Antoine Griezmann

[tekkers3]

Surely if Greizmann comes in, its Rooney that goes down the pecking order. One of my frustrations on here is the "best 11" point of view. I much prefer to think of the whole squad and the best squad is one that has two quality players for each position.
Currently there are 7 players for the front four (admittedly Pogba could be included here, but that is dependent on formation, tactics and opposition) :

Mhiktariyan, Mata, Martial, Lingard, Rashford, Rooney, Zlatan - could include Young and Depay, but both have been sparingly used and Young more as a fullback.

For me, having 8 players for these spots would be better, especially when Rooney and Zlatan are 30+. Rashford is good but young and his time to lead the attack will come in 3 to 4 years, not 1 to 2.

Greizmann fits this perfectly as he can play each of the positions and is the right age, experience and quality.
Rooney may become 3rd / 4th choice striker and 3rd choice CAM but that is good squad management. And until he feels the need to see out his career elsewhere then it works for everyone.

I feel that Depay and Schweinsteiger will depart in the winter / summer and Mourinho will bring in 2 defensive minded midfielders, one about 20/21 and another 24/25 and a CB that can play RB. And Greizmann. Then you have a perfectly balanced squad in terms of quality, age and experience. Maybe he could just give Fosu-Mensah a bigger role and that may cover a couple of those.

 

[JPRouve]

No it was a 4-2-3-1 with Cambiasso and Motta holding then Sneijder ahead, even in the final with Motta suspended he went 4-2-3-1 and played Zanetti as the holder.

You are basing your opinion on some CL games* aren't you? And you forgot Stankovic and the fact that he often switched between 4312 and 4321, the 4231 wasn't used often.

*Important games I have to admit.

 

[JustinC00]

I thought Lindelof was bullshit?

​

Probably is. I was just having a bit of fun with that lineup based on the recent transfer rumors which were Griezmann, Lindelof and Bakayoko

 

[goin4glory]

You are basing your opinion on some CL games* aren't you? And you forgot Stankovic and the fact that he often switched between 4312 and 4321, the 4231 wasn't used often.

*Important games I have to admit.

I'm talking about the treble winning team. Stankovic and Motta rotated with Cambiasso but it was always a 4-2-3-1.

 

[JPRouve]

I'm talking about the treble winning team. Stankovic and Motta rotated with Cambiasso but it was always a 4-2-3-1.

If you limit it to that year, it was almost 50-50.

 

[DWelbz19]

I think the overall point is still that it's very unlikely Mourinho will switch to a diamond.

Did he ever do it at Chelsea? Even just for a few games?

 

[JPRouve]

I think the overall point is still that it's very unlikely Mourinho will switch to a diamond.

Did he ever do it at Chelsea? Even just for a few games?

I think that he only used it at Porto and Inter.

 

[Philadelphian]

No it isn't. Griezmann is by far at his best in the 10 role or a second striker, we aren't spending what will likely be close to a world record fee and sticking him on the wing. Mourinho has used the 4-2-3-1 system at Inter/Madrid and Chelsea, it's easily his preferred system.

Hahaha not going to pay a world record fee for Griezmann only to stick him on the wing...but going to do the same for Pogba and shove him back into a 2 man midfield. Fine analysis.

 

[Von Mistelroum]

Do you think it'll happen?

You know I don't Katie....I can't. By default :P

 

[Gasolin]

Why wouldn't we be able to stick Griezmann in the center instead of Zlatan and ask Martial / Griezmann / Mkhitaryan to switch positions often? Griezmann plays more or less alone top there for France, with Pogba behind him, granted in a midfield of 2 that did not do wonders.

 

[Andy_Cole]

Greizmann Ibra Mki
Pogba
Herrera Carrick

That would work would it not?

 

[liamp]

Why wouldn't we be able to stick Griezmann in the center instead of Zlatan and ask Martial / Griezmann / Mkhitaryan to switch positions often? Griezmann plays more or less alone top there for France, with Pogba behind him, granted in a midfield of 2 that did not do wonders.

He doesn't play alone up top for France though...he usually plays with Gameiro, Giroud or Gignac.

If Jose brought him in a false 9 of sorts, it would be a remarkable departure from the types of forwards he's favored in the past.

Greizmann Ibra Mki
Pogba
Herrera Carrick

That would work would it not?

I'd rather keep Martial and the 90mil than do that. You'd end up relying solely on your fullbacks for width, because Mkhi and Griezmann would both want to drift inside as often as possible. Honestly, if bringing in Griezmann ends up marginalizing Martial, I'd be really upset.

