All-time Fantasy Draft - antohan v Thisistheone

Who will win based on players in their prime, team tactics, balance & bench strength?

  • Total voters
    40
  • Poll closed .
antohan said:
Interesting. My view is his pitch reads like "I can't stop him so I might as well put all the guns out there and see if it sticks".

And the only player I'm clearly talking down is Weah, who is completely out of his depth here.
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I've explained why I've picked this team, it's in Brwned's OP. From my point of view, I want my best players on the pitch and doing what they do best, rather than play a negative team and basically just sit back waiting to get stuffed.

Weah is not completely out of his depth. Are you mad? He was World Player of The Year. The best player on the planet in his prime. A time when Batistuta, Baggio and Romario, Stoichkov, Maldini, and your very own M.Laurdup, were around.
 
Weah was unplayable at times and devastating at his best. What a finisher, and also superb in the air.

 
Thisistheone said:
A comment made to try and motivate one of his players maybe?

Either way, a motivated Laudrup you might have. But due to your derogatory comments, my whole team is motivated for this. Maradona on a mission was always special to watch.
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I said nothing bad about Maradona, just that Cruyff would rub him the wrong way. In fact, as the game wears on he will be in full agreement, if he wasn't already after the last game.

You laughing your tits off at Weah will come back to bite you. He is the only true no.9 on the pitch and therefore brings my team better balance. Football has a habit of haunting manager's so maybe Weah will pop up with the winning goal and celebrate in front of you.
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A true No. 9 would score more goals. He is nothing like a true No. 9. He was at his best in a counter-attacking setup making runs from deep. That is, from an area you already have incredibly congested.

He is not too different from Henry in his "No. 9" qualities and Pelé is far far better at it. Christ sake, are you seriously arguing Weah, a 1 in 2 player at his best provides a greater threat than Pelé who scored the only goal and winner in the quarters, a hat-trick in the semis and a brace in the final in 1958, aged 17? It's mental.

Thisistheone said:
And yes, I'm not a fan of talking down the opponents players either. Make it reasonable & structured, but not plain insulting.
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Keep milking it, that's all you have going for you. There's only one side on the pitch which will have the ball and can fully control the game in all areas of the pitch. But hey, that doesn't matter, does it?
 
EDogen said:
Thisistheone for me since I like his formation and unit more. Also not a big fan of "talking down" the opponent, I like that Thisistheone mostly is focusing on his own team and what they will do to harm Anto.

I´m glad that you went with Cruyff - Maradona - Garrincha.
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Only because you've not seen Garrincha play...
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It would just never work, Ronaldo would make it a much more cohesive unit.
 
Thisistheone said:
My very own Holy Trinity! :D

And yes, I'm not a fan of talking down the opponents players either. Make it reasonable & structured, but not plain insulting.
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Yes, I just feel even if they do not work perfect together they still will produce magic for Weah to score his goal.

antohan said:
Interesting. My view is his pitch reads like "I can't stop him so I might as well put all the guns out there and see if it sticks".

And the only player I'm clearly talking down is Weah, who is completely out of his depth here.
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Sure, Weah is no superstar but he is a number 9 and a very good one, with that trio behind him I see him getting a goal even if it just is a simple tap in in the open net after a Cruyff solo.

Also one thing that got me thinking when I saw your team. Those long arrows forward for your full backs when they are facing Cruyff and Garrincha, maybe they should take it a little bit easier with going forward.

And do not get me wrong I really like your team also, but I guess that when it is this close personal taste will have the last word.
 
Brwned said:
Only because you've not seen Garrincha play...
whistling2.gif


It would just never work, Ronaldo would make it a much more cohesive unit.
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Well I admit that I have not seen much of him, just some game on youtube and highlights. So it is hard to see how they would work as a unit but like I said earlier, the quality between those three will make things happen.
 
EDogen said:
Yes, I just feel even if they do not work perfect together they still will produce magic for Weah to score his goal.



Sure, Weah is no superstar but he is a number 9 and a very good one, with that trio behind him I see him getting a goal even if it just is a simple tap in in the open net after a Cruyff solo.

Also one thing that got me thinking when I saw your team. Those long arrows forward for your full backs when they are facing Cruyff and Garrincha, maybe they should take it a little bit easier with going forward.

And do not get me wrong I really like your team also, but I guess that when it is this close personal taste will have the last word.
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Weah is underrated I feel, probably because his peak was too short and some of his best play was in France too.

