Thank you for clearing up the exact meaning of words the Home Secretary meant without any proof.
If you want to be pedantic, it's well known that respect generally means (using Oxford here) "a strong feeling of approval of somebody/something because of their good qualities or achievements."
Why would it offend me? I just think its fecking stupid.
There is absolutely no difference if the outcome was the same. If I was gay and knew that I ran the risk of imprisonment due to my sexuality I wouldn't go to a country with those rules by choice and advertise my sexuality. Its not a hard concept. Should this be the case? No. Is it the reality? Yes.
I don't know. I see a bunch of people reacting negatively to Cleverly's statement, and you calling that being up in arms and offended. I then see you reacting negatively to the reactions, so I figured maybe you were up in arms and offended as well? No, it turns out, you can react negatively without being up in arms and offended. Imagine that.
I'm looking at the context of what he's discussing (visiting another country with different laws). Surely he's not silly or unaware enough to ask visitors to approve?
Come on, do you honestly think he was asking the visitors to approve of the laws? He must hate his job.
All are welcome but you just gotta pretend you're someone else while you're there. You can't celebrate your choices but instead you have to feel guilty about it as if it's a dirty secret and hide in the shadows.
You're not being as smart as you think you are...
Fifa is to be blamed here. Money root of all evil and all that.
You seem really offended. If you don’t like it, just leave the thread.You're not being as smart as you think you are...
Plenty of people have had reasonable takes on this who are directly affected by the world cup being in Qatar and plenty have gone straight to being outraged over a few words used to warn people that Qatar isn't the UK and they need to be careful. Unsurprisingly I was referring to the latter.
Keep fighting the good fight though
What you think you're referring to and what you're actually referring to are two very different things, because you've very clearly misunderstood basically everything. Remember, you said this:You're not being as smart as you think you are...
Plenty of people have had reasonable takes on this who are directly affected by the world cup being in Qatar and plenty have gone straight to being outraged over a few words used to warn people that Qatar isn't the UK and they need to be careful. Unsurprisingly I was referring to the latter.
Keep fighting the good fight though
However, no one is outraged or offended over anyone pointing out that it's risky to be gay in Qatar. You made that whole thing up in your own head, and that fantasy made you go off.
Nope, just finding the outrage utterly baffling. We have people claiming that there are Qatar shills in here despite no one seeming to agree with Qatars opinion on LGBT people. We have people who seem to think that I have equated being gay to being a drug user. Its pretty bizarre what people are taking from this thread and peoples views.
Maybe it’s because that’s precisely what you did.
There have been numerous news articles about people unhappy that they have been told to respect the laws and culture of Qatar. It was a message on staying safe in Qatar. Its not been a simple discussion on the issues Qatar has with LGBT people, its been negative towards the guy delivering the message.
They're unhappy about being told to respect the culture, and being told that the Qatari government is just keen on making sure that everyone is safe. That is not the same as being informed about potential risks and you know it. You have to pretend otherwise to justify your initial outrage.
I really didn't. It was simple analogy. Plenty of countries are very hard on things that we don't even consider crimes and certainly not serious crimes. Thailand takes drug offences very seriously. Qatar takes being gay very seriously. I didn't think it was that hard to understand and not jump to a bizarre conclusion that I was saying being gay was the same as taking drugs.
Think the issue seems to be with the word respect.
I'm not sure Qatar did. I think they are now as it's been made into an issue.
Of course, but you can easily issue warnings to the citizens and NOT be seen as normalizing the homophobia of the host country at the same time. I am not saying he WAS normalizing it. But, the wording led to this thread and the conversation.
Its a muslim country where being gay isn't allowed. Its not just the government that people need to worry about. That is their culture and many of the people fully believe in it. Its being pedantic over the exact wording. I imagine that the Qatari government won't want any incidents while the world is watching so I don't think its a ridiculous statement to say that they want everyone to be safe.
Exactly.
You are conflating different kind of issues. If US still had not undergone civil rights reform and had discriminatory policies/laws against Afro Americans then FIFA should not hold a WC there. Similarly if any countries have laws that treat women as second class citizens then FIFA should not be awarding WC to them either.
You would think so wouldn't you. I don't think I have ever heard "respect the rules" used as anything other than "obey the rules". No one expects you to agree with the rules, just to adhere to them or face the consequences. Whether those rules should be there is a completely different discussion.
If you’re doing it right, it is.
And isn't this cultural diversity and differences in traditions exactly what makes the world so beautiful?
Only a matter of time before they all come and call you out for your whataboutisms…
There's no need to call them out when they are already so obvious.
Yeah agreed. As a pedantic cnut myself, I do sense a lot of pedanticism in this thread with regards to what he meant by respect. From my perspective it is very unlikely Qatar intends/expects for others to actually hold their opinions on LGBT people in high regard. But there is no harm in many fans maintaining that they do not in fact respect Qatar's culture in this regard, even if they will respect the laws while in the country. I can agree that it needs to be shouted out loud that the current situation is not ok. Even if a lot of pedanticism is involved
The frustration with Qatar is not about one issue. In fact this is only the latest among a mountain of other underlying annoyances related to having a WC there - not the least of which being that its an insignificant little Island petro-state with zero football prowess who bought their way into relevance through corruption, then had the audacity to interrupt club football seasons across Europe so they could circumvent the fact that they don't actually have a climate to actually host a WC after all. The LGBTQ issue is therefore not the only problem related to this; rather its but the latest compounding symptom that reinforces the absurdity of fecking Qatar hosting a WC.
Then we are just judging a culture for going through a different stage of development (unironically, this was part of the mindset of colonizers). Since western culture sets the standard for civil rights, developed countries aren't at risk of FIFA sanctions, which makes the comparison difficult.
