His right foot has become so bad he has now resorted to crossing with his left...god help us!!!
Antonio Valencia... | Will wear #25 shirt from this point onwards by request
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My grip is quite solid. If you study this thread closely, you'll note that I've pointed out that this is a form problem, not a class problem, with Valencia.
I've never been a Walcott fan but it's hard to deny he's looked very good lately. I am a big Valencia fan but it's hard to deny he's looked poor lately.
Right now, it's not even a close call. We're not talking about one poor game, but a poor run of about 2-3 months. I'm not suggesting that we actually go in for Walcott in January -- I've argued against it in another thread -- but Valencia better his get his act together soon or else Fergie may have to think about his options. I don't think Walcott even comes close to Fergie's radar right now, but if Theo holds out Fergie might eventually be tempted.
He seemed furious with himself (and rightly so) after that last shot/cross at the end.
I don't recall him expressing emotion on the pitch much in the past, be that joy or anger, but he was clearly angry with himself at the end.
I think he will work on it and improve (admittedly I've been saying this for a while now) but I'm sure he will come good. Even in this poor form he is still an important player for us and I'm sure he will still continue to be picked.
I don't recall him expressing emotion on the pitch much in the past, be that joy or anger, but he was clearly angry with himself at the end.
I think he will work on it and improve (admittedly I've been saying this for a while now) but I'm sure he will come good. Even in this poor form he is still an important player for us and I'm sure he will still continue to be picked.
Valencia has never been a prolific scorer, but he's managed a few goals here and there. His game is all about beating the left back and getting in the cross, high or low. That aspect of his game has not returned since he's come back.
I wonder how serious his hip injury really was. Tony is the kind of guy who wouldn't want to make a big deal out of an injury and it looks to me like he's not 100% yet. You can see this with the total lack of acceleration off the dead stop he used to have before the hip injury.
I wonder how serious his hip injury really was. Tony is the kind of guy who wouldn't want to make a big deal out of an injury and it looks to me like he's not 100% yet. You can see this with the total lack of acceleration off the dead stop he used to have before the hip injury.
If he's not fit, he shouldn't be playing.
There are option, albeit limited, but option.
Like Jones at RB and Rafael on the wing.
If that report is true, he is playing injured and it's not helping Valencia or the team. Nani are you ok?
There are option, albeit limited, but option.
Like Jones at RB and Rafael on the wing.
If that report is true, he is playing injured and it's not helping Valencia or the team. Nani are you ok?
Not a great game for him when he came on. Didn't really add anything to the team or cause many problems for the other team. Really hope he starts to hit some form and gets back to the valencia we all loved last season.
Rafael was hardly effective on the right wing either though. At least when he plays defenders still see the need to double up on him, despite him playing like shit, which does help.
There's a little too much hate on here now, maybe he's the new obvious choice to get angry at with Nani injured and Young playing decent. Obviously his form warrants criticism but some of what I quoted in the match day thread was an absolute joke.
There's a little too much hate on here now, maybe he's the new obvious choice to get angry at with Nani injured and Young playing decent. Obviously his form warrants criticism but some of what I quoted in the match day thread was an absolute joke.
FFS, wasn't sure who "cocaina" was until I read your location!
You surviving this onslaught from mods. Cina?
You surviving this onslaught from mods. Cina?
The conspiracy theories really are booming in here.
Some would have that he is injured and some that he has lost pace this year compared to last year:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EvfLg8_Wi9s
(I don't know how to embed
)
Do you guys remember that sprint, from this year? I doubt I have seen anyone run faster than that on a football pitch, including Ronaldo and Valencia from last season.
He's been struggling this season for sure. Opponents seem to close him down quicker and tend to double or triple up on him, thus if Valencia bursts past one defender he will run right into the next. What we should note though, is that this leaves other players with more room, so he still plays a very important part.
All that said, he has been below his standards, but I don't think his pace is gone, and I doubt he is injured. I remember Giggs going through similar patches where people thought he had lost his pace (at the age of 28 or so) and was figured out by the opposition, then he came back, flew past defenders and everyone shut up accordingly. I just hope the same will happen with Valencia as he has all the ability and attributes to do that.
Is Valencia playing poorer because Scholes isn't up to his standards and not playing as much either? Our midfield keeps playing a short passing game, whereas Valencia thrives on exploiting room behind the defense, running into that hole. He has never been at his most lethal from a standstill, not because he lacks acceleration but because he lacks agility. Running at defenders and in behind them is what he is world class at. Our play atm is not doing him any favours.
Some would have that he is injured and some that he has lost pace this year compared to last year:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EvfLg8_Wi9s
(I don't know how to embed
)Do you guys remember that sprint, from this year? I doubt I have seen anyone run faster than that on a football pitch, including Ronaldo and Valencia from last season.
