When we compare success, 1 Europa League, 1 League Cup and finishing 2nd in the league are more than Poch has achieved in his managerial career. Poch appears to be progressing his team, but as yet they're not a successful side, indeed they've been found to be a bit of a bunch of bottlers thus far. I'd rather United took Kane from Spuds than their manager. Kane would transform this team, he's exceptional at everything we lack.
A serious look at Mauricio Pochettino
- Thread starter NotBrendanRodgers honest
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When we compare success, 1 Europa League, 1 League Cup and finishing 2nd in the league are more than Poch has achieved in his managerial career. Poch appears to be progressing his team, but as yet they're not a successful side, indeed they've been found to be a bit of a bunch of bottlers thus far. I'd rather United took Kane from Spuds than their manager. Kane would transform this team, he's exceptional at everything we lack.
Great manager and a class act. Should be our no1 target for next manager.
I think we will go balls out for him. Either us or Real Madrid will land him next summer, or one after.
Depends on how much he loves the cheese counter af the new Spurs Super Bowl Stadium.
For players coming into and out of the squad he does. Purchasing of players falls to the business side of things, once a target has been identified by Pochettino.
Pochettino doesnt go out and talk to clubs about the cost of purchasing their players. And broker deals with the players agent for their xfer. That is Levy and the boards job.
But this is simply one half of the equation. The other is the ability to move players on as the manager sees fit. Cull the squad as desired, I dont see Woody letting any manager come in and sell off/move on his 'investment players'.
Jose has been more successful than Pochettino if you are looking at it from a pure trophies won metric.
Poch is most peoples choice to succeed Jose (myself included) but I'm not sure if he is glamourous enough for Woodward.
I think our primary target will be Zidane.
That's how you judge success. Look back a decade from now and what will history show, 4 years a coach and not even a league cup to show for it. Not going to go into his deep past and how successful he was, only his United tenure. Pochettino is a good manager, but as yet hasn't installed a winning mentality into his team, they've certainly been found wanting when the pressure is really on. Plus he inherited and developed possibly to the best centre forward in the world, Kane would improve any side. I'd love him at United.
On the Caf style of football also plays an important part. People arnt happy winning trophies with a defensive style of football it seems.
Pochettino plays an open attacking style of football which is one thing that makes him desirable.
That's not a Caf thing, that's every big prestigious club in the planet.
I've always been a bit confused by stuff like this to be honest. People are always referenced looking back. Who are these people? Spurs fans? Even if Poch were to leave tomorrow, I can say with some confidence that spurs fans will look at our time with Poch almost universally in a positive light.
Other fans? I guess the question would be who cares?
Casual fans? I doubt many casual fans could name the 1970 league Cup winner. For that matter, neither can I. Or the fa Cup, league title, European Cup, uefa Cup etc etc.
It's obviously incredible to win trophies but the attitude that memories are only built with trophies is a strange one to me. Its also strange to say success is only measured by trophies. Different clubs have different aims, different expectations.
Di Maria, Pogba and Sanchez were exceptional at everything we lacked.
We can choose to measure success however we want but the reality is Spurs have been a better football team than us over the period that Poch has been their manager and they have far more bottle than we do.
If Poch leaves and a next bloke takes over and actually wins something he'll be instantly more successful. Poch unless he actually wins stuff will never be classed as a top class manager. Players and managers are judged by their career and what they achieved, years of celebrating good football and qualifying for the Champions League doesn't really cut it, otherwise Wenger would still be in situe and he was very successful at La Arse. If Spurs fans are happy with that then all is well.
The way United are set up is made for a player like Kane, I cannot say that of Sanchez nor Pogba.
As for bottle, what have they won with this bottle? Answer nothing they've faltered when it really matters...
Honest question, do you think Juande Ramos is a more successful manager than Pochettino? And if you happen to see it like that, do you think the majority of Spurs fans feel the same?
If falling short of expectation equals “bottling it” then you could say the rest of the top 6 have shown themselves to be bottlers with the exception of City. (And City are where they are because of relentless investment not “bottle” I.e there are other factors to consider when judging success)
By that logic:
Klopp and Liverpool have “bottled” two cup finals at Liverpool (and a few more at Dortmund). He’s “bottled” finishing in the top 3 at Liverpool despite having more resources than Pochettino. But you’d probably still take him as United manager right now.
United are bottling the league every season. A couple of seasons ago, every time we had the chance to move up to 5th we dropped points. This season is following a similar pattern. In the cups that we have won we have done so with a series of shaky performances against inferior opposition where are own lack of “bottle” have put the results in the balance.
Sarri won nothing at Napoli so they were bottlers. Great manager though.
If we are judging managers suitability to the United job based on what silverware they have won in their careers then you’d keep Mourinho.
Wouldn't discussion/debate on forums like this be so much more reasonable if posters could evaluate their potential posts logically like you have posted here before they decide to push send? Instead they choose to repeat the same facile, contrived, foolish talksport arguments like the one you to which you have responded. They could just self-censor and discussion could be so much more sensible.
Poch's time at Spurs will be viewed positively irrespective of whatever success the manager after him has. He brought us out of the AVB/Timmy doldrums and made us actually identify and love the team again. He is classy and respectable and we don't dread his next news conference or interview. He has changed the culture and brought us more on-field consistent success than we have had in a long time. For that he deserves to be thought of fondly. He's not a perfect manager but he is perfect for Spurs.
