[Nighteyes]

I think the reasoning behind LVG actions were that he didn't want Januzaj to just sit on the bench or play with U21 because he preferred Memphis, and Martial as LW. So instead of having Januzaj as a 3rd option, he let him go on a loan. Which was the right thing to do. Of course we could say that Januzaj should be second, and Memphis should've been loaned out, but that's in hindsight since we didn't know that Memphis was going to have a shitty season, and we just bought him.

Nah. Martial didn't even play LW until it became obvious Memphis was shite. As for Memphis I always maintained Januzaj was the better talent. Had Januzaj gotten half the chances Depay did he'd have done a lot more them. No doubt, going to Dortmund was the wrong move by Januzaj and he only has himself to blame but i'd strongly question the decision to loan him out in the first place.

Hopefully, all that's water under the bridge and Januzaj kicks on because he has serious talent. That said, I'm still baffled why this discussion has sprung up when he was one of our better player against Dortmund.

 

[prath92]

That would be strange reasoning from Van Gaal as in his two years at United he didn't once play Januzaj as a left winger for 90mins. I'm not sure either that Martial was brought in with left wing in mind maybe he was but he only seemed to be consistently played out there once Rashford emerged.

Martial played almost always on the left wing. Rooney was the striker.

 

[stevoc]

Martial played almost always on the left wing. Rooney was the striker.

I remember it differently he moved around a lot from RW to LW and upfront, before Xmas he played a fair few games on the left but not exclusively. After Rooney was injured for 6-8 weeks he was playing upfront for a stretch until Rashford made his debut.

http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/anthony-martial/leistungsdaten/spieler/182877/plus/0?saison=2015

According to transfermarkt he played more games up front last season than he did on the left. Considering how many games he played on the left towards the end of the season i think it's fair to say he didn't play almost always on the left wing in the first two thirds of the season.

 

[Mark Pawelek]

He is your typical LAD. Wears snapbacks, talks in slang and loves to hang with his "bros" and bang hoes.

When he was playing well, he was showing a maturity beyond his years in terms of decision making. He was an unknown quantity when he first came through. Teams started figuring him out more and more as time went on. You receive more respect from defenders and players double up on you.

I think the hype went to his head. He became more and more of an individual player. This is what let him down at BVB. They attack as a unit, but he was slowing down attacks by dallying on the ball and trying to dictate things to his own rhythm. They like sharp, crisp attacks.

It happens all the time in football. It could even happen to Rashford, but he has shown great mental strength so far.

And his attitude was called into question when Ferguson went on a rant aimed towards him during a FA Youth Cup match a few years back.

As for things happening in people's heads - I think your head has too much happening in it. I heard what let him down at BVB was him comparing Dortmund to United, and they didn't like that. [I remember a coach actually said that]. No one complained about him being too individualistic; nor do I see an individualistic player when I watch him.

I can't help but feel you have it in for him and your're just finding something to criticise. I'm probably wrong, but this is what happens when we let our imaginations fly: endless speculation.

 

[bpet15]

I've been banging on for 3 years about this boy - ever since I saw him play in my hometown youth tournament, the Dallas Cup. The talent is so plain to see, but he has some uniqueness about him that not all managers necessarily desire. He was given a ton of freedom with Moyes and while we can all agree that the Moyes era was a disaster, Adnan was very good during this time. That freedom enabled him to move about the pitch and get on the ball in dangerous areas. He would move deeper to pick the ball up if he wasn't getting involved, he moved wide to find space and he floated underneath the striker. The thing about Adnan is that he is never going to be a high percentage passer like a #6 or #8, which is what LVG wanted from all of his players.

For me, he was never a player that I wanted to see with chalk on his boots simply taking people on, although he isn't terrible at that, it is simply not his game. What impressed me the most about him is his ability to pick out a pass that could cut defenses in half - you don't get to play that ball when you are stuck on the touch line. He is cut from the same cloth as a Hazard, Willian, Silva or Ozil - I am not saying that he is at their level, I am simply saying that the way he plays is similar to them.

As for the attitude that everyone seems to talk about. From what I read, it sounded more like he was constantly comparing Dortmund to United and that didn't go over to well with the Dortmund staff. I take that as he loves United, not that he had a bad attitude and didn't put in the work for Dortmund.

I don't know how Adnan's career will end up - the talent is obviously there, when used the right way. The one thing that isn't up for debate is the fact that he hasn't had any sort of a run of games. Last year was a complete waste with only a couple of cameos here and there.