Thisistheone has a few good options off the bench.
 
Have you looked at that video? It pretty much supports my point that he is not a classic No.9.

Do any of those goals look as No.9 as this?


World Cup Final, 17 years old, the cheek... Let's have a look at this chap who isn't as good a striker as George Weah who was, quite rightly, a 12th Round pick
 
Fergus' son said:
Weah is underrated I feel, probably because his peak was too short and some of his best play was in France too.
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I like Weah from what I have seen but yes he seems underrated. As this game is talking about peak he will do just fine in that team. Hard to have the 11 best players of all time in your team, that will just not happen.
 
antohan said:
A true No. 9 would score more goals. He is nothing like a true No. 9. He was at his best in a counter-attacking setup making runs from deep. That is, from an area you already have incredibly congested.

He is not too different from Henry in his "No. 9" qualities and Pelé is far far better at it. Christ sake, are you seriously arguing Weah, a 1 in 2 player at his best provides a greater threat than Pelé who scored the only goal and winner in the quarters, a hat-trick in the semis and a brace in the final in 1958, aged 17? It's mental.


Keep milking it, that's all you have going for you. There's only one side on the pitch which will have the ball and can fully control the game in all areas of the pitch. But hey, that doesn't matter, does it?
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Again, why are you bringing stats into when they don't tell the whole story? Weah was playing in serie A at the time when defence was king. (as it always is really in Italy) At the same time in the 90's Les Ferdinand was scoring more. Does that make him better than Weah? Obviously not.

Weah was also sensational in France before his Milan days.

And me milking the fact that you're insulting my players? It's pretty obvious for everyone to see.
 
Thisistheone said:
Weah is not completely out of his depth. Are you mad? He was World Player of The Year. The best player on the planet in his prime. A time when Batistuta, Baggio and Romario, Stoichkov, Maldini, and your very own M.Laurdup, were around.
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He lasted twelve rounds for a reason mate, despite being Liberian as well. All those you mention were past it, bar maybe Batistuta who hadn't hit prime form yet. Not a lot available in the 1995 vintage and, being African, it was a good opportunity.

Mind, I planned to get him in the 13th round if he was still there, but wouldn't have expected to see him in the semis TBH.
 
@ Antohan - You do realise by stating these reasons and arguments that the overall point is to get people on your side? While your stats may be flawless, the way you speak harbouring pettiness and being quite condescending, superior and closed in your statements, surely won't win you any fans even IF your team is better...

And you do VASTLY underrate Weah, not saying he was as good a number 9 as Pele, but to say Weah wasn't a goal scorer proves you haven't seen much of him, at Monaco and PSG he was very good, and still had a desent return for a 'not too prolific striker' at AC...
 
Only lasted 12 rounds? Even if that was true (I personally don't think it is) does it even matter? We're judging a player on prime of career. Whether it was for a year or two or twenty, doesn't matter. Otherwise Giggs and Zanetti would be top picks over the rest of the draft.
 
EDogen said:
Also one thing that got me thinking when I saw your team. Those long arrows forward for your full backs when they are facing Cruyff and Garrincha, maybe they should take it a little bit easier with going forward.
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Which part of the BIG CAPS BOLDED ZANETTI AND FACCHETTI WILL TAKE TURNS did people not see?

As I said, I would expect Zanetti to bomb forward quite regularly as Cruyff is not going to be sitting up there, out wide, waiting for a counter. If Cruyff has tracked back, then Facchetti may as well as Rijkaard can pick out Garrincha. Garrincha is not some chap who will get the ball and fly down the wing in a direct way, there's ample time for recovery, particularly with Facchetti's pace.
 
EDogen said:
I like Weah from what I have seen but yes he seems underrated. As this game is talking about peak he will do just fine in that team. Hard to have the 11 best players of all time in your team, that will just not happen.
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Weah would have worked very well if TITO had a tight defence and counter-attacking setup. He doesn't. Wrong man for this game really.
 
Zanetti going forward is suicide. You can get away with Facchetti because of Garrincha and Bremner on his side. But on Zanetti's side there's Cruyff, Charlton and Breitner. That side of the pitch is where I expect to get a lot of joy in this game. Could prove crucial.
 
antohan said:
Which part of the BIG CAPS BOLDED ZANETTI AND FACCHETTI WILL TAKE TURNS did people not see?

