A serious look at Mauricio Pochettino
- Thread starter NotBrendanRodgers honest
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Is this "news" coming just from PDB or others as well?
Oh not Pilib De Brun...I thought he was just a summer chancer 
"Oh if it happens, it'll happen in the summer"
Nooo…really? Hold the back page chief!
"Oh if it happens, it'll happen in the summer"
Nooo…really? Hold the back page chief!
We’re the only club in constant rebuild? Are you serious?
Where were you in the 30 years since Liverpool last won the league? Or the last decade and a half since Arsenal won the league. Or the decade Barcelona went without getting to a CL final. Or the 6 years Real Madrid went without getting past the round of 16.
All teams go through cycles and rebuilds.
One of his "demands" apparently.
As otherwise it'd be truly insane to let a manager you're actively looking to bin off, wad 60m down on a player the next manager might not fancy!
And we're not insane, we make great decisions, always.
Always.
Where’s that gif of Lisa Simpson rocking quietly in a corner, be ideal right now
I'd assume his demands are a decent size transfer budget like Jose got, maybe no DOF. Perhaps an allowance of not making the top 4 in the first two years and a strong say on players to move out as well. We or United might think wow we could save a lot money with this guy but he grew frustrated each year having perform on a tight budget.
United I think will insist and quite rightly the use of youth and utilize players like Rashford, Williams, Greenwood, James, McTominay. I dare say some managers would've sold Rashford 1-2 years ago and it would be our Salah De Bruyne moment. To me he's transforming into a top left sided player and I wouldn't take 150 million for him.
United I think will insist and quite rightly the use of youth and utilize players like Rashford, Williams, Greenwood, James, McTominay. I dare say some managers would've sold Rashford 1-2 years ago and it would be our Salah De Bruyne moment. To me he's transforming into a top left sided player and I wouldn't take 150 million for him.
All clubs are in a constant state of rebuild, it is the nature of the game that you must be bringing in new players either through transfer or the academy. Players need to be challenged to improve by having another player push them for their spot. If a club isn't rebuilding they are regressing.
Listened to his pod. Says it's the same source who told him we'd sign Lukaku and di Maria, before it was out there. Says Poch doesn't have an agent, so they had to find a trusted middleman as Woodward could not be seen discussing with Poch. Poch's demands were: Doesn't want to take over until the summer, demands a DoF, Woodward is not to interfere with football matters and Poch will need funds to go into the market.
Wasn't it you @Adnan who said Poch doesn't want to work with a DoF ?
Not sure what to make of this. Interesting gossip at least.
Wasn't it you @Adnan who said Poch doesn't want to work with a DoF ?
Not sure what to make of this. Interesting gossip at least.
Yep.. It was me..
It's been reported that Poch doesn't want to work with a DoF. Our resident Spurs fans @GlastonSpur and @InLevyITrust have said the same.
Yeah, hard to gauge the credibility of that. But even a manager who previously would have baulked at a DoF, might think it's necessary when looking at the state of United..
I think this is fake because of the "Doesn't want to take over until the summer". We are top 5 and still have a lot of chances to get into top 4, and if we can do that, it will be really hard to justify sacking Ole.
I suppose if Ed is there then a DOF is favourable if you're considering taking the job now.
Are you sure it was a dof and not a dof, the accent can be hard for some but perhaps he elaborated.
Are you sure it was a dof and not a dof, the accent can be hard for some but perhaps he elaborated.
You actually make a good point and it did cross my mind tbh. He might feel it's imperative to have a DoF at United due to our problems in the last 6 years to help him.Yeah, hard to gauge the credibility of that. But even a manager who previously would have baulked at a DoF, might think it's necessary when looking at the state of United..
Good point. Frankly, you’d need to be bonkers not to request a DOF if the alternative is Ed calling the shots.
Good point, it's not just that. If he feels he is a better manager than Ole which one would he assumes he does. He would want to take over asap to increase the chances of being in the champions league next season.
He will have followed the demise of both Van Gaal and Mourinho at United whilst he was Spurs manager to know better than to just jump straight into a project without being assured of a solid structure he would be comfortable with.
We sacked LVG practically the same day we won the FA Cup.
Plus he'd take a summer pre season. IIRC Saints and Spurs players needed a certain period to adjust to Poch's tactics. Also, he's probably got a clause that prevents him from joining another PL club this season. I mean there are plenty of reasons why he'd want to take over during the summer. Also didn't Poch work with Paul Mitchell as DoF, so it wouldn't be the first time. I know what I'd prefer if I was to come in and have Woody get on like clueless wanker that he is.
It sounds like Rubbish to me but it would be favourable for us to get Poch in summer. I still think the club will persist with Ole so long as we get a champions league spot. When you consider how LVG got the sack, I've no idea why people think Solskjaer being given time is some sort of foregone conclusion the Glazers can and have been ruthless when the managers underperforming.