 

[Clas Sified]

Why is everybody so obsessed with selling players? We sold so many players going into last season that we literally had room for six more senior players to be registered. While having four overage keepers on the books that were registered. Relax, let him fight for his spot.

@stevoc I believe Tuchel said "his heart was always in Manchester" and I would warrant that the attitude stuff stems from the fact that he went on loan in the first place which was a bizarre set of circumstances in itself. I'd personally add that I think he believes he is better than he has shown. But sometimes when a player grows into his ego it can make him that much better.

He's got a very good opportunity under Jose to get his head down, get wide and get towards goal and make use of himself. I am looking forward to seeing how he goes.

Oh believe me, I have no wish to sell him. While I do love the occasional big transfer, I tend to think I'm a bit traditional in the sense that I like to see the youth players do well, and would rather we achieve success with our youth.

My previous post was merely pointing out that if we do sell him for whatever reason, we're smart enough to learn from Pogba and put in clauses that could benefit us in the futute.

 

[Siddharth]

You can cut a good highlight video of almost any player, even Ashley Young and last year's Wayne Rooney. At this level consistency is what matters and you will only get it when you play regularly. For his own sake, he should get the feck out of Manchester United and not go to a club like Borussia Dortmund where he would have similar problems as he is encountering here.

 

[Varun]

He is your typical LAD. Wears snapbacks, talks in slang and loves to hang with his "bros" and bang hoes.

When he was playing well, he was showing a maturity beyond his years in terms of decision making. He was an unknown quantity when he first came through. Teams started figuring him out more and more as time went on. You receive more respect from defenders and players double up on you.

I think the hype went to his head. He became more and more of an individual player. This is what let him down at BVB. They attack as a unit, but he was slowing down attacks by dallying on the ball and trying to dictate things to his own rhythm. They like sharp, crisp attacks.

It happens all the time in football. It could even happen to Rashford, but he has shown great mental strength so far.

And his attitude was called into question when Ferguson went on a rant aimed towards him during a FA Youth Cup match a few years back.

Your 1st paragraph is pointless and nothing to do with football unless you're looking for 18yr old role models instead of footballers.

Regarding the rest of your post, he was always a mite individualistic player and absolutely didn't have decision making beyond his years. He was, as you said, an unknown quantity and a breath of fresh air in a shit team. Even then, he was prone to taking shots when a pass was better etc. That's how young players are. It's just that his bad performances now have led to revisionism of his past. What let him down at Dortmund was more of a weakness in getting used to the style and tactical system than play rather than him hogging the ball, etc. No wonder either as what he's used to and what they have there is poles apart.

The hype does seem to have gone to his head though as you said, going to Dortmund against the advice of LVG shows that. Agree with you there.

I do think he has everything to succeed though. Hopefully, the year gone by has taught him a valuable lesson and he's willing to slog it out here.

 

[Varun]

That only tells me he desperately wanted to play for United. Of course loaning him out after he started a couple of games on the bounce and did fairly well was ridiculous in the first place and sums up LVG.

The entire blame isn't LVGs. He was advised not to go to Dortmund but he went there anyways. It was incredibly stupid as they had 3 players in his positions comfortably superior to him, 1 other who's also superior and a youth prospect they'd obviously prefer to develop than him. He basically went there hoping he'd outperform one of reus/kagawa/Mkhitaryan to such an extent that a club like Dortmund would play a loanee ahead of them, it didn't happen, to no one's surprise.

 

[dichinero]

I don't think the whole going to Dortmund against LvG's wishes should be used as a stick to beat Januzaj. Before LvG came, he was the most promising kid on the block and it is only natural to try to back up his hype. He played against Aston Villa, score the winning goal and deemed surplus to requirement by LvG. This is same LvG that offloaded some players so that some of his pets can get more opportunities. I can understand him picking a competitive team as opposed to a lesser team with all due respect. If he felt "Hey, I thought I did ok in struggling United team, I can back myself in another team in a lesser competitive league, a team that will not be dealing with the lack of atmosphere and confidence like my current United team, why not". Obviously it was a wrong call but I admire that. If he went to some league 2 team, I doubt the experience may be worthwhile for a maverick like Januzaj.

Same thing with Pereira, the boy decided to risk his United career by forwarding his football experience by going on loan but was hindered by LvG. That is admirable that the boy was the one pushing for experience outside the glamour of United.

