All-time Fantasy Draft Final - antohan v Cutch

[Snow]

It's funny all this talk about weak spots. I don't see them. I see spots that are weaker but not weak. Just because a player isn't as good as Baresi at defending means there's going to be trouble defensively. If your defense manage to work as a unit it can't really be broken down easily. The way to do it would be to cross and hope to hit the target or for some individual brilliance which is more rare than people like to think.

When Beckenbauer is on the pitch I can't stop thinking about him and Charlton talking about their match up about how they were told to mark each other without the other one realizing it was their duty and thus both of them were pretty much nullified in the game. Since there are so many excellent midfielders in this draft I feel like that's Edwards only duty in the game but I can't see Beckenbauer having the duty of marking Duncan.

I don't know who to vote for. There's nothing that tells me that one team is definitely better than the other on paper. What would make the difference is the team unity, how they manage to work together and that's impossible to tell without actually seeing it in action.

People who vote based on personal feelings towards the managers. Get over yourself. It's not who you want to win. It's who is more likely to win.

 

[Balu]

Indeed, I'm not sure subordinate is what I meant. I meant to get across that if anyone is 'the man' out of he and Beckenbauer, then it's the latter. With Maradona and Franz it's not so clear IMO.

I'll point you to this post:




It's not quite clear wether the poster believes Beckenbauer falls into the category with Pele, Messi best etc but it's that point that I was trying to get across.

More a point of discussion than anything else...

I agree with Brwned, but I think Beckenbauer doesn't need to run the game as much as all the others. That's what sets him apart. Mainly because he's playing deeper, is great at doing defensive work. He doesn't mind doing the dirty work. He'll find a few spots to make his runs, he helps bring the ball forward, but he's contributing a lot without running the game upfront and you need a second playmaker in the team. Even Maradona can be man-marked out of the game. You need to give him the possibilty to go wide, drop deep and give the ball to another player who's able to create. Can't think of a better one than Beckenbauer.

 

[Snow]

That was the game i was thinking about first and foremost actually as it was the most recent. Rafael barely crossed the half way line the whole first half, and when we did double up on Ronaldo it created notable space for others.

I accept now that Facchetti is under instruction to get forward, he has to as Anto's left is the only side with width, but as i said earlier i think this would cause more harm than good.

There was a clear difference between the first and second half. United scored early and naturally Real tried to peg back immediately and were the better team for the remainder of the half. In the 2nd half the tactics changed and Rafael actually got some help. But in the first, despite his troubles and a yellow card, he still managed to keep Real from creating anything too dangerous (but it was a matter of time how long he could keep it up without any help).

I'm sure most people thought when they saw Jones on the team sheet that his job was to be a similar one like in the Everton match but instead of Fellaini he would chase Ronaldo. I don't know why that wasn't the case the whole match. He looked a bit lost the whole 1st half.

That's really the case with both flanks. Difference is obviously how you set it up. Any defender on the pitch could well close down his flank with help but also any attacker on the flanks can also give trouble to them for 90 minutes.
It's usually the most talked about aspect I've found in these fantasy matches. How the full back will cope.

 

[Cutch]

There was a clear difference between the first and second half. United scored early and naturally Real tried to peg back immediately and were the better team for the remainder of the half. In the 2nd half the tactics changed and Rafael actually got some help. But in the first, despite his troubles and a yellow card, he still managed to keep Real from creating anything too dangerous (but it was a matter of time how long he could keep it up without any help).

I'm sure most people thought when they saw Jones on the team sheet that his job was to be a similar one like in the Everton match but instead of Fellaini he would chase Ronaldo. I don't know why that wasn't the case the whole match. He looked a bit lost the whole 1st half.

That's really the case with both flanks. Difference is obviously how you set it up. Any defender on the pitch could well close down his flank with help but also any attacker on the flanks can also give trouble to them for 90 minutes.
It's usually the most talked about aspect I've found in these fantasy matches. How the full back will cope.

