[el3mel]

You are looking at it differently. Salah does not bail Liverpool out. The team play more collectively and he profits. Utd don't play like a team. We struggle to pass and move effectively. We fade in and out during matches more often. I don't look at Liverpool and think Salah bails them out. I think Klopp has a team with players who all know what they're doing, they've playing for each other.

I don't see that at Utd. I see a lot of individualism on the pitch. Look at the way Brighton played against us. It was fantastic, fluid and exciting. I watched it thinking that's a team that know what they're doing. Utd are still unsure about themselves. Especially when it comes to utilising Pogba.

Thought I replied on that already. Exciting or not, if Salah dribbles past 2 players to score, or made a R2 shot out of the box to score, it's down to him only, and has feck all to do with how his team plays (whatever it's good or not).

Also your point can be replied on easily. If it's down to team play that makes Salah that prolific only, can you tell us why out of nowhere Liverpool look devoid of ideas every time Salah leaves the field or has a bad day ? Surely, surely, if it's down to their style, anyone who's put instead of Salah would done the job ?

 

[limerickcitykid]

It's a relevant factor. Kane and Salah scoring goals is also down to the football the team play and style. De Gea making over 100 save is a mark of his quality but also a sign that he is getting over worked.

If you look at the shots he faces you'll see its down to our team play and style. He faces an exorbitant amount of long range shots compared to other keepers, so evidently our style is to let up long range shots which De Gea will easily deal with.

 

[Jig1234]

Thought I replied on that already. Exciting or not, if Salah dribbles past 2 players to score, or made a R2 shot out of the box to score, it's down to him only, and has feck all to do with how his team plays (whatever it's good or not).

Also your point can be replied on easily. If it's down to team play that makes Salah that prolific only, can you tell us why out of nowhere Liverpool look devoid of ideas every time Salah leaves the field or has a bad day ? Surely, surely, if it's down to their style, anyone who's put instead of Salah would done the job ?

Players have natural ability to do amazing things, I accept that. But do you honestly believe Salah would be doing what he is doing now in this Utd team, under Mourinho?

Manager, formation and systems are all a factor and that includes the players ability . I don't think it's a case of either or, both are important.

That's why players at certain clubs fail but thrive under different manager and teams.

 

[el3mel]

Players have natural ability to do amazing things, I accept that. But do you honestly believe Salah would be doing what he is doing now in this Utd team, under Mourinho?

Manager, formation and systems are all a factor and that includes the players ability . I don't think it's a case of either or. Both are needed.

That's why players at certain clubs fail but thrive under different manager and teams.

There're definitely different factors and I'm not saying Klopp and his style has zero role in Salah form this season, but at the same time, it's true that Salah has bailed Liverpool several times this season with pure individual job and they always looked devoid of ideas without him or with him in bad form because he's simply their main man. Similar for Kane in Spurs so having a player to bail you out with individual work is normal. I don't remember any top team who didn't have this kind of player that win you matches when you're in bad days.

 

[AP88]

I don't think that:
liverpool would be in CL finals without salah.
Real would won 3 cl without ronaldo
Tottenham would be in top 4 without kane
Barca would be champion without messi

So that thing with de gea is rubbish

And it’s not like Romero concedes many when he plays either.

There have been numerous goals that have gone in this season that De Gea should have saved/come off his line to catch - the implication that he’s making Mourinho look better than he is inaccurate.

 

[McGrathsipan]

Do they who want Martial to be sold really trust JM judgment or because the love they have in JM?

I mean how could you trust a Manager that has endless love for Fellaini and the one who failed to identify the weakness in our Fullbacks position for 2 consecutive season yet he complaining that he need more money to compete with Man City?

For me it's nothing to do with JM.
Martial was the same slouch under LVG.

If he is going to stay he needs to work harder and bully his way into the team

 

[Mickfoley]

His "fans" are the worst and most irrational fans I have ever seen. They just refuse to see he lacks the character and fight and put it all on Mourinho. I don't think Martial is toxic or anything but surely he's an introvert and lacks any confidence. He has charisma of a brick.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

For me it's nothing to do with JM.
Martial was the same slouch under LVG.

If he is going to stay he needs to work harder and bully his way into the team.

As if Rooney, Ronaldo or Giggs would have allowed this to happen. Players with that level of talent make the manager listen whether he likes it or not.

 

[Dancfc]

His "fans" are the worst and most irrational fans I have ever seen. They just refuse to see he lacks the character and fight and put it all on Mourinho. I don't think Martial is toxic or anything but surely he's an introvert and lacks any confidence. He has charisma of a brick.

