with a 10. If we are going to be pressing high then we need people who can read the game well and intercept high up the pitch.
I just hope the next manager doesn't look for fancy star named players first. The Woodward galatico era is what failed us more than anything. I do think with our recent changes in place we will start to get our act together more.
I really hope Ten Hag is the next appointment after Rangnick.
If its Ten Hag, we might go for Edson Alvarez, Ajax’s cdm
He's playing right now with Monaco against Sturm Graz in the Europa League
0-1 to Sturm Graz
0-1 to Sturm Graz
How was he in this match and vs PSg?
I see all those reports that connects him to Chelsea, Why aren't we even in the equation ?
They are asking a very large amount of money for him now
I just don't get the hype with him. He is hardly seen in the areas that gives protection to the defenders. Even if he is just a centre midfielder I see players getting past the midfield with him on a very regular basis.
Monaco won vs Rennes but Rennes players were just in behind all the time.
Is he really a player we need? I've been trying to keep my eyes on him to see if he can convince me but I can't. I like Caqueret better when I was looking at him.
Monaco won vs Rennes but Rennes players were just in behind all the time.
Is he really a player we need? I've been trying to keep my eyes on him to see if he can convince me but I can't. I like Caqueret better when I was looking at him.
I'm not too familiar with Tchouameni, so I can't comment much. However, I do remember watching him in the Nations League final against Spain, in which he lined up next to Pogba in a 3412 formation. Like yourself, I didn't find him anything special defensively. Actually, I remember being impressed with Pogba's defensive work more than Tchouameni's, which is saying something really.
Now, I personally don't think we need a out and out holding midfielder. I just think we need two box to box midfielders who are defensively sound, especially if we continue with a double pivot (hence the love for Fred and McTominay). I guess Tchouameni would fall into that category.
We have; however, been recently linked to another defence minded midfielder in Boubacar Kamara. Again, not a player I'm familiar with, but could be a stop gap to rotate with McFred, whilst focusing on a Matic replacement in the summer.
That's the thing, even as a box to box I'm not particularly that impressed with his attacks all that much. His numbers are good defensively but he doesn't really provide a stability that I like.
I guess its because I just don't see why we would be buying to further build up a box to box partnership that is arguably our only strength in midfield. What about the things we lack?
Do we have any deeper creativity that can come from midfield? (Examples at rivals are thiago, Jorginho) Do we have a CDM that can provide a stability to such a player and the players playing in front of him like Matic can. (Examples are Fabinho, Fernandinho)
Whilst I know Pogba is gone from Manchester United - I think finding a CDM that could have made Pogba work in a double pivot as his partner is a good analysis of what type of defensive midfielder we need. Then replacing Pogba as that creative CM in our squad should be done after aswell.
I just don't see how Tchouameni fits that really.
the problem was never to find a cdm for Pogba. The problem with Pogba is him not wanting to put in consistent shifts and being defensively responsible.
Where he had success, teams had 2 or 3 other midfielders covering for him.
Pogba is an advanced playmaker, His workrate from the LAM was good enough. The essential problem is to play him out of position. Some palyers are just lucky to play in their preffered positions all career because they are not as adaptable as Pogba who is the most well rounded player in the team we have seen for many years. Same could be applied to Rooney who was sacrificed a lot too to play deeper part of his career. Play Bruno as a no8 or a 6 and he will be atrocious, play Ronaldo as a winger and he will be half the player.
Discussing having a CDM to complement him is not about having a player to run for him but essentially push him forward to his advanced playmaker role he's more suited to.
We might yet see another revalation with Rangnick playing players where they should be or at least in a system which works which is something totally different as being the only world class talent in aging squad and playing with Pereira and Lingard in a subpar system for shite managers.
Yes please. Tchouameni is more of what we need and want in a CM. Not a CM that wants to be a no10 or a winger.
An actual CM that can pass and tackle well.
An actual CM that can pass and tackle well.
Man, I got excited when I saw this thread bumped… an ideal signing for me as a long term matic replacement.
The man sounds like a sneeze.
"Aaaaaaaaaatchouameni!!!!"
"Bless you"
"Thanks"
"Aaaaaaaaaatchouameni!!!!"
"Bless you"
"Thanks"
Sooooo another AWB in the midfield ? we don't need that
If I was United manager:
Matic out - Fabian Ruiz for Napoli and Spain as replacement
Pogba out - Aurelien Tchouameni
Potential United line up 442:
Sancho - Fabian/Bruno/McTom (nr.8 = the creative and more offensive role) - Aurelien Tchouameni/Fred (nr.6 = more defensive roles) - Luiz Diaz ( new left winger)
Greenwood/Bruno - Rashford
+ Aurelien Tchouameni still doesn’t the highest level of Pogba yet, the attacking and creative level. But his consistent mood will maybe and I think make him to strength United more, over a longer period. The next two years.
+ Fabian Ruiz from Napoli and Spain. If the left foot copy or category of Matic. Just younger and is able to score more goals from cm role than Matic. Fabian has clearly more goals in his game than Matic. And it is a strength.
And both of those two boys. Will help United to control the match. Dictate and dominate the matches more.
Both of Aurelien Tchouameni and Fabian Ruiz have really high football level right now. In theirs role and positions.
