2016 US Presidential Elections | Trump Wins

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Barring any nasty surprises, I think Clinton can have the whole thing officially wrapped up after New York. Of course, all bets are off if Sanders exceeds expectations and win SC, then it's game on.
Yeah, according to that list he needs to win around 29 states to break-even (including DC). And that's not with superdelegates included. Nevada will be a good test on the 20th, long enough after him winning NH for any momentum to kick in, and to see if he's improving with hispanic voters.
 
Yeah, according to that list he needs to win around 29 states to break-even (including DC). And that's not with superdelegates included. Nevada will be a good test on the 20th, long enough after him winning NH for any momentum to kick in, and to see if he's improving with hispanic voters.

Superdelegates can switch their vote. If the voters go one way and the party another, IMO Sanders supporters will be justified in not voting for her in the general.
 
I understand the rest, but why white?
Not sure exactly, a lot of loyalty still there for Bill though.
Superdelegates can switch their vote. If the voters go one way and the party another, IMO Sanders supporters will be justified in not voting for her in the general.
No need to justify a vote really, if they're fine with the consequences then they can vote for whoever they like.
 
Smooth bastard.

Elsewhere, Santorum has withdrawn and settled on Rubio.
 
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Obama did not win the Southern states because he was black. He won it because he was a progressive alternative. Hillary has not been pressed about what she is really offering. Keep things the same? Better health care...how? Lower tution? how?
 
Obama did not win the Southern states because he was black. He won it because he was a progressive alternative. Hillary has not been pressed about what she is really offering. Keep things the same? Better health care...how? Lower tution? how?
As I've mentioned before, Hillary's record in the Senate was more liberal than Barry's. As were her positions on issues like healthcare.
 
Smooth bastard..

I saw the classic Simpsons ep the other day that has him appear at the end and say "hey, I'm a pretty lousy President" , and it was the only thing in an otherwise timeless (and faultless) episode that seemed a bit dated and jarring. I wasn't old enough to remember much of Clinton's tenure in real time, bar Lewinsky (I started A Level Politics in his lame duck year) but the impression I've gotten ever since is that his Presidency is one of the most retroactively reappraised and well regarded of modern times. He's probably one of the smartest world leaders of the 20th century.

In that regard, I think he'll share a lot in common with Obama when the dust settles. Not just because his good deeds will be better appreciated in the fulness of time, but also 'cos they both had to content with a vociferous, witch hunting GOP determined to take them down.

While that is something. I think the magic trick of making people forget you gave an eulogy for a former KKK member is far more impressive than what is admittedly some fine sax playing.

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/vi...ds_kkk_ties_he_was_trying_to_get_elected.html

And Obama had a similar "old friend that turned out to be a hideous arsehole" scandal too IIRC. As much as I revere Clinton as a good President and American (quasi by our standards) liberal, I'd never deny that he's anything but a cynical career politician to the core.

I wouldn't trust the guy to take my Mrs home from a party if I was called away urgently, but if I had to choose a living world leader to bring back to power, I'd choose the one who helped broker the Northern Ireland peace process, and came the closest to bringing Israel and Palestine to an armistice (which isn't very close, tbf, but both at least Barak and Arafat respected him enough to share a room before disagreeing)
 
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Obama gives a eulogy there too, his video's even linked on that page.

she voted for the Iraq war.
And that doesn't change the fact she was progressive on domestic issues.
 
No need to justify a vote really, if they're fine with the consequences then they can vote for whoever they like.


IMO if it's Cruz in the general it would be wrong not to vote for the Dem. He's to the far right of the current Republican party which historically puts him in with probably General Pinochet.
Rubio is another issue, he's going to beat whoever their nominee is. Trump will lose to both.
 
fecking Obama why pushing so hard for the TPP agreement... hopefully the congress wont pass it.

what are the views on the TPP from the other candidates?
 
fecking Obama why pushing so hard for the TPP agreement... hopefully the congress wont pass it.

what are the views on the TPP from the other candidates?

Sanders has opposed it for ever (he opposed NAFTA too)
Hillary pushed for it as secretary of state, didn't comment on it for 1-2 years, and then opposed it after Sanders announced his candidacy.