It is reasonable to see how these boys may not have been pleased with LvG's way of doing things. So the talk of their poor attitudes is just lazy journalism with no sense behind it. These boys are still kids and have massive potential and they need the fans backing.

 

[Nighteyes]

The entire blame isn't LVGs. He was advised not to go to Dortmund but he went there anyways. It was incredibly stupid as they had 3 players in his positions comfortably superior to him, 1 other who's also superior and a youth prospect they'd obviously prefer to develop than him. He basically went there hoping he'd outperform one of reus/kagawa/Mkhitaryan to such an extent that a club like Dortmund would play a loanee ahead of them, it didn't happen, to no one's surprise.

Goes without saying but the decision to loan him out in the first place was farcical in itself. A fecking travesty that Memphis played so many minutes and while Januzaj barely got a game

 

[Varun]

Goes without saying but the decision to loan him out in the first place was farcical in itself. A fecking travesty that Memphis played so many minutes and while Januzaj barely got a game

Yep, all true. No one quite expected Memphis to be this bad but yeah, loaning him out was a bad decision anyways.

 

[Perrick Dubois]

Oh believe me, I have no wish to sell him. While I do love the occasional big transfer, I tend to think I'm a bit traditional in the sense that I like to see the youth players do well, and would rather we achieve success with our youth.

Yeah, sorry I generalized a bit on your post there. But there is so many player threads with "Sell with a buy back clause", the "get rid" culture is getting ridiculous.

 

[Kag]

Poor handling of this gem is Van Gaal's biggest error in two years here. The most frustrating on a personal level, at least.

If Mourinho gives him a shot in an orderly side then he'll return the favour and then some.

It always fascinates me when people talk about young players and somehow expect them to improve in spite of little game time.

It happened with Smalling. Only when we placed some trust in his talent at centre half and actually played him regularly did he expand on the initial promise. He didn't play because he suddenly got better, he got better because we binned the oldies, avoided superstar defenders and gave him a shot.

If he were to leave we'd live to regret it.

 

[WhoDaGOAT]

As for things happening in people's heads - I think your head has too much happening in it. I heard what let him down at BVB was him comparing Dortmund to United, and they didn't like that. [I remember a coach actually said that]. No one complained about him being too individualistic; nor do I see an individualistic player when I watch him.

I can't help but feel you have it in for him and your're just finding something to criticise. I'm probably wrong, but this is what happens when we let our imaginations fly: endless speculation.

Januzaj is one of my favourite players. I've seen every televised game he's played for United at every level since signing.

I'm just realistic. It's been well over two calendar years since he's shown any kind of form. That's a fact.

 

[Glanville95]

Just see him leaving a matter of when, not if. If the rumours about his attitude are correct then that puts him at an immediate disadvantage as Jose won't accept that. Not too mention he hasn't shown any discernible, high-level of form for nigh on two years now.

I'm clearly in the minority as I'm not a huge fan anyway, but I hold far more hope for Pereira than this guy.

 

[flappyjay]

How would he have shown any form during the past 2 seasons. LVG first season 3-5-2 reigned supreme then the 4-4-2 diamond another formation that did not use wingers. We used the 4-3-3 in the last 9-8 games of the season. The second season he uses Januzaj as a striker during pre-season then plays him as a number 10 for three games and loans him out. Has LVG honestly gave him a chance to succeed as a winger, he never did. I am talking about 3-5 games in a row from the left or right. Adnan and Pareira were badly mismanaged by LVG, you could never say Memphis is clearly better than Januzaj/Andreas but he kept getting chance after chance. Heck even Memphis was mismanaged.

 

[Jaybomb]

I'm almost positive selling Januzaj will come back to haunt us in the future.

 

[stevoc]

How would he have shown any form during the past 2 seasons. LVG first season 3-5-2 reigned supreme then the 4-4-2 diamond another formation that did not use wingers. We used the 4-3-3 in the last 9-8 games of the season. The second season he uses Januzaj as a striker during pre-season then plays him as a number 10 for three games and loans him out. Has LVG honestly gave him a chance to succeed as a winger, he never did. I am talking about 3-5 games in a row from the left or right. Adnan and Pareira were badly mismanaged by LVG, you could never say Memphis is clearly better than Januzaj/Andreas but he kept getting chance after chance. Heck even Memphis was mismanaged.

