Certainly not true. Trippier got 7 assists in 1400 mins while Valencia got 6 in 3700 mins. And that was just the first player I bothered to check.
25
Season Average Rating
- Appearances
- 39
- Clean sheets
- 18
- Goals
- 3
- Assists
- 1
- Yellow cards
- 9
- Status
Certainly not true. Trippier got 7 assists in 1400 mins while Valencia got 6 in 3700 mins. And that was just the first player I bothered to check.
Nice compilation I seen of youtube on of him vs Marcelo:
I think Walker, Rose, Bellerin had nearly same goals + assists and also chances created.
He does most of all the 'hard' bits VERY regularly attacking wise, which is making space to drive into the box/channel (for a cross, offering width, a passing option etc) but then his seems to lose all the impetus and holds himself back.
It's incredibly bizarre as the last bit is an half yard gained, which gives the best opportunity to cross, fire it across goal, take another touch pass the defender etc but by hesitating he lets the opposition close him out.
He scored against Arsenal so no complaints but more times out of 10, that shot should have been saved by the keeper and possibly closed by the defender because he took another touch; Pogba laid it on a plate for him to fire it first time across goal.
He is such an impressive player in doing all the 1-6/7 steps you want a player to do but it's just the final 3-4
It's a case of be careful who you wish for but a bit of quality composure is worth so much. Case in point Young, who offers more quality in the final third but not on the same level in terms of defensively, offering width on the channel (in terms of pitch coverage, overlaps etc) and dominance on the flank. Yet in reality despite his level being lower in those other factors, he doesn't really concede that much (space for the opposition etc) or rather we don't get hurt by it. Not criticising Young but it's just the easiest example.
Anyways ffs let's hope Shaw starts tomo. We fecking need more width and penetration from the full backs.
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Antonio Valencia is the perfect example of a professional, committed player. He trains hard, plays hard and gives everything for the team. I am so glad he is one of the captains of the team, he really deserves it. If you ever watch any of his games, there's not even a single time he stopped fighting for the ball, he never stops running. He is a prime example of what a Manchester United player should be, for that matter what any professional footballer should be.
How many assists do all fullbacks register on a consistent basis in the PL? I can’t think more than 2 or 3 at best
Azpi already has 5, Kolasinac has 4, Trippier has 4, Walker has 4. The only fullback we have who's registered an assist this season is Young with 2 - everyone else hasn't contributed to a single goal.
When you consider most, if not all the teams those players play for (bar City) have scored less goals than us in the league, that's simply not good enough from our FB's.
Valencia has 2 goals though
In Evra's best season for us (assists-wise), he only managed 5 throughout the whole of 2012/13 in the league. And in the 2007/08 PL/CL winning season, he only managed a single assist in the league. Do you not believe he was good enough?
Azpi has a goal and 5 assists, Kolasinac has 1 goal and 4 assists, Trippier has 0 goals and 4 assists. All those players have contributed to more goals than Valencia, despite playing less minutes than him and playing for teams who have for the most part scored less goals than us.
Azpi is a CB though, also Kolasinac and Trippier plays as wing back in every game, Valencia played in back 4 for most games. He should improve his final pass, no doubt about that but all of them don't play same role.
Back then it was a completely different ball game imo. We didn't need our FB's to contribute as much offensively as we'd have Nani, Young and Valencia, Ronaldo etc. playing out wide as actual wingers.
These days fullbacks being a threat offensively is essential. With a lack of wingers in the game and every wideman basically just being another forward you need a threat from wide. Valencia has played hundreds of minutes more than the other fullback's listed at the other top clubs in the league and is yet to register a single assist. He's being involved in half or even less than goals than they are.
He's scored two goals and one was an absolutely worldie he'll probably never manage again. Even taking that into consideration, I don't think two goals is enough given the minutes he's played and the amount of goals we've scored. His poor delivery is what I put it down to, he's great at every other aspect of attacking play and regularly gets himself into great positions but seldom gets it right in the last phases imo.
That's not true at all. Evra was fantastic in attacking game, his final pass was erratic but in the build up he was fantastic. He stretched the teams and helped in attacking lot.
Back then it was as important to have attacking fullbacks as proved by Evra for ManUtd, Alves for Barca, Maicon for Inter.
Ye fair enough on your point about Azpi, hasn't played out right enough this season to be classed a RB, he's moved more centrally even though he still plays out right at times.
On your point about wingbacks - they're essentially just fullbacks with more attacking impetus. I don't think Valencia would be much more effective playing that role consistently, if anything he'll be worse imo. Dribbling and being a proper attacking threat isn't his strong point anymore, hasn't been for years. He's great and give and goes and is good at running into open space but actually beating defenders from standing points etc. isn't what he excels at anymore.
He basically plays as a wingback anyway as he has the whole wing to himself and is regularly our only threat from out wide.
I never said Evra wasn't good at the attacking game. He absolutely was. I simply said we didn't have to rely on him contributing as much from an offensive standpoint as we had players who could do that old-school winger charade.
