Which one of your gripes with him is fixed with Antony?
Antony under investigation by Brazilian authorities for domestic abuse | Back in the squad
- Thread starter laughtersassassin
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Different profile of player but he creates more opportunities and works his fullback more frequently!! A lot of our attack is balanced with Antony on the pitch. Pellistri offers f all but two attacks a game and one of those is a wasted G/A.
My sentiments. I don't know if Pellistri is the answer but I know Antony certainly isn't, one of the most frustrating players we've ever had.
The team as a whole is better with a mobile pellistri type player instead of a static wide player. You can get great goals from Antony but you get more players involved and space in the midfiled with a player like pellistri. Am not saying pelistri is the answer . We need players in the mould of winger than an attacker.
I think it's more likely Bruno or Mount will play there than Pellistri anyway.
Yes most likely. But it will still be an imbalance. You could clearly see the difference in the team with wide players actually playing as wide players. Issue is we have too many playmakers all over the field and no one to get to end of these play making.
I know Antony hasn’t been performing but let’s not create false narratives like he doesn’t add balance and hold his position well. The only difference is like i mentioned… profile.
Antony refuses to take on his man down the outside in good positions that Pellistri will never get into because he isn’t that good yet.
Ideally we get a winger Like Antony who can actually take on there man whilst also being a good footballer. I.e. Greenwood before the drama or just a recent example Pedro Neto.
Pellistri offers what Elanga gave us. We just had a larger sample size to not be deluded.
Sorry, nothing against the kid but Pellestri offers nothing when compared to Antony. Antony is a superior player yet he can improve loads .
Shows where we actually stand in terms of quality, when we play Pellestri.
I'd really like to see what Antony apparently offers that's so great because whatever it is he's been hiding it really well since he joined.
Holds the ball, holds width and tracks back. That's all the positives people can come up with.
Everyone on here could do two of those as well.
Not a whole lot, which is a massive condemnation of our other RW options because he's still somehow a clear upgrade over them.
Superior at what? Slowing down our attacks?
Pellistri is an actual winger, not a wanne-be Brazilian Robben who cannot hit the target in most cases. Antony offers great defensive structure but going forward his decision-making is poor, he is slow to find his man on the break and just generally doesn't provide all that much threat, especially in the big games.
Don't start me on Rashford being a supposed winger, now that's an absolute comedy of a statement based on his recent performances (although seems like he's been told to do the role a bit better).
One thing I do find funny though is Pellistri being called a kid. They're literally 14 months apart.
Because he’s left footed, so that would involve using his weaker foot and crossing with his weaker foot. I’m sure you know this, it’s just surprising that when an inverted forward is particularly one-footed, people still expect him to be able to dazzle at pace with the useless foot.
Pellestri is an average player at best. I am talking about the difference between a 'winger' and wide attacking player. For our balance of play and the way the ETH wants us to play it makes better sense to have a more dynamic winger who can not only drag players wide but also make quick decisions with crosses/passes. If Antony can do that great, nothing against him either.
Again, i am not saying Pellistri is the answer, i was generalizing him as a 'winger' as opposed to a wide attacking player. The balance of the team is definelty hindered when you have a wide player who doesnt make decisions soon enough or right. You can call it profile i called it the player type.
Bro he brought Antony from his old team!! Make it make sense…
Are you claiming he brought the wrong profile for the style he wants to play even though said player was a part of the style he played.
This reads as if you're describing Antony rather than Pellistri. Honestly amazes me people actually think Pellistri is anywhere close to Antony's level whether invidually or his impact to the team.
I’m very much aware but what does that have to do with taking on someone down the outside. Garnancho does it and he’s right footed. I could list more but I think I’ve made my point. He needs to improve.
Ok maybe I did not convey the point across. But i did mention pellistri like player which mean a direct winger. But anyways now that you got the point lets discuss.
Bro, he ditched his preferred formation after 2 disastrous games in his first season. No he probably brought him to play a preferred style which after seeing/assembling the team didn't work as everyone expected. Nothing wrong with that.
ETH came out saying he wants us to be the best transitional team in the world. You cannot have a player hold up play and delay attacks/offense if you want to be that kind of team.
Have you ever played football? Doesn't sound like it. If you are left footed and trying to go past your marker outside, you are either showing the ball to the opponent or you are using your far weaker foot. If the foot wasn't far weaker, as it is in Antony's case, then it wouldn't be a problem. He's almost as one-footed as Antonio Valencia. The larger problem is that if he does get past his man outside, like Garnacho, then he can't do fecking shit with the ball because he has to check back inside onto his better/ only foot. Neither of them can cross accurately with their weaker foot. Asking them to "improve" that aspect of their game at their age is a laughable request.
The whole argument that Antony was his player somewhat falls apart when you see how DvdB's fortunes have changed, since EtH arrived at the club.
