It is a shame he isn't good enough but given where we are with Martial it was worth a try. We could help him out a bit by passing to him when he gets clear in the box rather than picking the other option or shooting from tight angles. I don't know how much bigger he would have to be to be seen though. In truth that's not a Wout thing, its a team thing.
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Season Average Rating
- Appearances
- 31
- Goals
- 2
- Assists
- 2
- Yellow cards
- 2
- Status
I actually thought he would be better than this, wasn’t expecting fireworks but expended half a dozen goals or so and some better hold up play. He’s actually worse than expected.
He's just so slow, and I don't mean his sprinting. He doesn't sort his feet out fast enough when the ball is fizzed into him and he's always on his heels and flat footed when trying to get on the end of things in the box.
Some people are implying this, by saying we should take him on a permanent deal to be back up next season, because apparently anyone better than him either wouldn't want to sit on the bench or would be too expensive.
Yeah he's literally Burnley standard. People praising him for his tactical intelligence and workrate and saying we should buy him permanently in the summer are missing the bigger picture - he's not very good. Not even close to good enough to be a backup striker for us. He's the Mctominay forward equivalent, only actually worse.
Weggy is a lot like McTominay, or at least the way they are both perceived. They both fall well below historic standards for United, they both are triers, they both have a positive attitude. People want us to upgrade both of them, which should not be difficult, but apparently is, at least with McT because he's still here. McT is on something like 60K pounds per week. Brandon Williams, for instance, gets 65K. Phil Jones gets 75K. VanDeBeek is on 120K. Sancho is 350K. (figures from Sportrac, https://www.spotrac.com/epl/manchester-united-fc/payroll/) So McT is relatively very cheap, and having him part of the larger squad is cost-effective. He plays as much as he does because the better players ahead of him are not available. Weghorst is also very cheap, and the one thing he's ostensibly in the side to do (i.e., score goals) he can't seem to do. Yet he keeps playing and we (mostly) keep winning.
As long as we're winning the matches, I don't care who plays, even if it's 90 minutes of McFred. I would love swashbuckling 1-touch football, who wouldn't. I would love to have another Ruud/RvP/Rooney/Yorke/Cole/Shearingham leading the attack and score wonder goals. It would be fun to watch. But we don't have anyone like that. We have Wout the Workhorse. He's trying his balls off. He is like Rudy, and if everyone had the heart of Rudy (or Weggy) we'd be something something champions. For whatever reason(s), EtH selects Weggy and has him do whatever it is he does. It looks to me like EtH's plan is to use Weggy in the first half to batter the opponents into a mindset that changes when we bring on our speedsters in the 2nd half. It's mostly working.
If we get bought by the Qataris, we are going to have so much money that we will constantly be demanding that every player is world class and the backups are world class too. It seems a little soulless to me. Think of all the players we've been linked with who were coming for the paycheck, and we're going to have a team full of them. I like watching players with personality and good attitudes. Winning with a bunch of cnuts in the team isn't as enjoyable. When next summer transfer window opens, we will probably shift a bunch of these players, Wout included, because we will be so flush with cash it's going to be insane. Then we'll have a team full of late stage Ronaldos. Hooray, I guess.
As long as we're winning the matches, I don't care who plays, even if it's 90 minutes of McFred. I would love swashbuckling 1-touch football, who wouldn't. I would love to have another Ruud/RvP/Rooney/Yorke/Cole/Shearingham leading the attack and score wonder goals. It would be fun to watch. But we don't have anyone like that. We have Wout the Workhorse. He's trying his balls off. He is like Rudy, and if everyone had the heart of Rudy (or Weggy) we'd be something something champions. For whatever reason(s), EtH selects Weggy and has him do whatever it is he does. It looks to me like EtH's plan is to use Weggy in the first half to batter the opponents into a mindset that changes when we bring on our speedsters in the 2nd half. It's mostly working.
If we get bought by the Qataris, we are going to have so much money that we will constantly be demanding that every player is world class and the backups are world class too. It seems a little soulless to me. Think of all the players we've been linked with who were coming for the paycheck, and we're going to have a team full of them. I like watching players with personality and good attitudes. Winning with a bunch of cnuts in the team isn't as enjoyable. When next summer transfer window opens, we will probably shift a bunch of these players, Wout included, because we will be so flush with cash it's going to be insane. Then we'll have a team full of late stage Ronaldos. Hooray, I guess.
he's an athlete, but not really a footballer
The crazy thing is it can be premature to leap to conclusions after a new players first full season. Weghorst has been here two months!
We've become progressively worse since he arrived and are now relying on Rashford to save our skin every week.
If Martial doesn't stay fit I'm worried for the run in. I could easily see us dropping out of the top 4 because every game with Weghorst is on a knife edge. We can't afford to be playing with 10 men.
