You're Ten Hag - what do you do?

Right now the task fo Ten Hag hands is to steady the ship and dealing with the current injury situation better. Many feel changing the current full back will solve a lot of the woes but Maguire brought into the starting line up will cause it's own issues as will lindelof in a full back position.

And injuries can very diffcult to deal with for example from Jan 4th to March 7 2021 Liverpool under Klopp played 12 Premier league game won 3,drew 1 and lost 8. Among those defeats included at home to Burnley,Everton,Brighton and Fulham.
 
When all are fit:

Onana
AWB -------------- Varane ----------- Martinez ---------- Shaw
Casemiro ---------- Amrabat
Antony ---------------------- Mount ------------------ Garnacho
Hojlund

For now:

Onana
Dalot ----------------- Varane ------------ Evans ----------- Reguillon
Casemiro ---------- Amrabat
Antony ---------------------- Mount ------------------ Garnacho
Hojlund​
 
There's no magic trick here. The players' confidence will definitely be shot. We don't have many options with our injuries.

I think it's stupid to be "pragmatic" as armchair managers on here call it. Scraping wins here and there doesn't get us closer to being a dominant side that competes for major trophies. He needs to figure out how he wants us to play in the long term, and get us started on that, today. We don't have everyone needed in place. But you can't keep on switching tactics and patterns in a major way, because you leave the players confused and we don't get good at anything.

Klopp and Pep got called naive for sticking to their methods even while suffering defeats in their first season, but there was enough seen for the clubs to gain confidence in the methods and back the managers with improved players.

Murtaugh and/or Fletcher need to sit down with Ten Hag and give him confidence the club has his back through the end of the season, and he needs to just work on making the team real good at a certain kind of play. feck the results. We aren't winning the PL or CL this season. Focus on ensuring that at the end of the season that there is a solid foundation that can be built on.

That, or cosplay Real Madrid and sack him immediately, sparing him the trouble.
 
If I was Ten Hag, I would try and stop moving players out of their natural positions.

With our current injury crisis I understand that is difficult, but I would definitely put Amrabat back in midfield, Bruno behind Hojlund.

I would also use players like Maguire, McTominay and Van De Beek. If there is an injury on their positions I would put them on. No need to freeze them out.

A player I would freeze out is Sancho. He needs to understand he's not a superstar and he can't be given special treatment.

Lastly, select players who are fully focused, who work their socks off during training and leave a good impression that week. If it's Hannibal, Pellistri, Dan Gore or that Turkish keeper, then play him.
 
Unam333 said:
If I was Ten Hag, I would try and stop moving players out of their natural positions.

With our current injury crisis I understand that is difficult, but I would definitely put Amrabat back in midfield, Bruno behind Hojlund.

I would also use players like Maguire, McTominay and Van De Beek. If there is an injury on their positions I would put them on. No need to freeze them out.

A player I would freeze out is Sancho. He needs to understand he's not a superstar and he can't be given special treatment.

Lastly, select players who are fully focused, who work their socks off during training and leave a good impression that week. If it's Hannibal, Pellistri, Dan Gore or that Turkish keeper, then play him.
Click to expand...

Exactly.
 
Get all the coaches and senior players together and figure out a plan for Brentford. The situation is so dire we have to take this game by game.
 
Play more solidly. Play somebody else at left back and put Casemiro and Amrabat in midfield. We need to stop bleeding goals. Get a few 1-0s if required. We can't go on completely open.
 
When all are fit

Onana

Varane ------------- Martinez
Dalot --------------------------------------------------------------- Shaw
Casemiro
Bruno ------------------- Mount
Antony ----------------------------------------------------- Rashford
Hojlund


For now

Bayindir

Varane ------------ Maguire
Dalot ---------------------------------------------------------- Amrabat
Casemiro
Bruno --------------------- Mount
Antony -------------------------------------------------- Rashford
Hojlund​
 
Avero said:
When all are fit

Onana

Varane ------------- Martinez
Dalot --------------------------------------------------------------- Shaw
Casemiro
Bruno ------------------- Mount
Antony ----------------------------------------------------- Rashford
Hojlund


For now

Bayindir

Varane ------------ Maguire
Dalot ---------------------------------------------------------- Amrabat
Casemiro
Bruno --------------------- Mount
Antony -------------------------------------------------- Rashford
Hojlund​
Click to expand...
Amarabat for Bruno or mount. Also AWB for Dalot.
 
For god's sake Erik.