I also imagined something similar to what happened in the madrid game where Ronaldo would frequent in one area only to pop up on the opposite side to score an unstoppable header. As Gary Neville says, he's a bully that thrives on frailties. If he's not getting change out of Facchetti he'll cross over and hopefully tear a new one in Andrade. Best similarly. I think this flexibility is key, good to be able to mix it up. Between the 2 surely one will make a telling contribution, i can't imagine both being nullified all game.

 

[antohan]

There's two weakspots for me. That one you've cited and your own when Facchetti joins Henry. Obviously Facchetti's powers of recovery are excellent and Rijkaard exudes ruthless discipline, but I'd fear for him one-on-one out by the touchline, especially if Ronaldo's fed an early ball from Hierro.

Agree, an early ball from Hierro to Ronaldo is Cutch's main counter weapon there.

There are a couple of things to point out there where people on here usually seem to completely forget real games.

1. Typically, Ronaldo is not going to be sitting miles upfront waiting for a ball but somewhere around the halfway line, even in his own half. i.e. Facchetti doesn't have to race the length of the pitch to catch up but about half of it at the most.
2. In the time it takes for whoever recovered the ball in defence to collect himself, look out for the pass (not always immediately Hierro), execute it and, assuming Hierro is the recipient he has to do the same again, likely under pressure from one of my forwards... Facchetti has easily dealt with most of the recovery and all Rijkaard really needs to do is keep Ronaldo controlled for whatever remains, if much at all.
3. The riskier scenario is the one where Hierro himself recovers it, which will indeed happen and places the pass straight away (which won't always be the case having the likes of Best, Edwards and Di Stéfano also as options). In the ones going to Ronaldo, Rijkaard will assess the situation, as any self-respecting defensive midfielder would, and if it looks bad -not always the case- he will commit an early foul.

Overall, the number of true risky situations is going to be very limited relative to the constant joy Facchetti and Henry will be having.

 

[Snow]

I also imagined something similar to what happened in the madrid game where Ronaldo would frequent in one area only to pop up on the opposite side to score an unstoppable header. As Gary Neville says, he's a bully that thrives on frailties. If he's not getting change out of Facchetti he'll cross over and hopefully tear a new one in Andrade. Best similarly. I think this flexibility is key, good to be able to mix it up. Between the 2 surely one will make a telling contribution, i can't imagine both being nullified all game.

I don't think so either. It's just hard to take these two teams and then use examples from real life to make it logical. There haven't been teams with that kind of talent. Best team in the world right now, their 2nd best players doesn't make the starting lineup.

I see it as a goal fest rather than a defensive stalemate.

 

[Cutch]

Agree, an early ball from Hierro to Ronaldo is Cutch's main counter weapon there.

There are a couple of things to point out there where people on here usually seem to completely forget real games.

1. Typically, Ronaldo is not going to be sitting miles upfront waiting for a ball but somewhere around the halfway line, even in his own half. i.e. Facchetti doesn't have to race the length of the pitch to catch up but about half of it at the most.
2. In the time it takes for whoever recovered the ball in defence to collect himself, look out for the pass (not always immediately Hierro), execute it and, assuming Hierro is the recipient he has to do the same again, likely under pressure from one of my forwards... Facchetti has easily dealt with most of the recovery and all Rijkaard really needs to do is keep Ronaldo controlled for whatever remains, if much at all.
3. The riskier scenario is the one where Hierro himself recovers it, which will indeed happen and places the pass straight away (which won't always be the case having the likes of Bent, Edwards and Di Stéfano also as options). In the ones going to Ronaldo, Rijkaard will assess the situation, as any self-respecting defensive midfielder would, and if it looks bad -not always the case- he will commit an early foul.

Overall, the number of true risky situations is going to be very limited relative to the constant joy Facchetti and Henry will be having.

 

[antohan]

It's usually the most talked about aspect I've found in these fantasy matches. How the full back will cope.

True, and the funny thing is that even then people consistently draft fullbacks almost as an afterthought as they know that ultimately it's the winger drool-factor that wins the votes and not the fullback that stops you from losing them, however competent he is.