Mitchell was the head of recruitment for a short time at spurs.
Ed will say to him it's all right I'll be the DOF.
Why would Woody need a middle man to talk to Poch? That’s a bit odd, absolutely no reason why he couldn’t be seen to be talking to I him.
It would put unnecessary pressure on Ole for the rest of the season. If true, it is the correct way to go about things given the current situation.
I can't see Ole getting sacked but I can see Woody offering him DOF, I can also see Poch not being happy with that decision.
This would be absolutely bonkers, why are people even suggesting this?
A lot of fans here think that Ole isn't a very good manager so what makes people think he can do the next job up in DoF? What has he done to merit even been thought of as a DoF?
I knew Pochettino wouldn't get the Barcelona job. The job in Spain he'd bite your hand off is the Real Madrid one.
Are people really suggesting we've lined up Poch to take over in the summer, and are already signing players he's asked for? Come on now.
But maybe it's not really Poch the signings are for, maybe it's really for his replacement in a year's time when he is sacked.I get that, but these things always come out anyway, the middle man probably met him with a United shirt on, with full scarf and hat. For what its worth I believe Poch would do an excellent job at United if handled correctly, and he is given time.
Thought it was Judge doing the negotiating and they then have several people deciding on who to buy.
What the same amount of time fans are giving Ole? He better be top of the league in his first few months then
Time is something your not giving Ole.
Me? I am a Spurs fan.
Oh yes. I see now.
AC Milan, Liverpool, Tottenham, Bayern München, Boroussia Dortmund, Barcelona, Real Madrid, Atletico Madrid, Juventus, Inter Milan, Arsenal and Chelsea. These are just some of the clubs who have gone through either enormous rebuilds over the last generations. Some team are fortunate enough to find those generational talents within their squad early on either through fortunate recruitment or academy that carries them for the next decade and over (Barcelona, Xavi, Iniesta, Puyol, Messi, Pique, Bosquets. Manchester Unitd: Class of 92, Eric Cantona, CR7,) - While other clubs have high highs and low valleys, like Inter Milan and AC Milan, even Bourussia Dortmund. 10 years ago Bayern München finished third in the bundesliga. Juventus has been dominant in the Seria A since 2011. Before that they had double seasons at 7th.
Liverpool is the very dictionary definition of a "constantly" rebuilding team.Manchester City, Chelsea and PSG bought themselves a team with monopoly money.
Hell, there are 2 teams in world football that has had consistent grip on the top of the table in the past 15 years, Real Madrid and Barcelona, and their key was always the backbones of their team that far and above rivaled anyone in the league and their impossibly big financial advantage over other Spanish teams.
Every other team in world football has had the low valleys. It's a little comical that we are so spoiled rotten that we never though this could possibly happen to us. Like, why wouldn't it? When the financial powers of the clubs are starting to get to an equal level, you are ALWAYS going to have shifts in powers. You can not retain the status quo forever if your competition is competing on equal terms, it's just not going to happen. Hell, even the greatest Sumo Yokozuna in the history of the sport gets slapped around from time to time.
Regarding rebuild. Happy to address it. If you are willing to agree that the word rebuild implies changing and developing players, not just telling them to play in a different formation than your predecessor.
1) Marcus Rashford, 22 yo. - Surpassed his previous goal total on a season. Halfway into the current season. Joint 2nd top scorer with 14 goals. Marcus Rashfords xG stat is so skewed because of his misses previously in the season that if all averages meet in the middle, Rashford is this seasons top scorer. (The point about this argument is that Marcus Rashford has missed a LOT of high danger chances that a more in form Marcus Rashford would have scored on)
2) Mason Greenwood, 18 yo. - 9 goals on the season - Developing as one of the best striker talents in Europe currently. Not being overused, eased into the team.
3) Brandon Williams 19 yo. - Leftback - Usurped Luke Shaw as the teams first choice LB - Incredible talent who gives us what we've lacked - Forward ability.
4) Fred - Largely considered a flop, by everyone from fans to pundits. Has under OGS turned around and become one of the teams best players. Several motm lever peformances recently. Currently justifying his pricetag - Was conidered a waste leading into the season
5) Daniel Jame - A longshot prospect from the lower leagues - One of our best players early in the seson. Currently shares fourth with 6 assists in the EPL on the season
6) Offense. This team generates a LOT more offense than the projection is when we don't win a game. We've generated the 4th most amount of shots so far this season. 7 behind Liverpool.
7) Bad luck. We got 9 hits in the woodwork so far. The 2nd most of any team, right behind Manchester City
8) We're still stingy with the goals. 25 GA ranks 5th in the league with Manchester City. A vast improvement on previous season.
9) GD is a lot better this season around. We're on pace to improving our GA despite losing Lukaku.