Play the following Saturday:

Bayinder

Lindelof Maguire Varane Dalot

Eriksen Casemiro Amrabat

Mount Hojlund Martial

Please god Reguilon is back so Dalot can play RB instead of Lindelof.

Bruno, Rashford, Onana need removal from the squad. Set up defensively. Stop this chaotic, kamikaze style of play. Farcical last night.

Lindelof and Varane were brutal last night. Fernandes anonymous.
 
Pair Amrabat and Casemiro as a proper centre mid combo. Dalot to left back and Lindelof or anyone in the youth team as right back.
Hope to take the best moments of yesterday without the circus nonsense meltdown and win.

Them hope someone on the injury list is back to play left back next game out.

Obviously having conducted an inquest into why the keeper keeps sitting down on thr spot instead of narrowing the angle.
And why the centre mid let everyone storm through.
 
1. He should stick to his guns overall. In principle what he's trying to do makes sense, and he's bought the right profile of players for it, and they all not only have the right pedigree but have very recently all been in good form, either for us or elsewhere. Form is temporary, class is permanent and all that.

2. Externally, he must highlight that we are riding out a serious injury crisis. With some luck, by the end of October, the starting XI will be looking significantly better, because a number of our FB options will be available again (including Shaw, hugely valuable to the team in his own right). That will allow us to either replace or combine Casemiro with Amrabat, which should ease our biggest consistent issue since the start of the season, our defensive weakness through the middle.

Internally, he must talk as little as possible about the injury situation, and instead hold the players to a higher standard, especially the experienced ones. I expect he already is: these things aren't always like waving a magic wand.

3. He must stick by Onana. It was never going to be easy to adapt from one of the most line-hugging to one of the most ball-playing top-level GKs in the world. We all knew this, and plenty said it. We are in the same adjustment period in which De Gea was getting battered for failing to claim crosses. It takes time. Onana will settle, and the rest of the team will adjust to how to play with him.

4. He should move Rashford to the right and start Garnacho on the left. Hojlund looks capable of being a consistent goal threat, and regardless of who's new and who's the 'star' player, you should build an attacking unit that allows your CF to score goals. That's conventional wisdom for a reason.

Of course for fans it's maddening to see the season slipping away after all the promise of last year. Fans are reactive. Sadly so are owners. But even given the latter, I think as a manager you have to ask whether your approach is a logical one given the resources available, and if it is you have to stick at it.
 
sugar_kane said:
This isn't a thread to discuss whether Ten Hag should go or not or whether he's doing a good/bad job, but rather pose the question of if you were in his position what would you do to turn things round?

First of all, he needs to stop with all this talk of players making unacceptable mistakes etc. He's tried it for months, and I understand why given our mentality issues, but it isn't working. If he keeps it up, the dressing room will turn on him and he is fecked.

Second of all, he needs to start making a big noise about the injuries we have. He doesn't want to make excuses which is noble but it means the pundits completely ignore it despite it being a full blown crisis and one of the main issues facing us right now. The narrative needs to shift to ease the pressure on the team as they clearly can't cope.

Thirdly, he should do similar when we're getting shat on by referees. Take a fine or a ban if needed. We hate Klopp and take the piss out of him for it, but (ignoring the insane VAR feck up at the weekend) it seems to work.

On the pitch he needs to rest Onana, Rashford and Bruno asap and consider dropping Casemiro as a guaranteed starter as they are all performing terribly. I think he's working up to this with the Rashford substitutions. We need energy and confidence in the team and all these guys are sapping that when they're on the pitch.

Also don't be shy of re-introducing Maguire, he's been out of the limelight enough now to have rebuilt some confidence, and he can't possibly be worse than our current players. Being cynical, I also think it will ease some of the pressure he's getting from the press many of whom are Team Maguire.

In terms of what he shouldn't do, don't bring back Sancho unless he apologies. While he could certainly add something to the team right now, it will completely undermine him in front of the squad. I don't think Sancho has enough allies in the press or the squad for the current strategy to be too much of a risk.
Click to expand...

There's little he can do differently based on information he has (and fans don't) in terms of who is performing well in training and who isn't. The players who are unavailable narrow his options.
 
Onana
Dalot Varane Lindelöf Amrabat
Casemiro
Antony Mount Hanibal Garnacho
Hojlund

Bench the hell out of rashy and bruno. Give Varane the c or even Eriksen.
Fix the problem with Sancho, have him as backup for Antony/Garnacho.
 
Until we have a left back fit...

