2020 US Elections | Biden certified as President | Dems control Congress

Status
Not open for further replies.
I don't know about that. Trump hasn't done what Dubya did, and is still incredibly unpopular. It has a lot to do with personality alongside policy.
Trump is an evil narcisist , nothing unexpected when liberal minded people can't stand him. But my point is that Dubya was generally liked before the Iraq war, after 9/11 that is.
 
I don't know about that. Trump hasn't done what Dubya did, and is still incredibly unpopular. It has a lot to do with personality alongside policy.

The Greenland thing was what turned it for Denmark. Their prime minister called him Donald dump and a joker :drool: They really detest him over there!

It's not just healthcare. For example, the Dems support private gun ownership, albeit with greater restrictions than the Republicans want. In Europe, hardly any mainstream parties support private gun ownership, except in highly restricted circumstances such as pest control (farmers) or for very limited hunting purposes (e.g. grouse shooting).

gun ownership is enshrined in their constitution. They don’t really have a choice. (And there’s nothing intrinsically wrong with private gun ownership)
 
:lol: I know bud. I was being an ass about how Trump spent all of 2015-2016 saying we’d be more respected.

You are, by Kim jong un:lol: And Putin “likes us.” The “great president Xi“ liked us too before the China virus!

The proud boys respect federal government more too!
 
...
gun ownership is enshrined in their constitution. They don’t really have a choice. (And there’s nothing intrinsically wrong with private gun ownership)

Constitutions can be amended or changed.

And yes, there is something intrinsically wrong with private gun ownership - e.g. a vast increase in gun-related death rates. It's a product of toxic masculinity.
 
Constitutions can be amended or changed.

And yes, there is something intrinsically wrong with private gun ownership - e.g. a vast increase in gun-related death rates. It's a product of toxic masculinity.

Only in dreamland. There’s a reason there’s not been a single constitutional amendment for decades.

The evidence suggests you’re very wrong. It shows that guns need controlled, not banned. I’ll let you keep harping on about toxic masculinity and uneducated males though. If you wanted to educate yourself on the subject, you’d have done so by now.
 
Ah hell, I forgot about those bastards.

Feck me it really is quite sad for you guys. I'm far from an international relations expert, yet its obvious the balance of world power has heavily shifted. You've practically given up on Africa; China own it now. And you potentially have an election coming up where the fecking president is going to act like a strongman and attempt to steal it.

Biden or no Biden, you've much work to do. (He'll probably feck up the one positive international change that Trump did effect though...)
 
Feck me it really is quite sad for you guys. I'm far from an international relations expert, yet its obvious the balance of world power has heavily shifted. You've practically given up on Africa; China own it now. And you potentially have an election coming up where the fecking president is going to act like a strongman and attempt to steal it.

Biden or no Biden, you've much work to do. (He'll probably feck up the one positive international change that Trump did effect though...)
Do tell
 
Feck me it really is quite sad for you guys. I'm far from an international relations expert, yet its obvious the balance of world power has heavily shifted. You've practically given up on Africa; China own it now. And you potentially have an election coming up where the fecking president is going to act like a strongman and attempt to steal it.

Biden or no Biden, you've much work to do. (He'll probably feck up the one positive international change that Trump did effect though...)

Africa is obviously not a priority for the US's strategic interests as it is for China.

The main priority is renewed great power competition with China itself, and to a lesser degree Russia.
 

Ah, the Israel thing and the policy of 'positive pressure' towards the gulf states. I'm not sure how I altogether feel about it as I've not exactly studied it. But he does seem to have managed to accelerate a very slowly alligning partnership based on strategic need into one that's somewhat faster. I'm reading there's pressure on Sudan too, though that one seems more forced.

I think the UAE/Bahrain peace deals can only be a good thing for the region though. (And the saudis will follow eventually)
 
Ah, the Israel thing and the policy of 'positive pressure' towards the gulf states. I'm not sure how I altogether feel about it as I've not exactly studied it. But he does seem to have managed to accelerate a very slowly alligning partnership based on strategic need into one that's somewhat faster. I'm reading there's pressure on Sudan too, though that one seems more forced.

