Alisson Becker | Budding Target Man

the_irish123 said:
This. He's not the best at anything, but he has the most complete locker I think. Not the best with his feet, aerial command or shot stopping, but he makes the top3 in each category imo. I don't think there is another keeper that is that well rounded. De Gea for example would get a 9.5/10 at shot stopping, but would be a 6.5/10 for feet work and physicality. I think Alisson is the only that is 8/10 in all aspects.
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I think this sums it up for me, it appears he has the most complete locker. You can see why someone would label him the Messi of goalkeepers, I mean just watch hiz “Alisson Becker Best Saves & Skills 2018” Youbtube video 10:10 mins long, for a display of his all round skill set.

As soon as we were linked a year ago, you could see straight away he was the exact type of keeper for the way we play.
 
JohnSuarez said:
I think this sums it up for me, it appears he has the most complete locker. You can see why someone would label him the Messi of goalkeepers, I mean just watch hiz “Alisson Becker Best Saves & Skills 2018” Youbtube video 10:10 mins long, for a display of his all round skill set.

As soon as we were linked a year ago, you could see straight away he was the exact type of keeper for the way we play.
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This has to be a wind up.
 
Man of Leisure said:
Liverpool finally got themselves a decent keeper. Annoying that he’s arguably having a better season so far than De Gea. Not that De Gea is having a bad season per se, just not on the same level as he was a couple years ago.
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How is arguable that he's having a better season than De Gea, when he could literally take the rest of the season off, and still finish with more clean sheets than De Gea? (Based on current performance metric) And we arent even halfway yet.
 
Bergman said:
How is arguable that he's having a better season than De Gea, when he could literally take the rest of the season off, and still finish with more clean sheets than De Gea? (Based on current performance metric) And we arent even halfway yet.
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Don't think it's that simple. Apart from that one goal versus Arsenal, how many goals has DDG been responsible for Man United conceding? How many saves per game is DDG called on to make compared to Alisson?
 
Tommy said:
Don't think it's that simple. Apart from that one goal versus Arsenal, how many goals has DDG been responsible for Man United conceding? How many saves per game is DDG called on to make compared to Alisson?
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Last time I checked Alisson was top 3 in Europe in all the goalkeeping stats since 2017. Not sure about De Gea but will check soon as I get a chance.

If Striker A scored 10 goals and Striker B scored 2 goals in the first half season, would you say striker B is having the better season?
 
Bergman said:
Last time I checked Alisson was top 3 in Europe in all the goalkeeping stats since 2017. Not sure about De Gea but will check soon as I get a chance.

If Striker A scored 10 goals and Striker B scored 2 goals in the first half season, would you say striker B is having the better season?
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Why are you comparing strikers to goalkeepers? It's completely different.
 
Roady said:
People arguing it if it was a great save or not Fact is it’s a save that kept us in the champions league. That in itself is worth half his transfer fee alone. Add onto that the constant it’s a save he should have made etc.... that may be so but there’s not many keepers who would have saved it. It wasn’t a bad miss as that tweet above points out. A bad miss is a miss. It was a good save. Simple as that.
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Unless you win the competition it's not really worth all much let alone "half his fee".

And it wasn't a great save. It was hit at him. Good decision not hit the floor but there was nothing particularly exceptional about his goalkeeping there. Solid I suppose.
 
amolbhatia50k said:
Unless you win the competition it's not really worth all much let alone "half his fee".
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If you really wanna be precise, through Uefa alone, it's worth...

Clubs that qualify for the knockout stage can expect to receive the following amounts:
• qualification for the round of 16: €9.5m per club
• qualification for the quarter-finals: €10.5m per club
• qualification for the semi-finals: €12m per club
• qualification for the final: €15m per club
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So what, 15% of his fee? We need to get to the semis for the save to be worth about half :D

(This isn't subtracting the amounts received from being in the Europa league, but it also isn't adding the sponsorship deals from being in the CL for longer as well).
 
UnrelatedPsuedo said:
Never in a million years would Klopp swap his keeper for ours.
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Pretty sure he would have chosen DDG if Alisson was playing like this but still at another club. Pep is one of the very few managers in the world that require keepers that are really good with the ball (and just really technically gifted players in general). Klopp isn't one of them. DDG hasn't been in top form for a while, but he is still a ridiculously good shot stopper nonetheless.
 
