No, I’m judging him on his performances and general attitude in games for more or less the last 2 seasons.
Today was just another glimpse of his obviously already forgotten poor application.
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No, I’m judging him on his performances and general attitude in games for more or less the last 2 seasons.
Today was just another glimpse of his obviously already forgotten poor application.
Some fans place more importance on body language and facial expressions than on actual football.
That was a proper CF play
I'm confident that if he stays injury free he can be a decent player for us. He's certainly not awful anyway
Awful poster.
People are here judging him for 8 minutes when Liverpool was dominating us. Grow up.
Unreal criticism
Yeah that's just not true really.
Rashford was constantly running and pressing and challenging in the air.
You honestly think Martial came on and had the same effect on the game that Rashford was having?
Again nothing changed with or without Rashford.
We were under the cosh with Rashford on the field and it remained so after he got subbed. People reaching in order to bash players with these sort of ridiculous argument is downright petty.
Martial FC are so far up his ass they can't see daylight, or the match unbiased.
He did feck all in the game, keeping Rashford on would have been a better choice. The reason he was brought on was that he could provide some energy and goal threat, which a normal player would do in a football match.
I don't know what match you saw, but we were comfortable handling them pretty much the whole of the second half. Keeping the ball does not equate to dominating. They created feck all till the 80th minute. Guess you were busy seeing martial on the bench and not the game.
Yeah the worst part is he has a cult following and anything you say against him is just blasphemy.
He's our best finished right now, but this game was a bad time to bring him on in the dying minutes.
He can appear lazy at times, and he is not the type to close people down relentlessly, but he was pressing more before his injury. The fact that he is coming back from a lay off, I won't be too harsh on him.
Hopefully, he will get back to sharpness soon, as we need him.
Hopefully, he will get back to sharpness soon, as we need him.
Very glad he didn't come on and headlessly run after everything like Rashford. As a physio, I was cringing at the thought of him being brought on with 7 minutes to go and re-injuring himself.
This thread is filled with trolls now.
Wow. I should know how this place is by now, but I keep getting impressed by the low standard of posts on the football forum. The only thing to take away from his 7(?) minutes today is that he’s back from injury.
He could have made an effort to pressure the opposition when not in possession. He was on for a few minutes and I’d expect 100% for those few minutes, instead he jogged around. Waiting for the ball to come to you is absolutely not what you do.
So I guess Martial FC is off, and Brexit FC is on by the reaction from some of the posters here. I look forward to revisiting this thread when we have played against a team sitting low.
Wonder if he'll start on Thursday if he was only deemed fit enough for 10 minutes today. Might be more sensible to save him for next Sunday. After what happened with Pogba I think it might pay to be cautious on this one.
What did he get today? Around 10 minutes? He'll probably get 25-30 minutes. Hoping Ole eases him back into match fitness.
He was being brought on with all hands on deck. Given this, why then, would a manager bring on a player who can't run around like a headless chicken?
The idea should be to send on a player full of energy, who can run with more energy than anybody else, for 10 minutes.
Whatever the case, the Martial sub happened at the wrong time. Ole should've brought on someone who could actually do hard running and not a player returning from injury.
And also, running around a lot. A lot in here bring it up all the time as if it is some sort of measure of 'how much you care'. I remember people laying into Berbatov because he didn't run much. Same goes for Martial too. Just because you didn't chase a lost cause ball to the opponent gk or a throw in doesn't make you a bad player.so true.
The problem was that Ole shifted tactics and put 4 across the middle which stopped Young and Bissaka stepping in and picking off passes and not pressing. We retreated as a team inviting them on to us.
personally bringing on Greenwood might have been the better option or Martial and Greenwood and leave it as 2 up top but one Martial was only cleared yesterday so probably not fully fit so obvioulsy he is not going to sprint around like Rashford and James were but what he did do which was better was one moment where he took the ball down gave us a break and played a ball through to James.
I guess he’ll probably get 30-45 minutes next game as he continues his comeback.
English mentality i guess... huff and puff, play for the badge, earn the shirt.. that kind of stuff.
Running a lot and looking like you care is the most important thing. Someone who keeps playing when he is bleeding is the ideal player for some posters here. They dont care about the technical abilities of someone like Pogba or Martial. They love a technical very limited player like McT because he runs and works hard yet they hate Pogba even if Pogba creates more chances in one game than someone like McT does in 10 matches.
Same with Martial.. technical, his ball control and dribbeling is a level above Rashford his ability but Rashford keeps running.... so they love him and call Martial awfull.
Some absolute weirdos in this thread I swear.
Liked his nice touch and hold up when he came on, delighted he's back!
Solo pressing a back 4 is a complete waste of time.
Big bonus this lad is back, expect him to start and score midweek
Not a Martial hater but was a little disappointed with his effort when he came on.
I thought it was a really poor substitution. He took Rashford off just so he could get a round of applause, that’s madness with the game balanced on a knife edge. It looked a heartfelt decision rather than one made with his head.
