[Sylar]

I think some of the stuff he does whilst were attacking hasnt changed much. It was always there.
However I have seen him add coming to the half way line to hassle a defender into the ball turning over, more this season than before. It probably helps when you have a manager that believes in you. And confidence being at an all time high.

That first season under LVG was a bit of a frustration as well, because when he came into the team, he was on fire. But that got cooled down by Rooneys return and him being pushed out to the side. However he seemed to be better during our late FA cup run and towards the end of the season.

 

[Deleted 112447]

I don't think any team in the world would be willing to pay (the past) Martial 250k/wk.

Why not? The talent was there, just needed to be played right; if Ole knew that ,other managers did too.

 

[JPRouve]

Arguably I’d say it was more of a LWB under Jose. He was always good at getting back and helping out and he’s never shirked from a tackle. People just don’t take notice that he did work hard but in a defensive manner.

There is an interview with Zabaletta who is mentioning how poor Jose’s tactics are and why he doesn’t let players like Martial and Rashford go free. He says Martial tracked him all night and kept saying to Zabaletta aren’t you tired yet. He went on to mention if Martial didn’t have to sit so deep Zabaletta couldn’t have come forward as much.

Now he can translate that work ethic in to the final 3rd where he wants to be. I’ll agree with their is more intensity and purpose to some of his runs but I think that just comes from being the focal point. He had always made runs before just weren’t picked out and now he is being so people maybe notice these things more.

Exactly, I had the same thought yesterday about Zabaleta's comments. People seem to have completely ignored the fact that Martial was actually doing his defensive job under Mourinho.

 

[Isotope]

Why not? The talent was there, just needed to be played right; if Ole knew that ,other managers did too.

I didn't see an overwhelming offers from any team at that time. And when he's caretaker, Ole preferred Rashford, not Martial, as main striker.

 

[Deleted 112447]

I didn't see an overwhelming offers from any team at that time.

Are you Woodward to know what offers our players have?

 

[Fracture90]

But wait. You've just told me in the other thread I couldn't possibly be critical of Matic because of all the accolades he'd won in the past. Surely then you cannot be right and one of the most decorated managers in history be wrong? That just won't do. We wouldn't want an agenda, would we?

fecking acolytes and bone picking. Your hypocrisy is palpable.

There's a noticeable difference in his attitude and demeanor now. Ex players with far more experience than you have claimed to have seen it. Stop with the excuses.

As tedious as ever, always trying to twist one's words the way it fits your skewed narrative.

In your eagerness to throw a jab you failed to read properly what I've written. I was calling out acolytes and not Mourinho for attaching those generic verbal diarrhea adjectives "lazy" and "attitude", because it's what acolytes used to say in order to justify Mourinho's treatment of Martial.

But then again it's you, so nothing surprises me really.

 

[Fracture90]

Arguably I’d say it was more of a LWB under Jose. He was always good at getting back and helping out and he’s never shirked from a tackle. People just don’t take notice that he did work hard but in a defensive manner.

There is an interview with Zabaletta who is mentioning how poor Jose’s tactics are and why he doesn’t let players like Martial and Rashford go free. He says Martial tracked him all night and kept saying to Zabaletta aren’t you tired yet. He went on to mention if Martial didn’t have to sit so deep Zabaletta couldn’t have come forward as much.

Now he can translate that work ethic in to the final 3rd where he wants to be. I’ll agree with their is more intensity and purpose to some of his runs but I think that just comes from being the focal point. He had always made runs before just weren’t picked out and now he is being so people maybe notice these things more.

Actually great point, he had a shiitload of tracking back to do back during Mourinho's days.

 

[roonster09]

Arguably I’d say it was more of a LWB under Jose. He was always good at getting back and helping out and he’s never shirked from a tackle. People just don’t take notice that he did work hard but in a defensive manner.

