I think it has something to do with fulfulling his potential.
Although imo he's not even as good as he could be yet.
Alas poor Carrick...WTF has happened?
- Thread starter Carl
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I think it has something to do with fulfulling his potential.
Although imo he's not even as good as he could be yet.
That and not playing second fiddle to Scholes anymore.
The only thing left is to grow some balls and start ordering people around on the field. He is getting more respect this season and it's possible that we may see him doing that in the future. If he could enforce himself as a leader, you wouldn't find many mids better than Carrick out there.
Carrick has always been a consistent performer, and has found his niche at United. No one claims he is in the top bracket of midfielders in the world. However, you do not play for United for as many years as he has and not be good. He is an absolutely vital clog these days since the illness of Fletcher. I reckon his worst games were when paired against Fletcher, and has had to do the physical work of Scholes - which has never been his strong point.
He'll never be that person. He is naturally too laid back.
Problems I've had with Carrick:
1. Looked excellent for parts of seasons, ordinary for other parts. Never really maintained his form for a full season.
2. Not dominant enough, seemed to be too deferential towards players like Scholes.
3. Lacked a kind of nimbleness to get past players and get around the opposition when they pressed him well.
Problem 1 has been sorted this season. Problem 2 has been improved upon as he has assumed the mantle of our main midfielder, though he'll never be a dominant personality. Problem 3 will always exist, it's why he's relatively weak against teams that press us well.
1. Looked excellent for parts of seasons, ordinary for other parts. Never really maintained his form for a full season.
2. Not dominant enough, seemed to be too deferential towards players like Scholes.
3. Lacked a kind of nimbleness to get past players and get around the opposition when they pressed him well.
Problem 1 has been sorted this season. Problem 2 has been improved upon as he has assumed the mantle of our main midfielder, though he'll never be a dominant personality. Problem 3 will always exist, it's why he's relatively weak against teams that press us well.
So, we just need an Iniesta/Yaya Toure hybrid and we're sorted.
Quite a few on here do.
He's definitely up there though, who is better than him that plays the same role? There definitely aren't very many out there currently.
*raise hand*
Bar in few top teams, it's extremely hard to find anyone similar to Carrick.
Bar in few top teams, it's extremely hard to find anyone similar to Carrick.
Besides a rare once in a decade player you will always find weakness in all players. What Carrick possesses, other more dominant, and forceful players are likely to lack. Besides, It's not always about having World class players in a successful team - Fitting into a teams system is far more important. Messi has not been as dominant in an Argentinian team as he has been for Barcelona.
In his role the only better player is Busquets, and even he's not been better than Carrick this year.
Hard to define his role as it's quite unique, but certainly in the sort of position he plays, Alonso and Vidal are better than him. Martinez is also turning into a great player.
Busquets long range passing doesn't compare to Carrick, never has...
I disagree on Alonso and haven't seen enough of Vidal to make a judgement, but either way that's only two players. I'd say that definitely warrants a place in the top bracket of midfielders.
Maybe in the top bracket of his type of midfielder, but he's quite a unique midfielder. If you named a list of overall midfielders, not just a very specific type, he wouldn't be in the top 10.
If you expand it to players capable of covering the defensive side of the midfield I think he'd be top 10, and basically every team has a player like that. Then you add in his passing as well, he's certainly up there. But yeah, if you were to go strictly by the 10 best midfielders in the world he wouldn't be on the list.
Carrick doesn't go down like a bitch at the slightest touch, either.
How do you know that? Carrick has always played in teams that encourage long passes whereas busquets plays for teams that religiously pass it short.
Busquets is brilliant, I don't think Carrick is nearly as good. Same goes for alonso. Carrick is very good, especially during the last season and a bit but he isn't a special player. Very good but not among the veto best.
Exactly, so he's not in the top bracket of midfielders.
Yeah, I'm always left bemused when they say Carrick is as good as Alonso or Busquets. It's just not true.
Vidal isn't better midfielder than him, and he doesn't even play same position.
It's hard to compare his position even with Alonso's, because Alonso doesn't seem too be playing his best football without Khedira(more defensive oriented), but I would say this year Carrick's been better.
