“United don’t even fancy it” - Carragher

[Drainy]

Isn’t it acceptable that United are not quite ready? This looks like our coming of age season. Liverpool are putting up one of the worst title defences of recent times.

Whether people want to accept it or not reality would bite in the end. If Ole believed we had a chance this year he would be delusional and his appraisal of the squad would need to be questioned.

It takes a lot of work to get a club from regularly finishing 6th to winning the league and on top of that we've been letting some of our experienced players leave and having to rebalance the squad and we're still a ways off.

 

[James35]

They can fancy it all they like, the team is simply not good enough to win it. It needs better players, coaching and mentality from a fair few of them.

 

[Client6]

This forum thrives on our failures, there’s nothing we love more than shitting on the team we supposedly support.

This.

People are using Solskjaer's quote as an admission of having less ambition - amazing really. It's pretty clear to see what he is trying to do.

 

[DWelbz19]

He's spot on. All we need to do is say we'll win it and we will.

 

[Valencia Shin Crosses]

Carragher on sky before dismissed United’s title challenge, said we don’t fancy ourselves & are just happy to be there. Talked about how it’s a golden opportunity to win the league & United are showing we don’t have the bottle to go for it. Basically thinks we’ve got no chance because we don’t truly believe ourselves.

It’s a fair point. I don’t think we want it the same way City & Liverpool do. I think we’re chuffed to bits to be involved & our owners are more than happy with a top 4 finish.

No I think that's a load of crap and people love to just excuse a team just because of the wrong "mentality" or "passion". Bottom line is we are a solid 2nd tier team but are clearly behind City because of the solidity we lack at the back compared to them. It's not this crap that we "don't fancy it", we've actually pulled a fair few results out of our arse with all of the comebacks we've had. But we sport a past it keeper behind two unathletic CB's and expect to dominate games. And football is a sport where if you leak bad goals it's going to be difficult to put together consistent results, since scoring at the other end can be so difficult if you're forwards are in bad form or unlucky.

 

[JustAGuest]

City look to be on for 90+ points once again. To finish above them will require one of the highest points totals in Premier League history. I do not see how it is a golden opportunity at all.

 

[arnie_ni]

Its bizarre isn't it? If anyone 'doesn't fancy it' then it would be the fans that turn on the team every chance they get.

City have just won 10 league games in a row. We can't compete with that. Nobody can. They are a class above and will be worthy winners. If we can end up being the best of the rest then that's a worthy achievement and something to build on.

We'd be right in it if we beat Sheffield United and held on against Everton though. Joint top with an extra game played

 

[Greck]

He's right, Some people sound like being near the top is such a gift we should be happy. Year on year progress is never guaranteed. We could spend 200m and finish 4th next year. The league isn't just going to let us win it once we think we're ready. Yesterday's result was a kick in the nuts

 

[P-Nut]

It's a year or 2 too early. This season I'll take finishing 2nd as decent progress and expect us to properly challenge next season and a cup. We should be winning the title in the next few years with the young core we've got though.

 

[siw2007]

Never felt we were good enough this season to win it anyway. City have a better team than us so it’s no surprise they are a distance ahead now. The aim this year was to close the gap and maybe win a trophy along the way.

 

[Abhinav]

All great title winning teams invariably have a strong defensive unit and quality players across the back 5. Right now, we have probably one player in Luke Shaw who could claim to be playing at a league winning level. Unless we improve the individual quality of the back 5, we will not be in a position to win the league. Belief alone is not really going to carry a team to the title. Neither is organisation at the back. We make so many individual errors while defending that no amount of organisation is going to solve for players making mindless mistakes.
Good thing is, there are hardly any games in which we don’t look threatening and we are definitely getting more consistent in our attacking play. Need a couple of good additions in CB, CDM, RW maybe GK positions to really complete this team

 

[BluesJr]

2/3rds of the team are ready. The defence isn’t unfortunately.

 

[kouroux]

All Ole had to do there was say the whole "one game at a time" cliche.

By categorically declaring we're NOT title challengers, he's basically saying he doesn't fancy it.

Many of our fans were/are deluded tbh. We're not there yet for a proper title race

 

[RuudTom83]

The only joy Carragher will have this season is seeing United not win the league...but this Liverpool team was meant to be the greatest in premier league history, and its all falling apart along with the manager after one season.

Ole shielding his players from talk of winning the league is a nothing story, but if Jamie wants to make a meal out of it, then so be it, it still wont disguise the fact Liverpool are an utter mess.

 

[Feed Me]

No, not really. We have one of the highest wage bills in world football. We should be expecting to challenge for the title every year.

I recognise there are mitigating circumstances, I've listed them in defence of the management many, many times. However, its not really acceptable for Man Utd to get to the top of the table and just shrug our shoulders at falling away.

We should, for example, be good enough not to throw away a draw against Sheffield United. We should, for example, be good enough to defend a two goal lead at home to Everton. The hindsight really just lets the players off for bottling it.

