Interesting, I shall give it a whirl sometime.
Antonio Valencia | 2009/10 Performances
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) and Jamie (@Vault Dweller) are here to talk about United's dreadful home defeat at the hands of Big Ange's Tottenham Hotspur. Should this have been the end of Ten Hag? How long does he actually have left? And does Nik finally want ETH out?!
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Interesting, I shall give it a whirl sometime.
"Getting Games" is a bit of a daft argument.
You could apply that to any decent player and any club.
You could apply that to any decent player and any club.
That has absolutely nothing to do with suggesting he's better than Capdevila. He could get into a lot of La Liga sides, most through rotation but he could start matches for Valencia or Atletico and those are decent sides.
I see alot of potential in Valencia..can't believe some quarters are so quick to write the kid off.
Bags of pace, some great first touches at times, can ride challenges(against stoke he was fearless)..and although he needs work in terms of consistency of delivery, he clearly has the great technique for whipping the ball in.
We've seen from his time at Wigan and for Ecuador he also posesses the ability to hit a long pass and join in with midfield play..so clearly this guy has alot in his locker.. now it's all about honing his talents into the finished article.. let's not lose faith when he's only just joined us.
Flaws which need to be ironed out.. he needs to cut in more often and utilise his left foot..whether it be long range shots or even crossing with his weaker foot. This would allow his trademark move of taking a man around the outside alot less predictable and catch the full-back by surprise.
He also needs to stop slowing the game down at times and maintain the momentum of the attack.. he tends to stop the ball and then want to look the full back in the eye before beating him again which is just unnecessary.
Bags of pace, some great first touches at times, can ride challenges(against stoke he was fearless)..and although he needs work in terms of consistency of delivery, he clearly has the great technique for whipping the ball in.
We've seen from his time at Wigan and for Ecuador he also posesses the ability to hit a long pass and join in with midfield play..so clearly this guy has alot in his locker.. now it's all about honing his talents into the finished article.. let's not lose faith when he's only just joined us.
Flaws which need to be ironed out.. he needs to cut in more often and utilise his left foot..whether it be long range shots or even crossing with his weaker foot. This would allow his trademark move of taking a man around the outside alot less predictable and catch the full-back by surprise.
He also needs to stop slowing the game down at times and maintain the momentum of the attack.. he tends to stop the ball and then want to look the full back in the eye before beating him again which is just unnecessary.
Great analysis Raees - spot on with all of your points.
For Ferguson to sign him, and for the other clubs that were interested (Real Madrid, Bayern were suitors) there's clearly something about the boy.
He has the ability to be a huge player for us - give him time under the tutelage of the great coaches at United, learning from his fellow players, and he will grow into an important player for us.
I think all United fans want to see is one game where he really dominates an oppostition team and runs them ragged - once that happens, I think everyone will relax about him and realise how good he will be. They just want to see it, that's all!
Have faith in the lad, he'll be good!
For Ferguson to sign him, and for the other clubs that were interested (Real Madrid, Bayern were suitors) there's clearly something about the boy.
He has the ability to be a huge player for us - give him time under the tutelage of the great coaches at United, learning from his fellow players, and he will grow into an important player for us.
I think all United fans want to see is one game where he really dominates an oppostition team and runs them ragged - once that happens, I think everyone will relax about him and realise how good he will be. They just want to see it, that's all!
Have faith in the lad, he'll be good!
I can see him becoming an excellent squad player for us. Nothing else though (unfortunately!)
I'm sure we have seen barely the tip of the iceberg as far as he's concerned. He's got good strength and pace and they will be handy attributes. Not sure how much of a goal threat this lad will be though.
I think the main thing he needs to do is get settled within the team, I think he's playing within himself at the moment and thats understandable. Once he builds up his confidence I think he's be a smashing player for us.
He's very very quick and powerful, coupled that with his directness I think he'll be an hand full for most fullbacks once he's got the confidence to do so. The biggest thing he needs now is patience from the fans, I don't want Valencia to become the next Nani , who I think gets a bit too much stick from the fans which effects his performances.
I also think he should be given an extended run within the team so he can try build some momentum.
He's very very quick and powerful, coupled that with his directness I think he'll be an hand full for most fullbacks once he's got the confidence to do so. The biggest thing he needs now is patience from the fans, I don't want Valencia to become the next Nani , who I think gets a bit too much stick from the fans which effects his performances.
I also think he should be given an extended run within the team so he can try build some momentum.
I have high hopes for Valencia but I don't think he should get special treatment. Same rules apply to him as did to Nani last season. If he is to get an extended run in the team, he'll have to earn it.
