A serious look at Mauricio Pochettino

[Majima]

How many stars did he have when he took over at Spurs? What part did he play in developing stars?

People see names already there and think he walked into it with them at that level.

Eriksen was promising, along with Lamela (who was flopping), but Lloris, Vertonghen, Rose & Walker were no stars to begin with.

They shipped 51 goals in the league (11th) the previous season. They were mediocre.

They also only scored 55 goals (7th, behind Everton in 6th) that season, so you could say they were pretty mediocre overall.

 

[always_hoping]

Not that striking. Inter last won the CL and Serie A in 2010.

United have been in the CL 3 times, got to two Quarter Finals, one being last year, won the Europa/Uefa cup, finished 2nd place in the League recently. The financial status of each club is very different. Milan have had more than double the managers we've had, if our next 4 managers are Garry Neville, Tim Sherwood, Nicky Butt, Bilic I'll concede the manager point.

Yes United reached CL quarter finals under Ole and Moyes but at any stage did United look like a side capable of even reaching the final nevermind winning it? Beaten by Barcelona, Bayern Munich and both were knocked out in the following round with performances they would love to forget.

I'm expecting a 2nd year in a row without CL football, not consistent enough to finish 4th and unlikely to get the Jose rub of the green and win the Europa league. So that will all likely mean United will have their 5th (6th if you count Giggs short spell) manager since 2013. Not easy to adjust too when United had one manager for over two decades.

Finally the financial status of each club is very different, United have more money to spend but a lot of that money spent in recent years has been wasted and major rebuilding is still needed on the panel. Big improvement is required on the scouting and recruitment in the years ahead and would you trust Woodward and Co to achieve what is required?

 

[ti vu]

I am still not too sure about him. He is a good coach, won't deny that but his football being an attacking one is massively overrated. I always found his style of football to be less attractive and more laborious. I don't think his side were able to completely dominate other sides in big games either. Playing off the counter was his style too. If he is hired, I will back him and hope he is a success but I think soem of our fans are overrating him as a manager.

Tottenham had stood still due to lack of serious investment. They top score, and conceded least for a season, which is a good foundation to build on. Wasted chance. That’s more about Levy than the head coach.

Poch‘s style is not exactly gung-ho, yet it’s a modern style based on positioning play, pressing, being comfortable with the ball. This style would demand on players’ quality and compatibility, so there is a point where you must purchase new players to elevate/improve the team. Levy doesn’t spend (summer 2018 at all) (and overall) on the same level as City and Liverpool summer 2018. Expecting Poch Tottenham to continue to progress is just too unrealistic. Poch’s failure to win smaller trophies is a problem, but not so different to Klopp‘s Liverpool. Both reached a CL final, which is a turning point. Klopp had the backing, while the backing from Levy is laughable. Liverpool went on different level while Tottenham infighting and Poch lost the dressing room. Klopp’s Dortmund faced similar issue: style gets stale with squad quality decrease as replacement couldn’t fill in for the outgoing players. Klopp lost the dressing room, Dortmund lingering mid table despite their quality was still CL level.

It has been discussed many times here and on other forums, Klopp’s style implements counter attacking phase after the counter pressing phase, which is different than that of Pep,’s which prioritizes reorganizing the team shape, which in turn favors recycling possession first. Just state Poch’ style is based on playing off counter, to complain about his side is less attractive without considering context (lack of investment in squad quality over time) is just empty words. Not long ago, Klopp’s Liverpool was headless chicken in their approach, and struggled against teams that don’t allow them space to counter attack after their counter press (gen gen pressing)

 

[Member 58925]

People see names already there and think he walked into it with them at that level.

Eriksen was promising, along with Lamela (who was flopping), but Lloris, Vertonghen, Rose & Walker were no stars to begin with.

They shipped 51 goals in the league (11th) the previous season. They were mediocre.

They also only scored 55 goals (7th, behind Everton in 6th) that season, so you could say they were pretty mediocre overall.

I remember what Harry Kane looked like before Koch got there too. Cockney Andy Carroll.

 

[Mainoldo]

Not lazy more like a very striking comparison. AC Milan a club just like United that was one of the worlds best football clubs on the field of play, admired and feared in equal measure by the opposition but nowadays year after year both stuck in a mediocre rut.