Onana
Lindelof Varane Maguire Dalot
Amrabat Casemiro
Mount Hannibal Garnacho
Hojlund

For Ten Hag to do the right thing for the short term, he has to play a Maguire or Evans with Varane to allow Lindelof to play fullback. He also has to ditch the CM experiment with Mount.

He needs to drop both Fernandes and Rashford for the next game. I can't see him doing any of those so he may fall on his sword.

I actually think he's a great manager for us and disciplinarian, however his lack of control of the way the team perform on the pitch is now alarming. Especially when we're ahead and conceding straightaway. That cannot have gone on this long.

I think Ten Hags got 5 games to save his job here even if I believe it's too soon to call for the sack.
 
The first thing i would do is to re-examine the training method. we are flooded with injuries by september! it cant be coincidence.
 
We need to become a tighter team defensively, we're shipping too many goals and not covering the defense. We're all at sea in midfield and easy to exploit. We're a shambles on freekicks and corners too.

I would play a more orthodox 433 and have defenders or someone with more defensive line experience to cover our leftback.

Once we become tighter we can be more confident and not let leads slip or collapse. We have lots of attacking power in Rashford Hojlund and others.

Casemiro Amrabat
One of Eriksen/Mount/Hannibal/Bruno

Bruno has played an enormous amount of minutes. He's been overplayed for years and drying up on goals and effectiveness. Give him some bench time and have him come on for Eriksen or Mount. Our more advance mid has to be disciplined and instructed to help out the midfield. Right now we have too many players pushing on, no control in midfield and exposing our defence and keeper.

Maybe overtime when we're a well drilled side and not injury devastated we could play more attacking formations depending on the opponent but ETH has build up to this. We have fragile players and injuries, a new keeper, he's playing suicide football, it's all very aloof with our midfield. High turnovers don't even produce much for other teams. We can create and exploit teams from a little deeper with a good range of passing and a disciplined midfield and fast strikers. Smothering lower teams is not a good tactic, we need opposing teams to come out more, stretch them from one side to another to create the space.
 
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Do what LVG did. Play the youth, they will listen to the tactics.

Drop Bruno and Rashford and get Evans next to Varane.
 
Fluctuation0161 said:
Onana needs a rest. He lost us the last game singlehandedly. Bench him.
Click to expand...
He really didn't. We had already conceded two goals, which he could do nothing about, before his calamitous error. He's an easy scapegoat, because goalkeepers are always under such scrutiny and the error was so ridiculous, but in all honesty Lindelof, Dalot, Varane, Amrabat, Bruno and Casemiro were just as culpable in that defeat.
 
Midfield
We have got to play Casemiro in a deeper role, protect the gaping hole in the middle.

Due to our double pivot, he is playing higher up the field and just doesnt have the legs to track back and match pace with oppo midfielders. and we have no solid defensive minded player next to Case to provide that cover, with Amrabaat having to play at LB.

So, for the time being - 4-3-3.


--------------Casemiro----------------
--- Bruno ---------------------Mount/hannibal

Front 3
Upfront, thankfully Antony is back so he starts, Bruno can move back in the middle.
Between Rashford and Garnacho, I would continue with Rashford as first choice. He is a confidence player and once he does him and Hoijlund could be deadly upfront. Also, this season he is role transitioning (again!). From being the main goal threat, he is now re-learning to be the provider/partner for Hoijlund. Does seem to be affecting his decision making even more than usual.

So, front 3

---Antony --------------------Rashford--
------------Hoijlund -------------


Defense

With literally no options here, can't change personnel. At best give more protection by Case playing deep, and one of the 2 full backs defending more than the other. Cant have both bombing up and leading to pressure on the counter.
 
Has to go back to conservative, posession-based football and eke out some clean sheets, at the expense of what has occasionally looked a strong attack this season. Needs to get Amrabat next to Casemiro, tell Casemiro he is not, in fact, our number 10 and do his damn job. Put defenders in defense - that means Lindelof at RB, Maguire at CB.

Bruno statistically does all his best work playing from the pocket left of centre, so stick Bruno back in the midfield 3, shunt Mount over to the right as he's defensively pretty good. Leave Rashford and Hojlund to do their thing.

And most importantly, teach some patience. Every drill this week, no one can shoot until 10+ passes. If we score, no one tries to get into the attacking third again for 3 minutes of posession. If we score, Casemiro is banned from leaving his own half for 5 minutes. Ditto the full backs.