Not saying you are right or wrong, but that is alarmingly similar to what some of us were saying about KDB circa 2014.

 

[haram]

Not saying you are right or wrong, but that is alarmingly similar to what some of us were saying about KDB circa 2014.

I think Jose made mistakes with de Bruyne, especially considering Oscar was in the side at the time. However, Martial has been given many more chances than de Bruyne in the first team.

 

[rotherham_red]

His "fans" are the worst and most irrational fans I have ever seen. They just refuse to see he lacks the character and fight and put it all on Mourinho. I don't think Martial is toxic or anything but surely he's an introvert and lacks any confidence. He has charisma of a brick.

He was a one man attack in 2015/16. He took all of Jose's BS tests and his shit motivational techniques in his stride right up to the point that Sanchez was signed to replace him despite him being one of our best players. It also doesn't help that Sanchez hasn't exactly ripped up any trees either.

 

[SteveW]

He's been one of our best 5 players this season imo. Great stats, 3 player of the month awards. It's kind of crazy that there's talk of him not doing enough. I see so many others getting free passes but this guy is scrutinised to death.

 

[OL29]

He's been one of our best 5 players this season imo. Great stats, 3 player of the month awards. It's kind of crazy that there's talk of him not doing enough. I see so many others getting free passes but this guy is scrutinised to death.

There's definite double standards when it comes to Martial, I think a lot of people dislike him simply because he's in competition with Rashford, an academy player.

 

[Bwuk]

He's been one of our best 5 players this season imo. Great stats, 3 player of the month awards. It's kind of crazy that there's talk of him not doing enough. I see so many others getting free passes but this guy is scrutinised to death.

I agree with this. Not to mention - he's 22.

I wonder how half this forum would of reacted to the likes of Beckham/Scholes breaking through.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

I agree with this. Not to mention - he's 22.

I wonder how half this forum would of reacted to the likes of Beckham/Scholes breaking through.

Scholes was eased in over a number of years though @Bwuk, he had patience and so did the fans. Appears with Martial the fans have no patience and neither does the player.

 

[bosnian_red]

His "fans" are the worst and most irrational fans I have ever seen. They just refuse to see he lacks the character and fight and put it all on Mourinho. I don't think Martial is toxic or anything but surely he's an introvert and lacks any confidence. He has charisma of a brick.

The thing people who defend martial can and will keep coming back to is Mourinhos prior record with players just like him. Plenty of them just didnt get to their best under Mourinho, they were dropped and sold or had talks to leaving. Until Martial leaves and proves if he is a success or failure elsewhere, this will remain the case. Every single rival fan was saying the day Mourinho got appointed things along the lines of (
"just wait a couple of years when promising young players like Martial and Rashford are basically asking to leave". People always side with Mourinho at the time because of the story he builds up over the 2 years, of him just having better players at the minute, but very quickly after they're in a situation where they need to get someone exactly like who they sold, because that player developed elsewhere. Here we are, 2 years into Mourinho, and all those rival fans are being proven right about how he handles our young players.

Martial wasnt some random young player. He was ridiculously good in his first season, and already a very good player. It was past the point of "well hes a young player so maybe it was a Januzaj type thing". Nah. He scored 17 goals that season and had double digit assists, in his first premier league season playing as a winger primarily. That's terrific, especially at his age.

So me, and every other Martial "fan", have every right to point to Mourinhos prior failures with those types. The fact that Liverpool, city, spurs, arsenal and even Chelsea fans all predicted this would happen to Martial and us United fans laughed them off, saying he was already our best player, why would Mourinho replace him?? Well, that's where we are now.

 

[bosnian_red]

Scholes was eased in over a number of years though @Bwuk, he had patience and so did the fans. Appears with Martial the fans have no patience and neither does the player.

Lukaku was bought for 75m as our striker, 24 years old. Rashford has played more than Martial (despite clearly worse performances) on the left wing, and is clearly Lukakus first replacement to be the striker when Lukaku is out (despite being absolute trash every time he plays as a striker). Martial won 3 united PotM awards in the first half of this season, was easily out star player over the Christmas period and in January, but then the second Sanchez signed, instantly moved to the right wing then dropped 1 or 2 games later. So why exactly should he be patient? What's he being patient for? There isnt any specific place in the team he is being groomed for. Rashford looks like hes ahead in Mourinhos eyes (though he hardly looks happy either), while Martial played 1 game as a striker for us all season and hasnt been used since (despite scoring and having a very good performance). If Mourinho doesnt make him feel part of his long term plans, which it definitely doesnt look like, then he has every right to want to leave. The fact that better sides then United right now like Juventus want to buy him from us probably says something too.