If Martial doesn't stay fit I'm worried for the run in. I could easily see us dropping out of the top 4 because every game with Weghorst is on a knife edge. We can't afford to be playing with 10 men.
One of the most likeable guys in the squad but he has increased the spotlight on just how badly we need a top class number 9. Cannot fault his effort but his ability just isn't there.
There has been a lot of talk that Weggy has enabled others around him, mainly Rashford, to improve, create and score, and while I agree with the notion, we still need some goals from the guy. Still a fair bit of the season to go but he needs to start chipping in with a few goals before the end of the season. We cannot rely on Rashford every game.
There has been a lot of talk that Weggy has enabled others around him, mainly Rashford, to improve, create and score, and while I agree with the notion, we still need some goals from the guy. Still a fair bit of the season to go but he needs to start chipping in with a few goals before the end of the season. We cannot rely on Rashford every game.
But sometimes it's immediately obvious a player shouldn't be at this level. They're that far off it's not a question of more time.
I will sidestep the Qataris stuff here.
The issue with your argument is that it's based on hit and hope type of logic. It's the same logic with McFred midfield in recent past, or building the defense around Maguire. We finished 2nd and 3rd. Made EL final, so it must have been Okay? Then adding more luxury players, and higher expectation of the team, and it came crashing down.
Weghorst case is like McFred argument vs fitting Pogba into the midfield thing. Some people would point out that Weghorst (McFred)m Maguire is better than Ronaldo (Pogba), Lindelof, Bailly, Varane but the problem remains: ridding the greater of the two devils does not stop future issue when the other devil still exists. The flaw is too big to just sidestep to continue on this path.
It's been a great season where ETH and the team exceeding expectation. However, if this team is expected to challenge for title and meet CL heavyweights regularly, not only the starting XI required to do better but also the rotation options.
If you look at the games against true big teams with high ceiling, performance wise is not really good enough from Weghorst: Arsenal, Liverpool, Barcelona. He was not available to play against City might have been a good thing.
While result has been generally good, the performance against beatable teams is not nalways great too, despite the scoreline. Both Leeds game had long period where the game was on the balance which can sway either direction. Leicester first half despite the lead it was an overall meh performance for the whole team (ETH said as much). Crystal Palace away was another meh performance for the team. People got overboard with new signing syndrome where Weghorst just did what he's expected as CF. His failure to convert chances was deemed as new player unfamiliar with the team (he's still messing up chances till this day!!!). The Crystal Palace home game, team played very well, yet we did better after Weghorst subbed off until the red card. Weghorst played well whole game but against West Ham and we needed our key players to rescue the game, and only won the game in 90th minute. Fulham game was end to end with Fulham was all over us in second half until Antony came on. Other games against teams we expected to beat easily and soundly, despite we played well, Weghorst did decently, he just failed as a scoring threat.
Even ETH is wisen up not to use McFred together after the Brighton game (Either one of them with other midfielder), and we clearly need to upgrade. Learning from last mistake, you don't want to wait for expectation to rise, and thing crashing down before you realize you should have get a better forward for rotation. Proactive is better than reactive.
On the wage thing. We overpay our top paid players. Being able to save on low earners in McTominay, Weghorst don't mean a good thing. Two wrong doesn't equal one right. You rather than having your starter worth his wage, and a competent rotation player on competitive pay. That would result in strong team, and squad.
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Something I’ve heard many times before about footballers who go on to be a great success.
And once more, for the cheap seats, I’m not saying that Weghorst will go on to be a great success. Just that there’s a good chance he’s a better player than we’ve seen so far.
All other clubs and scouts must be blind, because he was moving from Wolfsburg to Burnley then Turkish League; and they missed out on such potential. He may marginally better (scorer), but there is no potential for him to fulfill at our current level, let alone the level we inspired to get to in near future.
The Nunez, Gakpo, you name it... has potential worth gambling the time, patient with them. Different kind of expectation for WIP players, and seasoned/old players.
You think SAF spent that much on RvP with expectation that he could wait a year for RvP to adapt, when secretly planned on his retirement? Or Herik Larsson 2 month loan. How much time he would have needed to adapt?
Based on what he’s shown so far, no. If he shows he can add goals to his game by the end of the season then I’d consider him as a squad player. He’s clearly never going to be what what we need as our first choice number 9 though.
Pointless to criticise the guy when we had zero budget anyway. It's not like we could afford anyone else. The guy is available for every game, and gives his best. That's all you can ask for. Imagine if we had Felix instead for 15m euros fee who got himself suspended for 3 games and has scored the exact same number of goals as Weghorst.
Obviously he works hard but his ability to not score goals is really quite something.