Loads of people pointed it out when I picked Facchetti but I didn't care as ultimately I wasn't just picking a fullback but a credible attacking threat as well, at least in real life.

He won two European Cups and was runner-up in another two, and a World Cup as well, and was always invariably one of the key attacking weapons for his side.

 

[Skorenzy]

 

[antohan]

You will score off a beach ball?

 

[antohan]

got it now

Yeah, what the feck is HE doing on the pitch?

 

[Cutch]

You will score off a beach ball?

Yep, thats another option i have that you don't

 

[NM]

Thought long and hard on this one.. The thought of Best and Ronaldo swung it for me.. Them on one team and Pele and Maradonna in the other.

Have to say well done to Antohan though. I thought there was no way his team would be good enough to compete against Cutch a few rounds ago but he has picked well from the opposition.

 

[antohan]

Yeah, lots of options yet late in the first half you are still playing with a major tactical blunder in your team. Major.

 

[antohan]

Thought long and hard on this one.. The thought of Best and Ronaldo swung it for me.. Them on one team and Pele and Maradonna in the other.

That's 6 votes against with no reply now

I'm still waiting for the second half for news on that eyesore.

 

[NM]

That's 6 votes against with no reply now

I'm still waiting for the second half for news on that eyesore.

Reply to? I havent read the thread. will read at night.

 

[antohan]

Reply to? I havent read the thread. will read at night.

I meant it was 14-9 and now it's 14-15. 6 Cutch votes "with no reply".

I've given up on people giving reasons:

• 13 of the votes for Cutch have given no reasons.
• Fergus' are clear.
• Paceme wants me to play Werewolf, which I've said before I don't understand what it is about.

And you just went for the wingers over the Best Ever Player according to FIFA and the Best Ever according to a FIFA fan poll. Not even when they face two outstanding fullbacks and several steps have been taken to contain their threat as much as possible.

Nothing I can do about any of that TBH.

 

[Skorenzy]

True, and the funny thing is that even then people consistently draft fullbacks almost as an afterthought as they know that ultimately it's the winger drool-factor that wins the votes and not the fullback that stops you from losing them, however competent he is.

Loads of people pointed it out when I picked Facchetti but I didn't care as ultimately I wasn't just picking a fullback but a credible attacking threat as well, at least in real life.

He won two European Cups and was runner-up in another two, and a World Cup as well, and was always invariably one of the key attacking weapons for his side.

Also, in tight games like these the scorer is likely to be someone that isn't the main attacking threat, like a Facchetti or a Hierro (for Cutch).

In this sense, Facchetti has form. Of his 5 European Cup goals, 4 have come in the semi-finals. And all quite clutch goals as well.


1964/65 European Cup, Semi-Final, 2nd Leg | Inter 3 - 0 Liverpool; he scored the 3rd goal (very similar to Jordi Alba's goal in the Euro 2012 Final, great run forward, he receives a perfect pass into his stride and a great shot finish past the keeper, although in Facchetti's case it was right through the centre of the pitch, funnily enough not the left side), which meant Inter won the tie 4-3 on aggregate.

1965/66 European Cup, First Round, 2nd Leg | Inter 2 - 0 Dinamo Bucuresti; he scored the 2nd goal (headed in a cross), which meant Inter won the tie 3-2 on aggregate.

1965/66 European Cup, Semi-Final, 2nd Leg | Inter 1 - 1 Real Madrid; he scored the equaliser (a striker's finish as Inter tiki-taka their way through RM's defense and he receives the ball on the left side and finishes with a perfectly placed low diagonal shot in the side of the goal just inside the far post), but RM won the tie 2-1 on aggregate.

1966/67 European Cup, Semi-Final, 1st Leg | Inter 1 - 1 CSKA Red Flag (Sofia); he scored the opening goal (he turned in a cross I think, can't quite tell from a video I found as its quality is unclear; in open play anyway).

1966/67 European Cup, Semi-Final, 2nd Leg | CSKA Red Flag (Sofia) 1 - 1 Inter; he again scored the opening goal (headed in a corner), but the Bulgarians equalised which lead to a decisive, play-off game which Inter won 1-0.

