Would you sack or keep Ole? (Poll reopened)

Sack or Keep OLE?

  • Sack Ole & appoint new coach ASAP

  • Keep Ole & back him to finish rebuild

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It is the belief of some that Ole will never win anything concrete which is because he hasn't yet won anything of note in his career and failed when given a chance at a low level club.

Everything else is just BS they come up with to support this narrative. Almost all "reasons" have been debunked and shown to be false throughout the season. Which is why goalposts have been continously shifted to explain their belief. From can't-beat-low-block to being-shit-defensively to only-counterattacking-football to good-players-will-always-improve to it's-just-Bruno to now: points tally and us being lucky since other good teams floundered.
 
lysglimt said:
In fairness there werent a lot of big games that season and we didnt lose more than one big game against Arsenal, but we drew a lot of games.

We drew twice with Chelsea, got 1 Point against Arsenal and 4 Points against Leeds

After that West Ham ended 5th over 20 Points behind us - and we din't even get max Points from them either.

In fact we have to go down to 14th Place to find the strongest team we beat home and away - Everton.
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You mean there weren’t a lot of big games in the league or in all competitions? In the league it is obviously always the same, you play every team twice. We didn’t beat the other big teams in the league twice, but that rarely happens anyway. The league was also competitive with Arsenal and Chelsea finishing so close behind us.
We beat Arsenal and Chelsea though when we had to (in the replays of the FA Cup). And Liverpool too in the FA Cup. Plus we beat Bayern, Inter and Juve in the CL. Enough big games that. You will usually end up drawing a few games if you play every 2-4 days for several months whereas most other teams have 1 week rest.

Back to Ole, if he keeps a decent to good big game record (we are of course not going to beat Chelsea/City twice every season like this year) and we manage to beat most of the smaller teams, we will be fine in the league. The signs in the last few months for this have been good.
 
GailSpaceWynand said:
It is the belief of some that Ole will never win anything concrete which is because he hasn't yet won anything of note in his career and failed when given a chance at a low level club.

Everything else is just BS they come up with to support this narrative. Almost all "reasons" have been debunked and shown to be false throughout the season. Which is why goalposts have been continously shifted to explain their belief. From can't-beat-low-block to being-shit-defensively to only-counterattacking-football to good-players-will-always-improve to it's-just-Bruno to now: points tally and us being lucky since other good teams floundered.
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It's the same with your theory he is going to win.
Any decent manager with this team would get into the CL spots. Ole to his credit had overcome a very bad spell.
Yes other teams competing with us did flounder. Leicester was a goal post away from opening scoring against us.
Ole did what he had to do. Let's see what happens next season. At this moment in time he is not half as good as Pep or Klopp who have proven it. The proof is in the pudding.
 
Foxbatt said:
Doesn't say in double quick time. Yes he has to win. There is no point in keeping any manager who is going to get only CL spot every year.
We are not Arsenal in case you are a Manchester United fan.
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Yet people were screaming out for Poch last year? Ok.
 
Foxbatt said:
It's the same with your theory he is going to win.
Any decent manager with this team would get into the CL spots. Ole to his credit had overcome a very bad spell.
Yes other teams competing with us did flounder. Leicester was a goal post away from opening scoring against us.
Ole did what he had to do. Let's see what happens next season. At this moment in time he is not half as good as Pep or Klopp who have proven it. The proof is in the pudding.
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But I haven't said he's going to win. He may not but all the signs point toward an upward trajectory which some still can't see.

With the state of our squad it's not that easy as you make it. We expected it yes but you've to be a good manager to achieve that esp from where we were at the start and the injuries.

We were a goal post away from winning a few of our matches. In fact Rashy has hit the post multiple times this season and we drew to Southampton conceding in the 96th min. We have been unlucky too with injuries.

Not half as good as Pep yet beat him 3 times?
 
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RedPed said:
Yet people were screaming out for Poch last year? Ok.
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And if Poch failed to win he would eventually be sacked without reservations. Because Man Utd is bigger than any manager, no matter how much of a favourite he may be.
 
Ole outers are desperate arent they? You should now at least realise you wanted to sack a Utd legend all season that did indeed have the ability to improve our team and get it to finish 3rd in the league (something you all said was impossible). A very good achievement while breaking records for playing youth all season and shipping out expensive dead wood and coping with serious injuries to our top talent. The fact that they still complain just proves our suspicions that they were agenda posters in the first place that just wanted the latest shiny new toy even though they never won feck all.
 