AC Milan last league title 2011 and last champions league title 2007. Compared to United 2013 last league and 2008 last champions league. Average league season points for United since Ferguson retired 69 compared to Milan with 60 points average in the last 6 seasons.

Conclusion two poorly run clubs with supporters of both clubs hoping that rise from/out of mediocrity will come sooner than later..

But it’s not the same at all.. like I’ve pointed out and like your comparison point out. AC Milan have zero money, cannot attract quality players and keep hiring dead beat managers. Except for Ole and Moyes this is not the same for us.

 

[reddevilchennai]

Poch is the best what we can get at this moment. With Ole we are going nowhere near the top 4.
Nagelsmann and Rose would not come to United next season. Rodgers signed a new deal at Leicester.

Poch is the realistic option for us whereas for Poch he can choose between Bayern, Madrid, City (if Pep leaves).
If Ed has any sense, he should go for Poch soon.

 

[always_hoping]

But it’s not the same at all.. like I’ve pointed out and like your comparison point out. AC Milan have zero money, cannot attract quality players and keep hiring dead beat managers. Except for Ole and Moyes this is not the same for us.

You can't ignore that it's two broken clubs from the top to bottom. The way United have wasted money on poor transfers and ridiculous wages given to players that didn't deserve it is agurably worse than Milans "zero" money.

On dead beat managers, Others will claim or already have that LVG was finished and Jose past his sell by date during their time as United manager but the next possible appointment by Mr Woodward is sure to be right? after all how could he fail when this so called messiah awaits the call...

 

[90 + 5min]

How many stars did he have when he took over at Spurs? What part did he play in developing stars?

Well some of them were Lloris, Kaboul, Walker, Rose, Paulinho, Dembele, Adebayor, Eriksen, Lamela and so on. Just look at their squad when he arrived. It is not some peanuts he worked with. Kane and Dier was on way up to.

He did well developing some players. Nobody is denying that. But some of people in here want to make it as if he took over Wycombe and took them to top 4 with 15 years old players that he developed into supermega stars. Many are overrating him. He is good manager but not that good that some people want to make him.

 

[FootyGirl88]

Well some of them were Lloris, Kaboul, Walker, Rose, Paulinho, Dembele, Adebayor, Eriksen, Lamela and so on. Just look at their squad when he arrived. It is not some peanuts he worked with. Kane and Dier was on way up to.

He did well developing some players. Nobody is denying that. But some of people in here want to make it as if he took over Wycombe and took them to top 4 with 15 years old players that he developed into supermega stars. Many are overrating him. He is good manager but not that good that some people want to make him.

These guys were awful when Poch arrived especially the FBs they didnt have a clue what they were doing. Any Spurs fan will tell you this.

 

[El Jefe]

Even if we go with the Poch isn't a winner narrative, I wouldn't mind if he had a run with us like he did with Spurs. Post Fergie we've won 3 cups and while they were good to celebrate the football in each of those seasons have been poor and we've finished outside the CL spots.

If Poch can take us from a EL team to a team that is just on the cusp of winning the actual big trophies like PL and CL, that would put us in a far better position for the future.

People reduce it all to trophies but ignore all the good he's done. Imagine if he turned Martial and Rashford into the new Kane and Son. Or if he got Shaw playing to pre injury levels or if he actually got this team to pass incisively from the back and all over the pitch. All the naysayers would be creaming themselves if this happened, so lets not act like its trophies or nothing. He didn't take over City, Bayern or Juventus, he took over Spurs.

 

[90 + 5min]

People see names already there and think he walked into it with them at that level.

Eriksen was promising, along with Lamela (who was flopping), but Lloris, Vertonghen, Rose & Walker were no stars to begin with.

They shipped 51 goals in the league (11th) the previous season. They were mediocre.

They also only scored 55 goals (7th, behind Everton in 6th) that season, so you could say they were pretty mediocre overall.

Mediocre? And still managed to come one place better then us despite us having stars in the team (although some on way down). Once again you are making Tottenham as if they were Wycombe and not some top team.

Eriksen was dominating in Netherlands. Verthongen was already playing in Ajax and was important part. Lloris came like a next goalkeeperstar, already nominated for best goalkeeper by UEFA. Walker were already a Premier Legaue fullback that was established. Pochettino didn't came to a empty table. He came to internationals and stars.