I am surprised no one posted these



https://www.telegraph.co.uk/footbal...ng-david-de-geas-position-worlds-best-threat/

Carragher is expected to be a bit biased but, Michael Cox of Zonal Marking/Totally Football show has the same conclusion.

http://www.espn.co.uk/soccer/englis...alisson-usurps-de-gea-as-premier-leagues-no-1

De Gea's reign, though, is seemingly over. We're less than halfway through the campaign, but it's impossible to make a case for De Gea after his alarming dip in form since last season. In 2017-18, De Gea not only kept the highest number of clean sheets in the division, he also performed best statistically. Opta's data suggests he conceded 14 fewer goals than you'd expect based upon the shots he faced, by far the most impressive record in the top flight.

Something, however, has changed. De Gea endured a disappointing World Cup campaign, notably letting a Cristiano Ronaldo shot squirm beneath him in Spain's thrilling 3-3 draw with Portugal. That prompted closer inspection of his international form, which simply didn't compare with his Manchester United displays.

Now, they're roughly equal. Rather than De Gea's performances for the national team improving, his Manchester United displays have dipped. The statistics this season make for grim reading, and the headline figure is just two clean sheets in 16 matches.

More alarmingly, De Gea simply isn't saving enough shots. A 67 percent save rate puts him in the bottom half of goalkeepers, while Opta's statistics now suggest that his performances have prevented only 0.76 worth of goals this season. His mistake last week against Arsenal, where he practically pushed Shkodran Mustafi's weak header into the air and over the goal line behind him, has prompted extra scrutiny of his performances. De Gea may well return to form, and it would be unreasonable to write him off on the basis of a six-month dip in form after half a decade of brilliance. In 2018-19, though, De Gea is not the Premier League's top keeper.
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It’s understandable that De Gea league form in general is suffering with him playing in such a toxic environment. He will bounce back eventually. What I will say is that Alison’s distribution is on another level and it really does have a huge impact in facilitating Liverpool’s style of play from the back. We really need De Gea to step up this part of his game under the new regime whomever it may be.
 
Raees said:
It’s understandable that De Gea league form in general is suffering with him playing in such a toxic environment. He will bounce back eventually. What I will say is that Alison’s distribution is on another level and it really does have a huge impact in facilitating Liverpool’s style of play from the back. We really need De Gea to step up this part of his game under the new regime whomever it may be.
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Thing is, De Gea's distribution was never quite top class, while as a shot-stopper he is miles ahead (Except Oblak probably). That is one way to explain his struggle for Spain NT.
 
Ray_of_Hope said:
Thing is, De Gea's distribution was never quite top class, while as a shot-stopper he is miles ahead (Except Oblak probably). That is one way to explain his struggle for Spain NT.
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Exactly. I’m saying he needs to be coached in this regard - he’s been unfortunate in that his club career he has been managed by Fergie, Moyes and Mourinho - none of them placed any particular emphasis on playing out from the back at all costs - imagine Alisson making that blunder he did under Jose - he would be ordered to punt it long on all occasions.

De Gea is still young enough to make that transition - he’s not quite Joe Hart just yet.

Re Spain - imagine if all season you have to punt it and then you’re forced to play out from the back at all costs in big international arena - it’s a huge change and he must feel uncomfortable. I think it adds to his nervousness when playing for them and I think the lack of any real big match experience at United in the elite end of CL is also affecting his ability to handle the big international stage. I think mentally and in some technical respects he has stagnated at United and he’s in his comfort zone here.
 
Raees said:
Exactly. I’m saying he needs to be coached in this regard - he’s been unfortunate in that his club career he has been managed by Fergie, Moyes and Mourinho - none of them placed any particular emphasis on playing out from the back at all costs - imagine Alisson making that blunder he did under Jose - he would be ordered to punt it long on all occasions.

De Gea is still young enough to make that transition - he’s not quite Joe Hart just yet.

Re Spain - imagine if all season you have to punt it and then you’re forced to play out from the back at all costs in big international arena - it’s a huge change and he must feel uncomfortable. I think it adds to his nervousness when playing for them and I think the lack of any real big match experience at United in the elite end of CL is also affecting his ability to handle the big international stage. I think mentally and in some technical respects he has stagnated at United and he’s in his comfort zone here.
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To be fair, Alisson has stopped playing risky passes since that Leicester game. His overall distribution has regressed a bit, and he is indeed punting the ball long now. I think it is both due to media pressure and Klopp. As much progressive manager as Klopp is, He is determined this season not to take any unnecessary risks and win at all cost.

Regarding De Gea, you are right. He can still better the distribution aspect of his game. But he needs a different manager to do that, Jose Mourinho is not the answer. Who is United's goalkeeping coach by the way?
 
What a save that was eh? It in no way just happened to hit him at all. Obviously way better than DDG for me.
 
