Through his end product mostly. He's a great great player but his contribution outside goals is nowhere near messi's. The obsession with statistics makes this some big competition between the two.
Messi v Ronaldo | Contains double your daily salt allowance
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) and Imran (@Annihilate Now!) are here to discuss three 1-1 draws.
The first got us knocked out of the FA Cup, the next puts us in a good position in our Round of 16 Europa League game, and the latest was an actual decent performance against Arsenal at Old Trafford.
All hopes for the season now rest on the Europa League - does Amorim have the squad to win it?
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Through his end product mostly. He's a great great player but his contribution outside goals is nowhere near messi's. The obsession with statistics makes this some big competition between the two.
He didn't need to do more. He was brilliant, he just wasn't as good as Messi, which doesn't reflect badly on Xavi.
Messi was and is that good that even in a team like Barcelona he looked/looks way above the rest.
It was more than the goals. Where is Vato or Skorenzy when you need them?
If it all comes down to personal opinion then fair enough, but that is the only argument I'm hearing.
On the odds I come off as Cal reincarnate, I shall retire for the day from this thread.
Nothing. Xavi was such a brilliant player but it was never in him to peform at Messi's level. He'd have to suddenly develop abilities he simply didn't have.
That's why I said mostly. I used to argue a lot against people who claimed Ronaldo was a poacher, but yeah, he's sort of like a striker in that you can sum up his game by his goal threat. Neymar right now is a good comparison. It's not comparable to a guy who is a proper playmaker, and who can help run the game, split defences and is the best passer in the game, as well.
Why? Ronaldo is good on the ball but he's never been like a Ronaldhinio on the ball let alone messi. Having seen Ronaldo so much United fans should know this.
How come you never really get Cristiano Ronaldo being compared with Pele or Maradona etc??
It seems the nearest Ronaldo gets is being compared to Messi who is regularly talked about in that kind of company.
It seems the nearest Ronaldo gets is being compared to Messi who is regularly talked about in that kind of company.
Why?
because a lot of United fans tend to be just a tad biased when it comes to Ronaldo.
Of course that's not what he meant but still :P
It does seem wrong that Xavi will retire without having a Ballon D'or. But at the end of the day it wasn't his god given right to win one, and he's just unfortunate that his good form happened at the same time his team mate was turning in performances that had him being compared with the games greats. Plus I doubt Xavi cares that much anyway, he's never once came across as being bitter in any way.
Yes I am a United fan. Do you mean that when he was playing at United, he had more flair to his game? I definitely agree with that but it wasn't to the level that would cement him as an all time great. What makes him an all time great is records and stats as they are out of this world. Messi has the same stats plus a level of flair that rival Zidane and Maradona which is frankly ridiculous.
I think Cal needs to address why he reckons Ronaldo's 2006 WC was superior to Messi's 2014 WC when in the past he had insisted on judging players on their trophies (Messi's silver medal to Ronaldo no medal) or goals scored (Messi's 4 goals to Ronaldo one penalty kick goal). Portugal 2006 wasn't really weaker than current Argentina either.
Despite the Messi/Ronaldo comparisons, it's generally Messi who comes out on top in most of them. In fact, a couple of years back (probably around 2012 and 2013 for a while), the debate seemed almost dead. It started to crop up again, although Messi's now found his very best form.
messi is xavi plus ronaldo
dont hold your breath
I don't know where I should put this one..
By that logic the best footballer in the world is one of those football freestylists.
That's exactly it with Messi fans, you're sure, with no evidence whatsoever. Messi clearly does not have the pace to play Real's counter attacking game the way Ronaldo does, but never mind, you're SURE he'd be EQUALLY effective.
You make it sound like the end product isn't the only thing that decide football results. If football was like gymnastics and scored by judges, Messi will win by some distance.
I've never said that, otherwise you'd have to conclude Jordi Cruyff was much better than Gerrard and Shearer.
Something to do with Ronaldo being much the better player over the last 2 years...
Very debatable. It's not as if Messi's been poor by any means, and his overall game is generally a lot better than Ronaldo's.