That is the thing I was referring to though. If the next manager comes in and wins one, let's say even two league cups but finished outside of the CL places three or four seasons in a row, then no, he hasn't been more successful. Because right now, what this club needs the most is so ultimately get to a financial footing where we can compete on a relatively similar level to Arsenal, Liverpool and maybe Chelsea. The two Manchester are realistically out of reach. Winning a cup here and there but failing to qualify for the competition that actually brings the club more exposure, actually brings the club more money, is more detrimental to the club right now than a manager who consistently gets us top 4 but doesn't win a trophy.
This is different for a club like Man Utd because realistically you could spend ten seasons straight out of the CL and winning only league cups and you'd still be richer than Spurs and still be more famous.
Does that mean we don't all win trophies? Of course not. I'd love spurs to win the league, the CL, the fa Cup, Europa, league Cup, whatever. But trophies are not the only measures of success. Otherwise Man Utd would be lining up to get Ramos or AVB or Martínez or Mcleish or Di Matteo or Scolari or Redknapp or any number of the clearly inferior managers who have won something at some point.
Dont see the point of him moving to Real now. The job will always be available and it’s not like he is coming to the end of his career or anything. I’m sure he wants to achieve more in England first.
100% agree, I feel he is invested in his Spurs project for the forseeable future.
Has this been posted yet? Not sure if it deserves it's own thread but I think it was interesting to watch.
Understand what you are saying and agree with a lot of it. But if Pochettino was to end his Spurs stay without winning a trophy then whenever talking about this team that will almost certainly and rightfully so be talked about in any discussion about his time at the club, as for the big clubs that is essentially the main reason of competing.
Meh I'm pretty sure this is all bullshit, we won some titles playing really ugly under Fergie and no one complains.
The reason the fans are upset is because we aren't winning anymore, so they vent their frustration out in anyway they can including blaming the coach and the playstyle.
If we have an attacking coach that goes down in flames every match you will hear new kinds of moaning from the Caf.
Winning is the only thing that will stop the moaning.
You mean ultra-defensive with lack of creativity, no intensity or pressing?
I was just coming to post this.
It was pretty interesting, and although I don't think we stand much of a chance of getting him (having recently signed a new contract and that) - he would be a good fit because it seems like he wouldn't need a complete rebuild to utilise his style/tactics.
For people who can't be arsed watching the video, it says that:
- he would want to upgrade the full-backs straight away (Trippier maybe)
- Lukaku would probably not fit his style, so Rashford or Martial would likely be first choice up front.
- Fred and Fellaini would probably be his double-pivot
- Pogba used as kind of no.10 or benched/sold.
I f you believe Pochettinos interviews never Barca. His Espanyol ties, played 10 years for them. Captained the team and then managed them.
RM a logical progression down the track however once the Spurs project ends.
RM a logical progression down the track however once the Spurs project ends.
I can see Pogba as a 10, not sure of Lukaku can adapt to be the 9 that would work in that system.
This is utter nonsense, he's the manager of a club which is on a shoestring budget in comparison to the other top teams. He's done and doing a phenomenal job to even have them challenging.
He's bought players from obscurity and put together a really well organised team. He's bought players like Deli, Trippier, Son, Davis, Alderweireld at absolute bargain prices. You could only imagine how successful he could be with a larger budget.
Challenging as in? Getting to a final or close to the league winners? So not really then eh...
What exactly is a Spurs project anyway?
I've heard this before
Forget what clubs they are managing, look at the squads. Are we a better team or squad than Totternham? They are a settled and harmonious team for many years with the same players, and they have one of the best strikers in the world. It seems every fan on here wants all of their players in our team, barring rubbish ones like Lloris. So they have a better team, a better manager.. but what have they done? Nothing! Mourinho, with a lesser team, with no star striker and disharmony won the Europa League (Tottenham embarrassingly went out to some Belgian side) and the League Cup. Poch hasn't even been near a final in his time here.
So I ask again, since Poch has a better team and less pressure every day, how has Mourinho not had short-term success when we are up against Man City, arguably the best ever side to play in England? If anything, and please forget "club expectations", Pochettino has under performed with his set and brilliant team full of stars, Mourinho has somewhat done the opposite. Forget the money and how big the clubs are (which goes in Tottenham's favor anyway) - you are judged on the team and players you have put together, not what fans historically demand of you. If you have a great team, you must deliver results based on their ability - Pochettino has not done that at all. They had a huge, huge opportunity when the top six went into hibernation, yet Leicester pipped them to the title when it mattered the most. It could be 50 years until Tottenham have that chance again.
They are not supposed to be challenging, You can't judge an average sided club or it's manager on the criteria of how close are they to winning the league. If we go by that standard we should be looking at Ranieri to be our next manager.
Plenty of spurs players would get into United's starting 11, so what has he actually won with a very talented squad? Stop making out Poch works with a bunch of limited players who are performing above their talent.
Average side club ? Who - spurs ?
Yeh exactly, he's a built a better team at the fraction of the cost, which is why he's done a great job. He doesn't need to win anything with Spurs to warrant a big job, he's already proved enough.
They're pretty average, maybe a tier above but the point is they not close to the top teams financially.
So you're saying he's a slightly better version of Moyes then?
As for the finances, that doesn't really matter, he has some excellent players in his team. A team that he's won nothing with.
Wasnt he quoted as saying he wanted to take Spurs through the transition to the new stadium and win a trophy?
I thought that was the reason behind signing the long term contract at Spurs?
Im sure Glaston is more informed on the situation