He's been struggling this season for sure. Opponents seem to close him down quicker and tend to double or triple up on him, thus if Valencia bursts past one defender he will run right into the next. What we should note though, is that this leaves other players with more room, so he still plays a very important part.
All that said, he has been below his standards, but I don't think his pace is gone, and I doubt he is injured. I remember Giggs going through similar patches where people thought he had lost his pace (at the age of 28 or so) and was figured out by the opposition, then he came back, flew past defenders and everyone shut up accordingly. I just hope the same will happen with Valencia as he has all the ability and attributes to do that.
Is Valencia playing poorer because Scholes isn't up to his standards and not playing as much either? Our midfield keeps playing a short passing game, whereas Valencia thrives on exploiting room behind the defense, running into that hole. He has never been at his most lethal from a standstill, not because he lacks acceleration but because he lacks agility. Running at defenders and in behind them is what he is world class at. Our play atm is not doing him any favours.
Surely the tag is more obvious than the location?
I'll live, this one isn't too bad in fairness. Some of what Hectic is doing to the newbies is far more horrible.
Yeah sorry bud, meant tag + location. Maybe Hectic's on the warpath coz some posters called him on owning that Red_devil account? 
Anyhow, don't want to derail the thread.
On a positive note, i am pretty sure i saw Tony V use his left peg to put a cross into the box on Saturday!
Though I'm hoping that wasn't the reason for the utter shite he served from his right! The dude needs to get back to form now. We need him/Nani dominating down the right again.
Anyhow, don't want to derail the thread.
On a positive note, i am pretty sure i saw Tony V use his left peg to put a cross into the box on Saturday!
Though I'm hoping that wasn't the reason for the utter shite he served from his right!
The dude needs to get back to form now. We need him/Nani dominating down the right again.It's weird how Valencia and Young haven't scored for us yet, in one of our most prolific seasons in front of goal. And Nani only has 2 I think.
Have to say that i cannot remember when we have had such a mediocre set of wingers at United.
Valencia is good when on form, not really the exciting type of wingers we have been spoilt with. Young, also falls into this categorie.
Valencia is good when on form, not really the exciting type of wingers we have been spoilt with. Young, also falls into this categorie.
At the start of the season nobody would've said this. We are just extremely unlucky that two of the best wingers in the PL of the last few years are injured or in the worst form of their careers here.
This.
In Nani and Valencia, we have the two best wingers in the league (bar Bale). Nani was average when he played but injuries have prevented him from having a big impact. Sure, Valencia has been below average, but give him time.
Nani is our best winger, he's just been out of the side most of the season. People are forgetting this.
Valencia was great last season, and absolute shocking this. Young is just the usual, plays decent every few games then doesn't do much.
Valencia was great last season, and absolute shocking this. Young is just the usual, plays decent every few games then doesn't do much.
Have you been living under a rock for the past three or so seasons?
When the ball fell to him right at the end and he swung at it like a blind person I just sighed.
And you seem to have forgotten Nani's fairly ordinary form throughout 2012. Valencia's been poor this season but his form in the second half of last season trumps anything Nani's done this year.
I can't bloody wait until we have Nani back. I think the 2nd half of the season will show us what he can do.
Also there is no competition on the right wing whilst nani is injured which could also result in a lack of performance from Valencia. Competition for places is what has made United so good over the past 10 or so years.
Also there is no competition on the right wing whilst nani is injured which could also result in a lack of performance from Valencia. Competition for places is what has made United so good over the past 10 or so years.
What about his assist for RVP's winning goal against Southampton? his brilliant play and finish vs Chelsea and his goal against Spurs?
Nani has been poor, but saying that 'Valencia trumps anything he's done this year' is extremely far fetched. Well done for not taking Nani's injury into account too.
You seem to have forgotten Nani's injury problems all throughout 2012, what any of this has to do with who a certain poster may or may not think is our best winger.... I have no idea.
Nani has had long spells out with injury too, and was finding form near the end of last season. He had a decent euros, and a really bad first game against Everton. Since then, it's as though he could do no right. He got us going against Wigan at OT with lovely skill and an assist, and his pinpoint cross to RVP won us the game at Southampton. Valencia was great last season, but Nani who apparently didn't have the best of years still outscored him and matched him for assists.
I do think Valencia is missing Scholes. Scholes is able to spot an open winger and hit him with a perfect pass better than anyone I've ever seen.
Cleverley and Anderson and even Kagawa don't look out to the wings as much as Scholes and don't have the same accurate range of passing.
Without Scholes I think Valencia has been getting the ball much later in the attack and therefore has more time to think and re-think a move and this is not Valencia's game.