There is an interview with Zabaletta who is mentioning how poor Jose’s tactics are and why he doesn’t let players like Martial and Rashford go free. He says Martial tracked him all night and kept saying to Zabaletta aren’t you tired yet. He went on to mention if Martial didn’t have to sit so deep Zabaletta couldn’t have come forward as much.

Now he can translate that work ethic in to the final 3rd where he wants to be. I’ll agree with their is more intensity and purpose to some of his runs but I think that just comes from being the focal point. He had always made runs before just weren’t picked out and now he is being so people maybe notice these things more.

Yeah, I posted that Zabaleta quotes so many times, he felt bad for our wingers, fecking West Ham close to retirement RB was feeling bad for our young and talented wingers, that says it all.

 

[Isotope]

Are you Woodward to know what offers our players have?

Conveniently cutting half of my post eh? Ignoring the wrong point you made.

 

[RC89]

He already has.

Against Chelsea

Spoiler: 35s in

Against Norwich

Spoiler: 1m25s in

One thing to note is that we don't typically play with many high crosses in, so we won't have that many headed goals in the first place

Thanks for sharing.

And yeah, I did think the highlighted bit myself.

 

[ivaldo]

As tedious as ever, always trying to twist one's words the way it fits your skewed narrative.

In your eagerness to throw a jab you failed to read properly what I've written. I was calling out acolytes and not Mourinho for attaching those generic verbal diarrhea adjectives "lazy" and "attitude", because it's what acolytes used to say in order to justify Mourinho's treatment of Martial.

But then again it's you, so nothing surprises me really.

That happens when someone demonstrates the degrees of hypocrisy you do. It all only seems to matter it suits your agenda. It's genuinely mind-boggling how you can apply your own logic is such contrasting ways and see no issue with it.

Oh the irony. These were the things Jose had said, that Jose had identified as an issue with Martial. He openly criticized Martial's workrate. That criticism went far beyond those who were sympathetic towards Jose. Still, by your own selective logic, they must be true. Look at his accolades, right? How dare you question the views of such a man. But sure, those instances where Martial made half arse efforts at pressing a striker must've come from the manager. 'Hey Anthony, I want you to meander over to your defensive position, and do with no enthusiasm whatsoever, just like I've instructed.'

But come on, lets have it. I can't wait to hear the next buzzword to come off the conveyor belt. Acolytes. Honestly.


It doesn't matter anyway. The improvements we're seeing from Martial has been widely discussed here and in the media. Long may it continue. He's looked like an absolute superstar for several months now.

 

[Deleted 112447]

Conveniently cutting half of my post eh? Ignoring the wrong point you made.

The second part genuinely did not register, i did not edit it strange. Still, you or i don't know about offers unless one of the parts decides to leak to the press. Ole played all of them starting with Lukaku and made the judgment Martial was the best. I put Martial in the same category as KDB, Salah, Pogba as elite level talent that the toxic one did not know how to use.

 

[roonster09]

I didn't see an overwhelming offers from any team at that time. And when he's caretaker, Ole preferred Rashford, not Martial, as main striker.

Spurs wanted him, whenever we were linked with any player, Martial name was always in the rumored section. There were rumors that Poch wanted him. Inter wanted him.

Also yes, Ole preferred Rashford as a striker as he just took over the team. When he saw them closely for few months, he switched their position. Ole preferring Rashford as CF initially means nothing, Jose not knowing it after spending 2.5 years shows how far he has fallen in the game.

 

[kafta]

He has really made that position his own. One of the best strikers in the league, and i think he is benefiting from having players he trusts around him.

I love having such a smooth striker up top, much more than having a static target man with a bad touch. He makes the whole team gel and brings others into play all the time.

 

[Fracture90]

That happens when someone demonstrates the degrees of hypocrisy you do. It all only seems to matter it suits your agenda. It's genuinely mind-boggling how you can apply your own logic is such contrasting ways and see no issue with it.