Carragher may just be trying to deflect from Liverpool's failings but there's something to what he's saying. Not every United player has the bottle for squeaky bum time. The panicky, frightened performances of certain players when we need them says a lot about their mentality. Bridesmaids not brides.

Even so, there’s some alchemy involved with creating a title winning team. We couldn’t reasonably go from last season to the top so quickly. We have unquestionably improved and have to keep doing so.

 

[Redfrog]

People tend to forget this team is so young, for that reason stability isn't there and most of the players doesn't have any experience in similar title fights.

It's all part of learning curve, team will only improve in next few years and titles will come. Even being in the title fight is already overachieving, no one expected that out of this team until at least 21-22 or 22-23

I hope so. I agree that we are a work on progress with a young team. But we will lose Pogba soon and Maguire is not the leader and the captain of a title winning team. He is a big part of the shamble at the back.

I hope that Guardiola will leave soon too bacause he looks like the manager who will win two title out of three and be involved every season...Now I know what it feels to have SAF in the league but for another club...it is kind of depressing...

 

[Feed Me]

Whether people want to accept it or not reality would bite in the end. If Ole believed we had a chance this year he would be delusional and his appraisal of the squad would need to be questioned.

It takes a lot of work to get a club from regularly finishing 6th to winning the league and on top of that we've been letting some of our experienced players leave and having to rebalance the squad and we're still a ways off.

I agree. We are on the journey.

 

[Havak]

He's right, but I also think it was laughable to involve Liverpool in the argument this season. I know he said Liverpool were in a similar boat to United unless they won today, but honestly, you could have reversed the scoreline and Liverpool still wouldn't finish anywhere near IMO.

United don't have the capability of winning enough football matches. I think we have a resilience of sorts. I think we are always capable of long unbeaten runs and big performances in big games. However, we just will not outright win enough matches to get the required points totals needed for a title. This was a big opportunity as it feels like every few years you can win the title with 80-sometbing points.

But City, I think they can win the 25+ games or more required for the title this season. No one else can. Everyone else needs something akin to winning close to 90% of remaining matches, while City could still get over the line with more like 60%

 

[Leftback99]

City are on another level to us. People just got too carried away at what was only the halfway stage with the likes of Leicester in a similar position to what we were.

 

[Redfrog]

Agreed. Looking at City right now v 'Pool, they have a GK and two CDs that are superior to United. Nothing much in it elsewhere. This where the improvement is required. This stability at the base of the team allows everyone else to play and confidence rises. No reason why this can't be sorted in the summer if there is a will to pay the money. City have done this twice to get it right.

City just have the best manager in the game and a team who has experience about winning the league...it is a big advantage, we had it for 20 years...

 

[Nou_Camp99]

Got to get 2nd place, try to win a cup and then actually buy world class players this summer. Ones our manager actually wants.

 

[Damien]

 

[Dearg hÉireann]

People tend to forget this team is so young, for that reason stability isn't there and most of the players doesn't have any experience in similar title fights.

It's all part of learning curve, team will only improve in next few years and titles will come. Even being in the title fight is already overachieving, no one expected that out of this team until at least 21-22 or 22-23

I don't think we can use the excuse of the team being young to be honest.
We have good experience throughout the team, it's quite simply down to the fact that our defence is pretty terrible and we have a keeper who should be on a multi million contract with Loctite super glue he's so stuck to his line.

 

[davidmichael]

I know we’re short of what’s needed to win the title as we need at least a quality right sided attacker, a quality defensive midfielder and a quality centre back with pace so not winning the title isn’t a massive thing but that being said the results against Sheffield United and Everton last night were simply unacceptable.

Last week we were awful against by far the weakest team in the league who struggle scoring yet made them look great as we were so poor, last night we were 2-0 up then blew it because we don’t kill games off other than Leeds and Southampton and we make games literally go to the final whistle due to piss poor concentration levels.

We’d be a point behind City if we’d done what we should have done last week and last night and even if we ended up 10 points behind at the end of the season it’d show genuine progression whereas right now it’s hard to honestly say whether we’re genuinely progressing or if those around us are regressing or COVID has been a factor.

 

[OrcaFat]

Caragher is, of course, biased and bitter.

Common sense tells you that we are not quite good enough to win the league, whether we fancy it or not.

The fact that our manager and players know this may be annoying but is not strange.

 

[ShinjiNinja26]

I hate to agree with him but he’s not wrong. Too many of our players just don’t seem to have the right mentality to be able to truly challenge for the title. We’ve lost 4 semi finals on the bounce, it’s become a theme with this side that when the pressures on and the big moments come we fail to deliver with the exception being the Leicester game to secure 3rd but it’s still not silverware. We’re in danger of becoming nearly men who are good but not quite good enough unless there’s some major investment in the summer.

 

[K stand Red]

He’s spitting mad

 

[TheGame]

Same argument needs to be made for Liverpool not fancying 4th.