As I said, I would expect Zanetti to bomb forward quite regularly as Cruyff is not going to be sitting up there, out wide, waiting for a counter. If Cruyff has tracked back, then Facchetti may as well as Rijkaard can pick out Garrincha. Garrincha is not some chap who will get the ball and fly down the wing in a direct way, there's ample time for recovery, particularly with Facchetti's pace.
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Well, Zanetti bombing forward is not what I would do with Breitner, Cruyff and also Charlton on that side of the pitch.

Facchetti going forward is a other thing, that I do not see many problems with.

I´m off now for a while, will be interesting to see how things develop from here!
 
Thisistheone said:
Again, why are you bringing stats into when they don't tell the whole story? Weah was playing in serie A at the time when defence was king. (as it always is really in Italy) At the same time in the 90's Les Ferdinand was scoring more. Does that make him better than Weah? Obviously not.
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All this "defence was king in Serie A" is BULLSHIT. The same season Weah got his World Player of the Year (1995-96) he scored 11 goals in 26 games in Serie A.

Serie A top scorers that season, straight from Wikipedia. WEAH IS NOT EVEN IN THE TOP 10 SCORERS FFS!

Top scorers

24 goals
22 goals
19 goals
17 goals
16 goals
14 goals
 
Jaybezia said:
And you do VASTLY underrate Weah, not saying he was as good a number 9 as Pele, but to say Weah wasn't a goal scorer proves you haven't seen much of him, at Monaco and PSG he was very good, and still had a desent return for a 'not too prolific striker' at AC...
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112 GOALS IN 269 GAMES, that's his French record, and they weren't king Serie A defences. He was never prolific.

I'm not saying he was a bad player, just nowhere near this level and BADLY DEPLOYED. He is a counter-attacking striker. TITO is not playing on the counter, there's no room for him to play on the counter either. He is completely ineffective. Pipo Inzaghi would be a better option by far.
 
antohan said:
I think he had personal stuff going on, glad to see he is focusing on that rather than faffing around on here TBH.

How are you anyway? Got better? You seem to have passed me that virus via your players, I spent all night on Sunday hugged to the bog :lol:
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I'm ok. Not great but ok.
It is Pele then. The cnut is a curse.

antohan said:
You are right. The longer version did include one ball on the pitch and that leading to the personality clash, I just had to cut down.



Who's getting the ball for them? Bremner? Really? Charlton will put a shift in but there's nowhere near enough fight in that midfield to keep up with mine.
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Fair enough.
If you had phrased it this way earlier, might have worked better for you.

I might be falling into the names trap, but I can't look past them
 
Thisistheone said:
Only lasted 12 rounds? Even if that was true (I personally don't think it is) does it even matter? We're judging a player on prime of career. Whether it was for a year or two or twenty, doesn't matter. Otherwise Giggs and Zanetti would be top picks over the rest of the draft.
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I meant you picked him in the 12th round of the draft, when people were picking subs and leftovers. There's a reason no one picked him earlier, or are all the other managers complete morons? (they appear to be as many are on here banging on about this chap they didn't bother pick themselves for 12 rounds!).
 
EDogen said:
Well, Zanetti bombing forward is not what I would do with Breitner, Cruyff and also Charlton on that side of the pitch.
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Zanetti bombs forward if I have the ball. If I have the ball then Breitner is busy with Zanetti and so is either Cruyff or Charlton with Laudrup. Beckenbauer covers whichever is spare.

Zanetti has owned flanks for over a decade, are we talking about the same player here?

BTW, how is Irwin faring with Henry, Iniesta and potentially Facchetti unaided by Garrincha?

Are you kidding me?
 
Ah right, I see.

Well I was amazed he lasted so long, especially considering his nationality.
 
antohan said:
Zanetti bombs forward if I have the ball. If I have the ball then Breitner is busy with Zanetti and so is either Cruyff or Charlton with Laudrup. Beckenbauer covers whichever is spare.

Zanetti has owned flanks for over a decade, are we talking about the same player here?

BTW, how is Irwin faring with Henry, Iniesta and potentially Facchetti unaided by Garrincha?

Are you kidding me?
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How's Rijkaard dealing, one on one, with Maradona?

Whilst Beckenbauer is caught up in the battle with Sir Bobby, Diego's getting so much space it's unreal.

I fancy Maradona to score to be honest.
 
Why is Irwin playing RB (when he was primarily a LB) and possibly the best RB ever, Carlos Alberto, is on the bench?

Unless I am missing something..?
 