Poch is the best what we can get at this moment. With Ole we are going nowhere near the top 4.
Nagelsmann and Rose would not come to United next season. Rodgers signed a new deal at Leicester.

Poch is the realistic option for us whereas for Poch he can choose between Bayern, Madrid, City (if Pep leaves).
If Ed has any sense, he should go for Poch soon.

Yes, and still he is without a job. Despite team like Bayern having noe of the worst seasons in long time. My guess is that he will end up in a team that is pushing for CL places somewhere. And not a team that is pushing for titles. Because if we are honost, he is no winner. Not titles at least.

These guys were awful when Poch arrived especially the FBs they didnt have a clue what they were doing. Any Spurs fan will tell you this.

No, they were not. Not for me. They did have a clue. Attack. That was the system. Defensivly they were bad. Attackingwise they were good.

 

[NWRed]

Well some of them were Lloris, Kaboul, Walker, Rose, Paulinho, Dembele, Adebayor, Eriksen, Lamela and so on. Just look at their squad when he arrived. It is not some peanuts he worked with. Kane and Dier was on way up to.

He did well developing some players. Nobody is denying that. But some of people in here want to make it as if he took over Wycombe and took them to top 4 with 15 years old players that he developed into supermega stars. Many are overrating him. He is good manager but not that good that some people want to make him.

I personally think we should stick with Ole, but this argument against Pochettino makes no sense. These players built their reputations under Pochettino because he improved them as players, the kind words for him from Kane and Dier since he left show the effect he's had on them and their careers.

The fact is without Pochettino these players wouldn't be rated as highly as they are now.

 

[Mainoldo]

You can't ignore that it's two broken clubs from the top to bottom. The way United have wasted money on poor transfers and ridiculous wages given to players that didn't deserve it is agurably worse than Milans "zero" money.

On dead beat managers, Others will claim or already have that LVG was finished and Jose past his sell by date during their time as United manager but the next possible appointment by Mr Woodward is sure to be right? after all how could he fail when this so called messiah awaits the call...

My point is besides being big clubs we have nothing in common. We aren’t doing the same things we aren’t in the same situations and we are by no means at the same level financial or in current stature.

Whether past it or not we still obtained high level managers... I mean Ancelotti wouldn’t even return to AC Milan.. do you think he would turn us down?

I just wish people would stop the comparisons it makes us sound sh*tter than we already are.

 

[JK-27]

Poch won't turn this team around, he just won't. Fact is we have a club that is full of mediocre talent, from first team to under 21's. And not only d we have mediocre talent, the board seem to continually back the mediocre talent, yet let quality managers go.

Jones, Bailly, Rojo, Young, Fred, Matic should have left a long time ago.

Lingard, Mata have had numerous chances and just aren't good enough.

McTominay, Pereira, Fosu-Mensah are never going to be the kind of quality players Utd should have. That's already 11 players out of a squad of 28 who can go.

Factor in Rashford and Martial being inconsistent strikers who can't score regularly and long-term they are also a doubt.

The club is now a major rebuilding project, it will take several transfer windows to fix our squad issues. And several seasons for us to be genuine title contenders. We just need the right manager for it, and Ole is not the right manager.

 

[redshaw]

Yes United reached CL quarter finals under Ole and Moyes but at any stage did United look like a side capable of even reaching the final nevermind winning it? Beaten by Barcelona, Bayern Munich and both were knocked out in the following round with performances they would love to forget.

I'm expecting a 2nd year in a row without CL football, not consistent enough to finish 4th and unlikely to get the Jose rub of the green and win the Europa league. So that will all likely mean United will have their 5th (6th if you count Giggs short spell) manager since 2013. Not easy to adjust too when United had one manager for over two decades.

Finally the financial status of each club is very different, United have more money to spend but a lot of that money spent in recent years has been wasted and major rebuilding is still needed on the panel. Big improvement is required on the scouting and recruitment in the years ahead and would you trust Woodward and Co to achieve what is required?

Which all means to say United are not AC Milan.

I also left out a caretaker for AC Milan but we can include it if you want to include Giggs. Milan still more than double our managers and they might sack their current if want to apply your reaching logic.

What has not looking like we can win the CL got to do with getting to two CL Quarter finals, winning Europa/Uefa cup and being in the CL 3 times, coming second in the PL compared to AC Milan's no show in Serie A and CL over the same time.