 

[Gasolin]

He doesn't play alone up top for France though...he usually plays with Gameiro, Giroud or Gignac.

If Jose brought him in a false 9 of sorts, it would be a remarkable departure from the types of forwards he's favored in the past.



I'd rather keep Martial and the 90mil than do that. You'd end up relying solely on your fullbacks for width, because Mkhi and Griezmann would both want to drift inside as often as possible. Honestly, if bringing in Griezmann ends up marginalizing Martial, I'd be really upset.

It reminds me of Cantona and his calling of the most expensive one, along with the one who stole his number, the special one, the Swedish one and the one with the hair transplant LOL.

Griezmann is a great player but indeed, he's not necessarily a problem solver. Technically, no one in the world is, but you need a strong player in Jose's team to replace Drogba so it would really be curious.

 

[OohAahMartial]

The clash between Pogba and Griezmann is what worries me about this signing too. I can't see how they will both be at their best in the same set up.

Interestingly, Delaney was on the Second Captains podcast yesterday and said Griezmann was to replace Zlatan. I'm assuming he meant as the team's talisman though....

Zlatan can't be expected to start every game next season so maybe we all have the wrong idea and actually Griezmann won't play with Ibra but instead of. Can he be our main striker?

Carrick/Replacement
Herrera Pogba
Mhki Griezmann Martial

BTW I don't see Jose using his Chelsea team as a blueprint for us, in fact he doesn't truly have a fixed style, he is a pragmatic manager who adapts his team to the club ethos and players he has at his disposal or are signable. So I think you can forget all this Drogba nonsense.

 

[Hahao]

I do think Mourinho plans to use 4-2-3-1 one long term anyway. Herrera will drop out of the starting 11 if we get Griezman and we will replace him with someone more physical.
This is how I see it.

Bakayoko Pogba
Mikhi Griezman Martial
Ibra

Long term we may play Griezman as a 9 instead of Ibra but it will still be 4-2-3-1

 

[izec]

I do think Mourinho plans to use 4-2-3-1 one long term anyway. Herrera will drop out of the starting 11 if we get Griezman and we will replace him with someone more physical.
This is how I see it.

Bakayoko Pogba
Mikhi Griezman Martial
Ibra

Long term we may play Griezman as a 9 instead of Ibra but it will still be 4-2-3-1

That is a very unbalanced team, especially the midfield. We make Pogba impotent. And it would only work at home against the dross. As soon as we play away or a better team, we would need to switch again. That midfield is physical, but would get overrun and our defense totally exposed. I hope thats not how we intend to line up and use Pogba. I still dont see us getting the best out of Griezmann or Pogba if we buy him.

 

[Chaky_Best]

I really think that if Griezou comes to United, it will be more Mata than Rooney that will be under big pressure.

Rooney is another issue. He may stay to play on the bench and be the second striker, as he's now, but Griezmann is more like Mata, a second striker playing down the middle.

But it's true that I would rather keep Mata than Rooney this summer.

My team with Grizemann would be

---------------------------De Gea--------------------------
Valencia------------Bailly--------New CB------------Shaw
--------------------------New CM--------------------------
Mkhitaryan--------Herrera------Pogba--------------Griezou
------------------------------Ibra---------------------------

And sometimes a 4-2-3-1

---------------------------De Gea--------------------------
Valencia------------Bailly--------New CB------------Shaw
--------------------Herrera------Pogba--------------------
Mkhi----------------------Griezman------------------Martial
-------------------------------Ibra---------------------------

 

[Fraud]

Yeah, I don't see it. The 4-3-3 is better and it works more than fine with this team. There's no reason to change the system. Even if Antoine plays as a RW in the oficial scheme, for example, he doesn't have to play as a classic winger. Ibrahimovic can give him the space that he requires to build or run. Ander or Antonio can occup the outside in the ofensive phase when Griezmman is inside.

In any case, our current scheme is more versatile and less fragile.

 

[devips]

It's only January. We have time till August to make this overtake the 'Pogba' thread. Keep on guys, make it happen.

 

[Hawks2008]

Don't think we'll get him as I doubt he'll move here without CL football (which I doubt we will get).

 

[Big Andy]

I'd get Griezmann to play in the 10, and get Lukaku to replace Ibra...

Lukaku is a Jose type forward, big, strong, scores goals...I think Lukaku would be great here...