No way we should keep him. Even as a backup he isn't good enough.
Nice lad it seems but that's irrelevant in football
No way we should keep him. Even as a backup he isn't good enough.
Nice lad it seems but that's irrelevant in football
Oh they see him. They're just choosing not to pass to him.
Depends how much transfer budget we have because if we sign someone like Kane or Oshimen for £80m+ then i don't think we'll sign a back up for big money as well, I'd rather sign Weghorst and let Martial go
Better off let both go and take another punt on a different cheap backup
I mean fair enough but it's not like he's a young player adapting to the league for the first time. He's 30 and played in the Premier League for Burnley last year where he performed at a similar level.
Yeah there's that too.
Like who? He's not a kid and he's not new to the league. We know what his level is and it's not too far from where he is now.
He is close to becoming a detriment to the team now as he is wasting so many opportunities and other players appear to be becoming reluctant to pass to him.
He's clearly not what we need as a backup striker either. 30 years old and, nearly a full seasons worth of games in Prem League and 4 goals. United's backup striker should be a top player himself.
I'm normally with you in wanting to give players more time but this is beyond that. The guy is just nowhere near good enough. Given you don't want to currently sign him either I think it's splitting hairs to say others are being too quick to judge.
I just love his name Weghorst, sounds like a V8 engine.
The team don't pass to him in those situations because he can't finish.
Showed why he is a bit of a journeyman
I want to add something here. We should already start to plan for next season, we can't wait until the end of the season to assess stop gap option that is at mercy of other club (Burnley may try to be funny and even ask a silly fee for Weghorst in the summer). Because free agents in the summer, are available to be negotiated for pre contract right now.
The Muani of yesteryear, may be negotiating with another club right now. Last year when, we were busy with new manager appointment mess, the club didn't properly scout independently to identify potential cheap good. Always leave it to last minute would get us overpay again, or even worse grasping at the bottom of the barrel.
So in the spirit of proactive, well planning, even if one want to give time to assess Weghorst, a back up plan should be already in place for the CF rotation role. So Weghorst is also hard pressed to impress even more now if he is to earn his keep for next season here.
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When we get a top striker in we're going to see a McTominay to Casemiro-like transformation in the side again. From dogshit to pure gold.
This is going to sound weird but I reckon we would have been better with mcburnie from sheffield united rather than him. McBurnie works for the team too but also seems to have a better shot on him as well.
Yep. We need a better backup 9 but couldn’t afford one. Wout is doing his best and we just need to make a fist of it until the window opens. Maybe he’ll add some goals between now and end of season. In the meantime I’ve enjoyed his story.
Noticed other players won't give him the ball. Said in a previous post he's a passenger. It's beginning to be frustrating seeing him in a utd shirt.
Wout should serve as an example for those who think any bog standard player could score goals in a team that creates a lot.
I've haven't seen a player look so out of place since Bebe. What makes it worse is he's so slow, it looks like everyone else is playing at 1.5 speed compare to him.
I've haven't seen a player look so out of place since Bebe. What makes it worse is he's so slow, it looks like everyone else is playing at 1.5 speed compare to him.
City: Haaland / Alvarez
Arsenal: G.Jesus / Nketiah
Spurs: Kane / Richarlison
Newcastle: Wilson / Isak
That's just top four there are other examples in the top 10. Look at the difference in quality between the clubs mentioned and United. Considering Martials availability it does discredit his contribution. Weghorst should not be here beyond this season. A football player is acquired for their ability, working hard is only greatly appreciated in an underperforming team. It's the standard for any top tier team.
Arsenal: G.Jesus / Nketiah
Spurs: Kane / Richarlison
Newcastle: Wilson / Isak
That's just top four there are other examples in the top 10. Look at the difference in quality between the clubs mentioned and United. Considering Martials availability it does discredit his contribution. Weghorst should not be here beyond this season. A football player is acquired for their ability, working hard is only greatly appreciated in an underperforming team. It's the standard for any top tier team.
We all love the heart of Weggy, but there’s no denying that for a striker he just doesn’t strike any fear into defenders whatsoever.
Whoa, really? Is that all it's been - two months? Really shows our mad fixture schedule because to me at least it feels like he's made about 30 appearances
He's at 18, which is quite insane.Whoa, really? Is that all it's been - two months? Really shows our mad fixture schedule because to me at least it feels like he's made about 30 appearances
Yep, pretty good comparision. Don't forget that many thought Mctominay deserves to start ahead of Casemiro when he first arrived because "he was in better form", only to realise that he is nothing player once Casemiro started playing, pretty much the same as people who think our striker is playing good enough because he runs a lot.
He scored 2 in 18 games for Burnley in the League. He is just not a Premier League footballer.
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