We've not slumped to their level yet and the club situation is quite different, hence we're not AC Milan, the comparison is not striking, it's the same as Inter from 2010 and you're trying to dodge it by saying we didn't look like winning the CL, that goes for many.

The clubs colours are red white and black though.

 

[always_hoping]

My point is besides being big clubs we have nothing in common. We aren’t doing the same things we aren’t in the same situations and we are by no means at the same level financial or in current stature.

Whether past it or not we still obtained high level managers... I mean Ancelotti wouldn’t even return to AC Milan.. do you think he would turn us down?

I just wish people would stop the comparisons it makes us sound sh*tter than we already are.

He'll be turning us down now as tied up to Everton.

Look at where both United and Milan finished last season plus points total. Look at the points total this season and league positions this season. The reality is things are shit and could become more shite before getting out of this mess.

 

[Mainoldo]

He'll be turning us down now as tied up to Everton.

Look at where both United and Milan finished last season plus points total. Look at the points total this season and league positions this season. The reality is things are shit and could become more shite before getting out of this mess.

Both teams are in completely different leagues.. if we was in Serie A we would have finished 3rd and if they was in our league they would probably be bottom half of the table. I mean their manager was Rino Gattuso FFS. For 2 seasons at that.

 

[always_hoping]

Both teams are in completely different leagues.. if we was in Serie A we would have finished 3rd and if they was in our league they would probably be bottom half of the table. I mean their manager was Rino Gattuso FFS. For 2 seasons at that.

That's debatable, United currently find themselves behind the might of Sheffield United and Wolves two sides that was playing championship football not so long ago and level on points with Thursdays opponents Newcastle...

 

[thegregster]

Poch won't turn this team around, he just won't. Fact is we have a club that is full of mediocre talent, from first team to under 21's. And not only d we have mediocre talent, the board seem to continually back the mediocre talent, yet let quality managers go.

Jones, Bailly, Rojo, Young, Fred, Matic should have left a long time ago.

Lingard, Mata have had numerous chances and just aren't good enough.

McTominay, Pereira, Fosu-Mensah are never going to be the kind of quality players Utd should have. That's already 11 players out of a squad of 28 who can go.

Factor in Rashford and Martial being inconsistent strikers who can't score regularly and long-term they are also a doubt.

The club is now a major rebuilding project, it will take several transfer windows to fix our squad issues. And several seasons for us to be genuine title contenders. We just need the right manager for it, and Ole is not the right manager.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2013–14_Tottenham_Hotspur_F.C._season

Poch took over a similar squad at Spurs.

The previous summer before he took over Spurs pissed away 98mil on dross like Pauliho,Chadli,Soldado,Caupoe,Chiricheş and Lamela.
Add in all the rest like Lennon,Adebayor,Bentaleb,Townsend etc and they had problems all over.

 

[reddevilchennai]

Poch won't turn this team around, he just won't. Fact is we have a club that is full of mediocre talent, from first team to under 21's. And not only d we have mediocre talent, the board seem to continually back the mediocre talent, yet let quality managers go.

Jones, Bailly, Rojo, Young, Fred, Matic should have left a long time ago.

Lingard, Mata have had numerous chances and just aren't good enough.

McTominay, Pereira, Fosu-Mensah are never going to be the kind of quality players Utd should have. That's already 11 players out of a squad of 28 who can go.

Factor in Rashford and Martial being inconsistent strikers who can't score regularly and long-term they are also a doubt.

The club is now a major rebuilding project, it will take several transfer windows to fix our squad issues. And several seasons for us to be genuine title contenders. We just need the right manager for it, and Ole is not the right manager.

He might not turn this team around. Poch can make this team to play ten passes continuously. Atleast the football will look better with Poch.
With Ole as manager, passing has been absymal, no proper formation and tactics to break down teams that defend deeply, substitutions has been poor, favours Lingard for No.10 position when he has recorded 1 assist/goal in an year in PL, does not have courage to drop players, sits in the bench clueless during the game, etc.

 

[AshRK]

Tottenham had stood still due to lack of serious investment. They top score, and conceded least for a season, which is a good foundation to build on. Wasted chance. That’s more about Levy than the head coach.