He'd essentially do what Valencia does for us now, run with the ball forward. The only problem is, nowadays with all wingers basically being forwards who overload the box, they need to run up the pitch and then offer a threat from wide. Valencia doesn't have an oldschool Nani or himself waiting to receive the ball, beat their man and a whip a cross in. Now they also have a responsibility to try and do that too.
Rubbish. In the 7 seasons Evra was at United, only once did United score more goals than we have so far this season. We've got 35 in 15 games. That's a brilliant return. We've got some great players offensively.
Incidentally, this is a better season start than Evra EVER had at United in terms of goal difference. The balance is right between attack and defence.
That’s my point - and yet Valencia wasn’t directly involved in any of them. (In regards to assists at least).
I was speaking about those players in regards to their styles, not necessarily their ability. They were old school wingers, these days you don’t find many of those.
They were capable of sitting out wide and waiting for the fullbacks to give them the ball, only for them to beat their man and whip a cross in. Nowadays the wide players drift centrally and look to attack the box, putting more emphasis on the fullbacks to continue their run and deliver that cross or pass instead.
No. We don't need Valencia to be involved because our frontline have a brilliant understanding and assist each other. Valencia's job is patently to defend and then carry the ball forward. And Rashford/Martial/Lingard's job is clearly to provide the creativity.
You've got a weird notion of who should be doing what, rather than looking at who is actually producing performances that help the team succeed.
After 15 games, this United side has the second best goal difference we've ever achieved in the PL at this stage of the season. It's working. There's more than one football tactic in the world. Valencia is doing his part in this one and the results are there to see.
People would disagree with you. Our attack looks lethargic at times and we are known to struggle to break down defensive teams, due to the middle of the pitch being congested and having no width.
All the top teams have fullbacks who contribute offensively, we aren't an exception to that rule. You just have to look at how City's attack has improved with better fullbacks, look at what Alaba etc. does for Bayern, Semedo for Barcelona.
Football now places greater responsibility on fullbacks than ever before and Jose seems to have noticed it as well. If he simply wanted a fullback who could defend and move the ball forward he'd play Darmian who is great at that, probably our best proper 'defender' fullback too. Blind is also more than capable of that. He went with Young and is sticking with Young due to his offensive contribution, even though he's not as good defensively as say a Darmian - who he uses in special matches to nullify individuals.
Sorry but no way Darmian is our best proper fullback. He is on the top of the list of deadwood who should be gone by next season. Horrible going forward, poor defensively, relegation battler standard fullback at best. Not good enough to be the backup to the backup fullback at man united, and I'm 100% certain he'd already have left by now if we signed Perisic. Worst senior player (so no youth or anything, a bit harsh to judge them too much at that age) in our squad by some distance.
Valencia in contrast is much better defensively than Darmian, hes surprised me by how good he has been defensively over the last year or so, going forward too Valencia is excellent until it comes to the final pass or cross, horrendous, absolutely horrendous, if he could cross he'd be a world class right back.
Anyway thats just my thoughts.
From an offensive standpoint Darmian is wank. I still think if used correctly he’s a very good defender though. Jose has opted to use him for defensive jobs to nullify certain players or opposition in the past and it’s worked pretty well.
I do think he’ll be shipped out though as Jose seems to be looking towards offensive fullbacks.
Valencia is my favourite player but his end product is very poor when crossing. His overall game though is excellent. Love his willingness to tackle and attitude to winning.
So as near as makes no difference to everyone, bar Trippier. Must have got him and Walker mixed up. And that’s “per 90” data. My original point was about total number of assists. The fact Trippier played so much less minutes than everyone else makes his stats less reliable too. Those data certainly don’t show a fullback who is significantly less creative than his peers, that’s for damn sure.
That’s because that screen grab shows only the league mate.
Sometimes people forget football is a team game. It may be another player getting the final pass before a goal but there's more goes into it than that. Stats obsession can go far too far.
Also Valencia mans the right side on his own.
Sounded a bit like you told me not to pick an isolated statistic, then next sentence you used an isolated statistic there Mike?
I'm sure Valencia as assisted Lukaku at least once this season, maybe it wasn't in the league.
I used two statistics, not just one. And no, Valencia has no assist this season in any competition.
Well if you're using goals it doesn't support your argument as he's joint third. So that leaves assists which could be called an isolated statistic also in that context.
Or..or.. you could use both assists and goals, as people have done down the years.
Some seem to have forgotten there is a giant gaping hole on our right wing that Valencia has to account for.
The fact that our left side tends to be targeted by other teams forwards is a testament to Valencia's quality
The fact that our left side tends to be targeted by other teams forwards is a testament to Valencia's quality
We'll miss him when he's gone.
Man Utd 2:1 Moscow
Should have had a pen, surely?
I was surprised he played tonight but he had a good game, needs to get on the overlap a bit more though, he often looks to provide the pass for the overlap instead of making the run.
His goal the other night was pure filth! Nice and solid as usual! Going forward still very all over the place, but beggars can't be choosers!
He's just such a tank. Was watching a 16/17 highlight compilation and there was this moment where he and Moussa Dembele were going for the ball and he made Dembele look like a kid.
Man Utd 1:2 Man City
Fine defensively but a non factor in attack.
- Status