Largely impossible in my opinion with the options we have.
The standard of the PL seems to have dropped, although its still very entertaining.
Alas poor Carrick...WTF has happened?
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Largely impossible in my opinion with the options we have.
The standard of the PL seems to have dropped, although its still very entertaining.
I think it's because the times he gets caught tend to be scary moments, whereas the first-time balls aren't that memorable in themselves. They're not splitting defences that often, but they're incredibly important to our game in getting possession to the front-men quickly.
Apart from Scholes, he's the only player that can do this really consistently. Giggs, Cleverley and Anderson can do it, but not in the metronomic way Carrick does.
I just think it's odd that, for some people, the one bad performance is the norm, whilst the 15-20 excellent performances are the "one-off"
To suggest he hasn't been pressurised in any of those games where he has been excellent would be wholly inaccurate.
To suggest he hasn't been pressurised in any of those games where he has been excellent would be wholly inaccurate.
Not worried by his bad performance of last night.He's been really good in the last few months
Me neither. It was just one poor performance, several brilliant ones had preceded it.
I thought Anderson didn't help Carrick much last night at all. I was at the game and it was clear that Ando hardly ran into space or made himself available to receive the ball back quick enough which is the reason I think Clev and Carrick work so well together imo.
People label Cleverley as 'tidy' and 'unadventurous' but its his strength rather than a perceived weakness (plus he's more than just that too). He passes and then instantly moves into space and has his arms out begging for the ball back almost straight away. He completes most of his passes too even if they are short and not overly penetrative but tbh all we needed last night was someone to help us hold the ball because for some reason we struggled to string two successive passes together for the entire second half and I just thought Cleverley could have helped us control the midfield a bit more and keep the ball better.
I'm not blaming Anderson either, the entire team struggled to pass the ball in the second half and it was highlighted since Carrick was having an off day. As mentioned before though his defensive contribution was still significant.
It's at times like this where I think we miss Fletch most.
I thought he had a shocker and was completely at fault for Swansea's first. Despite giving the ball away his ponderous run back was terrible from a supposed top level midfield player.
...
You thought Michael Carrick had a shocker against Swansea?... A shocker?
Sorry, that is just nonsense. Carrick was outstanding that day, ask any (normal thinking) United fan who watched that game and they will tell you the same.
Also, it's been a while since I've seen it, but Evra allowed the run in behind and whoever let Michu go in the middle were at fault for that goal.
Nothing either of you have said repudiates my point it simply shifts the blame from Carrick to someone else. Were Carrick the kind of player who assesses the situation before he gets the ball he would already have it in his mind either to dribble, go short or go home before he gets it having already determined the movement ahead of him is too static for the direct pass. The fact he often fails to show this foresight is down to the fact that fundamentally he is a two touch not a one touch footballer.
Carrick isn't one of those players who can be described as having his head on the swivel, always looking over his shoulder before he receives the ball. When he gets the ball facing the play he's in his comfort zone but when his back is to the opposition he rarely displays the awareness of what is around him. He has it in him and has displayed it at times, I mentioned his turn away from his marker against Spurs as an example, but its the exception not the norm and I don't believe there's anything particularly controversial in saying so either.
He does have the situation in his head, and this is shown by the fact that he continually plays incisive first-time or one-touch balls through the middle, often when receiving the ball at a different angle.
It's completely and utterly mental to say Carrick lacks awareness in any aspect of play, in my view.
Unless you count awareness that his mouth is hanging open
I don't question that Carrick can take the ball sideways on I question how well he responds when the play is behind and not ahead of him. The compilation below showcases Carrick's strengths better than most videos out there. A lot of very impressive things but the common thing witnessed from it is that more often than not Carrick's never in a position where he can't see the play long before he makes his move. Whether he's coming side on or square on he's had a chance to see the whole game before getting involved he's not called on to take a look over the shoulder and then play. What we need to see more of is Carrick c.5:50.
Contrast Carrick's awareness of the game with the awareness Pirlo displays in the compilation below. How many times Pirlo looks once, twice, three times over his shoulder around him before getting the ball and how little hesitation he has of taking the ball and working it into positions he can open up the opposition if nothing is on. You have to admit there is a visible difference between Pirlo's awareness of the game with the play behind him and Carrick's. That does not make Carrick a bad player, there are thousands of players inferior to someone like Andrea Pirlo, my point simply is that there are tools in the shed that Carrick could add to his game to get to Pirlo level.
I've watched a minute or two of that Pirlo video, and I see a lot of passing with the play ahead of him.
But yeah, as you say Carrick's not as good as Pirlo. He's still good at first-time and one-touch passing though, that's all I'm saying. It's the best part of his game, and you can easily see when he's off his game because then he does start to get caught.
Also, this season he's improved a lot at making space for himself under pressure, using feints etc. Passing with the game behind him you may be right, I've not noticed one way or the other.
But yeah, as you say Carrick's not as good as Pirlo. He's still good at first-time and one-touch passing though, that's all I'm saying. It's the best part of his game, and you can easily see when he's off his game because then he does start to get caught.
Also, this season he's improved a lot at making space for himself under pressure, using feints etc. Passing with the game behind him you may be right, I've not noticed one way or the other.
I found it funny that after Carrick finally got some recognition, both on the caf and in the press, he had probably the worst game he's ever played for United.
It was just one of those days, nothing to worry about. It's a good thing it was one of those days against Southampton and not against City, against whom all hands on deck will be required.
