Active players who will go down as all-time greats in their position?

Fortitude

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Messi, C.Ronaldo, Modric and Kroos are givens.

Kroos is already retired, so he doesn't count anyway, but these players denote the kind of standard being talked about.

Casemiro should be added, but I'm sure some believe he's tarnishing his own legacy at the moment, or won't be able to separate what he's done from what he's currently doing... ?

Curious to know who you believe to be the players outside of this bunch best fitting of the title. Who have you got as sure things in their position?
 
Looking at players earlier in their careers you'd have to imagine Mbappe will get there. Haaland could also go down as an all time great striker.

A bit more uncertainty but I think Yamal may get there. What he has done at 16 is pretty unique.
 
Kante and Neymar probably.

I was trying to think of fullbacks since they generally have to do a lot more these days, but a current standout escapes me.
 
Salah, Neuer, Rodri are the three that immediately stand out. Mbappe, if he carries his PSG goal tally into La Liga
 
Mbappe just needs a champions league and he's there. People remember greats by moments and achievements and he's already started in two world cup finals.
 
Neuer.

I think some lads like Rodri and VVD don't make the cut quite yet due to longevity. Rodri will likely make it in by the end of his career though.
 
Regulus Arcturus Black said:
All time great? Kin ell, that’s a low bar.
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Was more of a question - he'll probably go down as a PL great with the scouse banging on about him being the best to play in the league.

His peak was too short though, you're right.
 
Regulus Arcturus Black said:
All time great? Kin ell, that’s a low bar.
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It all depends on the criteria that you personally use. I don't think he's that horrible of a shout, although obviously he needs some asterisks.

From those not mentioned yet, de Bruyne should be a very obvious one once he retires.
 
Depends how you define all-time great but if it’s something like top 15 in their position then I’d go for:

Mbappe
Benzema
Suarez
Haaland
Lewandowski
Neymar
Salah
De Bruyne
Kante
Rodri
Van Dijk
Thiago Silva
Marcelo
Neuer
Oblak

Obviously that can be whittled down with a tighter definition.
 
No point repeating players already mentioned so I’ll toss another to the mix, although I’m unsure myself.

Sergio Ramos?
 
didz said:
Kante and Neymar probably.

I was trying to think of fullbacks since they generally have to do a lot more these days, but a current standout escapes me.
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Maybe Theo Hernandez? But all time great is a big statement, probably the French isn't going to cut that.
 
Has no one mentioned Sergio Busquets!?

Still no right backs either. Could Carvajal pass into some kind of weird folklore pick in a decade or so, having won practically everything the last few years?

-----------------Neuer
Carvajal-Silva-Pepe-Marcelo
-----------Modric-Busquets
Messi-------Iniesta-----Neymar
----------------Ronaldo

Not a bad legends side for a charity match. Inter Miami could try and make it happen in the MLS, Ronaldo aside.
 
NZT-One said:
Maybe Theo Hernandez? But all time great is a big statement, probably the French isn't going to cut that.
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I'd say he's definitely number one at present, but Marcelo and probably Jordi Alba were better players having given it some thought, and both of them are still going.
 
Neuer, Rodri, Modric, Kroos, Kante, Carvajal, Messi, Ronaldo, Muller, Mbappe, Haaland, KDB, Salah, Walker
 
Does being world class make you an all time great? Even Modric I'm unsure is an all time great. Ronaldo and Messi I don't think there's any doubt, Kroos not for me at all. Does he stand out as significantly better than say Xabi Alonso? All time greats you're talking about Redondo, Edwards, Makelele, Rijkaard...

Vinicius is the best shout outside of the big 2 I think, he would stand out in any era.
 
Active players who are already all time greats in their positions:

Messi
Ronaldo
Lewandowski
Neuer
Modric
Suarez
Ramos
Van Dijk
Neymar
De Bruyne
Salah
Kante
Busquets
Thiago Silva


Active players who will be all time greats in their positions:

Mbappe(almost there; just needs a few club trophies for Real Madrid)
Rodri
Haaland
Vinicius
 
Van Dijk....

Jeez. He Wouldn't even be in the top 10 defenders in the history of the English league.
 
TwoSheds said:
Does being world class make you an all time great? Even Modric I'm unsure is an all time great. Ronaldo and Messi I don't think there's any doubt, Kroos not for me at all. Does he stand out as significantly better than say Xabi Alonso? All time greats you're talking about Redondo, Edwards, Makelele, Rijkaard...

Vinicius is the best shout outside of the big 2 I think, he would stand out in any era.
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Manuel Neuer is arguably the greatest and most influential Goalkeeper ever.


If he's not an all time great, then hardly anyone is.
 
TenonTen said:
Manuel Neuer is arguably the greatest and most influential Goalkeeper ever.


If he's not an all time great, then hardly anyone is.
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Yeah he's been consistently very good but even Kahn is more iconic surely? Maybe it's just that modern players are often duller than those of previous generations so I'm biased I suppose.

Schmeichel is still the greatest and most influential goalkeeper I've ever seen though. Taking Denmark to the Euros in 1992, the double double with United, the first ever treble. Bit of a prick but an amazing player and leader.
 