 

[NM]

I meant it was 14-9 and now it's 14-15. 6 Cutch votes "with no reply".

I've given up on people giving reasons:

• 13 of the votes for Cutch have given no reasons.
• Fergus' are clear.
• Paceme wants me to play Werewolf, which I've said before I don't understand what it is about.

And you just went for the wingers over the Best Ever Player according to FIFA and the Best Ever according to a FIFA fan poll. Not even when they face two outstanding fullbacks and several steps have been taken to contain their threat as much as possible.

Nothing I can do about any of that TBH.

with regards to me- people are always going to go with their hearts and United bias - he has Best Ronaldo and Edwards. You have only Ferdinand!

Didnt even realize that but it definitely factored into my vote.

 

[antohan]

with regards to me- people are always going to go with their hearts and United bias - he has Best Ronaldo and Edwards. You have only Ferdinand!

Didnt even realize that but it definitely factored into my vote.

Oh, I'm sure it did. No worries mate.

As I said in my write-up, it's a tight game where most people will ultimately vote according to personal preferences. That was before I realised Cutch was going into the game with two glaring weaknesses, but I understand not everyone will home in or care about them. I've even been teasing about the other for a while now and no one is venturing a guess although once explained it will be very very clear.

 

[antohan]

Stoichkov is left footed though, he'd be better placed to attack Eyzaguirre by taking him on the outside, whereas Henry would be more prone to cutting infield which is Hierro/Baresi territory.

Not really the greatest example but this is kind of what I had in mind.

Just noticed you had posted this clip. I know you clarified it wasn't the greatest example but Henry is clearly fully capable of doing that.

And by the way, in the same World Cup Stoichkov scored this very similar goal, on the right, attacking precisely the space between fullback and centreback I've been going on about.

Notice as well the move starts from a Stoichkov headed clearance deep in Bulgarian territory.



This is one of the three trademark ways Stoichkov scored which I mentioned earlier, it's the one I least expect as I see Cutch defending deeper than Argentina here (which gives me acres of space to play in) and my team having the lion's share of possession.

It's never only one side getting counter opportunities though.

 

[Snow]

You might have decide the vote on my part by having Laudrup on instead of Stoichkov or Henry purely because of sentimental reasons. Wouldn't make much sense tactically.
Not that many players in this match that I'm particularly fond of.

 

[antohan]

You might have decide the vote on my part by having Laudrup on instead of Stoichkov or Henry purely because of sentimental reasons. Wouldn't make much sense tactically.
Not that many players in this match that I'm particularly fond of.

He is on the bench and has played his heart out to get his teammates here. His mate Stoichkov is on the pitch, he wants it!

One thing that defines Laudrup as a player and an individual is the way he dealt with Stoichkov. Upon arriving at Barca, Stoichkov was used to being the main man. He had always been the star, the one with the team built around him, the one everyone would pass the ball to, the weight of expectation was always on his shoulders...

His early games at Barca were a disaster, he was out of sorts and getting quite upset about it all. A lesser man would have been delighted to see the guy struggle in his attempts to take over, but not Laudrup. He himself had long struggled to find his mojo at Juventus after his big transfer to a big league.

He had a chat with him, told him he was surrounded by great players, that he shouldn't worry so much or try doing everything himself, that if he could let go then they had the makings of an attacking force which would be quite something.

Stoichkov listened, handed over the reins to Laudrup and just revelled in his service. The Dream Team was born.

That man battling for his team on the right wing is every bit his own doing, but also part of Laudrup's legacy to the game.

 

[Cutch]

Have a massive game tomorrow so time to hit the sack here. Will resume again in the mornin for a wee last minute recruitment campaign.

 

[Fergus' son]

Also, in tight games like these the scorer is likely to be someone that isn't the main attacking threat, like a Facchetti or a Hierro (for Cutch).

In this sense, Facchetti has form. Of his 5 European Cup goals, 4 have come in the semi-finals. And all quite clutch goals as well.