Finally, he HAS to stick with Onana. That'll be a big man-management moment for him. Everything we've seen from the keeper before he came is that he's a very confident player, so ETH has to get him feeling happier about being the no 1 at one of the biggest clubs in the world. I actually think we'd be better if ETH just let Onana be Onana. Despite being lobbed in preseason, he looked a lot better when he wasn't being shackled and was halfway up the pitch most of the match. That's why we bought him, let him be him. It's not like he's goign to do any worse at this stage.
 
I don’t envy Ten Hag the situation, because there are no quick fixes for a team depleted of players, of telations and of confidence at the same time. Time and again we see that strategically, United get the match into a favorable pattern - what Ten Hag can affect - and then bad decisions and rookie mistakes cost goals at both ends, deciding the actual results.

Arranging a family togetherness day at Carrington was a good example of Ten Hag trying to affect the togetherness of the squad, and it worked - for one game, until CP scored on their first attack in the league game, and then it’s all undone.

A back five with no internal relations will produce mistakes. The issue is that the players as a collective don’t handle mistakes too well. That has been the case under different managers with differrnt players, and the simple answer is that media and fan negativity frenzy will affect footballers. As managers, both Solskjær and Ten Hag actually has shown impressive skills in keeping outer mass scrutiny at bay, it just gets too much in the end.
 
The first step is to decide what my strongest XI and if the players are fit they play exactly where they are strongest. Any gaps are filled with stopgap players who can ‘do a job’ - no more Bruno on the right or Rashford upfront or Amrabat at left back.

Onana, Wan Bissaka, Varane, Martinez, Shaw, Casemiro, Amrabat, Antony, Bruno, Rashford, Hojlund. Anyone missing gets replaced by someone else, no shifting players out of their best positions to accommodate injuries.

No loyalty shown to players who aren’t working in his system - if Rashford won’t pass it or won’t track back, drop him until he does. The ‘moments’ players aren’t allowed to be like this any more, either help the team and the system or feck off.

Lock down after we score, it feels like concede immediately after scoring every game. I don’t care if it’s boring, don’t chase a second, get your concentration back.

Don’t neglect midfield. Eriksen was left as our only midfielder towards the end against Gala. Even if we’re losing, don’t abandon the shape.

Aim for wholesale changes around 60 minutes if it’s not working, no more 85th minute attacking subs to chase a goal.
 
Abraxas said:
Play more solidly. Play somebody else at left back and put Casemiro and Amrabat in midfield. We need to stop bleeding goals. Get a few 1-0s if required. We can't go on completely open.
Click to expand...

Exactly that.
We are shipping far too many goals.
So the very first thing he absolutely has to sort out is to drill the players on how to keep the defences as tight as possible. And keep drilling this until he believes they both understand and can execute his coaching.

By all means just sit back and play counter attacking football. But keep the defence as compact as possible and as you rightly say, a few 1-0 results will improve confidence.
 
Care_de_Bobo said:
He really didn't. We had already conceded two goals, which he could do nothing about, before his calamitous error. He's an easy scapegoat, because goalkeepers are always under such scrutiny and the error was so ridiculous, but in all honesty Lindelof, Dalot, Varane, Amrabat, Bruno and Casemiro were just as culpable in that defeat.
Click to expand...
I'm not excusing our terrible defending. But I think Onana was the most culpable for that defeat.

Regardless, when you combine his culpability in other games also, a picture begins to emerge.

But, now the dust has settledafter that depressing performance, maybe it is best in the long term that we play Onana to build his confidence back up. As that will be vital to our season. I'll trust in Ten Hag.
 
Set an example, first of all. Playing players that performs horribly sends a poor message to the youth and our other players, that it is okay to not be at your best because you'll continue to play. Weak manager.
 
Jacob said:
When all are fit:

Onana
AWB -------------- Varane ----------- Martinez ---------- Shaw
Casemiro ---------- Amrabat
Antony ---------------------- Mount ------------------ Garnacho
Hojlund

For now:

Onana
Dalot ----------------- Varane ------------ Evans ----------- Reguillon
Casemiro ---------- Amrabat
Antony ---------------------- Mount ------------------ Garnacho
Hojlund​
Click to expand...

This is the thing with EtH, he actually has some credible replacements for Bruno and Rashford. Time to dump Player FC.
 
A- Hire some fitness people. They are dreadful
B- Go with a deep line and counter at least until we have a functioning defence
C- Play Lindelof on the RB, Maguire and Varane as CB and Dalot on the left. That would allow us to play Amrabat and Casemiro in CM with Mount on the right, Bruno as AMC and Rashford/Garnacho as LW.
 
