“United don’t even fancy it” - Carragher

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SAFMUTD said:
Thats the thing, its a golden opportunity because this year points required would be around 85. That's around 15 points less than the last 3 seasons. I agree we wont reach those points, not with this manager with this squad. But more certainly we wont reach 99 points heights with this manager, no matter which squad.

Thats the missed oportunity, we had to improve 20 points to win this year, next year it will be 35.
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Aye, City are on track for 86 points. This team is capable of reaching around that in my opinion, but stupid games like Palace & Sheff U at home have really cost us. We certainly could have been in race until the final month at least.

Had we won those two home games we’d be on track for 84 points, so absolutely an opportunity for a genuine challenge was there this season.

Next year has to be a full on challenge for the title, this season must finish strongly and piss top 3, not scrape it, that’d show real progress and have us in a great position to challenge next season.
 
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Borys said:
Of course, but saying at least something like "the race isn't over" is a strong statement to all around. It has a psychological impact. Saying we're not is just weak and invites comments like this from Carragher.
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I invite Carragher to say whatever the feck he wants.
 
SAFMUTD said:
Thats the thing, its a golden opportunity because this year points required would be around 85. That's around 15 points less than the last 3 seasons. I agree we wont reach those points, not with this manager with this squad. But more certainly we wont reach 99 points heights with this manager, no matter which squad.

Thats the missed oportunity, we had to improve 20 points to win this year, next year it will be 35.
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And there is the answer to it all. Which is why I don’t see it as a “missed opportunity”. Was it really even an opportunity in the first place?
All this drop off in points meant was that city and Liverpool could then not have to be as perfect to win it because they’re the only ones capable of hitting those tallies.
 
There is a mentality issue, United are progressing but you can't argue with the comments. There is a fear and lack of belief at critical moments. United got caught out yesterday at the back. We nearly conceeded late chances to Fulham and Villa. We are crying out for a real leader at the back. We are getting better, just not there yet unfortunately.
 
Leroy The Red said:
And there is the answer to it all. Which is why I don’t see it as a “missed opportunity”. Was it really even an opportunity in the first place?
All this drop off in points meant was that city and Liverpool could then not have to be as perfect to win it because they’re the only ones capable of hitting those tallies.
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We dont getting it doesnt change the fact that its a missed opportunity. Even when we arent capable of getting it this was the "easiest" season for a champion in the last years.
 
Schmeichel's Cartwheel said:
Carragher on sky before dismissed United’s title challenge, said we don’t fancy ourselves & are just happy to be there. Talked about how it’s a golden opportunity to win the league & United are showing we don’t have the bottle to go for it. Basically thinks we’ve got no chance because we don’t truly believe ourselves.

It’s a fair point. I don’t think we want it the same way City & Liverpool do. I think we’re chuffed to bits to be involved & our owners are more than happy with a top 4 finish.
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I think he's half right. I'm happy for the team to be as close as they are because I don't believe we have the manager and/or squad to win the league. I don't think belief or "bottle" or whatever BS catchphrase he used is the issue. The lack of quality is.
 
Although it's true that we might not have the requisite quality to win the league, we're 2nd place in a season when everyone is dropping points except for City. The point is, we're here now and there's no guarantee that our rivals won't be better than us next season. So this is the moment to have a winners mentality, stop thinking in terms of top four preservation, and embrace the very good opportunity presented to us.
 
SAFMUTD said:
We dont getting it doesnt change the fact that its a missed opportunity. Even when we arent capable of getting it this was the "easiest" season for a champion in the last years.
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Maybe, but then that applies for everyone in the league not just us right? I haven’t seen Leicester, Chelsea, Everton or Spurs get this kind of ciriticism ..
 
He's just bitter that the greatest Liverpool side of the last 30 years will only match Leicester's fluke accomplishments in the Premier League. They're done.

He's right about us though :lol:
 
SAFMUTD said:
We dont getting it doesnt change the fact that its a missed opportunity. Even when we arent capable of getting it this was the "easiest" season for a champion in the last years.
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Its only a missed opportunity if everybody falls a level. Now City are playing better than last year ffs.
Anyway its not over yet, the derby in a few weeks will tell the tale
 
It was always going to be the case that, as soon as we got anywhere near talk of a title, failure to achieve that would be used as a stick to beat the manager and the team - no doubt from most of the same people that were saying at the start of the season 'progress would be closing the gap and solidifying a top 4 position'.