That's not true, Catalans use diagonall passes quite often, don't forget their fullback are very offensive, and I just checked that Xavi is the third best "long ball passer" La Liga passing 7.9 long passes per game. And they like to keep possesion more than any other club in the world, and you cannot do that without width, and with width, you will send long diagonal passes quite often.
That's silly then. You seem to want to compare Carrick only to modifiers exactly like him, if only to push him further up the list. It's a bit like the people who kept saying fletcher was world class because he was one of the best at what he did. Of course Carrick is better than fletcher but its the same principle.
Vidal is better, and they play in similar positions, just in a different way. It doesn't mean you can't compare them. Should Hernandez not be compared to RvP cause they play different styles?
Alonso is a better player than Carrick, he's just having his worst season for a while where as Carrick is having his best season for .. well .. ever.
If every team plays with a midfielder like him and he's one of the very best at that role then surely he's in the top bracket? He would get in to almost every team in the world the way he's playing currently.
I think your overrating Busquets and underrating Carrick a bit here.
Do they?
Maybe not his exact type of midfielder, but basically every team plays with a player charged with a majority of the defensive duties like Carrick.
Just look at the two play. Busquets is a special talent. His first touch, awareness, decision making and passing is brilliant. Carrick is a very good player who (now) is consistent too, but he doesn't have that level of talent.
Yeah and there are quite a few out there as good/better at it.
You already said he's not in the top 10, ergo he's clearly not in the "top bracket" of midfielders.
From what I have watched, Vidal is Juventus' most forward(can't find the word, you will understand it anyway) midfielder, and out of 3 players playing there in their system, it's surely not fair to Carrick comparing him with Vidal who is praised mostly because of his goal threat, and number of assist.
His passing and controlling the game isn't even close to Carrick's, and I don't need to even compare their defensive game, and those are one of three main aspects of quality midfielder. I am not saying Vidal isn't one, but he isn't better than Carrick in any of those.
Comparing Hernandez-RvP is okay, because they both play in same position and they have different style of play, but we are talking about two different positions.
As for Xabi, that's what I said, this season Carrick's been better, nothing more, nothing less.
No, I don't care about the list, because every person in the world will name different ten players, I am just saying he is better player than Vidal, and better player this year than Alonso.
And btw, I edited my last post quoting you, you probably missed it:
Put it this way, there aren't very many players at all that could come in to our side instead of Carrick and do better than he has. He's top bracket in what he does and like I said before every team has a player that sets out to perform his duties.
Basically every player in the top 10 is going to be more offensively minded so why compare someone like Xavi/Iniesta to Carrick when they'd be partnering him, not putting him on the bench.
But are there 10 midfielders who could come into our side and be better than him.
not many could come in and do what Jones did against Real in the first leg, does that suddenly make him one of the best midfielders in the world?
Be better than him yes, but my point is that they would need some one like Carrick beside them to form a functioning midfield. As good as Xavi and Iniesta are, both clearly better than Carrick, do you think them as a midfield two would perform better than either one with Carrick?
Of course it would, what the feck? Two of the best midfielders of their generation alongside each other, how would it not be?
He's a good player no doubt, but he very much benefits from the team around him I feel. Would he play as well if we swapped him and Carrick around? I wonder.
Then why do Barcelona always play a midfield 3 with a defensive minded player? Xavi and Iniesta wouldn't perform near as well as a midfield two.
I guess we just aren't going to agree. I just think that if every team plays with someone in charge of the same duties Carrick does for us and only 2-3 players are better at those duties/as an overall player then Carrick should be considered to be in the top bracket.
Cause that's how they play. Why do we only use two midfielders? Cause it's our style, Fergie loves 4-4-2, simple as that. I highly doubt Barcelona line up that way purely to ensure Iniesta and Xavi don't play in a midfield two!
Who are they? And how are you measuring 'better'?
I'm not naming them, I have before, and people using highlight one and go "
feck u nub, ** clueless lol!". Never works out.How am I measuring better? By the fact that they are better footballers, how the feck else? Their beards? Their hair length? The campness of their running?