Yep Van Gaal never gave him a proper chance. Don't think he actually played one game at LW under Van Gaal. Which says it all really.

 

[MD7]

Yep Van Gaal never gave him a proper chance. Don't think he actually played one game at LW under Van Gaal. Which says it all really.

But LVG did see him in training, right? Januzaj got game time in U21, so it's not as if he was out of form, I would guess he might have been less motivated once he returned from Dortmund, but if you don't show it in training, there's no reason to put you on in a game... LVG was a trainer that expects 100% of his people all the time, and I don't think Januzaj was giving his 100%, and that shows lack of motivation, and interest.

 

[Nighteyes]

Yep Van Gaal never gave him a proper chance. Don't think he actually played one game at LW under Van Gaal. Which says it all really.

He did play against Chelsea there in LVG's first season and was probably our best attacking player in that game. That said, I think he play across the front 3 so that's not really an issue. As long as he's not restricted to being a classic winger he's alright on any side.

 

[stevoc]

But LVG did see him in training, right? Januzaj got game time in U21, so it's not as if he was out of form, I would guess he might have been less motivated once he returned from Dortmund, but if you don't show it in training, there's no reason to put you on in a game... LVG was a trainer that expects 100% of his people all the time, and I don't think Januzaj was giving his 100%, and that shows lack of motivation, and interest.

But based on what mate?

We have no idea what he was like in training, for all we know he could have been great in training and LVG just didn't like him.

 

[dichinero]

But based on what mate?

We have no idea what he was like in training, for all we know he could have been great in training and LVG just didn't like him.

Exactly, it's more likely that LvG didn't want instinctive players, a category that features the likes of AdM, Nani, Januzaj, Pereira etc.

 

[NinjaZombie]

Yep Van Gaal never gave him a proper chance. Don't think he actually played one game at LW under Van Gaal. Which says it all really.

Man, did Van Gaal put his hopes into the wrong players last season.

Rooney never got anywhere near 20 goals. Memphis was crap throughout the season.

We sold and loaned players out, thinking those two would do the job. Didn't happen.

 

[stevoc]

He did play against Chelsea there in LVG's first season and was probably our best attacking player in that game. That said, I think he play across the front 3 so that's not really an issue. As long as he's not restricted to being a classic winger he's alright on any side.

You're right mate i forgot about that game. I think he could eventually be effective anywhere as you say, but while he's still developing and until he gains confidence in himself and his ability i think it's best for him to play wide, possibly left wing as thats where he has had his best games for us.

He doesn't need to hug the touchline, he was very good in his season under Moyes at drifting in and playing through balls.

 

[stevoc]

Exactly, it's more likely that LvG didn't want instinctive players, a category that features the likes of AdM, Nani, Januzaj, Pereira etc.

I think thats highly likely to be the case look at Herrera also in his first season at the start was trying all sorts of passes and looked pretty creative. Then Van Gaal dumped him on the bench for a while by the time he got a look in again he seemed to play much more conservatively to me.

 

[prath92]

But based on what mate?

We have no idea what he was like in training, for all we know he could have been great in training and LVG just didn't like him.

I frankly don't think LvG had a vengeance and didn't play him out of spite or something. I don't think he warranted a place in the team and he was also injured quite a lot towards the end from March beginning.

 

[MD7]

But based on what mate?

We have no idea what he was like in training, for all we know he could have been great in training and LVG just didn't like him.

At Dortmund it was the head coach who said this, and in United there weren't any examples from at training, but I also found it ridiculous from him and Pereira to try to shoot the ball in the goal from a cornerkick during actual U21 games, instead of giving a decent crossing. LVG isn't pleased when players do stuff like that. (source)

I do like Januzaj btw, I hope he gets a loan to a great team where he can show how good he is again. I just get why he didn't get so many chances from LVG.

 

[stevoc]

I frankly don't think LvG had a vengeance and didn't play him out of spite or something. I don't think he warranted a place in the team and he was also injured quite a lot towards the end from March beginning.

Good because no one is suggesting he did. He loaned him out and after he returned he played him for about 5 minutes at LB vs Southampton in January. That was the last we seen of him until May.

I think it's safe to say Van Gaal just didn't rate him or like his style of play. Because he barely gave him a chance.

