AFTV/AM '17/'18: A New Hope

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oneniltothearsenal said:
Hi PNut,

I'll answer each of your points with my opinion as an Arsenal fan.



This is really only the case because of poor decisions by Arsenal. If we go back to 2004 especially, Arsenal should have been leagues ahead of Chelsea and City in developing a modern structure and increasing commercial revenue. That has been mostly failure but we are still positioned strong enough that that isn't really an excuse. If a weaker structure exists its the fault of the Board for not doing their job well enough. Heck we have a multi-billionaire minority shareholder that holds 30% of the club and is completely locked out from doing anything! Its disgraceful really the way greedy Kroenke runs our current Board. Also currently we have the resources to afford anything Chelsea can buy. Look at Chelsea's current squad, the players aren't as expensive as you or City and their biggest edition this summer was Kante, who could have been afforded by any of the top 6 teams.
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Would I be right in saying that you can afford to buy any player, but would not be able to wages paid by Utd, City or Chelsea as it would topple your wage structure?. I mean, your best players are on 150K a week while ours are on more than double that....

Do you think that's true and is a hindrance to signing big names?
 
bleedred said:
Would I be right in saying that you can afford to buy any player, but would not be able to wages paid by Utd, City or Chelsea as it would topple your wage structure?. I mean, your best players are on 150K a week while ours are on more than double that....

Do you think that's true and is a hindrance to signing big names?
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My answer is a bit complicated.

Wenger will not pay wages to compete with Utd, City or Chelsea. It's been known for two decades that Wenger believes in a socialist ( or socialist-ish by modern standards) wage structure. So as long as Wenger is manager then yes, its absolutely a hindrance and we can't compete in wages.

However, Arsenal as a club I don't see that limited based on current resources. Using Swiss Ramble blog as a reference plus comments from Gazidis plus taking into account the very obvious 100K+/week or so in pure inefficient wages every year (we paid Arteta last year to train as coach for City, we just extended Mertesacker who has contribued literally 0 this year and even last year looked not mentally inspired anymore, etc), I would say our current board could potentially easily afford 200-250K average wages for the top three players simply by eliminating the wage inefficiency of extending player's contracts who don't contribute but Wenger favors as people.

Then on an even more potential level, we have a 30% minority owner who has repeatedly said he would give a cash injection for an actual voice on the board. As is, Usmanov is locked out of any decision making or even donating money despite him owning 30% of the club.

So the way I see the limitations exist at 3 levels
1. Manager level - Wenger (150-175K limit max wage)
2. Board Level - Kroenke (200-250K max wage limit)
3. Usmanov Level - 300K potential for a top signing but obviously this is least likely of happening
 
Djemba-Djemba said:
It looks like he knows halfway through his rant he's talking bollocks but he's gone too far now to turn back.
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It's not even that, he's just a man out of time. Can't accept that the game has changed.

I do actually think he's right in that Arsenal will probably plummet for a couple of years if Wenger leaves, in the same way we did when Fergie left. But Arsenal frankly need a shake-up, and could find themselves challenging again within 5 years.

That said, I'd rather Wenger stays. I will never fear Arsenal in any way as long as he's there.
 
Ban said:


I simply don't get what is Neville saying. He has an incredible philosophy. What is that philosophy? To collapse every year and go out in last 16 of CL every year....
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I can understand Neville sticking up for managers getting the sack or being under severe pressure after less than a year in charge. Even if I disagree with him in certain cases. I can't agree with people sticking up for Wenger. Wenger has been Arsenal manager for a very long time and Arsenal haven't looked like winning the league for a very long time now. But if the Arsenal hierarchy is happy wiht top four each year, so be it. On a side note, there's a Dutchman in Portugal very happy with the word "philosophy" getting some air time.
 
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I find myself disagreeing with Neville more and more. Arsenal fans have every right to be angry with Wenger and voice their opinions and concerns. Although ArsenalFanTV is a bit of a joke
 
Neville has said on twitter that he would not advocate for any manager to be sacked. So all the discussion from him on Wenger is a bit irrelevant
 
Arsenal Fan TV is has become a bit of an embarrassment for Arsenal. I am not a fan of this fancam culture. Sticking a camera in a fan's face after defeat when emotions are high.

Rival fans binge watching it to laugh at them, not with them.

I think rival fans all get a kick out of seeing the very aggressive characters on ArsenalFan TV. It does paint a fan base badly when a few people come on there and preaching WengerOut every time they lose a match. While it's normally 'Oh Wenger got it right today'.

I think these people to be very fickle, in what universe is a manager called to be sacked on a game by game basis. It's laughable.