 

[Acole9]

I've had it with Martial FC. Felt sorry for him in the first half but second half he kept dribbling inside and losing the ball every time, so predictable. We criticise Valencia and Young for their one dimensional play.

 

[BombayBadBoy]

He was a one man attack in 2015/16. He took all of Jose's BS tests and his shit motivational techniques in his stride right up to the point that Sanchez was signed to replace him despite him being one of our best players. It also doesn't help that Sanchez hasn't exactly ripped up any trees either.

Amen! I can't understand why people overlook everything his been through to this point tbh. of-course he's had to adapt like any player has to at points in their career and he's done that well.

I mean, if you look back you could almost say Jose's had it in for him from the beginning,.. that shirt number change BS for zlatan?! right after a good season too lol.

I personally hope Martial leaves for his sake, I also want to see him balling at his best. The fact that Mou can't incorporate someone of his ilk says more about his coaching ways and perhaps nonexistent attacking acumen than it does with Martial.

We will find this out next season no doubt.

I'd love it if he somehow ends up at pool & rips it up just for the bants

 

[ash_86]

Martial is getting the playing time he'd get in any of the top clubs out there. If he's ready to stay committed ,work hard in training, then he's welcome to stay. Else he could go where ever he wants to but needs to realize he'd not be starting games at Juventus or other top clubs. Dybala who's 24 and highly rated has the similar number of Appearance this season as Martial in the respective league. Asensio, who's at the same age of Martial has similar number of appearance as Martial at Real Madrid. I can't see Martial getting minutes unless he moves to Lyon or Roma ect..

 

[FerociousCorgis]

With all the people complaining about martial dribbling into trouble, perhaps the reason he is doing that is because we never have overlapping fullbacks or players making runs into the box? Our team movement is so bad, it is essentially up to him to dribble past 3 players and try to get open in the box to find lukaku or the one other person in the box. I can't think of the last time i saw martial with the ball and a fullback overlapping to give him space to attack. Hopefully we just start with martial up top today and he gets a chance to just be ruthless in front of goal and make things happen.

 

[Mickfoley]

With all the people complaining about martial dribbling into trouble, perhaps the reason he is doing that is because we never have overlapping fullbacks or players making runs into the box? Our team movement is so bad, it is essentially up to him to dribble past 3 players and try to get open in the box to find lukaku or the one other person in the box. I can't think of the last time i saw martial with the ball and a fullback overlapping to give him space to attack. Hopefully we just start with martial up top today and he gets a chance to just be ruthless in front of goal and make things happen.

He doesn't have the movement that the ruthless strikers usually have, give up. Martial FC indeed.

 

[Adam-Utd]

With all the people complaining about martial dribbling into trouble, perhaps the reason he is doing that is because we never have overlapping fullbacks or players making runs into the box? Our team movement is so bad, it is essentially up to him to dribble past 3 players and try to get open in the box to find lukaku or the one other person in the box. I can't think of the last time i saw martial with the ball and a fullback overlapping to give him space to attack. Hopefully we just start with martial up top today and he gets a chance to just be ruthless in front of goal and make things happen.

Agreed, we don't fly forward with players pulling teams apart, it's left down to 1v2.

Unfortunately though he doesn't always help himself, he does the hard work then messes up the final ball so often.

In a more open team our attackers would look so much better.

 

[FerociousCorgis]

He doesn't have the movement that the ruthless strikers usually have, give up. Martial FC indeed.

i said i hope he is ruthless. Did he not play up top while he was in france? and with all due respect to lukaku he hasn't exactly lit up the league with his amazing movement. For all the people who whine and throw out that Martial FC crap, amazing how he has become their little whipping boy. Bash on his movement, his stats, his play while everybody else gets their excuses. Same people who bash/demean on martial stats vs the willian wet dream because they "play different" are the same who will try and excuse lukakus 16 league goals by pointing towards firminos near equal amount, even though they are also "different players" Funny how the Martial FC people are essentially the exact opposite end of the spectrum of the supposed Martial FC people.

 

[Baxter]

His "fans" are the worst and most irrational fans I have ever seen. They just refuse to see he lacks the character and fight and put it all on Mourinho. I don't think Martial is toxic or anything but surely he's an introvert and lacks any confidence. He has charisma of a brick.

And that’s a facet of Mourinho’s management skills that need to be improved. I’m sure basically admitted that he’s always struggled to coach players like Martial.

However those suggesting players like Douglas Costa or Pulisic as a replacement would be in for a rude awakening. If Martial’s end product isn’t good enough, they’d have a heart attack watching them.