 

[Adebesi]

Just FWIW, Griezmann is not going to dribble on the outside on counters or drift inwards whilst consistently beating markers and conjuring magic à la Messi or Neymar or Hazard in terms of technique, or Bale in terms pace + power, so just, be careful what you wish for if he's signed as a wide forward for United (a team that needs dynamism and magic in wide forward areas). He's not a great creator, and functionally - is going to be more of a improvement on someone like Mata (whose game is predicated on movement, relatively tidy passing and positioning himself in the right spots), expect Griezmann's a slightly worse creative passer, but a bit more direct and a better scorer as a support striker.

This is a standard game for him from a wide right position:



Scored a goal (centrally, after the exchange with Gameiro), but didn't have a significant net impact on the proceedings of the match in terms of running at people and creating decisive chances (corroborated by a record of 14 assists in 113 starts for Atlético). It's not about chucking him there and expecting him to perform, but about balance and building a structure for him to thrive in - like Simeone has done at Atlético where Koke + Saúl + Gabi + Thiago run and make big sacrifices for him. Outside of Herrera, United might be a bit short on players of that ilk (not least Pogba - who should be at the forefront of the show - not the stepping stone for Antoine).

We thought Mourinho had a plan for Pogba, too - but it took him months and several unforced errors to create the perfect harmony for him (like using him in a pivot with Marouane), even though it was blatantly evident that he's best in a midfield 3 as the left sided hybrid midfielder/midfielder. United might get the best out of Paul, or the best out of Griezmann, but high chances are that they both might not excel simultaneously, which is a bit worrying given the central overlap they'll create, and if there's no central overlap, Griezmann will go wide (where he was good for Sociedad, but nowhere near his Ballon D'Or Top 3 caliber central Atlético peak). Ah well, hoping for the best, if we do sign him, that is - maybe we'll go uncharacteristic diamond or try to emulate Dortmund's Aubameyang-Mkhitaryan-Reus setup by using Martial as the mobile center forward who can penetrate the central defensive line and minimize Ibrahimović sharpish. Though it does go against Mourinho's established template, and also - he did name Martial his 4th striker (while mentioning that it's only in a different system):

http://www.espnfc.us/story/3028579/...ld-be-disaster-but-mourinho-rules-out-striker

Ive been worrying a lot about this, based on very little (what I read on here from the likes of yourself and what I observed in the World Cup). It feels like we are buying a great player with little thought about how he will be used. Maybe I am sensitive to such concerns because its something the club has done so much over the years.

But then another part of me refuses to accept that Mourinho will make this mistake - again. And it would be worse this time than with Pogba because he knows better what he has and what he needs. I have to believe a manager like Mourinho has thought this through.

 

[Adebesi]

Maybe it will be Pogba back into a midfield two and he has the mother of all aces up his sleeve as a replacement for Carrick, someone who is going to be like a brick wall in front of the defence, like a heat seeking missile in terms of distribution and like a robot in terms of consistency and ability to avoid injuries.

In which case happy days.

 

[LawCharltonBest]

Don't think we'll get him as I doubt he'll move here without CL football (which I doubt we will get).

Don't forget we can get CL football by winning the Europa League as well

As for Griezmann, he's apparently a United fan and a Beckham fanboy. Offer him a United shirt and the number 7 to test his resolve

 

[Adam-Utd]

Ibra is only going to be around 1 more year maximum realistically. Signing Griezmann this year and giving him a year to settle in will be the right thing to do.

He can happily play in a 4-2-3-1 or wide forward as others have mentioned, we will find a way.

 

[Alexrad]

To be fair Pogba has the talent to play in any position in midfield and be quite good, perhaps he lacks the discipline to play a more reserved role but realistically he could play in a midfield two and still be very good there.

He came good for Juventus when they played him in midfield 3. He wasn't doing well for us until we switched to midfield 3. He simply couldn't work well for France as well when Griezmann was in the team and he had to drop deeper. He never showed so far he can play his best in midfield two so I am not convinced at all about that...

What I want has nothing to do with it. If we sign Griezmann it's far more likely we play in a 4-2-3-1 than shift him out wide is my point.

Than we limit our 89 million signing by doing that. Or we limit Griezmann. It can't work for both. Or we play diamond with no width which I doubt it would work.

Maybe something like this could...not sure though.

--------De Gea
--------Bailly Rojo Shaw
Semedo
------Herrera DM Pogba
--------Griezmann
Zlatan-------------Martial

Where Semedo(Valencia) would be very offensive right back to provide width on that side, while being covered by our DM signing when he bombs forward. Martial would play inside forward drifting to the left (similar to what he does now) to provide width there. Griezmann would be #10 and move into space left by Martial drifting or Ibra dropping and exploit it (he likes to do that). Bakayoko would be signed as short term backup for both Pogba and Herrera and long term upgrade on Herrera.