Rashford didn’t look knackered, he was still full of running. Martial, understandably after such an absence, looked a bit lost and we had no outlet. He looked like a player just coasting through and one who didn’t want to make an unnecessary stretch or lunge in case he aggravated his injury.
I’m not saying the outcome would have been different with Rashford on the pitch but we lost ten minutes of impetus once he went off.
Rashford didn’t look knackered, he was still full of running. Martial, understandably after such an absence, looked a bit lost and we had no outlet. He looked like a player just coasting through and one who didn’t want to make an unnecessary stretch or lunge in case he aggravated his injury.
I’m not saying the outcome would have been different with Rashford on the pitch but we lost ten minutes of impetus once he went off.
Bang on. Which is why there is no criticism towards Martial at all. It was a bizarre substitution. Greenwood was best fitted for that role late on. He will run aimlessly and still provide sharpness if we got one lucky chance. Martial was not poised to provide either running or sharpness.
Spot on.
So much has been said about his effort at the closing stages. Has anyone got a gif or a video of that ?
How do you know? Did you ask him?
He’s been staying that he needed to manage Rashford better and rest him, was that all a cover story for letting him get a round of applause? Feckin ell some posters...
fecking stupid post.
It's the Pogba/Marital defenders that are blind to the realities of the game, not the other way around.
Let's look at some of the best managers in the game to see what they value/valued.
Fergie - Ji Sung Park, Fletcher, Butt, P. Neville, O'Shea etc. None the most technically gifted but all played hundreds of games for United. Fergie knew how important it was to have workers in the team and actually saw the back of talented players without the work rate ie Veron.
Klopp - Has a team built with quality and hard work, but doesn't carry a single player on his team that isn't willing to work hard and press the opposition. His midfield is literally made up of work horses like Henderson, Milner, Fabinho, Wijnaldum. His full backs bomb up and down the pitch for 90 minutes. Firmino fights for eveything, as do Salah and Mane. Very hard working team, not one comparable to Pogba or Martial when it comes to work rate. Got rid of lazy players like Sturridge previously.
Guardiola - Inherits supremely gifted players and turns them into hard working versions of themselves. He did it at Barca with Xavi, Iniesta, Busquets etc. Try to win the ball back within 5 seconds of losing it. He had a Pogba type player in Yaya Toure, who he had issues with at Barca as he didn't fit his style. Same with Zlatan. No matter how technically gifted they were, if they couldn't fit his high energy style then they didn't survive.
Mourinho - Goes without saying. Had big issues with Pogba, Martial and others.
So basically, you're very wrong in thinking you can get away without working hard on the pitch. Technical ability often means nothing unless you can back it up with effort, especially in the PL and modern day football in general.
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He'll need to get more minutes under his belt to build up his sharpness. I'm sure he'll be involved Thursday.
If you are going to mention Fergie you should know that his teams were also build around very talented but less hard working players. Cantona and Ronaldo (yes he doesnt work/chase defend much during a game but will wait for the ball in the front) as prime examples. Fergie did see the need to add special quality to his teams instead of just playing the hard workers. Those players you mentioned were to support the hard working players, to make up numbers in training, play the "easy" games or fulfill a special role during a special game. Like Park shadowing Pirlo for a match.
Klopp tried bringing in more quality, creativity and less workrate to his midfield with Keita. So far Keita failed but the intention was there. Mane and Salah are the stars of the team and Klopp is lucky to have such talented players who also work hard (does Salah really work that hard though?). They mostly play because of their footballing qualities and not because they earn the shirt and play for the badge with their running.
Guardiola had Messi, everyone in that team had to work for the special class of Messi. That is still how Barcelona plays. Messi is allowed to walk most of the game because of his special qualities. Also before you mention Pogba or Martial and claim i compare them to Messi, im not. Pogba and Martial work way harder than Messi. They have to since Messi has way more talent.
In an ideal world you have hard working, world class ability players but that isnt always the case. Usually the super talented players dont work that hard. The less talented players will have to work harder to support them. How many of the best players in the world are also know to be very hard workers on the pitch? Messi isnt, Ronaldo isnt, Neymar isnt, Hazard isnt. Again the question if Salah even is that much of a hard worker? Kevin de Bruyne might be one of the few but that is very rare.
A team of hard workers and no special quality isnt going to win anything. You will need special quality to win stuff.
Pogba and Martial can offer that special quality but they wont be running up and down the pitch for 90 minutes. If you dont want to see special talent play than you should just watch midtable games because the not so talented but hard workers will usually play for midtable teams. Pogba and Martial have missed quite some matches and look where Manchester United is now... lower part of midtable. That is with a selection of players who do run a lot during matches.
You need special players to do special things to win medals.
How special are Pogba and Martial?
In this Manchester United selection of players? Very special. Pogba has some of the best vision and passing ability in the league and Martial has shown at a young age that he has a talent not many players have.
I really dont get why Martial is being called awfull. He started the season well before he got injured. Today the only central forward thing he had to do was control a ball and pass it to the left (which he did just fine) but he didnt chase 1 versus 3 or 4 Liverpool players after the ball like a energetic puppy... because of that he was awfull?
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