Poch‘s style is not exactly gung-ho, yet it’s a modern style based on positioning play, pressing, being comfortable with the ball. This style would demand on players’ quality and compatibility, so there is a point where you must purchase new players to elevate/improve the team. Levy doesn’t spend (summer 2018 at all) (and overall) on the same level as City and Liverpool summer 2018. Expecting Poch Tottenham to continue to progress is just too unrealistic. Poch’s failure to win smaller trophies is a problem, but not so different to Klopp‘s Liverpool. Both reached a CL final, which is a turning point. Klopp had the backing, while the backing from Levy is laughable. Liverpool went on different level while Tottenham infighting and Poch lost the dressing room. Klopp’s Dortmund faced similar issue: style gets stale with squad quality decrease as replacement couldn’t fill in for the outgoing players. Klopp lost the dressing room, Dortmund lingering mid table despite their quality was still CL level.

It has been discussed many times here and on other forums, Klopp’s style implements counter attacking phase after the counter pressing phase, which is different than that of Pep,’s which prioritizes reorganizing the team shape, which in turn favors recycling possession first. Just state Poch’ style is based on playing off counter, to complain about his side is less attractive without considering context (lack of investment in squad quality over time) is just empty words. Not long ago, Klopp’s Liverpool was headless chicken in their approach, and struggled against teams that don’t allow them space to counter attack after their counter press (gen gen pressing)

All fair points and my reservations regarding Poch had nothing to do with him not being a good coach. He is a good coach and If he is appointed I would back him and hopefully our fans show some patience towards him. Maybe you are correct lack of reinforcement could be one reason why SPurs football started to look a tad stale. But let us not forget he still had a good starting 11 comprising of Eriksen, Kane, Ali, top defenders, good goal keeper and a much better midfielder than what we have.

I think we should not overrate his style of football and have false expectation. I have not seen his side completely dominate big teams consistently. In last couple of years he preferred to have his side play on counters in big games and sometimes it worked and sometimes it did not. I am also not sure hoe much our squad will be suitable for him considering we do not have a striker like Kane nor attackers/midfielders who are able to perform consistently like Eriksen and Ali once did for him. This is why fans have to be really patient under him. He is not someone who will give you an instant success.

 

[Majima]

Mediocre? And still managed to come one place better then us despite us having stars in the team (although some on way down). Once again you are making Tottenham as if they were Wycombe and not some top team.

Eriksen was dominating in Netherlands. Verthongen was already playing in Ajax and was important part. Lloris came like a next goalkeeperstar, already nominated for best goalkeeper by UEFA. Walker were already a Premier Legaue fullback that was established. Pochettino didn't came to a empty table. He came to internationals and stars.


Yes, and still he is without a job. Despite team like Bayern having none of the worst seasons in long time. My guess is that he will end up in a team that is pushing for CL places somewhere. And not a team that is pushing for titles. Because if we are honost, he is no winner. Not titles at least.


No, they were not. Not for me. They did have a clue. Attack. That was the system. Defensivly they were bad. Attacking wise they were good.

I said Eriksen was promising. Along with Lamela (even though he was flopping at the time).

What's so hard to get? The so called ''Internationals and Stars'' Lloris, Verthongen, Walker & Rose, shipped 51 goals the season before Poch. That's 11th highest. Definition of average.

You say they were good attacking wise to make up for it. No they were not. They only scored 55 goals. 7th highest behind Everton (61) & us in 5th (64). You're talking about our season under LVG, where everyone was complaining about how dull and little goals we were scoring, we managed to score 9 more than them.

Mediocre defensively + attacking = Mediocre football team.

Explain this if you think they were good attacking wise, and that Pochettino walked into ''Internationals and stars''.

 

[Xaviesta]

Somebody with a subscription to the athletic could summarise but they claim United are no longer desperate for Pochettino: https://theathletic.com/1396462/?so...ttCnI4lN7Tz-pj5t5Kxd0yRQNMknMWOr2iFe4QJ6coG90

 

[passing-wind]

Forget many of the senseless debates, Solskjaer is at best a championship level manager because twice in the premier league now he's failed to excel. No amount of investment is going to make him turn around into some world class tactician.

Poch is a step up from Solskjaer and there's more negatives in the direction of Ole as opposed to Poch. Solskjaer's Molde league win is about as useful as his playing career in management. If it's any merit that a manager can win anything, then let's just hire the winners of the MLS, Ekstraklasa or the Romanian league and give it a pop.