 

[stevoc]

At Dortmund it was the head coach who said this, and in United there weren't any examples from at training, but I also found it ridiculous from him and Pereira to try to shoot the ball in the goal from a cornerkick during actual U21 games, instead of giving a decent crossing. LVG isn't pleased when players do stuff like that. (source)

I do like Januzaj btw, I hope he gets a loan to a great team where he can show how good he is again. I just get why he didn't get so many chances from LVG.

First off mate what the coach at another club has to say about Januzaj tells us nothing about his attitude or behaviour at United, harsh to take one comment and use it to judge a players mentality. Many coaches over the years have found players difficult and thought they had bad attitudes doesn't mean they were always right. Wilkinson thought Cantona was a bad apple Ferguson found him easy to work with.

Januzaj and Pereira trying to score from a corner is thinking outside the box, yes it's unlikely to come off but i would rather see someone trying to be creative than playing percentages. And yeah i'm sure Van Gaal didn't like them trying to score with anything out of the ordinary. Short pass to keep possession is more his cup of tea.

People keep repeating that he has a bad attitude but there hasn't been any actual evidence from his time at United that it is true.

 

[prath92]

Good because no one is suggesting he did. He loaned him out and after he returned he played him for about 5 minutes at LB vs Southampton in January. That was the last we seen of him until May.

I think it's safe to say Van Gaal just didn't rate him or like his style of play. Because he barely gave him a chance.

He was injured after the Arsenal game where he played 15 minutes.

He required a loan. He didn't play particularly great the previous season and we bought Memphis who was one of the highest rated youngsters in Europe. Ideally he should have gone to a PL or a championship team like we wanted to but he wanted to goto Dortmund and maybe we thought he will work hard and get into the team behind reus ahead of Castro. But not only that he didn't get games, he was average at best even when he played.

Even after he came back, he was rightly behind lingard as lingard worked hard and got into the team.

 

[stevoc]

He was injured after the Arsenal game where he played 15 minutes.

He required a loan. He didn't play particularly great the previous season and we bought Memphis who was one of the highest rated youngsters in Europe. Ideally he should have gone to a PL or a championship team like we wanted to but he wanted to goto Dortmund and maybe we thought he will work hard and get into the team behind reus ahead of Castro. But not only that he didn't get games, he was average at best even when he played.

Even after he came back, he was rightly behind lingard as lingard worked hard and got into the team.

As i said he was brought on for 5 minutes vs Southampton on the 23rd of January, he got injured on the 9th of February between those two events we played 3 games he wasn't even on the bench. So injured on the 9th fit again on the 27th of February he as you say got a few minutes vs Arsenal on the 28th of Feb then disappeared again. We played 8 games after this and he didn't get a minute in any of them. He got injured again on the 7th of April and was out for a month. Fit again on the 5th of May but only one sub appearance for a few minutes vs West Ham after that.

http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/adnan-januzaj/verletzungen/spieler/177847

So after he got back from Dortmund last year he was fit and ready to play for 20 of our 30 games and yet he made only 3 cameo appearances off the bench 5-15 minutes each. In fact he was only included in the squad a grand total of 7 times. So i'll stand by my opinion that Van Gall never gave him a chance last year.

Players don't need loans to develop does Rashford need a loan no. The same way Giggs, Rooney and Ronaldo etc. didn't need loaned out after the age of 18 to develop. What he does need is to play. And for all the praise Van Gaal has received for giving youngsters a chance he should be rightly criticized for completely mishandling arguably the most promising Academy player at the club. A player the club has put a lot of time, money and effort into developing. He should have never been loaned in the first place, we had no right winger all last season he could have been played there in many games instead of Mata who isn't even a winger.

 

[prath92]

As i said he was brought on for 5 minutes vs Southampton on the 23rd of January, he got injured on the 9th of February between those two events we played 3 games he wasn't even on the bench. So injured on the 9th fit again on the 27th of February he as you say got a few minutes vs Arsenal on the 28th of Feb then disappeared again. We played 8 games after this and he didn't get a minute in any of them. He got injured again on the 7th of April and was out for a month. Fit again on the 5th of May but only one sub appearance for a few minutes vs West Ham after that.

http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/adnan-januzaj/verletzungen/spieler/177847

So after he got back from Dortmund last year he was fit and ready to play for 20 of our 30 games and yet he made only 3 cameo appearances off the bench 5-15 minutes each. In fact he was only included in the squad a grand total of 7 times. So i'll stand by my opinion that Van Gall never gave him a chance last year.