Basically Valencia needs to get the ball while on the run, early in the attack when he can use his instincts and devastating speed.
As we have seen, Valencia is unplayable in these situations and has routinely made the supposed 'best LB in the world Ashley Cole' his bitch on numerous occasions.
Scholes is not going to start any more than he has this season so it is up to Valencia to adapt his game.
Amazing how our strikers have been able to score so many goals with so little help from the wingers.
Cleverley and Anderson and even Kagawa don't look out to the wings as much as Scholes and don't have the same accurate range of passing.
Without Scholes I think Valencia has been getting the ball much later in the attack and therefore has more time to think and re-think a move and this is not Valencia's game.
Basically Valencia needs to get the ball while on the run, early in the attack when he can use his instincts and devastating speed.
As we have seen, Valencia is unplayable in these situations and has routinely made the supposed 'best LB in the world Ashley Cole' his bitch on numerous occasions.
Scholes is not going to start any more than he has this season so it is up to Valencia to adapt his game.
Amazing how our strikers have been able to score so many goals with so little help from the wingers.
The issue with that though is Valencia doesn't need Scholes to play well, he might benefit more so from his long balls and ability to find him on the line in space, but we've seen enough of Valencia to know that he isn't dependant on that. In games where we haven't been afforded as much space, he's just as devestating when on form, often he's been the key in such games because of his ability to beat player, drive to the corner and put in a great ball. It might help enhance his game, but it doesn't really explain half of the problems we are seeing with him.
It's really just as Valencia being in poor form overall.
It's really just as Valencia being in poor form overall.
I think he does (though he blatantly offers more variation)...but Anderson obviously tends to look to the left more than the right because it's easier to swing a ball to the side you're stronger on. His signature pass is the swerved pass out to the left, it's been scribed into my brain.
Anderson has been excellent this season with his long passing. In seasons before it was very inconsistent. I guess he has had a word with Scholes on how it's done.
Still, he isn't close to Scholes or Rooney on cross field passing.
Still, he isn't close to Scholes or Rooney on cross field passing.
It does help explain it to some extent. However, as you say there are other issues too. He faces an 18 year old untested fullback and hardly even tries to get past him; that's just weird. But conspiracy theories in here would have it that he has lost pace and is injured, but as his run against Liverpool showed, no one can really keep up with him if he just decides to run. The problem is that he doesn't really. His crossing has been woeful, and that has nothing to do with Scholes.
Scholes' passing leaves Valencia on one on ones with the defenders though. Now, Valencia always faces two, maybe even three defenders, so running past one will only get him right into the next one. That said, we saw last year that Blackburn tried to double up on him with both Olssons, who are both very quick, but they didn't stand a chance.
I really don't quite know what to make of it.
His ability to split a defence open to play a winger (or a forward) through is vastly superior though. If only he could get through a period of more than 5 games.
Scholes' key attribute for us will be to calm games down when we need it. He can ping a ball to someone's foot better than any other United player, but if we utilise him in the way we did against West Brom he offers so much more.
Valencia has got to get his head down and work hard. He's got too much athletic ability to actually need the ball played so perfectly every time. I've seen times where Carrick would roll a gently ball over and he'd absolutely destroy the full-back, because he's got the athletic ability..but he also had the confidence.
When he fudges up now, he simply drops his head and looks fairly empty. Last season if he messed up, his head was up and you can tell he was genuinely annoyed at the missed opportunity. Appears to be a very different character this season but something as simple as a goal or a perfect cross could instill some self-belief back into him and he'll be back. Football psychology - I'm not an expert.
This belief that Valencia misses Scholes is nonsense to me. I don't even think it's a factor. Something is certainly off with Valencia. Scholes pinging perfect balls to him won't change that.
He's been isolated against a fullback many a time but wouldn't take advantage of the situation (Scholes or no Scholes).
He's been isolated against a fullback many a time but wouldn't take advantage of the situation (Scholes or no Scholes).
It's obvious what Valencia misses, his old number 25. Give it back to him and his glory days will return.
Confidence and the power that comes with it.
Scholes shuttling the ball out to Valencia every game would just expose Valencia's lack of productivity even more. Its more about Valencia missing the ability to kick the ball straight
It literally shocks me how little he offers when he plays. Bar from winning a free kick in the last minutes of the game Valencia somehow manages to constantly wreck our free flowing football with his neanderthal-esque ways of over hitting the ball and just sometimes raging the ball when it times of danger. He really must have a simple mind. Absolutely shocking.
Worse than Young.
He looked clueless when receiving the ball at times. Just went backwards and didn't think about trying to do anything productive.
I thought he was ok?
Probably because Young was alright I reckon. I don't see Valencia starting much in coming weeks.
Was the only one taking any pressure off us and not giving the ball away. People are idiots.
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