Oh the irony. These were the things Jose had said, that Jose had identified as an issue with Martial. He openly criticized Martial's workrate. That criticism went far beyond those who were sympathetic towards Jose. Still, by your own selective logic, they must be true. Look at his accolades, right? How dare you question the views of such a man. But sure, those instances where Martial made half arse efforts at pressing a striker must've come from the manager. 'Hey Anthony, I want you to meander over to your defensive position, and do with no enthusiasm whatsoever, just like I've instructed.'

But come on, lets have it. I can't wait to hear the next buzzword to come off the conveyor belt. Acolytes. Honestly.


It doesn't matter anyway. The improvements we're seeing from Martial has been widely discussed here and in the media. Long may it continue. He's looking like an absolute superstar for several months now.

How is it even possible for you to be calling anyone out on hypocrisy?

Mourinho was spewing his usual bs "he gotta give me what i want" blablabla whilst his acolytes saw it fit to attach his "attitude" to it because mofo isn't smiling like a joker 100% of the time. He was dropped almost after every good performance, and Mourinho even gloated after one bad performance from Martial ffs.

Are you really that much incapable of understanding the difference between the context of being on the pitch (Matic' case where after years of doing something it basically becomes a muscle memory and you do it on instinct) and Mourinho, a guy that has an extensive history of falling out with players, criticising them in order to justify his own mistakes and errors?

If you only were watching us play under Mourinho, you'd see that Martial did everything that was asked from him including him tracing back and spending more time running after the opposition players than running at them. But sure lets ignore Mourinho's history of behaving like a petulant child, because that's what you always do.

 

[SoCross]

Love the bit about Ole texting over the summer and asking if he wants his number 9 shirt back. Straight out of Fergie’s playbook.

 

[Isotope]

Spurs wanted him, whenever we were linked with any player, Martial name was always in the rumored section. There were rumors that Poch wanted him. Inter wanted him.

Also yes, Ole preferred Rashford as a striker as he just took over the team. When he saw them closely for few months, he switched their position. Ole preferring Rashford as CF initially means nothing, Jose not knowing it after spending 2.5 years shows how far he has fallen in the game.

Exactly. Ole needed to try them both first, with Rashford as his original first choice. If Rashford took his chance, Martial would stay on the wing. So it's not a straight cut that other managers would knew Martial would be this good as striker, and worth that 250k/wk wage. Especially with how Martial performed under Mou (when he signed that new contract).

If Poch wanted him, it wouldn't be as main striker then? And with Spurs "only" have Kane on 200k/wk, it doesn't make sense to assume they'd offer that (old) Martial 250k/wk. Admittedly, I don't know much about Inter interest, and their wage structure.

 

[ivaldo]

How is it even possible for you to be calling anyone out on hypocrisy?

Mourinho was spewing his usual bs "he gotta give me what i want" blablabla whilst his acolytes saw it fit to attach his "attitude" to it because mofo isn't smiling like a joker 100% of the time. He was dropped almost after every good performance, and Mourinho even gloated after one bad performance from Martial ffs.

Are you really that much incapable of understanding the difference between the context of being on the pitch (Matic' case where after years of doing something it basically becomes a muscle memory and you do it on instinct) and Mourinho, a guy that has an extensive history of falling out with players, criticising them in order to justify his own mistakes and errors?

If you only were watching us play under Mourinho, you'd see that Martial did everything that was asked from him including him tracing back and spending more time running after the opposition players than running at them. But sure lets ignore Mourinho's history of behaving like a petulant child, because that's what you always do.

Because you're a hypocrite? I've just demonstrated your hypocrisy, which is why you're throwing in your half-arsed conditions in a feeble attempt to try and justify it.

Which would be all fine and dandy if those concerns were prevalent before Jose joined us. It's all Jose's fault though, right?

No he didn't. He really didn't. You and The Martial Appreciation club refused to have anything bad said about him and it's the same with Matic. The criticism of Martial want far beyond this place for a reason. You get all upset if someone is critical. I've praised them both when they've done well, and criticized the when I thought they were poor. You haven't, and yet you accuse me of having an agenda. It's actually laughable.