 

[Plant0x84]

It’s a fair point. I don’t think we want it the same way City & Liverpool do. I think we’re chuffed to bits to be involved & our owners are more than happy with a top 4 finish.

He's right, the whole ethos of the club right now seems to be 'we're delighted with being comfortably in the top four'. And that's the limit of our ambition.

Solkjaer doesn't fancy it and it's rubbing off on the players.

Prick is right. We're just giddy at the thought of comfortable CL qualification.

Nobody gave us a hope of winning the league this year, so why wouldn’t we be happy with a top 4 finish?
Carragher is clearly using United to deflect from how woeful Liverpool are.
Furthermore it is well in Oles interests to downplay our chances, because failing to win it will be a bigger media fuss than if we manage it unexpectedly. Had nothing to do with whether we fancy it or not, it’s clever media management from the boss.

 

[bosnian_red]

It's true but it's also not that big a deal. It's an incremental building process and we were always going to fall off. It's a learning curve. We'll get better and learn from this season, but it was always too soon to win the title this year, when we haven't had a semblance of a challenge in 8 years.

 

[JustinC00]

I don’t think we want it the same way City & Liverpool do

Ya the scousers definitely want it this year


in before INJURIES..

If Pogba doesn't get injured yesterday, we get all 3 points against Everton. If Lindeolf wasn't injured we beat Leicester. If we got a proper pre-season we beat Crystal Palace those 2 points become 9 and we are on 52 points in 1st. Would he be saying we don't want it then? But that's all part of the game so can't use those excuses.

 

[berbatrick]

the defence, especially central defence, can't be a spine for a title-winning team. you can get away with less physically dominant defenders if you play a certain way (city/pep), but that means insane upgrades in midfield and attack, and a level of coaching nobody else has. for a conventional team trying to win the title, chasing 85+ points, these centre-backs cannot do it.

that's without getting into the inconsistencies of the forwards, especially martial and greenwood, and the bizarre 4-2-4 formation.

it's not a question of wanting it, it's a question of quality.

 

[hobbers]

Nobody gave us a hope of winning the league this year, so why wouldn’t we be happy with a top 4 finish?
Carragher is clearly using United to deflect from how woeful Liverpool are.
Furthermore it is well in Oles interests to downplay our chances, because failing to win it will be a bigger media fuss than if we manage it unexpectedly. Had nothing to do with whether we fancy it or not, it’s clever media management from the boss.

Because that was before the season started......

And it's all well and good and calling it clever media management... but you don't know whether it is clever media management. Is it clever management if a lot of our players go and take Ole's public (and/or private) words on this subject to heart and feel elated about the idea of finishing 3rd again, regardless of how shit a season Liverpool and City have? And that reflects on their performances and effort in the last few months of the season?

Yes every manager downplays title expectations, but Ole has gone beyond that with his comments and put the season in the context of "well we're just happy to show a little bit of progress".

Are we supposed to expect Ole and the squad to just magically switch into "title-contender" mode next season? Almost like we paradoxically 'arrive' as title challengers before we can believe we're title challengers? Because make no mistake we had better be competing for the league next season or we'll have wasted another 3 seasons and will have truly morphed into another pathetic top-four-is-a-trophy club with no ambition. We're not fecking Arsenal. Finishing in the top four in consecutive seasons is not a valid achievement.

 

[Coops73]

Jamie Carragher spits at children, quite frankly what that cnut says holds no weight for me.

 

[Ramshock]

He's right, the whole ethos of the club right now seems to be 'we're delighted with being comfortably in the top four'. And that's the limit of our ambition.

Thats bollocks tbf

 

[The holy trinity 68]

We were never going to win it and no one predicted us to be sitting pretty in 2nd at this stage of the season, especially after how bad we started the season.

We are still a young and inconsistent team, we are a couple of signings away from being ready to challenge properly.

I for one am quite happy at the moment to be 2nd in the league as that's not where we were expected to be at this moment. We are over achieving this season anyway, and I am just pleased to see evident progress. We have continually improved since Ole took over so hopefully we continue the trend and who knows what will happen next season.

 

[Matthew84!]

We was never going to win it, we wanted progress from last season and that's what we've got, it'll do the players good being near the top even if we can't win it,
Pointless saying yeah we're in it for it to fall apart, let Ole get us top 4 this season, hopefully 2nd and get a few more quality players for our push next season

 

[RedIan]

People tend to forget this team is so young, for that reason stability isn't there and most of the players doesn't have any experience in similar title fights.

It's all part of learning curve, team will only improve in next few years and titles will come. Even being in the title fight is already overachieving, no one expected that out of this team until at least 21-22 or 22-23

Eye - “you wont win anything with kids” ....


if your good enough your old enough.

 

[mav_9me]

He's spot on. All we need to do is say we'll win it and we will.

Haha exactly. right?

The players and the manager know we are not good enough, they know the defense/GK are not good enough. Just believing that you can do it will not magically make us better.

 

[RedIan]

Looks like Liverpool fancy it even less JAMIE - just saying