10) Rebuilding team. The age of the team played on opening day was the youngest in that game round. Funfact: Manchester United have fielded the squad with the lowest average age a total of 10 times this season. Including the 2 youngest squads overalll.
11) See 10. Kids take time to develop. Thus the mantra of "We are going to see ups and downs". Its a stop to the policy of buying random players for all the money, and rather take time developing the young future stars. See 1-3 + 12 + 14for reference.
12) Tuanzebe 22 yo. Was on the verge of demoting Lindelöf to the bench before he got injured. Thus would have completed a 100% defensive unit turnover from previous seasons 57GA debacle.
13) Playing to our strengths. Pogba is out, and has barely participated in the season. We lack a creative offensive midfielder that can break down tight packed defensive teams. Jesse Lingard has disappeared from form and likely needs a change of scenery. As a result, while we wait to recruit the players that can fill this role we play to our strengths. We have one of the quickest team in the league and there's an argument to be made that Manchester United is currently the best team in the world right now on the break. Teams that play high always struggle, as we saw with Manchester City, Chelsea, Liverpool, Tottenham etc.
14) Scott McTominay. A player with not a lot of hype around him but someone who has gone from a good previous season to a crucial contributor this season. Another academy graduate.
15) David De Gea - As opposed to last season when De Geas junior mistakes cost us our CL bid, he's been true to form this season apart from a couple unfortunately very costly mistakes. If anything he has benefited from the managers public backing in times of turmoil.
16) The entire mood around the club. Now, this one is a bit of a perception thing, but what we have improved vastly from last year is the relentless negativity that seeped through every aspect of the clubs, with the manager being in open conflict with the board, despite being backed like no manager before him in the transfer market.
17) Getting rid of the deadwood - Non competers. Fellaini, Sanchez, Lukaku - All had different reaons for being unloaded. Fellaini just wasn't a part of the future here, Sanchez had scored 3 league goals for the club while sitting on the worst contract in football. Lukaku told OGS he wanted out - and was promptly allowed to leave. Lukaku has previously gone on in an interview and declared his everlasting respect to OGS for allowing him to go when he did.
18) Not backing down. Earlier in the season when we had our worst run of form and desperately needed a win. OGS responded by playing a junior team in the EL. If anything he has shown that he will not compromise on the project to save his own skin, or buy panic players that might save his job in the short term. There is never a "me" it's always about the longevity of the club. And it's hard to argue that that's a good thing.
19) Recruitment. OGS is 3/3 with finding staple first XI players thus far. Maguire has delivered some so so performances to the outright statesman like ones. Daniel James and AWB are both 22 and considered developing talents. facets of their game will continue to develop as time moves on. Harry Maguire is a natural leader and looks slotted to become our new Captain when Ashely Young departs either in January or this spring
20) The players. The players have completely sold in to the project the club is undertaking and a united playergroup went out of their way to go directly to Woodward ahead of the Tottenham game to give OGS their support and ask him not to sack him. No one here knows what's happening behind closed doors, but the players would not bother with that if there was not a very unifying amount of respect and belief in whats happening in the player group.
As for the Brendan Rodgers effect: Do you mean the biggest win streak of any debuting manager in Premier League history, the longest away win streak or the "third place" EPL finish after his managerial takeover of the club? We could throw in the night in Paris there but that's just icing on the cake.
As a side note, I've always found this amusing:
One of the greatest vintages ever, Bayern Munich in the early-to-mid 1970s, finished 10th in the Bundesliga in the season when they won their 2nd European Cup on the trot (they won a third on the trot the following season - but only finished 3rd in the league).
A team featuring Beckenbauer, Müller, Maier, Schwarzenbeck, Hoeness, Roth and a young Rummenigge. Finished 10th, I repeat.
One can wonder how some fans would've reacted to this if you imagine it happening in the social media era.
Caveat: I'm not claiming this is immediately relevant to...anything - like I said, I've just always found it amusing as an example of things not being quite what they seem if you only look at raw numbers (which many people do - increasingly so, in spite of the fact that it's obviously idiotic and has always been so).
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Poch will wait until the summer, if he wants the job here.
Let us ignore the following facts:
1) We have only have 34 points from a possible 66.
2) Managed to win only 9 games out of 22 games.
3) Nearly out of the Carbaro cup
No other manager in the world could write off a season saying we are improving, long term project, etc & no other board accepts this kind of mediocrity from the manager and no other clubs' half fanbase believe in the lies from incompetent manager and board.
United reaching out to Pochettino (if indeed they have), doesn't necessarily mean that Ole is for the chop.
Sensible to set up a 'plan B' in case they decide to make a change, though, and Pochettino is one of the best in the business.
Sensible to set up a 'plan B' in case they decide to make a change, though, and Pochettino is one of the best in the business.
It's never going to happen. Surprised this thread is 290 pages long.