Oh, I sure was as well. I did have him as a great ace up the sleeve to have in case I needed to set up on the counter. What I never expected was to see him starting in the semis and in an uber-attacking setup.
 
antohan said:
112 GOALS IN 269 GAMES, that's his French record, and they weren't king Serie A defences. He was never prolific.

. Pipo Inzaghi would be a better option by far.
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:lol:

Come on! Inzaghi wouldn't be better than Weah. There's so much more to a striker leading the line than goals, and you know it.
 
Thisistheone said:
How's Rijkaard dealing, one on one, with Maradona?

Whilst Beckenbauer is caught up in the battle with Sir Bobby, Diego's getting so much space it's unreal.

I fancy Maradona to score to be honest.
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If Gentile could do it, I see no reason why Frank Rijkaard can't. And you are forgetting the no small matter of Figueroa and Ferdinand protecting Rinat Dasayev in goal.

I still don't see how you are going to get much of the ball.
 
Thisistheone said:
:lol:

Come on! Inzaghi wouldn't be better than Weah. There's so much more to a striker leading the line than goals, and you know it.
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In this game, with so many creators, a fox in the box wouldn't be too bad. Anyway, he wasn't an option. Ronaldo and Messi were. I'm shocked you didn't go with either of them.
 
antohan said:
112 GOALS IN 269 GAMES, that's his French record, and they weren't king Serie A defences. He was never prolific.

I'm not saying he was a bad player, just nowhere near this level and BADLY DEPLOYED. He is a counter-attacking striker. TITO is not playing on the counter, there's no room for him to play on the counter either. He is completely ineffective. Pipo Inzaghi would be a better option by far.
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Thanks for putting that in capitals, I surely would have missed your intuitive points.

Is it crazy to believe then, by your own workings out that a year in which a Player won the 'worlds best player' he wasn't even in the top 10 scorers of the Italian League, is it crazy to think really then that perhaps that wasn't his job? If he was asked to get more goals and play further up that pitch, do you doubt someone of his ability would have been able to?

Also while it may not be up there with Pele, he has just under a goal every other game in the French and Italian Leagues.. hardly shooting blanks mate.
 
antohan said:
If Gentile could do it, I see no reason why Frank Rijkaard can't. And you are forgetting the no small matter of Figueroa and Ferdinand protecting Rinat Dasayev in goal.

I still don't see how you are going to get much of the ball.
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Much of the ball? My team is the attacking one, the one in the ascendancy. So therefore I'm having a lot of the ball. You've admitted I'm the team on the attack. I'm taking the game to you.
 
Im my opinion playing players out of position won't help against a well oiled and well drilled Team Antohan.
 
And one final thing on Weah (I hope!) he's not in my team to be a fox in the box. He's there to be an all-round striker. He won World Player of The Year because he could do more than just put the ball in the back of the net. He could run the lines, he could bring others into play, he was quick and strong and good in the air. He was such a handful that he is capable of occupying both centre halves the way your modern day forwards do (Drogba, Torres at pool etc) and even be effective from defensive set-plays the way RvP is for us this season.
 
Thisistheone said:
And one final thing on Weah (I hope!) he's not in my team to be a fox in the box. He's there to be an all-round striker. He won World Player of The Year because he could do more than just put the ball in the back of the net. He could run the lines, he could bring others into play, he was quick and strong and good in the air. He was such a handful that he is capable of occupying both centre halves the way your modern day forwards do (Drogba, Torres at pool etc) and even be effective from defensive set-plays the way RvP is for us this season.
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He and Maradona would work well I feel.
 
Jaybezia said:
Is it crazy to believe then, by your own workings out that a year in which a Player won the 'worlds best player' he wasn't even in the top 10 scorers of the Italian League, is it crazy to think really then that perhaps that wasn't his job? If he was asked to get more goals and play further up that pitch, do you doubt someone of his ability would have been able to?
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The thing is, that is precisely my point. TITO was banging on about how I have no one who is capable in the box while Weah was, which is ludicrous.

He was not a prolific goalscorer. He was excellent as a counterattacking forward but there's no counter on here and way too many players trying to operate in that space from the midfield to the box.

I do not dispute he could bang a goal in on a loose ball or something, but the two defenders there are superb and he is not playing to his strengths at all. In fact, he is likely instinctively dropping deep to do what he always did, further congesting that central area with Maradona, Cruyff and Charlton.

PS: the stuff in capitals is not for you but for thread scanners to pick relevant points.
 
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