Players don't need loans to develop does Rashford need a loan no. The same way Giggs, Rooney and Ronaldo etc. didn't need loaned out after the age of 18 to develop. What he does need is to play. And for all the praise Van Gaal has received for giving youngsters a chance he should be rightly criticized for completely mishandling arguably the most promising Academy player at the club. A player the club has put a lot of time, money and effort into developing. He should have never been loaned in the first place, we had no right winger all last season he could have been played there in many games instead of Mata who isn't even a winger.

Giggs Ronaldo and Rooney didn't need loans because they already showed much more than januzaj did in their first seasons plus Rooney and Ronaldo both played one season at least at a smaller team essentially acting like a loan for their development.

Going on loan was important because he needed games and it frankly didn't look as if he would get it. It was a decision they had to take and had he been kept there was a risk that he would have being on the bench (assuming that everyone played well like the plan would have been). So we took a decision to send him on loan. And quite frankly mata deserved to start more than he did at the start of the season. Mata was in a similar situation last season when he was benched for 2 full seasons but he worked hard and took his chances. Young and Fellaini similarly were nowhere near the team early on but they worked hard and took their chances and got their rewards. Last season too lingard started simply because more than anything he was willing to work hard and play for the team even though lingard is not the most talented player in the academy.

Van gaal has lots of stupidity in his Arsenal but one thing no one has complained of him in 20 years is him giving them chances if they work hard. Most who don't like him are older players who were upset with him not letting them walk into the starting XI (rivaldo ribery Di Maria and all). No youth has anything other than encouraging words about him right from guys at Ajax to Thomas Muller at Bayern. So no I don't think that he intentionally mishandled a hard working player unfairly and the probability is higher that januzaj simply didn't show enough to warrant a place in the 11 or even in the 18.

 

[Mike09]

As i said he was brought on for 5 minutes vs Southampton on the 23rd of January, he got injured on the 9th of February between those two events we played 3 games he wasn't even on the bench. So injured on the 9th fit again on the 27th of February he as you say got a few minutes vs Arsenal on the 28th of Feb then disappeared again. We played 8 games after this and he didn't get a minute in any of them. He got injured again on the 7th of April and was out for a month. Fit again on the 5th of May but only one sub appearance for a few minutes vs West Ham after that.

http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/adnan-januzaj/verletzungen/spieler/177847

So after he got back from Dortmund last year he was fit and ready to play for 20 of our 30 games and yet he made only 3 cameo appearances off the bench 5-15 minutes each. In fact he was only included in the squad a grand total of 7 times. So i'll stand by my opinion that Van Gall never gave him a chance last year.

Players don't need loans to develop does Rashford need a loan no. The same way Giggs, Rooney and Ronaldo etc. didn't need loaned out after the age of 18 to develop. What he does need is to play. And for all the praise Van Gaal has received for giving youngsters a chance he should be rightly criticized for completely mishandling arguably the most promising Academy player at the club. A player the club has put a lot of time, money and effort into developing. He should have never been loaned in the first place, we had no right winger all last season he could have been played there in many games instead of Mata who isn't even a winger.

I do want to see young players to get their chance and play but the reality is we are Manchester United, a massive club with a massive expectation. If we are Everton or Southampton, taking a risk by playing full of young and raw players are fine but club with high expectation like us can't just take a risk or playing young players who can't lead the club to that high expectation. Young players who are good enough and useful should stay, but the one who has yet to prove themself enough and ineffective for the manager's system should go on loan to get more games time and show what they can do. Especially that we have so many attacking mid or wingers option, some of them won't get enough games.

Loan move with Sunderland will be a good choice, if there is one manager right now who knows about Adnan the most that will be Moyes. But if Mourinho wants to keep him so be it.

 

[stevoc]

Van gaal has lots of stupidity in his Arsenal but one thing no one has complained of him in 20 years is him giving them chances if they work hard. Most who don't like him are older players who were upset with him not letting them walk into the starting XI (rivaldo ribery Di Maria and all). No youth has anything other than encouraging words about him right from guys at Ajax to Thomas Muller at Bayern. So no I don't think that he intentionally mishandled a hard working player unfairly and the probability is higher that januzaj simply didn't show enough to warrant a place in the 11 or even in the 18.

But he barely gave the guy a chance so i don't know how he was supposed to show he warranted a place in the side. Thats backwards.