 

[Fracture90]

I don't think any team in the world would be willing to pay (the past) Martial 250k/wk.

Think he was nearing the end of his contract, and those interested wouldn't have to pay the transfer fee so they could offer him close to that imo. Ramsey and Rabiot are on the similar money if not more iirc.

 

[KM]

Seriously the turnaround of Martial and to some extent Shaw under Ole has been frankly incredible. Martial is the best number 9 in the PL right now.

 

[roonster09]

Exactly. Ole needed to try them both first, with Rashford as his original first choice. So it's not a straight cut that other managers would knew Martial would be this good, and worth that 250k/wk wage. Especially with how Martial performed under Mou (when he signed that new contract).

It's not as if Martial was poor as LW, his goals+assist record was very good. He wasn't played regularly, that's why raw numbers are not good.

 

[Adisa]

There is an interview with Zabaletta who is mentioning how poor Jose’s tactics are and why he doesn’t let players like Martial and Rashford go free. He says Martial tracked him all night and kept saying to Zabaletta aren’t you tired yet. He went on to mention if Martial didn’t have to sit so deep Zabaletta couldn’t have come forward as much.

Remember that interview. I was fuming.
Abysmal appointment.
https://www.goal.com/en-gb/news/zab...ford-theyre-always/1d7iuy4giele11omzzrp3h381w

 

[JPRouve]

Seriously the turnaround of Martial and to some extent Shaw under Ole has been frankly incredible. Martial is the best number 9 in the world right now.

Has Lewandowski left us?

 

[KM]

As Lewandowski left us?

Meant PL, dunno why I wrote world.

 

[Isotope]

It's not as if Martial was poor as LW, his goals+assist record was very good. He wasn't played regularly, that's why raw numbers are not good.

He was pretty good, but not 250k/wk good. Otherwise, the Caf wouldn't be so divided about him.
If we signed Haaland, he might be our main striker now.

 

[RooneyLegend]

I honestly don't understand the media's obsession with replacing him with Kane. I mean, he does so many things Kane isn't capable of.

 

[marky]

Reminds me a little bit of Suárez

 

[Fracture90]

Because you're a hypocrite? I've just demonstrated your hypocrisy, which is why you're throwing in your half-arsed conditions in a feeble attempt to try and justify it.

Which would be all fine and dandy if those concerns were prevalent before Jose joined us. It's all Jose's fault though, right?

No he didn't. He really didn't. You and The Martial Appreciation club refused to have anything bad said about him and it's the same with Matic. The criticism of Martial want far beyond this place for a reason. You get all upset if someone is critical. I've praised them both when they've done well, and criticized the when I thought they were poor. You haven't, and yet you accuse me of having an agenda. It's actually laughable.

At this point i blame myself for even trying to supplement your caveman way of thinking.

What concerns? Martial won a golden boy award at Monaco, was our best player under LVG.

Again you're just proving me right when i said that you've always twisting other one's words in order to make them suit your flawed narrative. I've criticised Martial plethora of times when i found his performances below par, but unlike acolytes i didn't do that in order to excuse Mourinho's agenda and poor managing of Martial.

 

[roonster09]

He was pretty good, but not 250k/wk good. Otherwise, the Caf wouldn't be so divided about him.
If we signed Haaland, he might be our main striker now.

It depends on what his transfer fee would be. Rabiot earns 9 million after tax at Juventus and he didn't achieve much to earn such high wages.

If we signed Haaland, for all we know he might on the bench too struggling to play alongside our players. This is just hypothetical anyways, I don't know why anyone would even want to argue about hypothetical scenarios.

 

[Stacks]

Seriously the turnaround of Martial and to some extent Shaw under Ole has been frankly incredible. Martial is the best number 9 in the world right now.

He's defintaely exciting but strikers from other teams genrally have to prove a lot more before being preclaimed the best in the world so I think its only fair we wait a bit before making these claims. There are number 9's playing at a higher level in CL, international etc. Its a bit of a stretch to claim you are the best in the world. A few days ago people were saying Greenwood is better at some things than R9 was.