1964/65 European Cup, Semi-Final, 2nd Leg | Inter 3 - 0 Liverpool; he scored the 3rd goal (very similar to Jordi Alba's goal in the Euro 2012 Final, great run forward, he receives a perfect pass into his stride and a great shot finish past the keeper, although in Facchetti's case it was right through the centre of the pitch, funnily enough not the left side), which meant Inter won the tie 4-3 on aggregate.

1965/66 European Cup, First Round, 2nd Leg | Inter 2 - 0 Dinamo Bucuresti; he scored the 2nd goal (headed in a cross), which meant Inter won the tie 3-2 on aggregate.

1965/66 European Cup, Semi-Final, 2nd Leg | Inter 1 - 1 Real Madrid; he scored the equaliser (a striker's finish as Inter tiki-taka their way through RM's defense and he receives the ball on the left side and finishes with a perfectly placed low diagonal shot in the side of the goal just inside the far post), but RM won the tie 2-1 on aggregate.

1966/67 European Cup, Semi-Final, 1st Leg | Inter 1 - 1 CSKA Red Flag (Sofia); he scored the opening goal (he turned in a cross I think, can't quite tell from a video I found as its quality is unclear; in open play anyway).

1966/67 European Cup, Semi-Final, 2nd Leg | CSKA Red Flag (Sofia) 1 - 1 Inter; he again scored the opening goal (headed in a corner), but the Bulgarians equalised which lead to a decisive, play-off game which Inter won 1-0.

That's brilliant.

 

[Crustanoid]

Sorry, but if you're trying to stem the tide with Pele and Maradona coming at you, you're pretty much fecked

 

[Brwned]

Netzer was clearly subordinate though, with these too it's not quite so clear.

Pele is a number ten naturally.

Football is only played with one ball eh? Thanks for that insight.

Netzer was subordinate to no-one in fairness. Beckenbauer ran the game from defence to midfield, Netzer ran the games from midfield to attack - and it led to some of the best football you'll ever see. I completely disagree with someone trying to play Cruyff and Maradona in the same team because they want to dominate in the same areas of the pitch. There will be nowhere near as much overlap with Beckenbauer here because he can dominate games from his own half. Not only that but games like England in '66 show that there's a level of willingness to sacrifice himself for the team that we never saw from Cruyff, IMO. I think you can squeeze two generals in a team as long as they're playing in different areas of the pitch.

 

[Isotope]

I like that Antohan midfield, as Maradona-Rijkaard-Beckenbauer triangle is just the best you can imagine from an all-time team.

Although I don't think Henry as a winger is an effective one; he made his name as a striker, not in that position. But I can see Antohan's thinking that Pele would love to drop deep; and having Henry there would occupy opponents defence.

 

[Moby]

I would just like to say that a certain Arsenio Erico is on the bench, which is a remarkable thing in itself. Probably Pele is the better man in this game to head the attack but Erico almost equally deserves to be a part of this team's success. I was just reading about him, and came across an incident where he scored off a cross by putting his hands on the ground and making the contact with his backheel, pretty much like the Scorpion kick of Rene Higuita, I just can't imagine how much agile and acrobatic this man was. Di Stefano said that apart from being an outstanding goal scorer, he was also pretty selfless and could easily create chances in tough situations for others. Not having an international cap certainly hurts his reputation. He could have played for Argentina but he rejected the offer. A true great of the game in his own right.

 

[antohan]

Eyzaguirre EXPOSED

He was known as an outstanding attacking right back. Roberto Carlos is considered one of the outstanding left backs of his time but he'd have a nightmare up against Stoichkov - I think it's the same here with Eyzaguirre v Henry. I watched him against Italy in '62 the other week and thought about compiling a clip of all his defensive lapses for our game but couldn't be bothered in the end, here's one example of his idea of defending in that game.

That one clip doesn't prove anything but you'll have to take my word for it. He got caught under the ball for that long diagonal countless times and got sucked into the tackle over and over again. Great on the ball though, excellent passer for a fullback and really composed in possession.