They haven't.
Superior on everything. Better ball retention, Better passing, better physically, better dribbling and better defensive work . Antony may not be your favorite player but he is much more effective than Pellestri.
Not sure what's Rashford doing in this discussion and so I will ignore that part.
Most likely scenario
The reason why I mentioned that is because Antony does all the things you just listed for Pellistri, just better and at a higher level. He holds the width pretty consistently and is constantly showing for the ball, he's constantly driving at his fullback often driving them to the line. Its that aspect that causes frustration because he often has the fullback back pedalling but then checks back and is a valid criticism for him. In terms of technique Antony's touch and close control is a different level to Pellistri and even though his end product is not at a 80mil level yet, it is far far better than Pellistri. Pellistri is in fact pretty poor when it comes to passing, through balls, finding a shot in the context of this team. The one thing Pellistri does is drive at the defender on the outside more than Antony, but that is useless to us when he doesn't really have any speed nor any strength.
Exactly! clutching on straws and a framing their own narrative to support their beliefs
Ok i think the point is not getting through at all. Lets take Pellistri out of this equation, lets compare Antony to a winger. He does none of the things that are needed for a right winger to support the striker.
1. He very rarely crosses and if he does it's usually relayed via telegraph for the defenders to be ready for it
2. He very rarely takes his man on and complete the move. He either cuts back or tries to come inside and shot or does tricks and passes back
3. He very rarely makes runs behind the defender.
4. He stops all forward momentum by taking more touches than needed
He does track back and has a good engine so i will give him that. He has a good left foot that gets us a goal once in every 8 games or so. Not good enough. It was his first season and i will give him benefit of the doubt and hoping for him to improve.
I get what your saying but even in your points its not that straight forward:
1) He played without a proper striker for pretty much all of last season. If you go back to his last season at Ajax he was doing exactly what you wanted from him. Even still whether you have a left footed or right footed winger it comes down to team instructions on whether EtH wants Antony crossing or shooting more. The whole point of having a left footed rw is so they can both cross and shoot. Either way the point is moot as Pellistri very likely puts in less balls than Antony. The only one who has proved at a high level that they can consistently deliver balls to a striker is Antony.
2) That I agree with and he looks like he is working on it, but replacing him with a winger who is equally as bad but doesn't provide all the other things Antony does isnt the answer.
3) This may be team instructions, after all Antony is the one consistent attacker who shows for the ball under pressure. Even then running behind is not something Pellistri has shown is a strength of his.
4) This is inconsistent decision making on his part which hopefully he will improve. However as above very often he is one of the few players able to drag the team up the pitch.
Now I'm not saying a right footed winger would not be useful in this team, I'm just saying a winger as poor as Pellistri is is not useful to this team over playing Antony.
I agree with your thoughts. Like i said I am not comparing Antony with Pellistri. But what he showed yesterday ( in whatever little capacity) is what i think will suit our team going forward. Not saying pellistri is the answer, but maybe a better player of that ilk. If Antony can do that then great. But i dont think his 'profile' is suited for such a role. Hoping to be proven wrong.
Players are always better when they're not playing. Antony has been shite and has a grand total of 2 assists in 29 games and has 1 goal since this time last year in the league
Thats the thing I dont see Antony creating anything of note.
Left side or right I’d go past you mate. Don’t worry about my football skills.
I’m not asking him to beat a man and wipe in a cross, I said take a man on down the outside… it’s two different things and there’s many of a scenario when he fails to do so.
Nottingham Forest away comes to mind at the top of my head.
Did he ask for £80m of the our budget to be spent to get VBD in? Just because he was a member of his previous team doesn’t mean he has to rate him highly.
Jose Mourinho came here and didn’t request for Juan Mata to go. He didn’t rate him at Chelsea. So your point falls apart.
Erm, my argument doesn't fall apart because you've made up some imaginary criteria.
DvdB was by all accounts quite a key member of EtH's successful Ajax side, which is why he was linked to Madrid before Corona scuppered the move.
But, by all means, keep pointing to the transfer value (which everyone knows should have been no more than £50m) as the sole reason why Antony cannot be binned off by EtH.
Is that the same period they was buying Jovic, Hazard & Mendy? Probably makes sense.
It’s not an imaginary criteria. The point remains he didn’t ask for Donny. He asked for Antony. I mean if you can’t understand that point there’s no hope. I’m only hoping on the stupid criteria you created.
Antony is better physically and at his defending...that's all. Antony has one gameplan = can I get a shot of? No well guess I pass it backwards....
His passing is mostly backwards and his dribling is non-existent.
I don't think you get much less dynamic than Antony, there is barely any good link up play with him.
Isn't it a good sign that the police in Brazil let him go without any further information ?
Kind of, the better sign is that the Brazilian police weren't seemingly interested in detaining him at all.