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Shock to see the same posters still banging their heads against the walls. Just do us all a favour and go support City.
 
DFreshKing said:
Ole outers are desperate arent they? You should now at least realise you wanted to sack a Utd legend all season that did indeed have the ability to improve our team and get it to finish 3rd in the league (something your all said was impossible). A very good achievement while breaking records for playing youth all season and shipping out expensive dead wood and coping with serious injuries to our top talent. The fact that they still complain just proves our suspicions that they were agenda posters in the first place that just wanted the latest shiny new toy even though they never won feck all.
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This is a problem still.
 
Foxbatt said:
Our issues are not against the big teams. It's the smaller teams. Can someone do how many points we lost against teams below us? I would say we could be even beating Liverpool or fairly close to them.
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I am just commenting on the debate regarding how we did against the big teams in 1999. And merely pointed out that there werent many other big teams than Arsenal - but if we looked further down the table and called them big teams - we did poorly against them
 
TrustInJanuzaj said:
Shock to see the same posters still banging their heads against the walls. Just do us all a favour and go support City.
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It's more of a shock seeing the tripe they come up with to explain why. Not all do that, mind. In fact a few come up with valid rebuttals (like Revan for one) but a lot are just too hung up with what they believe (i.e Ole is shite) to see visible progress.
 
GailSpaceWynand said:
It's more of a shock seeing the tripe they come up with to explain why. Not all do that, mind. In fact a few come up with valid rebuttals (like Revan for one) but a lot are just too hung up with what they believe (i.e Ole is shite) to see visible progress.
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Completely agree, it’s fine to have doubts, even I do and I’m a massive Ole fan. But you have to be logical and objective and the mental gymnastics on display in this thread are just awful and especially against one of our own. Fortunately I think Ole will use this negativity to fuel this young team so keep the criticism coming and let’s continue to blow them all away.
 
GailSpaceWynand said:
It's more of a shock seeing the tripe they come up with to explain why. Not all do that, mind. In fact a few come up with valid rebuttals (like Revan for one) but a lot are just too hung up with what they believe (i.e Ole is shite) to see visible progress.
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People just don't like to admit they were wrong.
 
TrustInJanuzaj said:
Completely agree, it’s fine to have doubts, even I do and I’m a massive Ole fan. But you have to be logical and objective and the mental gymnastics on display in this thread are just awful and especially against one of our own. Fortunately I think Ole will use this negativity to fuel this young team so keep the criticism coming and let’s continue to blow them all away.
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Again not by all but a few who have unfortunately been the loudest (just need to look at who replied stats to understand that). In fairness there is very less negativity looking at our overall fan base. Most are optimistic about next season and rightly so.
 
RedPed said:
That's it you just keep on dodging the question, that's a good lad.
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I answered the question. Your trying to explain to me that Ole had a better season than Arteta because it league position. Okay he has.. but Arteta’s job right now doesn’t have the same requirements as Ole. Which I already explained early and your question is irrelevant.
 
GailSpaceWynand said:
Again not by all but a few who have unfortunately been the loudest (just need to look at who replied stats to understand that). In fairness there is very less negativity looking at our overall fan base. Most are optimistic about next season and rightly so.
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Yeh rightly most fans are optimistic which is great to see. The sad thing is that some fans are so clouded in negativity and bias that they can’t even enjoy the fantastic football and development that we have made this season. It’s petty but I don’t feel like those few fans deserve the opportunity to enjoy the good times ahead and I really think they will.
 
Tom Cato said:
It includes refreshing and reshaping the squad in perpetuity until the day comes when the team reaches the footballing equivalent of entropy.
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Cheers, this is a good way to put it.

So would you say it's fair to watch out for signs of entropy and try to act proactively? At least until the point where there are no doubts (in which case Ole would have smashed it).

Or do we act reactively, should said entropy occur?
 
Mainoldo said:
I answered the question. Your trying to explain to me that Ole had a better season than Arteta because it league position. Okay he has.. but Arteta’s job right now doesn’t have the same requirements as Ole. Which I already explained early and your question is irrelevant.
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Okay so Ole has a better season but he is the one winging it and Arteta had a good season?
 