I'd take any one of Rose, Naglesmann, Tuchel or Poch in a heartbeat if it means getting rid of Ole.

 

[momo83]

Mediocre? And still managed to come one place better then us despite us having stars in the team (although some on way down). Once again you are making Tottenham as if they were Wycombe and not some top team.

Eriksen was dominating in Netherlands. Verthongen was already playing in Ajax and was important part. Lloris came like a next goalkeeperstar, already nominated for best goalkeeper by UEFA. Walker were already a Premier Legaue fullback that was established. Pochettino didn't came to a empty table. He came to internationals and stars.


Yes, and still he is without a job. Despite team like Bayern having noe of the worst seasons in long time. My guess is that he will end up in a team that is pushing for CL places somewhere. And not a team that is pushing for titles. Because if we are honost, he is no winner. Not titles at least.


No, they were not. Not for me. They did have a clue. Attack. That was the system. Defensivly they were bad. Attackingwise they were good.

I’ve mentioned this before. Ericson, lamella, etc were all considered signings that flopped before Poch arrived. You might love Ole, but changing history and lying just proves you either don’t know much or have to bs to try and make Ole look good

 

[alexthelion]

Our transfer business hasn’t been great, so some fans believe he is at fault because of that. They believe since our club has poor structure, our performance suffers because of that. However, I don’t see it fully that way. Woodward has giving our manager warchest after warchest to spend on players. We just have chosen managers with different philosophy that has resulted in a somewhat unbalanced squad after spending nearly a billion pound. Pochettino will fix that because in the five years he has been with Spurs and with limited resources, he has created one of the best team in Europe. Pochettino sports science, philosophy and eye for developing players and finding talent is what United need to get back on top of Europe m

Are you related to Poch?

 

[Gehrman]

Mediocre? And still managed to come one place better then us despite us having stars in the team (although some on way down). Once again you are making Tottenham as if they were Wycombe and not some top team.

Eriksen was dominating in Netherlands. Verthongen was already playing in Ajax and was important part. Lloris came like a next goalkeeperstar, already nominated for best goalkeeper by UEFA. Walker were already a Premier Legaue fullback that was established. Pochettino didn't came to a empty table. He came to internationals and stars.


Yes, and still he is without a job. Despite team like Bayern having noe of the worst seasons in long time. My guess is that he will end up in a team that is pushing for CL places somewhere. And not a team that is pushing for titles. Because if we are honost, he is no winner. Not titles at least.


No, they were not. Not for me. They did have a clue. Attack. That was the system. Defensivly they were bad. Attackingwise they were good.

Since when are you expected to win the the PL with Spurs or Southamption? Or the CL for that matter(knocked out City despite missing his best player).

Poch has far more pedigree to deliver what we are looking atm than OGS that has none. If there are better coaches out there than Poch that suit us then we should go for them. If there isnt we should go for Poch. OGS has had his 1 year now and we havn' made progress in our result. Yeah beating City is nice but it's kind of pointless when we are losing to the worst teams in the league.

 

[Mainoldo]

That's debatable, United currently find themselves behind the might of Sheffield United and Wolves two sides that was playing championship football not so long ago and level on points with Thursdays opponents Newcastle...

Simply because we decided to do what that did and hire an ex under qualified manager.

But that’s the only thing we have in common.

 

[ti vu]

All fair points and my reservations regarding Poch had nothing to do with him not being a good coach. He is a good coach and If he is appointed I would back him and hopefully our fans show some patience towards him. Maybe you are correct lack of reinforcement could be one reason why SPurs football started to look a tad stale. But let us not forget he still had a good starting 11 comprising of Eriksen, Kane, Ali, top defenders, good goal keeper and a much better midfielder than what we have.

I think we should not overrate his style of football and have false expectation. I have not seen his side completely dominate big teams consistently. In last couple of years he preferred to have his side play on counters in big games and sometimes it worked and sometimes it did not. I am also not sure hoe much our squad will be suitable for him considering we do not have a striker like Kane nor attackers/midfielders who are able to perform consistently like Eriksen and Ali once did for him. This is why fans have to be really patient under him. He is not someone who will give you an instant success.

