True but it's also because they waste the resources we do have.
We spent enough to be competitive. But they let incompetent people waste it.
5 years without a trophy - Further away than ever
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True but it's also because they waste the resources we do have.
We spent enough to be competitive. But they let incompetent people waste it.
Don't let Fergie hear people say that. Winning at any cost was all that mattered.
Yes including the cups despite people here looking down in them even though we can't win them.
You say manager I say players are more important. We just disagree, no need for insults. Although I'm right.You are either troll or the most deluded person on this forum. Seriously man
You're not. Lampard had the same players.
The exact Chelsea team were sitting 9th with Lampard in charge and looked just as clueless as we do most of the time. How did these players suddenly turn to be good? Clearly has something to do with changing the manager... Don't you think?
I'm not saying a manager can't do a very bad job.
You believe Tuchel is your proof tonight but the better manager lost.
Your opinions are best left back in 99.
Not really. You can progress and not wina cup. You can be quite poor and have a decent run and win silverware.
More concerning for me is the our tactical ethos after two and a half years is to sit and hope nervously that Fernandes has a good game
I find it impossible to separate the awful starts Chelsea and Liverpool had to how I view our progress this year. This really doesn’t feel like a team or manager likely to kick on for me
Hilarious. So you think Tuchel is a better manager than Pep?
Tuchel was the better manager on the night, he got his tactics spot on and pep didn’t.
I'd swap places with chelsea right now than be second.
It's a bit of both - managers need the players that work for their system.
Tuchel has done a fantastic job turning this team into kryptonite for teams that press, but they struggle against teams who sit back (a bit like us).
Very few managers are adaptable enough to make any set of players successful, and those that are usually help teams survive rather than win stuff, think big Sam, and his ilk.
Ole beat Pep a few times. Do you think Ole is a better manager than Pep?
On results, which so, so many on this forum have been telling me this season is all that counts, absolutely yes.
Things might change but the top dog in football management is not a crown that is exclusive for long. It used to be Mourinho and then Guardiola took over.
This season he's been able to dominate thanks to his ridiculous squad depth but let's not forget Klopp schooled him plenty of times before this year and now it's the turn of his compatriot Tuchel.
It's also interesting that the last 3 CL winning managers have been German. It's so obvious that's where we should have looked for our appointment but we went for Ole Gunner 'perpetual' Student and he's still learning how to make a sub.
Well yes of course. But Chelsea sacked a popular former player and replaced him with an established, competent manager who got them playing good football and ended the season with a European trophy.
I can’t possibly see what you might think the lesson for us in that might be
4 years without a trophy is hard to stomach. But watching Liverpool and Chelsea winning PL and UCL titles makes it even worse.
The Glazers don't give a crap in hell about Manchester United winning titles. Chelsea's Starting XI is vastly superior to Utd's.
The Glazers don't give a crap in hell about Manchester United winning titles. Chelsea's Starting XI is vastly superior to Utd's.
He did. They deserved it.
But they lost an FA Cup final to Leicester and a crucial game to Villa last week (which fortunately didn't matter), now everyone here with a particlar agenda is making out he's amazing and proof we should sack our manager.
No, why would I?
let’s never make any changes or sign anyone unless we can prove definitively they’ve never had a poor match then.
Sancho was shit once against Hamburg yet muppets want to sign him apparently
He is proof. Top teams lose to smaller teams all the time. When it really mattered...he got it right...He won The UCL. I am sure any supporter would take that over an FA Cup. Losing to Villa did not stop them from going from 9th to 4th. He accomplished the goal of top 4 and a trophy. He beat Real and Atletico(The Spanish Champions) to get to the final. We lost a cup final to Villareal. A team whose squad cost about the same as we paid for Fred with several players that failed in The EPL. If you can't see the difference in achievement then I can't help you.
Similar favorites? Hell no. Chelsea is a very good team, Villarreal is garbage.
The pre match odds were almost the same.
We might be 4 years without a trophy but City still haven’t won the CL! 
May be, but still the difference in quality between teams it's higher between us and Villarreal than between City and Chelsea.
Came here to see who was wallowing in it even when United aren't playing.
Pathetic.
Pathetic.
Mental gymnastics at their finest.
Both top managers. One manager won in a game where only one team can win.
By the same token, City have the better team so it's proof that signing better players doesn't mean fuxk all for Ole.
They've won 20 major trophies over the last 20 years, by far the most in England over that time...
Think their model, which is the same as with the Madrids, Bayerns, Barcelonas, PSG's etc, is a lot more conducive to winning in the modern game than our outdated one of placing the manager on a pedestal and swearing fealty to them without conditions
We laugh and deplore plastic chelski but you can’t knock their recent trophy record. Their silent but ruthless owner demands success and doesn’t care who he sacks and how often to get there. They’ve now won two champion leagues since our last. I’m depressed
We are just outdated, same as our stadium, training ground etc. We are still following Fergie's philosophy, and he is gone. We either go with the times or wait and hope until a new Fergie emerges in decades and decades to come, with much less success in the meantime. Fun times.