We did the same with Berbatov at the beginning of last season to be fair. He had plenty of game time to help him get used to the team etc. I don't think it would hurt for Valencia to get a run of games to find some form/confidence.
I can't see Valencia making it as a starter at United. To be honest he'd be a rotational player at best. Can't see him being better than Park if the two of them are in their peak form.
Valencia needs to work with his left peg. Can't believe he's only using it like a cane. He should be at least decent being a winger and cutting inside. He's too one dimensional at the moment when it comes to dribbling and making decisions. I can't see him being a goal threat if the full back consistently shows on to his weak foot. He always seem to dribble past a defender by knocking the ball around him and relying on pace. Doesn't have the eye to get into the box when he's close to the byline. Always seems to cross the ball.
With that being said, he'll have time to improve and gel with his new team mates and would be given at least 1 full season to develop. Hope he turns alright and becomes much better footballer than what he's now. But I don't have high hopes of him to be fair.
Valencia needs to work with his left peg. Can't believe he's only using it like a cane. He should be at least decent being a winger and cutting inside. He's too one dimensional at the moment when it comes to dribbling and making decisions. I can't see him being a goal threat if the full back consistently shows on to his weak foot. He always seem to dribble past a defender by knocking the ball around him and relying on pace. Doesn't have the eye to get into the box when he's close to the byline. Always seems to cross the ball.
With that being said, he'll have time to improve and gel with his new team mates and would be given at least 1 full season to develop. Hope he turns alright and becomes much better footballer than what he's now. But I don't have high hopes of him to be fair.
He's got a hell of alot to live up to, so naturally some people are expecting more. I think he looks good, bags of pace and a good delivery with his right foot if not a little predictable at times.
Again miight just be worth holding judgement on him until he beds in properly.
Again miight just be worth holding judgement on him until he beds in properly.
Had you seen him play before we signed him?
yes. And to be honest at the moment he's exactly what he was brought in for - hard working, pacy and delivery in the box from the byline. (with the delivery not being good at the moment, apart from couple of crosses against Wigan, but I'm sure he'd adjust in that department)
Fair enough, obviously you're entitled to your opinion, I think its far too early to be suggesting he won't make it as a starter though.
yeah. I guess because he's Premiership proven I'd expect to fit in from day 1(so to speak), but the gap between Wigan and United is enormous so we'll have to wait to make a judgment I agree.
How old is he again? No chance of him developing I guess.. SAF never buys potential
24.
For the record, Elokobi is shit.
23 when we signed him. Another 5 or 6 years - at least - of improvement still to come. He's already improved immensely since he arrive in the Premier League.
Of course, that won't stop the usual 'tards from
writing him off already.
Of course, that won't stop the usual 'tards from
writing him off already.
Not so yung but lerning
Very foolish to write him off so soon and with him having his best years ahead of him.Haven't the likes of Evra and Vida taught anything to some of you ?
Both Evra and Vidic needed time to adjust to English football. They came from different countries, different cultures, unlike Valencia, who has like 90 apps in Premiership before moving to United.
He needs to improve himself in almost every area there is(except pace of course as he has plenty of it). He's too one dimensional at the moment to be a high profile winger as his price and club indicates. I can't remember the last player who was that awfully one footed as Valencia. Giggsy and Maradona were/are one footed, but Valencia is not a patch on either of them. Back in Wigan he was the same player as he's in his first 6-7 matches for United. He can't hold his own on the wing, as he's predictable and doesn't bomb the box or doesn't even find himself in good positions like Park does(surely he's excused for that as he's not accustomed to our gameplay but still, he's afraid to mix things up, if it doesn't go his way). Nani for example, as terribly inconsistent he is, always had the talent to be a top, top winger, and even in his debut season he showed glimpses of what he's capable.
Fact is I had my reservations when we signed him(as I don't think he was that impressive at Wigan) and I can't see him making it to be vital player for us(or say first teamer). And I don't believe ever was, or will be better than Nani, who gets much more stick never mind playing much less matches in Premiership than Valencia.
Sure I'd like to prove me wrong, and I'd be happy if I'm wrong and he turns into another Evra or Vidic, but so far I see him as another Poborsky.
Eh? He hit a decent cross with his left foot in the game against Stoke. If he's as one-footed as you're implying he wouldn't even have attempted that.
That's what's so annoying for me, with a lot of the criticism aimed in his direction. People are making snap really extreme snap judgements after a handful of games and as often as not these judgements aren't particularly accurate.
Enigma have you heard of Arjen Robben?
His left foot isnt exactly a swinger. He's scored goals with it you know. Cant remember the last time a certain Mr. Berbatov managed that so I'm not sure why Valencia is getting so much stick for only seeming to trust his right foot. He's not the only one.