 

[Canagel]

With all the people complaining about martial dribbling into trouble, perhaps the reason he is doing that is because we never have overlapping fullbacks or players making runs into the box? Our team movement is so bad, it is essentially up to him to dribble past 3 players and try to get open in the box to find lukaku or the one other person in the box. I can't think of the last time i saw martial with the ball and a fullback overlapping to give him space to attack. Hopefully we just start with martial up top today and he gets a chance to just be ruthless in front of goal and make things happen.

It's a coaching problem that needs to be solved on the training ground. Personally there's no doubt in my mind Martial has the qualities and the tools to do well but then again has any other attacking player we have shown any better? If we had 2/3 players on top form this season and Martial was struggling I could understand the frustrations and criticisms. But when everybody is struggling I don't understand why Martial is singled out. He has worked so much harder this year, adjusted to the managers demands and worked his way into the first team and in January was our best player before the whole Sanchez thing started. Even now he's had a better season than most players out there.

 

[laughtersassassin]

And that’s a facet of Mourinho’s management skills that need to be improved. I’m sure basically admitted that he’s always struggled to coach players like Martial.

However those suggesting players like Douglas Costa or Pulisic as a replacement would be in for a rude awakening. If Martial’s end product isn’t good enough, they’d have a heart attack watching them.

What about Willian??Literally never produces any goals or assist. Never even hit 10 goals in the league.

 

[PepsiCola]

Looks to be left out of the France world cup squad.

 

[Bwuk]

Lukaku was bought for 75m as our striker, 24 years old. Rashford has played more than Martial (despite clearly worse performances) on the left wing, and is clearly Lukakus first replacement to be the striker when Lukaku is out (despite being absolute trash every time he plays as a striker). Martial won 3 united PotM awards in the first half of this season, was easily out star player over the Christmas period and in January, but then the second Sanchez signed, instantly moved to the right wing then dropped 1 or 2 games later. So why exactly should he be patient? What's he being patient for? There isnt any specific place in the team he is being groomed for. Rashford looks like hes ahead in Mourinhos eyes (though he hardly looks happy either), while Martial played 1 game as a striker for us all season and hasnt been used since (despite scoring and having a very good performance). If Mourinho doesnt make him feel part of his long term plans, which it definitely doesnt look like, then he has every right to want to leave. The fact that better sides then United right now like Juventus want to buy him from us probably says something too.

Agreed with this. United aren’t the be all and end all some of the fans seem to think we are for players.

Looks to be left out of the France world cup squad.

Feel sorry for him. If we’d let his early season form continue he’d of no doubt been there.

 

[laughtersassassin]

SHould of been called up regardless of last few months. Players like Lemar have been way way worse.

 

[Member 90887]

Not saying you are right or wrong, but that is alarmingly similar to what some of us were saying about KDB circa 2014.

Yeah, and also very similar to what people were saying about Januzaj, or Depay...

 

[Jacob]

Wait.. The world cup squads are out?

 

[PepsiCola]

Wait.. The world cup squads are out?

RMC have reported the france squad - no Fekir either.

 

[ivaldo]

Out of the WC squad and unable to start in dead rubbers. The outrage.

 

[breakout67]

Is it possible to push for a move away from your country, he barely gets to play under Deschamps anyway.

Calm down Martial fan club

 

[SteveW]

Don't really understand the hard line approach from many on here. It's a shame for the player. Just as he broke into probably the strongest international squad of the lot his club manager signed a player in his position and froze him out. It's horrible for any player to miss out on one of the highlights of his career. Hate seeing that happen to any United player.

Sadly I reckon that probably ends any chance if him staying too. Why would he let this keep happening for the sake of sitting in our bench when the likes of juve want to sign him.

 

[Chiken138]

Who is going to buy him, Juventus and Bayern doesn't seem interested

 

[breakout67]

Who is going to buy him, Juventus and Bayern doesn't seem interested

Juventus are preparing a loan with option to buy offer as we speak.

 

[All 3 United]

Yes since he’s been dropped (arrival of Sanchez, 29). His form hasn’t been great on the few occasions he’s been used but one thing that’s indisputable he’s light years ahead of Lingard and his from prior to sanchez arriving was better that of Sanchez since his arrival. Looks like she’s going to be shipped out, I can’t understand that given the players that are staring regularly.

 

[shabadu84]

Am I missing something - the same people reporting he'll look to move on are also saying we offered him an extension, correct? So why isn't that being taken into account, that he's the one choosing not to sign it? Could that be part of the reason why Jose's not including him? If SAF did that with a player who wasn't going to sign, would anyone blink?