EDIT:
Q: As secretary of state, Clinton said she favored a trade deal with our 11 Pacific partners & fast track authority to make that happen. Is that an issue for you?

SANDERS: In the House and Senate, I voted against all of these terrible trade agreements, NAFTA, CAFTA, permanent normal trades relations with China. Republicans and Democrats, they say, "oh, we'll create all these jobs by having a trade agreement with China." Well, the answer is, they were wrong, wrong, wrong. Over the years, we have lost millions of decent paying jobs. These trade agreements have forced wages down in America so the average worker in America today is working longer hours for lower wages.

Q: So, is that a litmus test for you, to see whether or not Clinton is going to come out against the TPP?

SANDERS: I hope very much the secretary comes out against it. I think we do not need to send more jobs to low wage countries. I think corporate America has to start investing in this country and create decent paying jobs here.
 
fecking Obama why pushing so hard for the TPP agreement... hopefully the congress wont pass it.

what are the views on the TPP from the other candidates?
A trade with poor nations means jobs would move to those nations but since the politicians are above the law and insider trading is the main reason why they spend millions to gain a seat in the congress, I will say; that's the reason they want the TPP agreement. So Obama wants that deal to go through and for the first time he has the support of the Reps. I need to find out the Republican candidate against TPP.
 
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Watching Sanders speak tonight is remarkable. He's by far the best candidate out of any of the charlatans running.
 
Watching Sanders speak tonight is remarkable. He's by far the best candidate out of any of the charlatans running.

Good performance from him tonight . Hillary on deck now

Sanders has no script and speaks with conviction from the heart.

Hillary managed to circumvent almost every tough question that was asked of her tonight. Her replies seem fake, pandering and she is telling people what she thinks they want to hear. She really expects the voters to think she took over 15 million from wall street and they wouldn't want anything back?

Her answers on why she voted for the Iraq war and also the legalization of marijuana were deceptive. I don't understand why people would want to vote for her when she pales in comparison to Sanders.
 
Republicans once again proving themselves to be the party of bigots.Rubio and Trump calling out Obama for visiting a mosque.

This is why I will never ever vote for a Republican in my life. Absolutely sick and tired of the constant demonization and the point scoring at our expense.
 
I don't like Sanders line of her speaking fee with Goldman Sachs tbh. Sure, no doubt that was to curry favours to some degrees but insinuating that she's bought and paid for because of that is disingenuous. The fact is, corporations do shell out big fees for celebrities in events like that and they pay it as much for star power as anything. If you have to pick a target, why not George Soros, who backed Obama heavily in 08 and now have given $8m for Hillary's Super PAC?

There's nothing wrong with contrasting his and her positions, as well as their status (grassroots vs establishment), but character attack like that are driving a wedge between Dems. The hostility I see now, albeit online, is quite worrying.
 
Not sure exactly, a lot of loyalty still there for Bill though.
Bill's cache goes a long way. There's not a liberal alive who didn't swoon when he addressed the DNC in 2012.

What I meant was - is there any specific reasons why the minorities would prefer Clinton? Aren't they generally less well-off? Wouldn't they opt for Bernie's more socialist ideas?



I'd vote for that guy.
 
IMO if it's Cruz in the general it would be wrong not to vote for the Dem. He's to the far right of the current Republican party which historically puts him in with probably General Pinochet.
Rubio is another issue, he's going to beat whoever their nominee is. Trump will lose to both.

What has that to do with democratic super delegates? :P

Don't think any Republican can do it by the way. The party needs a serious overhaul, it's 5 minutes before 12 for them. With the demographics changing, they will probably have serious problems to eher win a nationwide election again.
 
What I meant was - is there any specific reasons why the minorities would prefer Clinton? Aren't they generally less well-off? Wouldn't they opt for Bernie's more socialist ideas?



I'd vote for that guy.
There's an article here - http://www.theroot.com/articles/pol...hy_black_voters_still_aren_t_feeling_him.html - that raises a few possibilities, but beyond Bill being very popular it's hard to tie down specifically. I'd have thought that as he became more well known his numbers would go up, but the evidence from that article suggests otherwise (though it is a few months old now). I also don't think that merely having "socialist" ideas does much, you need realistic ways of implementing them.
 