Mkhi would be 4th man for 3 forward positions though in that setup and would backup both Martial on the left and Griezmann. He would still get a lot of games but with Griezmann in you bench either him or Martial and Mkhi is not as effective on the left. Seeing how Jose played him in the middle and even as the left back, he could become some sort of very offensive solution in those positions when we chase the result in the game. Mata would be gone tho...

Either that or you spend 80-90 million on someone else that actually fits what we play right now.
​

Zlatan can't be expected to start every game next season so maybe we all have the wrong idea and actually Griezmann won't play with Ibra but instead of. Can he be our main striker?

Ibra is only going to be around 1 more year maximum realistically. Signing Griezmann this year and giving him a year to settle in will be the right thing to do.

He can happily play in a 4-2-3-1 or wide forward as others have mentioned, we will find a way.

He can't. He never really played that in his career neither he trives in that position. He would played there in few odd tough games against big teams where we set up to counter all game long. He's not Zlatan replacement at all. And he's wasted playing wide, he's not a winger or creator. His assist numbers are really low...14 assists in 113 starts for Atlético. He's #10/SS and unless we can play him there I am not in favor spending 90 million on him. People keep repeating how Pogba can play in midfield two just fine in that case but I have't seen anyone backing it up with any facts or his history so far. If anything he showed he plays so much better in current setup. Why on earth people want Griezmann just to shoehorn him in? If we didn't have Pogba I would be all up for it. Since we do...why not go all out for someone that would fit us like a glove...like Sanchez (unlikely but if he is definitely leaving and Arsenal finishes 5th...) or someone like Dybala? People see Griezmann and his name, see the world class player and that he's Beckham fanboy and just want him without thinking further. It's frankly stupid.

 

[Thisistheone]

Slightly mixed feelings now after initially being excited. Reading @Fortitude and @Invictus makes you worry if this really is a sensible buy, all things considered.

I'm 100% behind building the side around Pogba and anything that might hinder his level of performance is a major concern.

 

[NinjaFletch]

Just FWIW, Griezmann is not going to dribble on the outside on counters or drift inwards whilst consistently beating markers and conjuring magic à la Messi or Neymar or Hazard in terms of technique, or Bale in terms pace + power, so just, be careful what you wish for if he's signed as a wide forward for United (a team that needs dynamism and magic in wide forward areas). He's not a great creator, and functionally - is going to be more of a improvement on someone like Mata (whose game is predicated on movement, relatively tidy passing and positioning himself in the right spots), expect Griezmann's a slightly worse creative passer, but a bit more direct and a better scorer as a support striker.

This is a standard game for him from a wide right position:



Scored a goal (centrally, after the exchange with Gameiro), but didn't have a significant net impact on the proceedings of the match in terms of running at people and creating decisive chances (corroborated by a record of 14 assists in 113 starts for Atlético). It's not about chucking him there and expecting him to perform, but about balance and building a structure for him to thrive in - like Simeone has done at Atlético where Koke + Saúl + Gabi + Thiago run and make big sacrifices for him. Outside of Herrera, United might be a bit short on players of that ilk (not least Pogba - who should be at the forefront of the show - not the stepping stone for Antoine).

We thought Mourinho had a plan for Pogba, too - but it took him months and several unforced errors to create the perfect harmony for him (like using him in a pivot with Marouane), even though it was blatantly evident that he's best in a midfield 3 as the left sided hybrid midfielder/midfielder. United might get the best out of Paul, or the best out of Griezmann, but high chances are that they both might not excel simultaneously, which is a bit worrying given the central overlap they'll create, and if there's no central overlap, Griezmann will go wide (where he was good for Sociedad, but nowhere near his Ballon D'Or Top 3 caliber central Atlético peak). Ah well, hoping for the best, if we do sign him, that is - maybe we'll go uncharacteristic diamond or try to emulate Dortmund's Aubameyang-Mkhitaryan-Reus setup by using Martial as the mobile center forward who can penetrate the central defensive line and minimize Ibrahimović sharpish. Though it does go against Mourinho's established template, and also - he did name Martial his 4th striker (while mentioning that it's only in a different system):

http://www.espnfc.us/story/3028579/...ld-be-disaster-but-mourinho-rules-out-striker

I think this is spot on.

I don't think there is a single signing for us that makes less sense than Greizmann. He would undoubtedly come in and be one of the best players at the club, but there just is no natural place for him to fit into the side without neutering what we already have.