I don't honestly think this 'fans have a voice' argument washes. Yes of course you have a right to say what you want but does the board at Arsenal care. I don't think so.

Any Wenger replacement is not going to be Simeone. They will look to get someone that won't spend a lot and can secure top 4 finishes, I don't the next man in charge will do that as well as Wenger has over the years.

Not saying he should or shouldn't be sacked but I don't think it will suddenly get any better for them as a club should he go, They could be worse. Regardless of how much they call for his head, he won't leave until he is ready to leave, he won't be sacked by the club they will look to string him along as long as possible because they probably know there will be uncertainty on where the club is going to go without him.

I believe you always have a right as a match day fan to have an opinion but ArsenalFanTV always putting out the same characters to get views and to go viral. It's not a representation of an entire fan base.

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oneniltothearsenal said:
Re: resources
We don't even need to bring in a new owner, just give respect to the minority one we already have. Usmanov owns 30% of our club, is richer than Roman at Chelsea, and has said multiple times he would provide a straight cash injection if given a voice on the board to buy a few top class players to catch up. That's why I brought up the disgraceful way greedy Kroenke has treated him and why I said we already have the potential resources. Just a matter of disrupting our current stale, greedy structure behind the scenes.
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No way is Usmanov injecting resource without Kroenke doing the same and no way is Kroenke ever letting him sit on the board.
 
oneniltothearsenal said:
My answer is a bit complicated.

Wenger will not pay wages to compete with Utd, City or Chelsea. It's been known for two decades that Wenger believes in a socialist ( or socialist-ish by modern standards) wage structure. So as long as Wenger is manager then yes, its absolutely a hindrance and we can't compete in wages.

However, Arsenal as a club I don't see that limited based on current resources. Using Swiss Ramble blog as a reference plus comments from Gazidis plus taking into account the very obvious 100K+/week or so in pure inefficient wages every year (we paid Arteta last year to train as coach for City, we just extended Mertesacker who has contribued literally 0 this year and even last year looked not mentally inspired anymore, etc), I would say our current board could potentially easily afford 200-250K average wages for the top three players simply by eliminating the wage inefficiency of extending player's contracts who don't contribute but Wenger favors as people.

Then on an even more potential level, we have a 30% minority owner who has repeatedly said he would give a cash injection for an actual voice on the board. As is, Usmanov is locked out of any decision making or even donating money despite him owning 30% of the club.

So the way I see the limitations exist at 3 levels
1. Manager level - Wenger (150-175K limit max wage)
2. Board Level - Kroenke (200-250K max wage limit)
3. Usmanov Level - 300K potential for a top signing but obviously this is least likely of happening
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If you didn't make top 4, would that be the trigger to change the wage structure/pay increased transfer fees?
 
bleedred said:
Would I be right in saying that you can afford to buy any player, but would not be able to wages paid by Utd, City or Chelsea as it would topple your wage structure?. I mean, your best players are on 150K a week while ours are on more than double that....

Do you think that's true and is a hindrance to signing big names?
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Not really, our total wage bill is pretty close to Chelsea and City. TV money increased 40% last year, since we've paid those 140k wages. We should be able to offer special players 300k if we're renewing the likes of Mertesacker and paying Theo around 140k
 
Djemba-Djemba said:
He was still blindly backing Moyes well after it became obvious he was completely out of his depth at Utd too

He seems to think it's never ever the right decision to sack a manager no matter what. Playing under Fergie for 20 years appears to have clouded his judgement, Fergie was a complete one off freak to combine that longevity with sustained success.
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Don't you think that looking at our struggles after SAF have made Arsenal scared to sack Wenger in case it leads to time in the wilderness. They would rather keep the status quo than risk that.
 
DomesticTadpole said:
Don't you think that looking at our struggles after SAF have made Arsenal scared to sack Wenger in case it leads to time in the wilderness. They would rather keep the status quo than risk that.
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Extremely good point. Especially since Arsenal have no structure in place for a ready made replacement that they could have had in Viera/Arteta/Henry if they planned it right and would have to look at bringing in someone new who will inevitably bring his own coaching staff with him.
 
Robertd0803 said:
Extremely good point. Especially since Arsenal have no structure in place for a ready made replacement that they could have had in Viera/Arteta/Henry if they planned it right and would have to look at bringing in someone new who will inevitably bring his own coaching staff with him.
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It's ridiculous that it hasn't been thought about. All those great players and he let them leave without inviting, except for Steve Bould onto the coaching staff.
 
starman said:
tbf to Neville some of the people on there say Wenger should be sacked even if he wins the PL & CL
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They have said that, but it's because it's never gonna happen, they 100% would change their tune if it looked even remotely likely. Bayern will murder them if they play like they have been.
 