There's an article here - http://www.theroot.com/articles/pol...hy_black_voters_still_aren_t_feeling_him.html - that raises a few possibilities, but beyond Bill being very popular it's hard to tie down specifically. I'd have thought that as he became more well known his numbers would go up, but the evidence from that article suggests otherwise (though it is a few months old now). I also don't think that merely having "socialist" ideas does much, you need realistic ways of implementing them.

There might be one fundamental problem: he's a very loud, very white, very old, very unknown guy from a very white state. With the possibility of being a catastrophe in the White House.
 
There might be one fundamental problem: he's a very loud, very white, very old, very unknown guy from a very white state. With the possibility of being a catastrophe in the White House.

Isn't it just identity politics? Slick Willy wasn't called the first African American president back in the days for nothing. His upbringing and personal experiences resonate far more with black voters than Sanders's.
 
Sanders has no script and speaks with conviction from the heart.

Hillary managed to circumvent almost every tough question that was asked of her tonight. Her replies seem fake, pandering and she is telling people what she thinks they want to hear. She really expects the voters to think she took over 15 million from wall street and they wouldn't want anything back?

Her answers on why she voted for the Iraq war and also the legalization of marijuana were deceptive. I don't understand why people would want to vote for her when she pales in comparison to Sanders.

I didn't get that impression at all. She just communicates differently than Sanders.
 
Why are Americans so angry?
By Vanessa BarfordBBC News, Washington DC
  • 4 February 2016
  • From the sectionMagazine
_88005835_angryamerica.jpg
Image copyrightiStock
World War Three
Americans are generally known for having a positive outlook on life, but with the countdown for November's presidential election now well under way, polls show voters are angry. This may explain the success of non-mainstream candidates such as Republican Donald Trump and Democrat Bernie Sanders. But what is fuelling the frustration?

A CNN/ORC poll carried out in December 2015 suggests 69% of Americans are either "very angry" or "somewhat angry" about "the way things are going" in the US.

And the same proportion - 69% - are angry because the political system "seems to only be working for the insiders with money and power, like those on Wall Street or in Washington," according to a NBC/Wall Street Journal poll from November.

Many people are not only angry, they are angrier than they were a year ago, according to an NBC/Esquire survey last month - particularly Republicans (61%) and white people (54%) but also 42% of Democrats, 43% of Latinos and 33% of African Americans.

Candidates have sensed the mood and are adopting the rhetoric. Donald Trump, who has arguably tapped into voters' frustration better than any other candidate, says he is "very, very angry" and will "gladly accept the mantle of anger" while rival Republican Ben Carson says he has encountered "many Americans who are discouraged and angry as they watch the American dream slipping away".

Democratic presidential hopeful Bernie Sanders says: "I am angry and millions of Americans are angry," while Hillary Clinton says she "understands why people get angry".

Here are five reasons why some voters feel the American dream is in tatters.

1. Economy
"The failure of the economy to deliver real progress to middle-class and working-class Americans over the past 15 years is the most fundamental source of public anger and disaffection in the US," says William Galston, an expert in governance studies at the Brookings Institution think tank.

Although the country may have recovered from the recession - economic output has rebounded and unemployment rates have fallen from 10% in 2009 to 5% in 2015 - Americans are still feeling the pinch in their wallets. Household incomes have, generally speaking, been stagnant for 15 years. In 2014, the median household income was $53,657, according to the US Census Bureau - compared with $57,357 in 2007 and $57,843 in 1999 (adjusted for inflation).

There is also a sense that many jobs are of lower quality and opportunity is dwindling, says Galston. "The search for explanations can very quickly degenerate into the identification of villains in American politics. On the left it is the billionaires, the banks, and Wall Street. On the right it is immigrants, other countries taking advantage of us and the international economy - they are two sides of the same political coin."

2. Immigration
_88060919_graphangry.png

America's demographics are changing - nearly 59 million immigrants have arrived in the US since 1965, not all of whom entered the country legally. Forty years ago, 84% of the American population was made up of non-Hispanic white people - by last year the figure was 62%, according to Pew Research. It projects this trend will continue, and by 2055 non-Hispanic white people will make up less than half the population. Pew expects them to account for only 46% of the population by 2065. By 2055, more Asians than any other ethnic group are expected to move to US.

