If Biden was the candidate in 2016 and not Hillary, would Trump have still won?
2020 US Elections | Biden certified as President | Dems control Congress
- Thread starter Raoul
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My guess is no. It was pretty close in the rust belt and Joe was pretty popular in 2016 compared to Hillary.
I have seen this exact question in this thread but my answer is yes. Hillary was the most disliked active politician and Biden probably would have had a stronger appeal to conservative dems in then battleground states.
Yes. Bernie is not a Democrat. That is why he is able to espouse actual policies that benefit ordinary people and not corporations.
In the future I can see progressives like the "Squad" actually leaving the party if they are unable to change it from within.
On the 3 areas you mention, yes I can see policies that are far less harsh.
Environment especially. An Executive order can change this. Correct me if I'm wrong.
Meaningful Immigration reform can happen only if the filibuster is removed. If it is an executive order, it will be removed once another Republican gets in.
Abortion is a State Issue. As we have seen.
But even if all these can be done, how do they immediately help the pocket books of Americans?
The key point is this.
If the Democrats are united in wanting to pass policies supported by the likes of Bernie and Warren, they can get back all those Trump supporters.
Hate works when all people see is Lip Service.
Its actual policies that benefit everyone that helps unite all Americans.
All that we need is the Will.
A Triumph of the Will, would you say?
Why would the party support policies of someone who can't even win their own party primaries?
If Bernie or Warren wins the primaries, then I presume the party willback their policies by default.
You have it backwards.
Should a party that claims to support working people put forward such policies?
A party's identity would be very generic and can change over time (current GOP is best example). Dems have always leaned liberal to various extents and are against conservatism. Apart from them, I can't recall them having any other particular identity.
As in a democracy, you have various people putting forth their policies and whoever gains popular support dictates party policy. If Bernie/Warren wins then they dictate policy, not the vice versa.
It's not reasonable to expect Dems to come out and admit Obamacare is a bad policy right now...would be political suicide.
The point I am making is that the modern Democratic party has not actually put forward policies that benefited ordinary people for a long time.
Obamacare is a Republican policy.
That's pretty basic knowledge for anyone who wants to contribute in this discussion edgar.
What the Democratic party is saying to the voters is...
"We caused Trump. Now you have to clean up our shit and get rid of him"
"We caused Trump. Now you have to clean up our shit and get rid of him"
It was heavily influenced by Mitt Romney’s healthcare plan when he was governor of Massachusetts.
I'm not disputing the origins, but from the way the Dems celebrated (and still do), it has for all intents and purposes become a Dem plan. You now have Dems fighting for it and GOP against it. Calling it a Republican plan at this stage would be ignoring everything after.
Funny thing is, I recall an article that majority of Republican voters support Single Payer system too. I'm just surprised they have not jumped on the bandwagon and started to label it as theirs.....kind of a reverse Obamacare.
We now have a policy that as support across both parties not progressed due to politics.
Kamala Harris Unveils Medicare-Of-Lies
Bernie has already attacked her plan.
Also Bernie has levelled up
Cant decide if I hate him or Kamala more
Kamala is cooler because she knew about Tupac and Biggie and listened to them while smoking the marijuanas cigarettes before they became rappers.
Was talking to a friend last night and he brought up a great point regarding what the establishment Democrats and upper middle class Democrat are missing in their message. What the neoliberals (or moderates or centrists) and neocons have in common in message is they sell the last 30 years of corporate globalization as exclusively positive.
Both Trump and Bernie's messaging speaks to the losers of globalization of the last 30 years. This is extremely important because its a key behavioral driver for tens of millions of people that feel completely neglected and ignored by the establishment factions of neoliberal Clinton//Kerry/Biden and the neocon Bushes, Romneys and McCains.
The Republicans with Trump have a message to those that have been left behind by the outsourcing, gentrification, planned obsolescence, arbitrage of corporate globalization. Its a drastically different message than Bernie and progressives but Trump and Bernie are the only two people speaking to this target audience. When the Republicans sell xenophobic populism to the audience consisting of the losers of globalization the neoliberal Clinton/Biden message of "everything is great except Trump, lets get rid of Trump and return to the wonderful Obama world" falls completely flat. Only economic populism can counter xenophobic populism.
And people really need to stop using the sloppy term "protest voter". The losers of globalization are not "protest voters" and that's the key swing group where turnout is going to decide the election. They also systemically get underrepresented in polling. They are a huge segment of the population that has been pillaged by neoliberalism. The wealthy and well to do Democrats trying to ram this neoliberal message down their throats still after 30 years simply isn't going to work.
Both Trump and Bernie's messaging speaks to the losers of globalization of the last 30 years. This is extremely important because its a key behavioral driver for tens of millions of people that feel completely neglected and ignored by the establishment factions of neoliberal Clinton//Kerry/Biden and the neocon Bushes, Romneys and McCains.
The Republicans with Trump have a message to those that have been left behind by the outsourcing, gentrification, planned obsolescence, arbitrage of corporate globalization. Its a drastically different message than Bernie and progressives but Trump and Bernie are the only two people speaking to this target audience. When the Republicans sell xenophobic populism to the audience consisting of the losers of globalization the neoliberal Clinton/Biden message of "everything is great except Trump, lets get rid of Trump and return to the wonderful Obama world" falls completely flat. Only economic populism can counter xenophobic populism.
And people really need to stop using the sloppy term "protest voter". The losers of globalization are not "protest voters" and that's the key swing group where turnout is going to decide the election. They also systemically get underrepresented in polling. They are a huge segment of the population that has been pillaged by neoliberalism. The wealthy and well to do Democrats trying to ram this neoliberal message down their throats still after 30 years simply isn't going to work.
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That politico headline is incredible. The Hillary Clinton staff are thr least qualified people on earth to discuss how to beat trump. Jesus christ I want to die
Neo libs don't have the capacity to understand this and will resort to the circle jerking message of "hurr hurr but Bernie Bros don't get it".
Before you do that, can I have my money back?
That politico headline is incredible. The Hillary Clinton staff are thr least qualified people on earth to discuss how to beat trump. Jesus christ I want to die
I played the recorder in High School. Here's how to compose a symphonic masterpiece.
You see it here.
The fact is many of the Establishment/Upper Middle Class Democrats will not come out and say it, but they would rather a Trump who is 'good' for business than Bernie who will be for spending on working people's needs.
I once sold a freddo to my mate. Here's how to beat dragons den.
I'm Dale Earnhardt, here's how to live long enough to attend your grandchildren's wedding.
Jesus
Christ it looks a firing squad is about to happen.
Okay Delaney
All aimed at the center left candidates. Single entendre don't ask me how
Okay Delaney
I wanted to kick his head.
I swear, Tim Ryan’s face reminds me of Beaker.
@Eboue has somehow made me hate Beto.
No doubt
Buttigieg and Don Jr have the exact same voice
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