This prompted me to watch one of the most dour games of football I've seen. I was making a clip but it was taking forever as I had to keep stopping, chopping, etc. and these were the most inept Italians I've ever seen so they did no damage as a result. Ultimately, once Italy were reduced to 9 you could also excuse him being so far up the pitch and relying on the CB to cover (he does, a lot).

So I picked the Brazil game and fast forwarded to the four goals conceded. Lo and behold, he is at fault or has "WTF?" moments/positioning in all of them.

But surely, if playing for Rest of the World (their manager being the Chile manager) is testament to his quality and how he peaked so brightly as one of the best in the World, why not find footage on that game? He would then be playing alongside the sort of players on this draft! Brilliant.

Here it is, he came on in the second half at 0-0 for Djalma Santos. The guy really is not a defender. Everyone caught on to that immediately as most of the England attacks switched from right to left flank from one half to the next (despite England not making subs).

His positioning is atrocious, half the time you don't have the first clue what he could possibly be doing. He is lackadaisical, walks around watching on as his side is torn apart, has no composure, no reaction, no physical presence, nothing.

He is without a shadow of a doubt the worst fullback in this draft, John O'Shea would actually do a more competent job on Henry, and I'm not exaggerating.

But enough of me talking, here's Eyzaguirre playing with the very best, straight from English Pathé. You make up your own mind.



You may need to watch that a few times for it to sink in as some of the play is and it's hard to keep focused on where the feck Eyzaguirre has gone AWOL to, or the fact the man he was tracking suddenly appears on screen and then Eyzaguirre appears, several yards late.

Of course, the Chilean press had some major coverage of the event, blamed the rest of the team for not showing up (serious, I have the full article) and highlighted Yashin's performance in the first half -helps explain the goals that he came out, although he was indeed exceptional- and Eyzaguirre as one of the few bright lights in the RotW performance.

 

[antohan]

The other Tactical Blunder

With 3/4 of the game gone and little time left to make up for it, I'm ready to bring this out in the open. What's wrong with the way players have been deployed for the last 70 minutes?

Obviously, Baresi and Charles are the wrong way around.

• Eyzaguirre requires cover, a lot of it. He is being doubled up on, Hierro is not always going to get there in time to support, the CB will necessarily need to come out to deal with Henry or Facchetti countless times. Baresi would be much better for that job.
• On the other flank I have Stoichkov attacking the space between Santos and the left-side CB. Charles would be much better used on that side doing a stopper job.

It means both have not been used to the best of their abilities. Not ideal, but not game-changing.

The huge issue is my width is on the left. I'm hardly ever going to get any floated crosses in from the right, but Cutch will be peppered with crosses from the left PARTICULARLY as and when John Charles is drawn to the flank to provide cover.

If I have width on one side, John Charles absolutely should be the centre back on the far post, not the one I can drag out of position. But no, he is being dragged out of position and Nilton Santos and Baresi are left to deal with Stoichkov and Pelé aerially.

That is a BIG deal, particularly with Pelé vs. Baresi, Baresi is in all sorts of trouble there.

Sure, Cutch can ask them to switch around, but this weakness has been there for 70 minutes and actually should be assumed to have lasted the entire game seeing as I only have to highlight it because votes are only allowed before the final whistle.

For 70 minutes he has been playing an absolute liability at right back and his most aerially dominant defender has been dragged out time and again before placing crosses for a strike partnership which will be more aerially dominant than those meant to stop them.

How could I realistically lose this game?

 

[Cutch]

Such nonsense Anto. Baresi is playing on the side of the defence he's always played on and covering the fullback that's doing the most attacking. The right footed Charles is playing on his comfortable side. That's obvious surely. I'm playing to my strengths here, not moving players to other sides like you're doing with Stoitchkov.

Youve mentioned this throughout but why on earth is it assumed Eyzaguirre is the only player being doubled up on, are my fullbacks not allowed to any attacking? You think Stoitchkov and Thierry Henry are going to be tracking back all game? Yes, you have the Rijkaard contingency plan but I have Hierro doing exactly the same job.