I think the UAE/Bahrain peace deals can only be a good thing for the region though. (And the saudis will follow eventually)
Israel signing “peace deals” with two countries they weren’t at war with seems to be a whole lot to do about nothing to me.
 
Israel signing “peace deals” with two countries they weren’t at war with seems to be a whole lot to do about nothing to me.

It is - purely a publicity stunt by Kushner on Trump's behalf to give him a "win" and make it seem like Trump is solving middle east problems, when the underlying issues between all these countries haven't changed and will probably revert back once Trump and Netenyahu leave.
 
Israel signing “peace deals” with two countries they weren’t at war with seems to be a whole lot to do about nothing to me.

It is - purely a publicity stunt by Kushner on Trump's behalf to give him a "win" and make it seem like Trump is solving middle east problems, when the underlying issues between all these countries haven't changed and will probably revert back once Trump and Netenyahu leave.

I disagree. Those countries, [especially the UAE] have had converging interests for ages. It's more overt now, they recognise each others passports, and can do trade. It will long outlast Netanyhu.

Now if you were to talk about the pressure on Sudan to recognise them, I'd agree.
 
I disagree. Those countries, [especially the UAE] have had converging interests for ages. It's more overt now, they recognise each others passports, and can do trade. It will long outlast Netanyhu.

Now if you were to talk about the pressure on Sudan to recognise them, I'd agree.

They do have converging interests, but only to a degree. Other than their mutual disdain for Iran, there's really very little they have in common and the only reason some of the Arab states are playing ball at the moment is to placate Trump and not offend him in any way.
 
I disagree. Those countries, [especially the UAE] have had converging interests for ages. It's more overt now, they recognise each others passports, and can do trade. It will long outlast Netanyhu.

Now if you were to talk about the pressure on Sudan to recognise them, I'd agree.
Yeah, I don’t see it. The Palestinians aren’t happy with the Abraham Accords, which really tells you all you need to know about the motivations behind them.
 
They do have converging interests, but only to a degree. Other than their mutual disdain for Iran, there's really very little they have in common and the only reason some of the Arab states are playing ball at the moment is to placate Trump and not offend him in any way.

Economic interest and arms sales. I think Trump just gave them the political cover to go for it. (I'm pretty sure advanced arms is one of the Arabs end goals from Israel)

I guess we'll see after the election.

Mutual Disdain is a rather mild term by the way :D

Yeah, I don’t see it. The Palestinians aren’t happy with the Abraham Accords, which really tells you all you need to know about the motivations behind them.

The Palestinians won't be happy until Israel is a smouldering reminicsence of Carthage.
 
Only in dreamland. There’s a reason there’s not been a single constitutional amendment for decades.

The evidence suggests you’re very wrong. It shows that guns need controlled, not banned. I’ll let you keep harping on about toxic masculinity and uneducated males though. If you wanted to educate yourself on the subject, you’d have done so by now.

The evidence shows that private gun ownership leads to increased deaths by gunshot. The USA rate per head of population is, for example, 53 times that of the UK.

World-wide, 96% of those committing murder are male. Toxic masculinity is a big problem whether you like it or not.
 
The evidence shows that private gun ownership leads to increased deaths by gunshot. The USA rate per head of population is, for example, 53 times that of the UK.

World-wide, 96% of those committing murder are male. Toxic masculinity is a big problem whether you like it or not.

Steady on Donald. Don't try to wriggle. You said, and I quote: "And yes, there is something intrinsically wrong with private gun ownership - e.g. a vast increase in gun-related death rates. It's a product of toxic masculinity."

The conversation is about whether private gun owenrship is a product of as you call it "toxic masculinity," and is responsible for huge death rates; not whether that exists, or how big a problem it is. So lets stick to private gun ownership instead of pivoting back to our soundbites eh?