Yes of course. This is now based on success and not a popularity contest. They would easily sack Tuchel if he doesn't win again in two years time.
We are muppets. I got more depressed when I saw how agitated Tuchel was on the touch line and it shows to his players and fans what it means. Not sit on his arse looking glum. What a difference it makes when the owners get a competent manager.
The problem is this only works if you have a quality director of football or in Chelseas part apparently an owner who despite me disliking him seems to know how to assemble a squad that can win things.
As long as this isn't the case with us we would have to chop and change the squad every 2 years to appease the new manager, which would be a real problem imo.
I know we have a director of football now but so far I have no clue if he is actually any good or even has as much power as some of the directors of football have at the other clubs you mentioned.
I’d have someone like a Conte tomorrow. I honestly would take the gamble now that Ole has done his job and got us at least back in the champions league more regularly. Ruthless some may say but who’s holding the European Cup tonight....
We won't sign more than 1 starting eleven player.
There is far more than just Ole that is the problem.
We should have best in class in every department in order to compete.
Owners - Sucking money out of the club and curtailing any progression.
Manager - An inexperienced, nervous guy who is only there because he is our legend.
Coaching Staff - Ex players etc. The proof has been there for years that they really are not doing a good job. (Do we even have defensive coaches?)
Facilities - Compared to City, Chelsea, Spurs, we have not invested to maintain our lead and now we are far, far behind. (No doubt of the purchase of players has been impacted by this. Tour of OT vs tour of Tottenham Hotspur Stadium for a player? - No comparison)
Players - How many of our players would get into other top 6 teams? Maybe if we were coached better, but see the third point.
The wait will go on for many years until this club is rebuilt from the ground up. Who wants to be winning the Europa League next year?
We should have best in class in every department in order to compete.
Owners - Sucking money out of the club and curtailing any progression.
Manager - An inexperienced, nervous guy who is only there because he is our legend.
Coaching Staff - Ex players etc. The proof has been there for years that they really are not doing a good job. (Do we even have defensive coaches?)
Facilities - Compared to City, Chelsea, Spurs, we have not invested to maintain our lead and now we are far, far behind. (No doubt of the purchase of players has been impacted by this. Tour of OT vs tour of Tottenham Hotspur Stadium for a player? - No comparison)
Players - How many of our players would get into other top 6 teams? Maybe if we were coached better, but see the third point.
The wait will go on for many years until this club is rebuilt from the ground up. Who wants to be winning the Europa League next year?
Two years time? They'll happily sack him at Christmas if they're struggling. And it would probably end up being the correct decision.
This is very true. You could see with Liverpool in 17/18 that they were clearly onto something. It was clear as day that alll they needed to do was buy a defender. Everything else was there.
Chelsea are very similar, actually, although they actually won the CL rather than just reaching the final. But even if they didn't win today, I think you can clearly see they are on the right track. Everything is there, except one thing.
It was obvious that Liverpool needed a defender, and it is similarly obvious that all Chelsea need is a striker. I think the right striker signing will have a Van Dijk impact on Chelsea. They will challenge for the PL next season with this.
For Manutd, I don't see this clear path. I don't see a puzzle that needs a piece here or there. I see a mess, where the parts we have haven't been joined together properly. There is no clear discipline or tactics embedded into the team. It still looks like a jigsaw that has just been poured out of its box.
Darren Fletcher and Michael Carrick has a record at United of completing the highest number of passes at United. Then I found out that it was between themselves. these are the kind of people we have in charge at United.
Get Hassenhuttl. Most coaches appointed by Ralf Rangnick has turned to be successful. Yes Southampton is just above relegation but he is going to be a top coach and will move to a bigger club. Klopp did get relegated too.
Get Hassenhuttl. Most coaches appointed by Ralf Rangnick has turned to be successful. Yes Southampton is just above relegation but he is going to be a top coach and will move to a bigger club. Klopp did get relegated too.
When it comes to the crunch we have a manager who’ll sit passively on the bench , looking at his screen, biting his lip , looking nervously on too chicken shit to even substitute an injured player whose been stinking up the joint for weeks.
He brings nothing except convincing people that rivals collapsing somehow represents progress for us.
Well that would be very easy...he has won more games and earned more points. If you would rather keep finishing 6th with a 2nd tier pot from time-to-time then fine but I care about winning games in the PL
We are pretty much a joke now, we have literally become what we used to laugh at Liverpool & Arsenal for. The standards are absolutely in the gutter and unfortunately more & more clubs are catching up. When Saf left we had such a huge gap over most of the other clubs but now we are pretty much always in a rebuild. Constant rebuilding without any actual product. Absolute joke club from top to bottom. Now watch us give more useless players ridiculous contracts for no apparent reason and continue this rebuild
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