Lets be honest here, Januzaj along with Di Maria, Nani, Pereria and to an extent Herrera all share a common trait. They take risks, they will try the difficult ball even if it means losing possession. And they will try it again and again to try to create something.

The other thing they have in common is they all at one time or another have been on Van Gaals shit list and frozen out of the side. For me this is not a coincidence, and in my opinion that is why he was not a favourite for Van Gaal but a neat and tidy if not spectacular player like Lingard who will play the safer pass more often than not was an almost ever present for LVG. Thats not a criticism of Lingard by the way.

Giggs, Ronaldo and Rooney didn't need loans because they were played regularly, if any of the three had been handled the way Januzaj has been handled by Van Gaal the last two years. Barely played, rarely given a run of games and constantly moved around the pitch in different positions, then most likely their developments would have stalled also. And yes i am aware that Januzaj is not the same caliber of player and probably never will be.

 

[MD7]

First off mate what the coach at another club has to say about Januzaj tells us nothing about his attitude or behaviour at United, harsh to take one comment and use it to judge a players mentality. Many coaches over the years have found players difficult and thought they had bad attitudes doesn't mean they were always right. Wilkinson thought Cantona was a bad apple Ferguson found him easy to work with.

Januzaj and Pereira trying to score from a corner is thinking outside the box, yes it's unlikely to come off but i would rather see someone trying to be creative than playing percentages. And yeah i'm sure Van Gaal didn't like them trying to score with anything out of the ordinary. Short pass to keep possession is more his cup of tea.

People keep repeating that he has a bad attitude but there hasn't been any actual evidence from his time at United that it is true.

Thinking outside the box? It's not innovative, and they tried to do it several times... Over, and over again... LVG just doesn't like show offs that think they are more important than the team, which is why both players barely got any playing minutes, and Mourinho is exactly the same. So if both players don't grow up, we will barely see them in action this season.

 

[prath92]

But he barely gave the guy a chance so i don't know how he was supposed to show he warranted a place in the side. Thats backwards.

Lets be honest here, Januzaj along with Di Maria, Nani, Pereria and to an extent Herrera all share a common trait. They take risks, they will try the difficult ball even if it means losing possession. And they will try it again and again to try to create something.

The other thing they have in common is they all at one time or another have been on Van Gaals shit list and frozen out of the side. For me this is not a coincidence, and in my opinion that is why he was not a favourite for Van Gaal but a neat and tidy if not spectacular player like Lingard who will play the safer pass more often than not was an almost ever present for LVG. Thats not a criticism of Lingard by the way.

Giggs, Ronaldo and Rooney didn't need loans because they were played regularly, if any of the three had been handled the way Januzaj has been handled by Van Gaal the last two years. Barely played, rarely given a run of games and constantly moved around the pitch in different positions, then most likely their developments would have stalled also. And yes i am aware that Januzaj is not the same caliber of player and probably never will be.

You work hard in training and warrant a place. Or in januzaj s case play well in u21 games. Showboating at any level would result in nothing else. SAF would have sold him then and there just to prove a point.

Van gaal didn't have a problem with taking risks. His problem was not doing anything with it. Players like martial Shaw Young rashford and all took risks and thrived too. It doesn't get instinctive than martial yet martial had no issues with it. My understanding is simple. Van gaal wanted players to attack intelligently. No point in taking the ball and running down the line only to end up having nothing to do other than passing it back.

Herrera in any case is barely frozen out. He played a lot of minutes last season and didn't deserve to start or play anymore than that.

Rooney and Ronaldo came after seasons at other clubs. That's effectively like a loan for academy players. Giggs I don't know as I wasn't alive then but it was a different time.

 

[stevoc]

Thinking outside the box? It's not innovative, and they tried to do it several times... Over, and over again... LVG just doesn't like show offs that think they are more important than the team, which is why both players barely got any playing minutes, and Mourinho is exactly the same. So if both players don't grow up, we will barely see them in action this season.

LVG just doesn't like players who take risks full stop. Trying to score from a corner in an U21 game fair enough is a bit silly if they tried it more than once, but the point stands both players were not fancied by Van Gaal.

Both you and i have no idea of the actual reason why this was the case, we both have out opinions but thats all they are.

 

[stevoc]

You work hard in training and warrant a place. Or in januzaj s case play well in u21 games. Showboating at any level would result in nothing else. SAF would have sold him then and there just to prove a point.

Honestly mate you have no idea whether or not Januzaj worked hard in training neither do i, so lets not pretend that we do shall we.