The evidence is as follows, as we covered before:

The US rate of murder/gun death rate (suicides matter too ya know), is far larger than the UK. We know that. We accept that. The US has a huge rate/100k. The UK by comparison is around 0.26/100k.

You posited that the cause of that high death rate is private gun ownership which is a product of toxic masculinity. You also posited that liberal governments especially in Europe want to ban guns.
I replied that it's not, and you're talking crap.

So let's have a look at other countries, where private gun laws are allowed and encouraged, but are nicely regulated. (Which is what the democrats call for )

Let's start with Canada as it's right next door, has a lefty government. They have a rate of 2.0. 1.60 of those are unfortunately suicides. Compared to the UK this might seem bad. However, they have a lower total homicide rate by around 20%.

Ok, lets move on to Europe. We'll start with Norway as it's kinda easy to get a gun there. A rate of 1.75 is again higher than the UK, but far lower than the US. Unfortunately for the UK, the total homicides in norway is 0.47 compared to 1.76 for the UK. Not exactly a right wing government either.

Switzerland 2.64. Austria 2.75. Israel 2.04 - All allow guns. All have lower homicide rates than the UK.

I'd continue but this is akin to taking penalties against a dwarf.
 
Last edited:


It's rather curious - he seems to have got this relatively big bounce in nationals, but not in state polling. Important questions remain. I've tried to model to the best of my ability, but it's not completely clear. (hence my moonshot comment wrt alaska)

You also have to question is there's any damned elasticity left in the electorate, or whether this is now just a game of vote vs suppress votes.
 
It's rather curious - he seems to have got this relatively big bounce in nationals, but not in state polling. Important questions remain. I've tried to model to the best of my ability, but it's not completely clear. (hence my moonshot comment wrt alaska)

You also have to question is there's any damned elasticity left in the electorate, or whether this is now just a game of vote vs suppress votes.


It’s probably due to heavily Dem California being the most populous state, which means national polling is always going to be slightly bluer than swing state polling. That said, I’ve seen recent Quinnepiac polls in PA and FL that have Biden up 13 and 11 respectively, so at that point you would have to look at the individual pollsters to see how their sampling and methodologies diverge to understand how numbers in swing states play against national polls.
 
Constitutions can be amended or changed.

And yes, there is something intrinsically wrong with private gun ownership - e.g. a vast increase in gun-related death rates. It's a product of toxic masculinity.
My impression is that the big issue with guns in the US is the extremely low threshold people have when it comes to actually using them against other people. I guess allowing people to carry automatic assault rifles designed for the armed forces and warfare doesn't help, but it seems like it's totally normal and accepted to just shoot each other seven times in the back for any small shitty reason.

Norway has 1,3 million guns for instance, 5 mill citizens, but we don't walk around blasting each other's heads off for no reason over here.
 
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-54497567

Another shooting at a protest... got a nasty feeling the run up to the election and indeed the election will see more incidents

Perhaps its time for some armed un observers / peacekeeps ... or do the normal rules not apply to America
The alleged shooter was actually hired by a local TV station to provide security. That’s an interesting wrinkle to this whole saga. If the security guard was hit & pepper sprayed, then he shoots & kills that person, what’s the legal recourse? The kid in Wisconsin was in the same situation & his lawyers are going to claim self defense; no doubt the same thing happens here with an even stronger case for the security guard to go free?
 
It’s probably due to heavily Dem California being the most populous state, which means national polling is always going to be slightly bluer than swing state polling. That said, I’ve seen recent Quinnepiac polls in PA and FL that have Biden up 13 and 11 respectively, so at that point you would have to look at the individual pollsters to see how their sampling and methodologies diverge to understand how numbers in swing states play against national polls.

Last decent poll around 2 weeks ago (we dont count surveymonkey) in cali had undecided voters at around 5% iirc. NY and other strongholds similar. Not enough elasticity. Around 10-11% of voters are undecided (or were as of 3 weeks ago); It's also around 5% in states like GA and AZ, so there's leakage [or bad polling] somewhere. To get a 2% national swing if the undecided are like 5% average would be unprecedented so I'm inclined to feel that 10-11% was correct, and it's now a little less at around 7-8%.