Yorkeontop said:
Arsenal will now go on a tear and comfortably secure top 4. All this hoo ha about Wenger will soon be forgotten. Classic gunners.
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Very likely, yes. After all they seem to do so every season. However, those that want to see Wenger gone (of which there are more of now than ever before) will remain steadfast in their view that it is time for a change.
 
DomesticTadpole said:
It's ridiculous that it hasn't been thought about. All those great players and he let them leave without inviting, except for Steve Bould onto the coaching staff.
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It does seem like a consolidation of power really that theres no internal threat to him. (makes sense from Wengers point of view to be fair).
 
I'm really starting to fear for Claude's mental health tbh. I think Arsene Wenger is driving him to an early demise.

Watching him after Watford and Chelsea, he couldn't even shout like he used to. The fight has left him, and he just looked worn out and defeated. I think the Gunners are a 4-0 spanking at The Emirates from Spurs from pushing him over the edge.
 
Rozay said:
I'm really starting to fear for Claude's mental health tbh. I think Arsene Wenger is driving him to an early demise.

Watching him after Watford and Chelsea, he couldn't even shout like he used to. The fight has left him, and he just looked worn out and defeated. I think the Gunners are a 4-0 spanking at The Emirates from Spurs from pushing him over the edge.
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I don't think the bits in bold are appropriate given the personal issues Claude went through last year
 
Mitchell Nicholas said:
I don't think the bits in bold are appropriate given the personal issues Claude went through last year
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It's not a 'hope' or anything, it's a genuine observation, but apologies for any offence.

I do think he looks genuinely affected, and I'd imagine a doctor would advise him to lay off the Arsenal.
 
Claude is a bit too invested in the club. Poor guy, he honestly needs a distraction from football.
 
VP89 said:
Claude is a bit too invested in the club. Poor guy, he honestly needs a distraction from football.
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I'm telling you. Seeing him lately he looks so different. Looks so down.
 
Rozay said:
I'm telling you. Seeing him lately he looks so different. Looks so down.
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I wouldn't take it as an indication of how things are going in his life, I think in regards to Arsenal he's said all he can say about Wenger and the club, nothing is changing and he just can't be arsed anymore. He's given up but can't bear to stop going because I imagine it's a key part of his life.
 
horsechoker said:
I wouldn't take it as an indication of how things are going in his life, I think in regards to Arsenal he's said all he can say about Wenger and the club, nothing is changing and he just can't be arsed anymore. He's given up but can't bear to stop going because I imagine it's a key part of his life.
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Perhaps, but obviously he also suffered from depression last year so I'm making a link there. Knowing the troubles he went through, it can't be the best advice for him to endure another Arsenal collapse this season again.
 
What's the point? Neville's so convinced he's right about everything that no-one else will get a word in.
 
Fan channels: Pantomime meets opportunist greed

...in which established media outlets - oblivious of the flaws, incompetence & self-indulgence which have ruined their football coverage for decades - start to worry that fans might look elsewhere for entertainment:
Football365 said:
While it may be pious to insist that all fan channels should exist exclusively with a straight face, it’s still dispiriting to watch the industry break its ideological moorings and drift into questionable waters.
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Laughable lack of self-awareness.

More:
http://www.football365.com/news/fan-channels-pantomime-meets-opportunist-greed
 
The United one was pretty good viewing during the Moyes time. I remember that infamous 'scooby-doo' rant in particular.
 


This guy rapping about the pain of supporting Arsenal :lol:
 
SteveJ said:
Fan channels: Pantomime meets opportunist greed

...in which established media outlets - oblivious of the flaws, incompetence & self-indulgence which have ruined their football coverage for decades - start to worry that fans might look elsewhere for entertainment:

Laughable lack of self-awareness.

More:
http://www.football365.com/news/fan-channels-pantomime-meets-opportunist-greed
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Their clearly annoyed they didn't come up with the idea first. Miserable feckers.
Rozay said:


This guy rapping about the pain of supporting Arsenal :lol:
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Might want to put it as NSFW. From the youtube comments - ''1:18 I'm dead, how's man showing porn via the glasses''
:lol::lol::lol::lol:
 
Do these "fans" like Ty, Troopz, DT etc have their own channels or some sort of a "fan base" outside of Arsenal Fan TV?
If I remember correctly, in one of the videos, Ty was asking someone (Claude?) to not "insult his fans".
 
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