I like to be the voice of reason. Lewandowski has 50 goals

Him and Rashford though man. I love their partnership and can see they are competing with each other but in a friendly way.

 

[Siorac]

Early in the season I was concerned about him because frankly it felt he didn't really improve at all compared to his debut season. Felt like he was treading water and I was worried that his talents would be wasted.

Now it's day and night though, he's much better than he's ever been at United. He just needed a decent attacking set-up.

 

[Lash]

Man, his performances are becoming something to behold. He's now protecting the ball well also, which is probably the only criticism you could level at him as a no 9. Long may this continue!

 

[ivaldo]

At this point i blame myself for even trying to supplement your caveman way of thinking.

What concerns? Martial won a golden boy award at Monaco, was our best player under LVG.

Again you're just proving me right when i said that you've always twisting other one's words in order to make them suit your flawed narrative. I've criticised Martial plethora of times when i found his performances below par, but unlike acolytes i didn't do that in order to excuse Mourinho's agenda and poor managing of Martial.

Supplement it? What world are you in?

It doesn't surprise me that you can't figure that out, despite it being the single aspect of our discussion so far.

Oh! Who had 'narrative' in Fracture's Buzzword Bingo?

Ah. Back to Acolytes. You really are pathetic at times, aren't you?

We should be talking about what an incredible improvement he's made under Ole right now, but you continue to tread old ground to demonstrate what a superfan you really are.

 

[Isotope]

Think he was nearing the end of his contract, and those interested wouldn't have to pay the transfer fee so they could offer him close to that imo. Ramsey and Rabiot are on the similar money if not more iirc.

Still have one year left (4+1). But good point. It must have something to do with that. That explain the 250k/wk on 5 years contract.

 

[spontaneus1]

The only things that's changed in Marti - other than general improvement of possessed attributes - between now and the past few years is: 1] confidence of the coach 2] support of team mates who actually utilise him 3] that hunger for goals

It took a while for many to clock his worth, but Martial FC don't discriminate - all aboard !

I mean, the lack of apparent hunger for goals was why many of us didn't rate him that highly. To perform as a top level forward you need to have that desire.

 

[Posh Red]

Personally I can't understand how anyone didn't rate him before. It's always seemed obvious to me that he had everything to become a top player, and was just young and developing his game.

 

[Adisa]

Where are we even plucking this 250k a week figure from?
His form has actually been very good since the turn of the year. Not just the post-lock down period.
I think he needed time getting used to the position and the arrival of Bruno/Pogba has bade it far more easier.

 

[jesperjaap]

Lmfao “consistency” he’s probably been our most consistent player this year. 30 GA doesn’t lie

I said kick on with the consistency as in keep it going but thanks for the comment

 

[jesperjaap]

Personally I can't understand how anyone didn't rate him before. It's always seemed obvious to me that he had everything to become a top player, and was just young and developing his game.

I dont think anybody questioned his ability, more his attitude and demeanour on the pitch.

 

[Fracture90]

Supplement it? What world are you in?

It doesn't surprise me that you can't figure that out, despite it being the single aspect of our discussion so far.

Oh! Who had 'narrative' in Fracture's Buzzword Bingo?

Ah. Back to Acolytes. You really are pathetic at times, aren't you?

We should be talking about what an incredible improvement he's made under Ole right now, but you continue to tread old ground to demonstrate what a superfan you really are.

Listen you can persist with your petty attempts at provoking my reaction with those sly little jabs, I don't mind that at all. Though I'd prefer if you could try to actually convey and defend you stance.

It's actually bizarre you're trying to equate my reaction to your questioning of Matic' positioning game (one of the better aspects of his game imo) with me discarding the false narrative of Martial having a bad attitude and being lazy just because he's got a permanent sulking face facial expression.

You know you're allowed to praise the player without having to exaggerate and downplay his past performances to make his current performances look even better?