Admittedly, I haven't watched Barcelona or Real Madrid as much as most on here, it would seem. However, from what I have seen, judging a player solely on what he contributes instead of statistics, I would have to say that Iniesta is the best of the lot; he was involved in pretty much everything Barcelona did in their peak years. Xavi would be the one after him and then Messi. Both Iniesta and Xavi influenced matches more than Messi did. The three of them influenced matches more than Ronaldo has ever done, in terms of the overall play. That said, but taking away stats, you are taking away winning games, and that leaves Messi and Ronaldo standing. When talking about Henry for instance, nobody would say it was wrong to include his athleticism; why is it then wrong to include it when talking about Ronaldo vs Messi? What makes Ronaldo as good, or better according to some, is his athleticism. He is faster, stronger, has far greater stamina, much better in the air and that makes up, to a large extent for his inferior passing to Messi.
Messi fanboys always want to dismiss physical ability, and Ronaldo fanboys want to highlight them. The truth lies somewhere in the middle.
Messi fanboys always want to dismiss physical ability, and Ronaldo fanboys want to highlight them. The truth lies somewhere in the middle.
you said this:
messi scores as many goals as ronaldo, plus his involvmente in barcelona attack is as good as xavis
When Messi gets voted the Balon D'or it's because he's the bestest player ever ever, when Ronaldo wins it, it's debatable?
Anyway, like I've said many times, I respect many people have the OPINION that Messi is the better player, it's only those who insists their opinions are facts that I've a problem with.
Yes and you are sure he wouldn't with no evidence whatsoever. Pace, its not as if he is slow, and what he lacks in pace he would add in different ways. Barca doing pretty well on the counter this season.
I make to sound like it is. There's more to football than scoring goals. There is creating goals/chances, dominating possession, leading, defending, something called passing. You're an absolute moron if you think end product is all there is to football. Otherwise Ruud Van Nistelrooy was better than maradona. Even you're not daft enough to think that.
When Messi gets voted the Balon D'or it's because he's the bestest player ever ever, when Ronaldo wins it, it's debatable?
Anyway, like I've said many times, I respect many people have the OPINION that Messi is the better player, it's only those who insists their opinions are facts that I've a problem with.
It's a lost cause, I tell you. You are, of course right, but that's just my opinion.
Chicharito is a better player for Mexico than Messi is for Argentina.
38/70 > 45/96
tbf, it is a fact. Overall game > goal stats
When Messi gets voted the Balon D'or it's because he's the bestest player ever ever, when Ronaldo wins it, it's debatable?
Anyway, like I've said many times, I respect many people have the OPINION that Messi is the better player, it's only those who insists their opinions are facts that I've a problem with.
What? Never said that at all, I'm just stating my opinion...as you are. I'll happily admit that Ronaldo's first award was completely justified 100%, and even the last two I wouldn't say he was undeserving of - just that it wouldn't have been outlandish for it to go to Messi either. For someone who gets annoyed when people put words in his mouth, you're kind of doing the same thing here.
yes, i'm sure messi would be benched in mexico
As long as you're sure... I'm not so sure that Ronaldo will be as effective in Messi's role at Barca, even though he would add many different things that Messi can't do.
And all those things ultimately need to lead to goals (being scored or prevented), otherwise they mean nothing.
Of course completely ignoring the fact that Mexico largely dominate most North American teams they play against in qualifiers, while the South American qualifiers tend to be a lot more difficult. Although I think you might be taking the piss with that one...
Apologies for coming across as such, but there have been many Messi fans who loved the fact that it was 4-1 to Messi back 2 years ago and go on and on about how that proved they're so right.
It would have been pretty outlandish to give it to Messi for 2014, but never mind...
Probably a little bit, although I think part of that almost comes from how incredible he's been in the past since he hardly had a poor year. Still, I don't begrudge Ronaldo getting it for 2014 at all by any means, even if I think Messi's beats him as an overall footballer when he's at his best.
oh, those years ... when your opinion was that the voters were clueless
oh noes!!!! not that smilie!!!!!!! that means you are right!!!!!!!!!
Funny how clueless they've become in the last 2 years, isn't it?
If current form means 2015 only, I agree completely.On form, Messi > Ronaldo at the moment.
Yeah, 2015.
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