I guess the most annoying thing about Valencia for me is the amount of times he's given the ball and just passes it back. If he's going to actually create something he's going to need attempt after attempt of getting crosses into the box. So he needs to be positive with the ball the vast majority of the time he receives it. But when he does he just seems content to knock it backwards to his fullback or diagonally backwards to a midfielder and thats the end of it. He could at least pass and move in behind the fullback and get away with his pace, then in a position to be played in behind. When he is being positive, at least he's trying to make something happen and with enough attempts and maybe a bit of luck, something will.
I guess the most annoying thing about Valencia for me is the amount of times he's given the ball and just passes it back. If he's going to actually create something he's going to need attempt after attempt of getting crosses into the box. So he needs to be positive with the ball the vast majority of the time he receives it. But when he does he just seems content to knock it backwards to his fullback or diagonally backwards to a midfielder and thats the end of it. He could at least pass and move in behind the fullback and get away with his pace, then in a position to be played in behind. When he is being positive, at least he's trying to make something happen and with enough attempts and maybe a bit of luck, something will.
It's kind of typical of this place though, isn't it? I mean, with some of the comments concerning Valencia here you'd think he was some average Championship standard player. Didn't Arsene Wenger say last season that Valencia is the best right-sided midfielder in the Premier League?
Actually I didn't catch those quotes but that's enormously pleasing.
Not that I should doubt Fergie's eye for a player but none of us will forget the last right winger that both he and Fergie had their eye on.
To be honest after listening to alot of us talk about his strengths and weaknesses on here... It's a bit shocking how Raw the guy is!
I was a bit worried I might have been talking out of my Arsene(d) so checked:
Admirers abound but Antonio Valencia represents big gamble for United | Andy Hunter | Sport | The Guardian
OK, so not 'the best' but one of the best. Close enough...
um, one decent cross when he spend his first 6 games hovering around his left foot? He had fair share of dribbling from standstill position like his left peg was nailed to the ground.
I struggle to remember the last outstanding match Valencia had at Wigan. Even Lennon who inconsistent as Nani, when on can absolutely destroy every full back in Premiership. Valencia on the other hand, does not have the variety and the talent of Nani, Lennon, Joe Cole etc..
Sure Valencia can turn into very useful for us, and surely hope so. But claiming that he'll be better at 28,29,30 is something not realistic. Valencia relies too much on pace He doesn't have the footballing brain of Giggs, Berbatov, Sheringham, even Yorke to reach peak level at 28.
Valencia should be at his peak right now - 24-25. As I've said, Valencia has almost double appearances over Nani in Premiership, yet people expect much less from Valencia right now.
My criticism is aimed at the lack of variety in his game, lack of football brain(you can't teach that most of the time) and kicking the ball with his left foot couple of times during the match, which is not something you'd like to see in 24 years old accomplished winger in the Premiership.
I'm sure Fergie bought him for a reason and he'd fulfill his potential(I'm sure he expect him to turn out as a good buy) and I trust his judgment. Hope you're right and he becomes better and better, but seeing from 3 years in Prem he doesn't strike me as a player of United quality.
yup, much better dribbler than Valencia(in terms of variety especially), better shot, better head and much more mature when 23-24. His injury list is like Saha's tho - endless.
That'll do for me. Excellent.
Then your memory is, once again, failing you.
Here's a match report from Wigan v Brum last April.
Should add that the bit about Valencia being at his peak now is complete and utter bollox. He turned 24 just over a month ago. His peak as a footballer is at least another couple of years off, almost certainly twice that.
He was also excellent against us at Old Trafford last season.
that's year and half ago, mate. Not very fresh memories, if we get that far back I thought you would've brought the game against Villa - the week he played against us and failed to make an impact,or against B'Burn last year, which IMO is by far his best match, eventho Blackburn were piss poor then.
And even in those games(Brum,Villa,B'Burn), do you think Valencia was United quality?
Really? When was the last time winger/forward who relies mainly on his pace hit his peak at 26(at least), or 27, or 28, when he loses a step or two?
Jesus wept. What's your point, that he peaked at 23?
You're a complete embarrassment. Try watching this bloke we've got playing on the left wing for us at the moment.
He's called Ryan Giggs, he's nearly 36 and he's rather good.
Busted! My google skills are lacking...I was actually looking for a match report from around about the same time this year, when he was sensational. Can't remember who it was against. I'll see if I can dig it out...
Have to say though, it's a good thing if he's had so many great displays it's tricky to find the exact one I was thinking about.
pacy players peak earlier. He should be at his peak around 23-25.
are you really comparing Giggs to Valencia?
You're saying that Giggs is at his peak at 35? Really?
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