TwoSheds said:
Yeah he's been consistently very good but even Kahn is more iconic surely? Maybe it's just that modern players are often duller than those of previous generations so I'm biased I suppose.
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I don't think so. Neuer won the World Cup while Kahn made a huge error in the final gifting Brazil a goal.


Neuer is more complete, excellent on the ball and started the trend of sweeper keeper.


He is what every modern goalkeeper tries to be except they don't have his presence in goal and can't save like him.


Neuer is anything but dull. He does some of the most brave things a keeper can do. He dribbles past opponents with the ball confidently and does some of the smartest and cheekiest stuff with the ball.
 
Anyone disputing van Dijk is just exposing their lack of football knowledge. No need to be like RAWK, you can admit he's arguably the greatest centre half ever.
 
Rojofiam said:
Anyone disputing van Dijk is just exposing their lack of football knowledge. No need to be like RAWK, you can admit he's arguably the greatest centre half ever.
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:lol:
 
TenonTen said:
I don't think so. Neuer won the World Cup while Kahn made a huge error in the final gifting Brazil a goal.


Neuer is more complete, excellent on the ball and started the trend of sweeper keeper.


He is what every modern goalkeeper tries to be except they don't have his presence in goal and can't save like him.


Neuer is anything but dull. He does some of the most brave things a keeper can do. He dribbles past opponents with the ball confidently and does some of the smartest and cheekiest stuff with the ball.
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The sweeper keeper thing is just progression of a trend that probably originally started with Van der Sar in the 90s. Victor Valdes at Barcelona sure as hell wasn't being picked for his shot stopping for example.

I can see the argument for Neuer though certainly, he's as close as anyone active to being an all timer.
 
All time great is a very, very high bar indeed.

Messi, Ronaldo are obvious, but I wouldn't even consider Mbappe likely to be in this list.

Maybe De Bruyne, Muller, Neuer. Players of that calibre.
 
TwoSheds said:
:lol:
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You're just living in the past man. The Neuer-Kahn post also gives that away. Neuer is the greatest goalkeeper ever and there aren't many doubts about that IMO. A totally different stratosphere to someone like Kahn. But there will be someone in the future who surpasses him. Same with van Dijk. On ability, both of them are easily the first answers in their respective positions from the current active players.

Football is being played on the highest levels it's ever been played on. Efficiency, tactics, medicine, physicality, athleticism, everything you can think of. How do you make an argument for a player who played in the 90s, 00s, or even before, over the players of the last 15 years, who did it on a much higher level? Watch back any match from just 15-20 years ago, they look like glorified friendlies compared to today. And let's not go back to the 60s, 70s and 80s.

But there's no need to worry. It's all a natural evolvement. The present day will always be the best and highest level, just like technology, for example. In the next two decades, fotball will evolve again, and all-time greats will appear again in every position, surpassing their predecessors...except probably Messi.
 
Rojofiam said:
Football is being played on the highest levels it's ever been played on. Efficiency, tactics, medicine, physicality, athleticism, everything you can think of. How do you make an argument for a player who played in the 90s, 00s, or even before over the players of the last 15 years, who did it on a much higher level? Watch back any match from just 15-20 years ago, they look like glorified friendlies compared to today. And let's not go back to the 60s, 70s and 80s.
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By that approach Pele and Maradona should be completely ignored in that discussion. This works both ways though, current players would obviously massively struggle without the current tools too.
 
Lemoor said:
By that approach Pele and Maradona should be completely ignored in that discussion. This works both ways though, current players would obviously massively struggle without the current tools too.
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I think they should be, yes. Not their fault that they played 40+ years ago, but they've had their fair share of glory and admiration back then, anyways. No point in putting them into GOAT debates 40-60 years later. There would have to be something deeply wrong with the sport if they were in these discussions on merit. You can't compare eras, but modern day is undeniably light years ahead of the 1980s for example.
 
Rojofiam said:
You're just living in the past man. The Neuer-Kahn post also gives that away. Neuer is the greatest goalkeeper ever and there aren't many doubts about that IMO. A totally different stratosphere to someone like Kahn. But there will be someone in the future who surpasses him. Same with van Dijk. On ability, both of them are easily the first answers in their respective positions from the current active players.

Football is being played on the highest levels it's ever been played on. Efficiency, tactics, medicine, physicality, athleticism, everything you can think of. How do you make an argument for a player who played in the 90s, 00s, or even before, over the players of the last 15 years, who did it on a much higher level? Watch back any match from just 15-20 years ago, they look like glorified friendlies compared to today. And let's not go back to the 60s, 70s and 80s.

But there's no need to worry. It's all a natural evolvement. The present day will always be the best and highest level, just like technology, for example. In the next two decades, fotball will evolve again, and all-time greats will appear again in every position, surpassing their predecessors...except probably Messi.
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Van Dijk is only marginally better than Konaté at his own team, never mind the best defender ever. It's a nice wind up though, well done.
 
TwoSheds said:
Van Dijk is only marginally better than Konaté at his own team, never mind the best defender ever. It's a nice wind up though, well done.
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Typical one liner response when I take 10 minutes to write a detailed post, and funnily enough everything you wrote is untrue anyway.
 
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