I think this is a real test of whether we have pretensions of being a well managed, and structured, club or whether we're simply a new Galactico project.

 

[GDaly95]

I just can't see how he'd fit into the side. He's a world class player and it would obviously be an exciting buy, but I'd hope that we aren't just getting him for the sake of it. A diamond is the only thing that makes sense to me.

 

[Adisa]

Griezmann or no Griezmann, I'm fairly confident we will continue playing a three in midfield.

 

[shaky]

Don't think we'll get him as I doubt he'll move here without CL football (which I doubt we will get).

I don't think players would be too concerned over missing one season in the Champions League. If they are confident in their abilities, and the ambition of the team they're joining, they would expect to be playing in it most years after. No club in England can guaranteed to be playing CL football in future seasons any more but it won't stop big players coming over here.

 

[Catt]

You know I don't Katie....I can't. By default :P

I know but had to ask

 

[Alexrad]

Griezmann or no Griezmann, I'm fairly confident we will continue playing a three in midfield.

Same...question is why sign him then instead of spending 80-90 million on someone else that actually fits us?

 

[RedMaestro]

Zlatan can't be expected to start every game next season so maybe we all have the wrong idea and actually Griezmann won't play with Ibra but instead of. Can he be our main striker?

Carrick/Replacement
Herrera Pogba
Mhki Griezmann Martial

BTW I don't see Jose using his Chelsea team as a blueprint for us, in fact he doesn't truly have a fixed style, he is a pragmatic manager who adapts his team to the club ethos and players he has at his disposal or are signable. So I think you can forget all this Drogba nonsense.

I'm no expert but I would think that if Ibra stays then he is going to be the first choice in all of the "important" games and Mourinho would then let Rashford take care of the "lesser" games and making him gain experience and learn his tactics. If Griezmann would join the team then wouldn't that mean that Mourinho intends to use one of the current players in a new role?

 

[Catt]

According to some posters it looks as though it'll be rather difficult to fit him in and still get the best of Pogba and still keep some width.

Wasn't Mourinho after both of Pogba & Griezmann at Chelsea? If so one would think he has a fairly good idea how to play them?
I don't see enough of Atletico to discuss this in depth.

 

[Von Mistelroum]

I know but had to ask

That's mean! But I'll be ecstatic if we get him!

 

[PlayerOne]

It will be interesting to see what Jose has planned for Griezmann. I can't see a manager like Mourinho buying an attacking player and not having a plan for him, just hope we get a proper pre-season this time

 

[Ekeke]

According to some posters it looks as though it'll be rather difficult to fit him in and still get the best of Pogba and still keep some width.

Wasn't Mourinho after both of Pogba & Griezmann at Chelsea? If so one would think he has a fairly good idea how to play them?
I don't see enough of Atletico to discuss this in depth.

Even if he was, the profile of the players has changed since then and the squad they're coming into is different. Some time ago, one of Griezman or Pogba might be a player who could be rotated in an all star squad of players, but now with the amount of money it would requires to bring them together they'd have to be your main starters, together.

And at Chelsea there was already Hazard, Costa, Matic and these may have been more fitting players to go alongside them.

I suspect if we tried to use both of them it'd end up with Griezmann leading the line and Pogba again thrown in behind the striker to add physicality and the potential to hold the ball up. In theory if they had a good understanding it could even work out. But who knows if it would get the best out of them? On the surface it wouldn't seem the best use of Pogba but theres always the potential for him to learn and improve in the position.

It would be pretty odd to sign one of the world's best strikers for huge money and then try to use him wide. I appreciate he can do a job from that position and still be a danger, but its in his striking role that he has become one of the better attacking players in world football. Besides, he might not want to go back to playing from a wide position and if we didn't use him in his best position that would suggest we don't trust him to do the job. And that could be the difference in signing him in the first place.

 

[RedEM10]

I'd get Griezmann to play in the 10, and get Lukaku to replace Ibra...

Lukaku is a Jose type forward, big, strong, scores goals...I think Lukaku would be great here...

Pretty sure it was Mourinho who wasnt too keen on Lukaku and got rid of him. I like Lukaku personally.

 

[DWelbz19]

It will be interesting to see what Jose has planned for Griezmann. I can't see a manager like Mourinho buying an attacking player and not having a plan for him, just hope we get a proper pre-season this time

We all thought he knew his plan for Pogba, but it took around 3 months of tinkering and playing him in a flat 2 man midfield with Fellaini beside him.