My comments on Carrick were not intended as an attack on the guy. A number of posters were commenting on what they felt were flaws in Carrick's game and I was just throwing my two pennies in about where I felt the gap in his play is. A gap, I acknowledged in my two posts before this one on Carrick, that he's shown signs of filling in the Spurs and Swansea games.
Michael Carrick is our best centre midfielder right now but that doesn't mean he has no room for improvement. If he could just up his awareness with his back to goal I think he could step up to the next level. He does however have time on his side. Pirlo's new lease of life at Juve started at a riper age than Carrick is now after all...
YeahHow many times did Carrick get the ball last night and actually have a passing option on? That's what happens when you play with one midfielder and have next to no width.
^ This...
Carrick did not have a great game last night. No issue at all with that statement.
But for Carrick to make passes he needs people to move to open space to receive passes. I mean it is not like you can think of many points in the game where Carrick missed an open United player.
In fact as I rewind the game in my head I constantly see the United player with the ball, being pressed and not having many options to pass. We had no wide men and I do not remember Anderson moving that much in support. Is that what you saw or am I off?
Again Carrick did not have a great game, but lots of blame can go elsewhere and if looked at holistically I believe many of Carrick's issues stem from lack of support from stationary teammates.
Thoughts?
No, that's exactly the way I saw it. I think you can get away with playing one of Kagawa or Welbeck on the wing as long as you have a natural winger on the other side. With both of them on neither stretches the play enough. Anderson may as well have not been on for all the support or options he gave Carrick.
It doesn't matter if you're wide or narrow, if you don't get into an open position, then you're never going to be a passing option. This whole because we had no width is the issue is silly. Playing an expansive game can cost you if you get too stretched from the CMs and you're not open. It's no different with a narrow approach. Allow yourself to be closed down, you've taken yourself out of the game.
Isn't it funny that for a team with a 'shit midfield' that he's been our performer of the season, with van Persie and Rafael.
By maintaining width you stretch the opposition and you have a less crowded midfield area. Of course width makes a difference.
It's a fair point. But he has shown that he plays almost in a two-step kind of way. Take a ball, look for a pass, pick a pass. Even when he tries to move the ball with feet (apart from that goal at QPR which was stunning) it's a two-step kind of action.
Move ball, look for pass, move ball again, look for pass. He very rarely makes the right decision when he's under pressure to receive a ball. He'll often make hospital short passes instead of taking the opponent on.
It works well when the play around him is physically moving him around his zone to play a one touch pass or a quick spear ball through the pressing defenders. I feel he should take more responsibility when being heavily pressured with no options and move the ball himself to create. It's one thing that has lacked through his United career. Sometimes he'll bypass easy chances to move the ball to play a low% pass. It's frustrating when we're under the cosh but when everybody is firing on all cylinder's his A-game is the perfect combination to our attacking phase.
It only stretches the opposition if you get the ball to your wingers in between their defensive lines. If you cant, then you just leave players isolated from each other. Plus, if you're outnumbered in midfield, it can become even more problematic as the midfielders have trouble getting the ball out quickly enough. Narrowness can make a difference also when a team plays through tight spaces and then finds a quick outlet pass into space.
Width isn't the only way to make it work. Nor is being narrow. My point being, it is contingent on finding your teammates and not getting too isolated from each other. What good is it if Nani/Valencia/Young is standing on the touchline waiting for a pass but he isn't in a position for Carrick or any other player in midfield or defence to find him? At the same time, it's no good if we're playing narrow but players aren't moving into good positions to receive the ball.
And fair point to you.
Carrick can be pressured to make mistakes. Barca targeted Carrick as the key in the 09 final so not new ground here. But as much as he needs to adapt our team needs to adapt as well. It is not as if many United players the other night looked comfortable on the ball. We as a team did not adjust to what the Saints threw at us.
What I mean is teams that swarm the ball and press heavily can be exposed by quick give and goes or changing the field. We had few players moving off the ball and we had little width. Yes Carrick did not play well, but again Carrick is not going to win a game on his own most likely. What Carrick does is keeps us ticking... but what if we stopped ticking?
Not alot he can do by himself.
Good points Rob. I also think our sense of urgency was a factor as well. There was one occasion where Kagawa spun twice to beat his marker on the right wing but since no one was breaking forward at that moment, the attack just died. If anything, we should have been more decisive and precise in our play.
We were always a pass or two short from breaking their pressure.
We were always a pass or two short from breaking their pressure.
Pulled out of the England squad with an injury apparently. If it's an actual injury, it couldn't have come at a worse time for us with the Madrid game coming up.
I wouldn't lose any sleep over it if I was you.
Hope it's just a case of friendly-itis
I'm half expecting RVP to have some kind of knock as well
Ah the classic Carrick injury before an England game.
More like a - big games coming up and needs a rest type injury.
He looked fine on Saturday
How comfortable for us.
Good one, Fergie. Couldn't have done it at a better time.
Really hope this is one of those "convenient" injuries. Rooney and RvP next please.
what a stupid stupid time for a friendly
makes you realise how reliant we are on Carrick these days
makes you realise how reliant we are on Carrick these days
Yeah I think it is just a convenient time... nothing serious.
It does all of a sudden make you realize how truly important he is. Imagine facing Real without him...
Yeah I have always rated him and the feeling I have pondering the alternatives of with or without him right now makes me think I am dead on.
It does all of a sudden make you realize how truly important he is. Imagine facing Real without him...
Yeah I have always rated him and the feeling I have pondering the alternatives of with or without him right now makes me think I am dead on.
This 'injury' was always going to happen. He'll be fit for the Everton game