Scrap the transition system that's available with a fully fit midfield and go back to progressing the ball from defence to attack. Feels like the decision to try a new system has come to haunt the management. It's too early in his tenure to be chopping and changing tactical approaches which is far easier and likely successful in a settled team.

I think the 4-2-3-1 has yielded the best results for Eth, the double pivot with Casemiro / Amrabat and Mount on the left and Rashford on the right or visa versa.
 
I agree that he should stick to his guns in terms of what he's trying to do, but he must find ways to improve the defence in the interim.

You can't be leaking three goals a game, whatever style you play.
 
Depending on fitness I’d probably play:

Onana
Dalot
Varane
Lindelof
Reguillon
Casemiro
Amrabat
Bruno/Mount
Mount/Garnacho
Hojlund
Antony
 
Avero said:
When all are fit

Onana

Varane ------------- Martinez
Dalot --------------------------------------------------------------- Shaw
Casemiro
Bruno ------------------- Mount
Antony ----------------------------------------------------- Rashford
Hojlund


For now

Bayindir

Varane ------------ Maguire
Dalot ---------------------------------------------------------- Amrabat
Casemiro
Bruno --------------------- Mount
Antony -------------------------------------------------- Rashford
Hojlund​
Click to expand...

I don't agree 100% with this ^ but lets take a moment to congratulate you for that layout! perfect execution @Avero
 
always_hoping said:
Right now the task fo Ten Hag hands is to steady the ship and dealing with the current injury situation better. Many feel changing the current full back will solve a lot of the woes but Maguire brought into the starting line up will cause it's own issues as will lindelof in a full back position.

And injuries can very diffcult to deal with for example from Jan 4th to March 7 2021 Liverpool under Klopp played 12 Premier league game won 3,drew 1 and lost 8. Among those defeats included at home to Burnley,Everton,Brighton and Fulham.
Click to expand...
Unam333 said:
If I was Ten Hag, I would try and stop moving players out of their natural positions.

With our current injury crisis I understand that is difficult, but I would definitely put Amrabat back in midfield, Bruno behind Hojlund.

I would also use players like Maguire, McTominay and Van De Beek. If there is an injury on their positions I would put them on. No need to freeze them out.

A player I would freeze out is Sancho. He needs to understand he's not a superstar and he can't be given special treatment.

Lastly, select players who are fully focused, who work their socks off during training and leave a good impression that week. If it's Hannibal, Pellistri, Dan Gore or that Turkish keeper, then play him.
Click to expand...
Brightonian said:
1. He should stick to his guns overall. In principle what he's trying to do makes sense, and he's bought the right profile of players for it, and they all not only have the right pedigree but have very recently all been in good form, either for us or elsewhere. Form is temporary, class is permanent and all that.

2. Externally, he must highlight that we are riding out a serious injury crisis. With some luck, by the end of October, the starting XI will be looking significantly better, because a number of our FB options will be available again (including Shaw, hugely valuable to the team in his own right). That will allow us to either replace or combine Casemiro with Amrabat, which should ease our biggest consistent issue since the start of the season, our defensive weakness through the middle.

Internally, he must talk as little as possible about the injury situation, and instead hold the players to a higher standard, especially the experienced ones. I expect he already is: these things aren't always like waving a magic wand.

3. He must stick by Onana. It was never going to be easy to adapt from one of the most line-hugging to one of the most ball-playing top-level GKs in the world. We all knew this, and plenty said it. We are in the same adjustment period in which De Gea was getting battered for failing to claim crosses. It takes time. Onana will settle, and the rest of the team will adjust to how to play with him.

4. He should move Rashford to the right and start Garnacho on the left. Hojlund looks capable of being a consistent goal threat, and regardless of who's new and who's the 'star' player, you should build an attacking unit that allows your CF to score goals. That's conventional wisdom for a reason.

Of course for fans it's maddening to see the season slipping away after all the promise of last year. Fans are reactive. Sadly so are owners. But even given the latter, I think as a manager you have to ask whether your approach is a logical one given the resources available, and if it is you have to stick at it.
Click to expand...
we have no more injuries than Spurs, Sheffield, Forrest, Villa, have 1 or 2 more than Bournemouth, Brentford, Arsenal, Btown, Burnley, less injuries than Palace and 5 less than Chelsea.

Many of those teams are above us in the table
 
Pack his bags, he's just got the dreaded vote of confidence from the board :lol:
 
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