I don’t understand the point people keep mentioning about Tottenham still have a good starting XI/ better than us. Overall that team meets their target finishing top 4. Past season reached CL final. There is a point where players burning out physically & mentally after all these long seasons is predictably understandable (people had been talking about that for few seasons now in their Tottenham players have been wasting their career when the squad lack that extra push in term of quality injection to seriously try to win).

If it’s about not winning smaller trophies, then it’s an entire different point. Yes Poch should shoulder a lot of this blame, and which is why for him to be considered an elite coach is questionable. I feel like Poch would regret now after his sacking that he didn’t try harder for those smaller trophies instead of going on a goose chase about winning PL & CL project following Levy’s empty promise.

Back to us, it’s unrealistic to be able to lure an elite coach here after all the farce with Woodward getting exposed in recent time. Attainable is the first thing to consider. The squad is in terrible shape. It’s more a job for someone who wants to prove a point, willing & having experience in cleaning up a mess, and turning thing around. Still young to carry out a possible plan unlike LVG project. Poch is the best candidate ticking these boxes.

Only Pep‘s Barcelona at their pomp is considered as consistently dominating top teams. City, Bayern had period of domination then it waned with other top teams starting to be able to exploit the not so perfect condition of Pep’s Bayern & City. October 2017 Liverpool was still being thrashed by Poch‘s Tottenham. Not so dissimilar to what Liverpool would in turn to do to Pep’s City in CL. Bringing Liverpool up as people keep talking up Liverpool as if Liverpool had been all that when until their summer 2018, they‘re not all that. Liverpool couldn’t win against us either, and tactically defeated in that 2-0 game at OT. Poch’s team lacking mentality fortitude needs to be questionable as mentioned. However, people seem to forget how the games were played out, and only looking at result. Many occasion where they dominate the game but fail with result doesn’t negate the fact that Poch had come a long way with Tottenham to build a style, and a team that can play. That Tottenham can’t be fine tuned further than spending seriously.

 

[90 + 5min]

I said Eriksen was promising. Along with Lamela (even though he was flopping at the time).

What's so hard to get? The so called ''Internationals and Stars'' Lloris, Verthongen, Walker & Rose, shipped 51 goals the season before Poch. That's 11th highest. Definition of average.

You say they were good attacking wise to make up for it. No they were not. They only scored 55 goals. 7th highest behind Everton (61) & us in 5th (64). You're talking about our season under LVG, where everyone was complaining about how dull and little goals we were scoring, we managed to score 9 more than them.

Mediocre defensively + attacking = Mediocre football team.

Explain this if you think they were good attacking wise, and that Pochettino walked into ''Internationals and stars''.

I never said they were worldbeaters when they appointed Poch. They were very good team. And there is one more thing. They did have a manager, didn’t they?

I’ve mentioned this before. Ericson, lamella, etc were all considered signings that flopped before Poch arrived. You might love Ole, but changing history and lying just proves you either don’t know much or have to bs to try and make Ole look good

No they were not. You are trying to change history. They were not Messi and Ronaldo but they were still very good players. If you want to talk signings, why don’t you wonder why players of high calibre like Paulinho and Soldado flopped? And there is more.

I don’t love Ole. I love reality, understanding and som kind of patience.

Since when are you expected to win the the PL with Spurs or Southamption? Or the CL for that matter(knocked out City despite missing his best player).

Poch has far more pedigree to deliver what we are looking atm than OGS that has none. If there are better coaches out there than Poch that suit us then we should go for them. If there isnt we should go for Poch. OGS has had his 1 year now and we havn' made progress in our result. Yeah beating City is nice but it's kind of pointless when we are losing to the worst teams in the league.

Nobody is expecting Tottenham to win the league. And what I remember they did just what we expected. Zero titles. That is with very good players. If it is on manager or players, that can be discussed. They should have won at least a cup.
I don’t think Poch is the answer to our problems. The answer is time. If Poch would come to us I would stay behind him as I am behind Ole and I would say, give manager time. But I guess that lot of you would set up unrealistic goals and in 1 year time shout after new manager because he didn’t deliver that what you

 

[always_hoping]

Simply because we decided to do what that did and hire an ex under qualified manager.

But that’s the only thing we have in common.

Two broken/poorly run club is the main thing we have in common. Not to worry though as i suppose you are one of those people that reckon everything will be fine once a "qualified" manager is appointed.