Phenomenal signing for them. Having a better season that DDG, can we put this down to Mou too? ;)
 
Ray_of_Hope said:
To be fair, Alisson has stopped playing risky passes since that Leicester game. His overall distribution has regressed a bit, and he is indeed punting the ball long now. I think it is both due to media pressure and Klopp. As much progressive manager as Klopp is, He is determined this season not to take any unnecessary risks and win at all cost.

Regarding De Gea, you are right. He can still better the distribution aspect of his game. But he needs a different manager to do that, Jose Mourinho is not the answer. Who is United's goalkeeping coach by the way?
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Agreed - that did happen but against Napoli he was pretty much perfect at playing it out. So his confidence is growing again but I think he will strive to avoid it drifting into arrogance again.
 
The funny thing is, after a couple of seasons where DDG were making saves like the one Allison made on a routine basis, people were saying he needed to do this over a prolonged period to talk about being the best in the world - and he had to win something. After Allison has a good season in a well functioning team, he is automatically labelled as the best goalie in the world. He's not even the best Brazilian goalie - Ederson is. And that save he made against Napoli would be considered a routine save by DDG.

Although DDG is not having his best season, I'd argue that Allison is still making more mistakes than DDG is. Allison should praise himself lucky that Koulibaly was offside after he made that howler of a clearance that dropped to a Napoli player who put the ball into the net. The only thing Allison is better at than DDG is his distribution, but Ederson is better still.
 
Rossa said:
No white text? I love the hyperbole - way better. He may be in better form - and I say may, but only his distribution is better - and that is not even way better.
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ah, I see - the (lame) white text thing is about indicating withering sarcasm because it isn't ALWAYS immediately obvious in the post itself when reading through om a routine basis - or can be misunderstood (not that you did, and I'm not having a pop at you either, Rossa - I just never really got the white text thing.

anyway, I agree - and even the distribution thing is overrated if they are making poor decisions that cost goals - like Allison has.

and DDG hasn't been great this year, the exit door towards better things is being nudged for me, and I don't blame him
 
Tommy said:
Don't think it's that simple. Apart from that one goal versus Arsenal, how many goals has DDG been responsible for Man United conceding? How many saves per game is DDG called on to make compared to Alisson?
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Alisson has the highest save percentage in the league, and also the highest percentual difference between expected goals against and goals conceded.
 
Ray_of_Hope said:
Thing is, De Gea's distribution was never quite top class, while as a shot-stopper he is miles ahead (Except Oblak probably). That is one way to explain his struggle for Spain NT.
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No it doesn't, Spain won everything with Casillas, and he was far from great with his feet either. De Gea simply has been poor for Spain, nothing to do with distribution
 
Ray_of_Hope said:
Thing is, De Gea's distribution was never quite top class, while as a shot-stopper he is miles ahead (Except Oblak probably). That is one way to explain his struggle for Spain NT.
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Main thing to me is that he seems uncomfortable when it comes to controlling larger spaces. Be it in his box, or the areas in front of/beside it. That's something that comes to the fore in a team like Spain, who like to play high up the pitch. He also seems a bit nervous in that general situation/environment.
 
Synco said:
Main thing to me is that he seems uncomfortable when it comes to controlling larger spaces. Be it in his box, or the areas in front of/beside it. That's something that comes to the fore in a team like Spain, who like to play high up the pitch. He also seems a bit nervous in that general situation/environment.
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Again, Iker was the same. De Gea's main issue with Spain has been shot stopping
 
B20 said:
Alisson has the highest save percentage in the league, and also the highest percentual difference between expected goals against and goals conceded.
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Probably the greatest shot-stopper can't be poor suddenly if he is asked to play his own game, don't you think?
 
giorno said:
Again, Iker was the same. De Gea's main issue with Spain has been shot stopping
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I kinda wanted to make two points there:

1. That Spain's style isn't tailor-made for DDG
2. That this and the public pressure seem to make him nervous and flappy in general

Casillas was similar in point 1, but not point 2. 2008-12 he was class (as I remember), despite limitations in some areas. DDG for Spain reminds me a tad of Ter Stegen in his first few years as Neuer backup for Germany, where he couldn't handle the pressure. Although in my memory Ter Stegen was even more flappy back then.
 
Every Liverpool player is the greatest in their position, that’s why they never win anything these days.
 
I dont think they are players with same level in terms of shot-stopping, i think De Gea is much better in this aspect. It doesn't mean that Alisson is not a great keeper, just that De Gea is exceptional.

In the other hand its not easy to play progressive football if your keeper can not reciclate possession with world class quality. A perfect example of this quality was Ederson against Everton today. The hability to brake the pressure and pass through the lines.
 
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