Matic out - Fabian Ruiz for Napoli and Spain as replacement
Pogba out - Aurelien Tchouameni
Potential United line up 442:
Sancho - Fabian/Bruno/McTom (nr.8 = the creative and more offensive role) - Aurelien Tchouameni/Fred (nr.6 = more defensive roles) - Luiz Diaz ( new left winger)
Greenwood/Bruno - Rashford
+ Aurelien Tchouameni still doesn’t the highest level of Pogba yet, the attacking and creative level. But his consistent mood will maybe and I think make him to strength United more, over a longer period. The next two years.
+ Fabian Ruiz from Napoli and Spain. If the left foot copy or category of Matic. Just younger and is able to score more goals from cm role than Matic. Fabian has clearly more goals in his game than Matic. And it is a strength.
And both of those two boys. Will help United to control the match. Dictate and dominate the matches more.
Both of Aurelien Tchouameni and Fabian Ruiz have really high football level right now. In theirs role and positions.
If we had any sense and Tchouameni is genuinely a long term target then we should go all out for him this month so he can adjust to the league but also help address our biggest problem which is a proper defensive midfielder with the energy to cover all the ground needed and give our forward players a solid platform to play from.
Personally I’d prefer Rice as he’s proven in our league, has leadership skills which we seriously lack and has shown this year that he has the ability to become a box to box player but I’d take Tchouameni right now if the board believe Rice to be unattainable or too expensive right now.
We would still a playmaker regardless of who we buy between Tchouameni and Rice unless the plan is to play Pogba as such which I’m basing on the reports we’ve offered Pogba a £500K a week contract, my dream would be Rice alongside De Jong or Bellingham but I’d takeTchouameni instead of Rice too.
Just fecking snap him up before we’re talking about another Liverpool transfer success. He’s exactly the type of player we need.
Hope we actually scout him properly to see if he has the attributes a top DM needs, rather than signing another name because he's popular like VDB and Sancho.
He's actually the best defensive minded midfielder we can sign if the plan is to play a high line under a coach like ten Hag. His physicality/acceleration is exactly what is required without the ball to defend a 'large space'. It's also not a surprise that Klopp would want him at Liverpool, because Tchouameni provides a defensive balance out of possession in a high risk approach which would help a team to sacrifice defensive stability for goals, due to his ability to defend large spaces against the quickest of attackers.
Tchouameni paired with a midfielder with craft and guile to open up passing lanes would be the way to go imo.
Tchouameni paired with a midfielder with craft and guile to open up passing lanes would be the way to go imo.
Who will be the best manager we can get to develop a young player like this? I don't want to sign young players, well yes actually I do, then get a manager who goes with the same old regulars.
In a 4-2-2-2, do you think he would work with someone like Kamara with our players? I'm just thinking we might need that base that could create adequate cover to let Laird loose as a quasi winger.
I'm not too fussed about Rangnick because I don't see him as a quality FM to be here doing that job long.
However, do you think Tchouameni is a Ten Hag type of Ajax player and tactically why? Is there a player he uses at Ajax that Tchouameni could be his version of at United?
I'm personally hoping we bring in ten Hag who has proven to help young players excel at the highest level. But whoever the next appointment is, they will have to get a grip of the dressing room and lay down the law to some of our players who have become a little too comfortable at the club.
If the team spirit/togetherness isn't there, then there's no stability, which will then effect the development of the team/players.
Need to get the agitators out of there.
No chance in hell Monaco would let him leave halfway through the season. I'd even be shocked if they sold him and we loaned him back. 1, he is very important for them and 2, they know fully well if they were to sell there would be a bidding war in the summer as there is a lot of interest.
It could work with Kamara and Laird. Kamara has the capabilities to provide a strong defensive structure alongside the two CBs and the second CM. But the fullbacks will really have to provide the overlaps/under-laps as well as the ability to link play at a high level. I wouldn't personally worry about Kamara in such a formation.
Tchouameni would fit into ten Hag's style of play really well imo. And I say that because he has the defensive awareness and positional play to replicate what is demanded in a setup which looks to play the game in the opponents half by exerting zonal and positional control. But Tchouameni also gives you the ability to defend 'large space' in 1v1 situations against the quickest of attackers, which is very important if the team wants to maintain a high line out of possession.
I don't think there's a player at Ajax who i'd say is similar to Tchouameni per say. But I do believe Tchouameni would be a upgrade on Alvarez, who is a good player but isn't as well rounded as Tchouameni imo. Ten Hag also used Lasse Schone as a DM in the past and he was said to be a more attack minded player until ten Hag changed his role slightly and made him into a more disciplined defensive player next to Frenkie de Jong.
Tchouameni not only has strong defensive instincts but can also be used in a box to box role which would be helpful in different games in a high line.
I keep pin pointing him as a DM but I watched a game for Monaco last season and he was playing number 10. Not very well mind you. I watched him for France and he played the sitting role next to Pogba too but any idea of what his actual best position is?
The Quote in the article is: -
So it seems Liverpool, as well as United are interested in Tchouameni, the worry is that Liverpool snap him up and sell either of Keita or Ox to compensate for cost of Tchouameni, Keita is 26 and might fetch them a good fee as it seems he is over his injuries issues and been fit this season so far.
He's a box to box midfielder with good speed and a great stature, but a natural ability to win tackles.
Think of a more hard working, better tackling Pogba without the flair element.
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