Carraghers quote is ridiculous. This team are over achieving this season precisely because we've clawed back so many difficult situations, or to use his words, because we've 'fancied it' so many times up to now.

So many of you are all too willing to buy it hook line and sinker though, which shows what a soft touch and an easy target our fanbase have become these days.
 
Leroy The Red said:
And there is the answer to it all. Which is why I don’t see it as a “missed opportunity”. Was it really even an opportunity in the first place?
All this drop off in points meant was that city and Liverpool could then not have to be as perfect to win it because they’re the only ones capable of hitting those tallies.
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That is exactly why it is a missed opportunity. Because both City and Liverpool had injuries and not playing well and dropping points. Now Chelsea have got a top class manager and they will be in the mix too. Van Dijk will be back after injury. It is like the season Leicester won. Everyone else fecked up and that is why Leicester won.
 
Leroy The Red said:
Maybe, but then that applies for everyone in the league not just us right? I haven’t seen Leicester, Chelsea, Everton or Spurs get this kind of ciriticism ..
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Yes, it was a missed opportunity for everyone. They don't get that criticism because they're not held to the same standard we are.
 
Bilbo said:
It was always going to be the case that, as soon as we got anywhere near talk of a title, failure to achieve that would be used as a stick to beat the manager and the team - no doubt from most of the same people that were saying at the start of the season 'progress would be closing the gap and solidifying a top 4 position'.

Carraghers quote is ridiculous. This team are over achieving this season precisely because we've clawed back so many difficult situations, or to use his words, because we've 'fancied it' so many times up to now.

So many of you are all too willing to buy it hook line and sinker though, which shows what a soft touch and an easy target our fanbase have become these days.
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I’m with you on this.
 
cyberman said:
Its only a missed opportunity if everybody falls a level. Now City are playing better than last year ffs.
Anyway its not over yet, the derby in a few weeks will tell the tale
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City are a level below, pointwise at least, what they where in their champion seasons. The race is realistically over, we feck it up with the loss against Sheffield and the draws against Arsenal and Everton were just the nails in the coffin.
 
I would like more positivity from Ole in his press interviews. This “we’re just delighted to be there” attitude is an easy excuse for some of our players to accept poor moments because “no one really expected us to be up there anyway.” But we still are and I would prefer some more public belief installed by the manager. These little mentally things can make a difference with top class athletes. I can kind of see Carragher’s point here not that he explains it too well.
 
SAFMUTD said:
City are a level below, pointwise at least, what they where in their champion seasons. The race is realistically over, we feck it up with the loss against Sheffield and the draws against Arsenal and Everton were just the nails in the coffin.
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City are top because they went on a run they werent capable of last year and they have been on this run for a while now. We cant claim its a missed opportunity when City are on course for a higher points total than last season.
Is it that much of an opprtunity that it would take a 10 odd game plus winstreak to be ahead by a few points in gameweek 20? We would need late 80 points to win this league at Citys rate!
Its an outdated theory that has been blown away. Its not November anymore.
 
Bilbo said:
It was always going to be the case that, as soon as we got anywhere near talk of a title, failure to achieve that would be used as a stick to beat the manager and the team - no doubt from most of the same people that were saying at the start of the season 'progress would be closing the gap and solidifying a top 4 position'.

Carraghers quote is ridiculous. This team are over achieving this season precisely because we've clawed back so many difficult situations, or to use his words, because we've 'fancied it' so many times up to now.

So many of you are all too willing to buy it hook line and sinker though, which shows what a soft touch and an easy target our fanbase have become these days.
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Bring me those quotes about closing the gap and solidify top 4. We finished 3rd last season and we brought 3 new players this season, how finishing 4th is any good? I am sure almost every critic to Ole wanted to challenge for the league and nothing less. In the beginning of the season, I said anything but challenging for the title till the last few games is failure and he should move away taking into account the amount of money he spent and the squad he has.
 