Definitely not methodological on the underlying numbers; it's fairly consistent.
 
Steady on Donald. Don't try to wriggle. You said, and I quote: "And yes, there is something intrinsically wrong with private gun ownership - e.g. a vast increase in gun-related death rates. It's a product of toxic masculinity."

The conversation is about whether private gun owenrship is a product of as you call it "toxic masculinity," and is responsible for huge death rates; not whether that exists, or how big a problem it is. So lets stick to private gun ownership instead of pivoting back to our soundbites eh?

The evidence is as follows, as we covered before:

The US rate of murder/gun death rate (suicides matter too ya know), is far larger than the UK. We know that. We accept that. The US has a huge rate/100k. The UK by comparison is around 0.26/100k.

You posited that the cause of that high death rate is private gun ownership which is a product of toxic masculinity. You also posited that liberal governments especially in Europe want to ban guns.
I replied that it's not, and you're talking crap.

So let's have a look at other countries, where private gun laws are allowed and encouraged, but are nicely regulated. (Which is what the democrats call for )

Let's start with Canada as it's right next door, has a lefty government. They have a rate of 2.0. 1.60 of those are unfortunately suicides. Compared to the UK this might seem bad. However, they have a lower total homicide rate by around 20%.

Ok, lets move on to Europe. We'll start with Norway as it's kinda easy to get a gun there. A rate of 1.75 is again higher than the UK, but far lower than the US. Unfortunately for the UK, the total homicides in norway is 0.47 compared to 1.76 for the UK. Not exactly a right wing government either.

Switzerland 2.64. Austria 2.75. Israel 2.04 - All allow guns. All have lower homicide rates than the UK.

I'd continue but this is akin to taking penalties against a dwarf.

So all countries that you've mentioned with relatively easier access to guns have a larger rate of gun-related deaths than the UK... Your point is what? Private ownership of guns is not intrinsically wrong because it makes suicide easier?

Also, do you always congratulate yourself in inane terms when you think you've won an argument? It just makes your contrieved argument look even more stupid.

Pwned ah ah
 
So all countries that you've mentioned with relatively easier access to guns have a larger rate of gun-related deaths than the UK... Your point is what? Private ownership of guns is not intrinsically wrong because it makes suicide easier?

Also, do you always congratulate yourself in inane terms when you think you've won an argument? It just makes your contrieved argument look even more stupid.

Pwned ah ah

That high private ownership of guns is not what drives gun violence and murders. Furthermore that is has no relevance to overall murder and suicide rates.
 
That high private ownership of guns is not what drives gun violence and murders. Furthermore that is has no relevance to overall murder and suicide rates.
You can't conclude that from your arguments. Just that there are other confounding variables beyond private gun ownership. Which should be obvious anyway.

But, like @nimic points out above, old discussion, wrong thread. I apologise.
 


Whenever he tweets random phrases at the end of his tweets like "Big Crowds" I'm always reminded of those Optajoe tweets where they add something witty to sum up their statistics at the end of their tweets, except Trump's are never witty.
 

Just can’t believe this. He doesn’t seem to have the brain trust like he did in 2016. Who is his Bannon, who is this election’s guru? For as horrible a president he has been, one has to give him & his team credit for eking out the last election by whatever means possible. There was a certain genius to his campaign in 2016. Just don’t see the same collective intelligence this time around.
 
Ah, the Israel thing and the policy of 'positive pressure' towards the gulf states. I'm not sure how I altogether feel about it as I've not exactly studied it. But he does seem to have managed to accelerate a very slowly alligning partnership based on strategic need into one that's somewhat faster. I'm reading there's pressure on Sudan too, though that one seems more forced.

I think the UAE/Bahrain peace deals can only be a good thing for the region though. (And the saudis will follow eventually)

Well then you'd know he ain't done crap in middle east
 
Status
Not open for further replies.