 

[Majima]

I never said they were worldbeaters when they appointed Poch. They were very good team. And there is one more thing. They did have a manager, didn’t they?


No they were not. You are trying to change history. They were not Messi and Ronaldo but they were still very good players. If you want to talk signings, why don’t you wonder why players of high calibre like Paulinho and Soldado flopped? And there is more.

I don’t love Ole. I love reality, understanding and som kind of patience.

You're losing credibility here talking about reality and understanding, whilst refusing to acknowledge that Spurs were nowhere near as good to begin with. They were not a ''very good team''. ''Very good teams'' don't have the 11th best defensive record + 7th best attacking record. You said Poch walked into ''internationals and stars''. That couldn't be further from the truth, as i tried to explain.

No, @momo83 is not trying to change history. He is telling the truth, go speak to any objective Spurs fan about what they were like under AVB & Sherwood. Lamela was a flop. Paulinho & Soldado high calibre?

 

[90 + 5min]

You're losing credibility here talking about reality and understanding, whilst refusing to acknowledge that Spurs were nowhere near as good to begin with. They were not a ''very good team''. ''Very good teams'' don't have the 11th best defensive record + 7th best attacking record. You said Poch walked into ''internationals and stars''. That couldn't be further from the truth, as i tried to explain.

No, @momo83 is not trying to change history. He is telling the truth, go speak to any objective Spurs fan about what they were like under AVB & Sherwood. Lamela was a flop. Paulinho & Soldado high calibre?

So coming 4th, 5th, 4th, 5th, 6th prior Pochettino is not being good team? What is good team?

I’m still telling you that he walked into internationals and stars. Like it or not. Just look at the squad. It is not hard.

You are laughing at players like Soldado and Paulinho. Soldado came from Valencia as a goalscorer who had great stats in Premiera and Champions League. Even playing in national team. Paulinho came from Brazil as a international and a player lots of top teams wanted. One thing is that Poch didn’t know how to use them, one thing is saying they were not high calibre.

 

[BlueHaze]

I feel like he's the only one out there available at the minute who could steady the ship even under a clown like Woodward. Can't see us challenging for anything any time soon if we hired him but I would be much more confident of top 4 qualification at least. Would bring him in asap if it was up to me. At times I've been fine with Ole till the end of the season and asses afterwards but I've had enough. It's become painful.

 

[GlastonSpur]

Even if we go with the Poch isn't a winner narrative, I wouldn't mind if he had a run with us like he did with Spurs. …

Exactly so.

It seems some United fans are in denial as to how far your club has fallen. You've gone from league champions under Fergie to become more or less a serial Europa League team.

There is also denial about how much further the decline might go if nothing changes.

 

[Amadaeus]

Somebody with a subscription to the athletic could summarise but they claim United are no longer desperate for Pochettino: https://theathletic.com/1396462/?so...ttCnI4lN7Tz-pj5t5Kxd0yRQNMknMWOr2iFe4QJ6coG90

What have our club done right post Sir Alex? I would not be surprised if this is true.

Exactly so.

It seems some United fans are in denial as to how far your club has fallen. You've gone from league champions under Fergie to become more or less a serial Europa League team.

There is also denial about how much further the decline might go if nothing changes.

+1. Some fans are really in denial. I would love it if we are consistently in champions league and at least making it to the semi finals of that competition than battling the mighty Astana and winning few empty trophies that resemble the Audi Cup. With more resources, it is only logical to expect that we would see success as well

 

[Mainoldo]

Two broken/poorly run club is the main thing we have in common. Not to worry though as i suppose you are one of those people that reckon everything will be fine once a "qualified" manager is appointed.

No. I’m the guy that can identify the difference between a Carrot and a Tomato. You just call them vegetables.

 

[Random Task]

Exactly so.

It seems some United fans are in denial as to how far your club has fallen. You've gone from league champions under Fergie to become more or less a serial Europa League team.

There is also denial about how much further the decline might go if nothing changes.

How's Jose working out so far?

 

[Zlatan 7]

No. I’m the guy that can identify the difference between a Carrot and a Tomato. You just call them vegetables.

Tomato is my favourite vegetable

 

[Mainoldo]

Tomato is my favourite vegetable

It shouldn’t be it’s a fruit.