Honestly I think if we had a centreback with a modicum of composure to play instead of Lindelof we'd have had a genuine chance. That and just stick to playing players in their positions, which seems really obvious but for some reason we like to not do it.

There's no lack of desire or belief. We played a genuine top four contender yesterday and out worked them and played them off the park for a majority of the game. We played another in Leicester and again in Liverpool and were the better team in both games.

Problem is in two of those three games we basically won them and then threw it away by defending like a bunch of people running off the edge of a cliff to escape from a wasp.

That would be another 4 points on it's own which would put us in range of City...but not only that we'd know we don't have to descend into panic for the last 10 minutes of every fecking game where we're a goal up.

Earlier in the season in the Chelsea and City games Carragher had a point. We just didn't want to try and win, but the belief has definitely grown since then and what's let us down is just the lack of quality in certain areas. I mean I still feel we're a lot closer than we were a year ago, but unfortunately City are pretty good. Anyone else I'd give us a genuine chance over.
 
After 22 games City have 3 more points than last season and just 3 less than when they won the title in 18/19 (with 98 points).

Where is this idea that it's some big 'opportunity' coming from?
 
Regulus Arcturus Black said:
Forget Everton, beat Palace & Sheff U at home and we’re on course for an 84 point season, City 86.

A chance of a real title challenge has been there even if City do start to pull away later in the season.
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And ignore all the close wins we could have easily drawn and that City themselves drew with Leeds and West Brom. It doesn't really work like that.

Once they've got up to speed after having no pre season like us they've been barely challenged.
 
Foxbatt said:
That is exactly why it is a missed opportunity. Because both City and Liverpool had injuries and not playing well and dropping points. Now Chelsea have got a top class manager and they will be in the mix too. Van Dijk will be back after injury. It is like the season Leicester won. Everyone else fecked up and that is why Leicester won.
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except we’re not chasing Leicester, we’re chasing Manchester City who are still on course for 80-90 points. I don’t think this team/staff is capable of reaching that total. I know people point out “silly points dropped” at palace and Sheffield United etc. But we do this every season. It’d be more of a surprise if we didn’t lose a home game to Crystal Palace.

Regulus Arcturus Black said:
It’s because we’re clearly much better than them.
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Much better? Think we only finished one point above Chelsea and Leicester last season. And we’re two points above Leicester now. Six ahead of Chelsea. There isn’t much between the three teams to be honest.
 
Foxbatt said:
That is exactly why it is a missed opportunity. Because both City and Liverpool had injuries and not playing well and dropping points. Now Chelsea have got a top class manager and they will be in the mix too. Van Dijk will be back after injury. It is like the season Leicester won. Everyone else fecked up and that is why Leicester won.
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Man city have big squad depth that they could form an XI with their squad depth worth of top 3 team. It’s missing opportunity if man city losing points but the reality is they haven’t, they have won all their matches in 2021 so far. It speaks volume about their whole squad from XI and squad depth. They spent those money for years to form strong XI and strong depth and this season it paid off.

Before the season started, everyone in here expected United to get 80 points at max. It speaks volume the current squad’s ceiling. If to win the league this season you need minimum 85 points then we need to hit above our ceiling. Can’t call missing opportunities if we don’t hit above our ceiling.

Now we are back to our original aim which making progress, identifying what we need to challenge the league next season and in the summer we can improve our squad to challenge the league. You can talk about city and Liverpool will be back at their best again next season but let’s not forgetting that we can also improve our squad this summer for next season to reach their level.
 
It's difficult to go from where we've been the last seven years (nowhere near the top) to instantly winning the title. Not just in talent, but in belief and experience. Normally there needs to be a bridge year where the players (and coaching staff?) get the experience of being in the fight even though they may end up a bit short.

This season was always about significantly closing the gap to the top two and being in position to take advantage if one of them slipped up. For a while there it looked like maybe both of them might have a bad year which opens the door, but it now appears City are back in the groove and will likely go on to win the title. The important thing is to stay as close as possible and make sure we are the best of the rest, get our players the belief that we've closed the gap and we're ready to truly compete for the title next season. And if City have another blip this season, give ourselves that chance to take advantage.
 