"It's been an era of huge demographic, racial, cultural, religious and generational change," says Paul Taylor, author of The Next America. "While some celebrate these changes, others deplore them. Some older, whiter voters do not recognise the country they grew up in. There is a sense of alien tribes," he says.

The US currently has 11.3 million illegal immigrants. Migrants often become a target of anger, says Roberto Suro, an immigration expert at the University of Southern California. "There is a displacement of anxiety and they become the face of larger sources of tensions, such as terrorism, jobs and dissatisfaction. We saw that very clearly when Donald Trump switched from [complaining about] Mexicans to Muslims without skipping a beat after San Bernardino," he says, referring to the shooting in California in December that left 14 people dead.
 
Why are Americans so angry?
By Vanessa BarfordBBC News, Washington DC
  • 4 February 2016
  • From the sectionMagazine
_88005835_angryamerica.jpg
Image copyrightiStock
World War Three
Americans are generally known for having a positive outlook on life, but with the countdown for November's presidential election now well under way, polls show voters are angry. This may explain the success of non-mainstream candidates such as Republican Donald Trump and Democrat Bernie Sanders. But what is fuelling the frustration?

A CNN/ORC poll carried out in December 2015 suggests 69% of Americans are either "very angry" or "somewhat angry" about "the way things are going" in the US.

And the same proportion - 69% - are angry because the political system "seems to only be working for the insiders with money and power, like those on Wall Street or in Washington," according to a NBC/Wall Street Journal poll from November.

Many people are not only angry, they are angrier than they were a year ago, according to an NBC/Esquire survey last month - particularly Republicans (61%) and white people (54%) but also 42% of Democrats, 43% of Latinos and 33% of African Americans.

Candidates have sensed the mood and are adopting the rhetoric. Donald Trump, who has arguably tapped into voters' frustration better than any other candidate, says he is "very, very angry" and will "gladly accept the mantle of anger" while rival Republican Ben Carson says he has encountered "many Americans who are discouraged and angry as they watch the American dream slipping away".

Democratic presidential hopeful Bernie Sanders says: "I am angry and millions of Americans are angry," while Hillary Clinton says she "understands why people get angry".

Here are five reasons why some voters feel the American dream is in tatters.

1. Economy
"The failure of the economy to deliver real progress to middle-class and working-class Americans over the past 15 years is the most fundamental source of public anger and disaffection in the US," says William Galston, an expert in governance studies at the Brookings Institution think tank.

Although the country may have recovered from the recession - economic output has rebounded and unemployment rates have fallen from 10% in 2009 to 5% in 2015 - Americans are still feeling the pinch in their wallets. Household incomes have, generally speaking, been stagnant for 15 years. In 2014, the median household income was $53,657, according to the US Census Bureau - compared with $57,357 in 2007 and $57,843 in 1999 (adjusted for inflation).

There is also a sense that many jobs are of lower quality and opportunity is dwindling, says Galston. "The search for explanations can very quickly degenerate into the identification of villains in American politics. On the left it is the billionaires, the banks, and Wall Street. On the right it is immigrants, other countries taking advantage of us and the international economy - they are two sides of the same political coin."

2. Immigration
_88060919_graphangry.png

America's demographics are changing - nearly 59 million immigrants have arrived in the US since 1965, not all of whom entered the country legally. Forty years ago, 84% of the American population was made up of non-Hispanic white people - by last year the figure was 62%, according to Pew Research. It projects this trend will continue, and by 2055 non-Hispanic white people will make up less than half the population. Pew expects them to account for only 46% of the population by 2065. By 2055, more Asians than any other ethnic group are expected to move to US.

"It's been an era of huge demographic, racial, cultural, religious and generational change," says Paul Taylor, author of The Next America. "While some celebrate these changes, others deplore them. Some older, whiter voters do not recognise the country they grew up in. There is a sense of alien tribes," he says.


The US currently has 11.3 million illegal immigrants. Migrants often become a target of anger, says Roberto Suro, an immigration expert at the University of Southern California. "There is a displacement of anxiety and they become the face of larger sources of tensions, such as terrorism, jobs and dissatisfaction. We saw that very clearly when Donald Trump switched from [complaining about] Mexicans to Muslims without skipping a beat after San Bernardino," he says, referring to the shooting in California in December that left 14 people dead.
 
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