I'll be exposing your 2 fullbacks far more than you will mine in this game. You'd be a fool to think otherwise

 

[Cutch]

This laying in to Eyzaguirre is gettin really tiresome. The narrow system you're playing will obviously mean my 2 fullbacks tucked in more than usual. This tighter more cohesive unit when i havn't the ball will make my side a lot harder to break down than if you had genuine wide players on the pitch. Your formation is too reliant on Fachetti and your clinging your hope on Henry, the worst of the 4 wide attackers exposing the worst of the four fullbacks. I've even got Hierro aswell on that side, to help out aswell.

 

[Cutch]

I have FIFA's left back in the team of the century, and George Best attacking a fullback that played when the game was a snails pace in the 30s, with his only help an inside forward on his wrong side (Stoitchkov).

I have a right back markin Henry (a forward shunted to the wing cuttin inside all game), a defensive midfielder monitoring the situation and Cristiano Ronaldo occupying his fullback most of the game.

Which sounds the more likely source of joy?

 

[Thisistheone]

I'm going to vote for Anto. (Sorry Cutch). I'll echo NM's sentiments when he said Anto has done exceptionally well to get this team together when two rounds ago he looked nothing like a winning side, with Cutch's outfit clearly ahead. But come the final Anto's team has improved dramatically and therefore seems to have momentum, which is huge in tournaments.

It's like Anto has held his team back and now they're in full flow come the business end of the cup. I think tactically he's also been very shrewd.

There's hardly anything in it of course but glad if my boy Maradona ends up on the winning side.

 

[Cutch]

In reality this is the type of scenario Anto is pinning his hopes on when he has the ball down the left, where he expects Facchetti (his one source of genuine width), to get forward for a 2 v 1 situation on my fullback Eyzaguirre. As you can see it shouldn't be a 2 v 1 situation at all with Hierro shifting across as Facchetti pushes forward, with Eyzaguirre covering the overlapping run.

Obviously my hope here is that the move is contained enough (which it should be) where i can get a quick turnover back up the pitch to the deadly counter attacking of Di Stefano, Ronaldo and Best.

 

[Balu]

I have FIFA's left back in the team of the century, and George Best attacking a fullback that played when the game was a snails pace in the 30s, with his only help an inside forward on his wrong side (Stoitchkov).

I have a right back markin Henry (a forward shunted to the wing cuttin inside all game), a defensive midfielder monitoring the situation and Cristiano Ronaldo occupying his fullback most of the game.

Which sounds the more likely source of joy?

I don't get why the discussion is almost solely about wide play. I haven't read a single word about how you get the best out of van Basten. He's my favorite forward of all time and he should be your main attacking threat. Yet, he's not mentioned at all. Ronaldo has never played alongside someone like him, he's been a prolific goal scorer when the central striker was hard working, drawing defenders out of position, opening up space for him. Rooney and Tevez at United, Benzema at Real are different types of forward compared to van Basten.

In my opinion, it's wrong that you think Ronaldo is more important in this game than di Stefano and van Basten and I can't see you winning the game very often because Ronaldo scores on the counter. It's sad really, Ronaldo is nowhere near those players.

 

[Cutch]

I don't get why the discussion is almost solely about wide play. I haven't read a single word about how you get the best out of van Basten. He's my favorite forward of all time and he should be your main attacking threat. Yet, he's not mentioned at all. Ronaldo has never played alongside someone like him, he's been a prolific goal scorer when the central striker was hard working, drawing defenders out of position, opening up space for him. Rooney and Tevez at United, Benzema at Real are different types of forward compared to van Basten.

In my opinion, it's wrong that you think Ronaldo is more important in this game than di Stefano and van Basten and I can't see you winning the game very often because Ronaldo scores on the counter. It's sad really, Ronaldo is nowhere near those players.

Its turned into solely about wide play because we've significantly differing views over who's getting the better of those exchanges. I am convinced that is where this game is won or lost for me when you compare what i've got to Anto's two. I could go on and on about Van Basten but then Anto could go on and on about Pele. We'd be going round and round in circles.

 

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Slipping away from me here!

 

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But theres still time!