Regulus Arcturus Black said:
Forget Everton, beat Palace & Sheff U at home and we’re on course for an 84 point season, City 86.

A chance of a real title challenge has been there even if City do start to pull away later in the season.
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Title opportunity depends on how good you are first and not if other teams are giving opportunities. This city side are very good while we are still not there. There is a reason before the season started no one was talking about it.
You are right droppimg stupid points to sfu and everton was gutting but there is a reason we are dropping such points because defensively we are not good. Do you seriously believe we can win the title with this defense. Even pep will not be able to win it. There is a reason he continues to spend crazy amount fixing the defense.

People don't like to hear this but we need more investment especially at the back.
 
Leftback99 said:
After 22 games City have 3 more points than last season and just 3 less than when they won the title in 18/19 (with 98 points).

Where is this idea that it's some big 'opportunity' coming from?
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It’s coming from their agenda and delusional mind.

Before the season started, none think we can achieve 85 points, max is 80 points. And now all of sudden some people think we can achieve the 85 points if we don’t then it’s called ‘’missing big opportunity‘’.

This city team is even better than last season due to their defense and majority the players he still has are from 18/19 title which means there are enough experiences not just based on skills.
 
This is exactly what you called a missed opportunity. Because it was just one opportunity. It is an unexpected chance. Favourable condition for the attainment of a goal. That is the meaning of opportunity. City having a bad run, Liverpool having injuries. Chelsea and Arsenal having new inexperienced managers.
 
i think its gonna take a while to go from being hopeful top 4 contenders to real title challengers in terms of mind-set

its not like they players can just flick a switch, it takes time to build that level of confidence

and to be honest, we're just not good enough (yet)
 
The usual daft comments from a poor pundit. Same was about Uniteds teams in 2004, 05,06 and pundits not realising that Ferguson was building a new team to be a successful league team years later. Winning the league cup 06 and FA Cup 04 certainty helped in the winning mentality so would be good if United can win the FA Cup or Europa league this season along with a top 4 finish.
 
Foxbatt said:
This is exactly what you called a missed opportunity. Because it was just one opportunity. It is an unexpected chance. Favourable condition for the attainment of a goal. That is the meaning of opportunity. City having a bad run, Liverpool having injuries. Chelsea and Arsenal having new inexperienced managers.
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When they won 14 games in a row and unbeaten 21 games in a row, I don’t think it’s called having a bad run. That’s why it’s not missing opportunities, you need the others to do bad as well, missing opportunities is like when Leicester won it in 2015/2016.
 
Replace ole with max Allegro, that will guarantee success... It'll be defensive football, and require a few years of rebuild, but it guarantees success
 
Leftback99 said:
After 22 games City have 3 more points than last season and just 3 less than when they won the title in 18/19 (with 98 points).

Where is this idea that it's some big 'opportunity' coming from?
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"This is the season to win" was valid when City were in bad form and Liverpool were poor too, now City are back to their best and will win the league easily. People are just stuck in October/November month thinking City are still in poor form.
 
Carragher said it as a throwaway comment because Liverpool were taking a battering and Neville was clearly winding him up. Wouldn't look into it too much.

Obviously United want to win the title, literally every manager ever downplays their own team's chances in league competitions. Klopp was doing it last year whilst 20 points ahead ffs!
 
Tyrion said:
I think he's half right. I'm happy for the team to be as close as they are because I don't believe we have the manager and/or squad to win the league. I don't think belief or "bottle" or whatever BS catchphrase he used is the issue. The lack of quality is.
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Agree with this. City are not cruising at the moment because they ”fancy” it more than other clubs.
 
cyberman said:
City are top because they went on a run they werent capable of last year and they have been on this run for a while now. We cant claim its a missed opportunity when City are on course for a higher points total than last season.
Is it that much of an opprtunity that it would take a 10 odd game plus winstreak to be ahead by a few points in gameweek 20? We would need late 80 points to win this league at Citys rate!
Its an outdated theory that has been blown away. Its not November anymore.
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City weren't the champions last year, its a missed opportunity because from the last 3 seasons the champions have got 100,98 and 99 points. This year that won't be the case, next year it probably will.
 
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