Ferguson sell a player for showboating, which manager are we talking about here?

Heres two quotes from the great man himself:

''Playing football, even at the very highest level, should always be a joy,''

''A team that does not enjoy playing is not going to succeed.''

He would also often tell his players on the way out of the dressing room to go and enjoy themselves, Ferguson wasn't a totalitarian like Van Gaal. He loved flair players. I can remember Giggs tried to score from a corner in a Premier League game years ago in the 90's, and then he tried that cheeky corner against Chelsea a few years back where he tapped it and walked away and pretended he hadn't took it. Ferguson didn't sell him then and there on either occasion.

Herrera in any case is barely frozen out. He played a lot of minutes last season and didn't deserve to start or play anymore than that.

Herrera was unfavoured by Van Gaal for a stretch in his first season which is what i was referring to. When he returned to the side he was noticeably more conservative in his play. In his last season in La Liga i remember reading Herrera created over 50 chances one of the highest amounts by any one player that year. Where did that creativity go i wonder.

Rooney and Ronaldo came after seasons at other clubs. That's effectively like a loan for academy players. Giggs I don't know as I wasn't alive then but it was a different time.

Listen mate nothing magical happens during a loan that helps players develop. Its all about playing time simple as that, whether they get playing time at United or elsewhere is largely irrelevant. By the time Januzaj had turned 19 he had played in 35 matches for United and was looking like a top player in the making. Then Van Gaal took over and he hasn't even played 35 games since in two years.

I do remember Giggs first season and it wasn't too dissimilar to Januzaj's first season. Now imagine after Giggs first season a new manager had came in and changed the formation several times to ones that didn't utilize wingers, constantly play Giggs in numerous different positions, barely give him a run of 3-4 games in a row. And then in his second season ship him out on loan and then barely play him when he returns.

Do you imagine that would have been good for Giggs development?

 

[prath92]

Honestly mate you have no idea whether or not Januzaj worked hard in training neither do i, so lets not pretend that we do shall we.

Ferguson sell a player for showboating, which manager are we talking about here?

Heres two quotes from the great man himself:




He would also often tell his players on the way out of the dressing room to go and enjoy themselves, Ferguson wasn't a totalitarian like Van Gaal. He loved flair players. I can remember Giggs tried to score from a corner in a Premier League game years ago in the 90's, and then he tried that cheeky corner against Chelsea a few years back where he tapped it and walked away and pretended he hadn't took it. Ferguson didn't sell him then and there on either occasion.



Herrera was unfavoured by Van Gaal for a stretch in his first season which is what i was referring to. When he returned to the side he was noticeably more conservative in his play. In his last season in La Liga i remember reading Herrera created over 50 chances one of the highest amounts by any one player that year. Where did that creativity go i wonder.



Listen mate nothing magical happens during a loan that helps players develop. Its all about playing time simple as that, whether they get playing time at United or elsewhere is largely irrelevant. By the time Januzaj had turned 19 he had played in 35 matches for United and was looking like a top player in the making. Then Van Gaal took over and he hasn't even played 35 games since in two years.

I do remember Giggs first season and it wasn't too dissimilar to Januzaj's first season. Now imagine after Giggs first season a new manager had came in and changed the formation several times to ones that didn't utilize wingers, constantly play Giggs in numerous different positions, barely give him a run of 3-4 games in a row. And then in his second season ship him out on loan and then barely play him when he returns.

Do you imagine that would have been good for Giggs development?

That's exactly the point. I think what happened is mainly januzaj s fault. When van gaal who always gives chance to youth players doesn't give him a chance, then you have to really wonder if januzaj actually impressed in training because as I said no youth player has ever complained he hasn't given him a chance after working so hard. If this was mourinho it would be a little more believable as de bruyne lukaku and all have all complained about not getting chances after impressing in training or on loan.

Loan isn't about time alone. It helps players gain experience in various situations. Like how to play when chasing a game and so forth. At United level the pressure is high as even a single sitter missed could prove disastrous. Which is why players goto teams where the stakes aren't as high like it is at United. Rooney played at Everton and Ronaldo at sporting so they were more ready. Giggs played in a different era where there wasn't the same pressure to perform.

Herrera wasn't playing because we wanted to fit a maximum of RvP Rooney Di Maria and falcao in the same team. Like Isco didn't get many chances under ancelotti initially because of having to fit Di Maria in the squad