Mainoldo said:
I answered the question. Your trying to explain to me that Ole had a better season than Arteta because it league position. Okay he has.. but Arteta’s job right now doesn’t have the same requirements as Ole. Which I already explained early and your question is irrelevant.
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That's generally how leagues work, you get more credit the higher you finish up the table. It's like saying although Klopp won the title with Liverpool, Wilder had a better season as manager at Sheffield United.

And who says Arteta's job does not have the same requirements as Solskjaer's? That's a ridiculous argument.

And my question which you've still dodged and not answered was why you say Ole is winging it finishing in 3rd but Arteta is doing a good job finishing in 8th. But this thread has been 548 pages of the Ole nay-sayers not making much sense so I shouldn't really expect any different here.

Anyway you carry on.
 
TrustInJanuzaj said:
Yeh rightly most fans are optimistic which is great to see. The sad thing is that some fans are so clouded in negativity and bias that they can’t even enjoy the fantastic football and development that we have made this season. It’s petty but I don’t feel like those few fans deserve the opportunity to enjoy the good times ahead and I really think they will.
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They will. I have also seen a few talk about how celebrating top 3 or settling for anything less than PL/CL is bad. We are celebrating progress and clear visible signs that our squad is close to competing for the first time in ages and that too with exciting attacking footy.

Some live in a bubble completely ignoring context and where we are at this time considering the rot over the last 7 years. Ole deserves huge credit for turning around the mentality around the club / clearing the deadwood and being bang on with transfers. This is despite his top 4 achievements. Expecting title challenge or being CL heavyweights now is not reasonable. That will be the next point these guys bring up. If we don't win despite progress the same people will start spouting nonsense. Can't win against some really.
 
Mainoldo said:
:lol: I’m amazed how much people feel the need to back Ole over everything. I’m convinced some of you would back Ole over United.
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I'm amazed how some will do anything to not give credit where its due. All your points have been negated throughout and you have still continued shifting goalposts. Almost twice the number of posts as the 2nd highest poster; Not a single valid point made.

Why don't you answer the question instead? Because there is nothing to answer and you know your reasoning is faulty at best. Do continue. I don't want to waste my time on somebody whose mind is made up.
 
GailSpaceWynand said:
Okay so Ole has a better season but he is the one winging it and Arteta had a good season?
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I think comparisons with other random managers was never appropriate and I found it quite annoying earlier in the season. Especially when it was used purely to highlight Ole's deficiencies.

But now Ole needs to win the title, so we do have to compare him with the best, that's how it goes. For instance, Pep at City came 2nd but still had a poor PL campaign. Why? Because he didn't win, and Klopp was better than him. That's how it is at the top.

So I think comparing with Lampard and Arteta isn't our ambition anymore, because who cares if Arsenal or Chelsea eventually flounder with rookie managers. We have to compare with the best, as that's ultimately where we want to be.
 
RedPed said:
That's generally how leagues work, you get more credit the higher you finish up the table. It's like saying although Klopp won the title with Liverpool, Wilder had a better season as manager at Sheffield United.

And who says Arteta's job does not have the same requirements as Solskjaer's? That's a ridiculous argument.

And my question which you've still dodged and not answered was why you say Ole is winging it finishing in 3rd but Arteta is doing a good job finishing in 8th. But this thread has been 548 pages of the Ole nay-sayers not making much sense so I shouldn't really expect any different here.

Anyway you carry on.
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Again what’s your point? I’ve been talking about Ole you’ve brought up Arteta. I’ve gave a simple response to how Arteta’s season has gone and your comparing it to Ole’s? Why?
 
Mainoldo said:
Again what’s your point? I’ve been talking about Ole you’ve brought up Arteta. I’ve gave a simple response to how Arteta’s season has gone and your comparing it to Ole’s? Why?
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Ffs! :lol:
 
Mainoldo said:
:lol: I’m amazed how much people feel the need to back Ole over everything. I’m convinced some of you would back Ole over United.
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Same can be said about you that you will like for the club to fail for you to be proven right.
 
Mainoldo said:
Again what’s your point? I’ve been talking about Ole you’ve brought up Arteta. I’ve gave a simple response to how Arteta’s season has gone and your comparing it to Ole’s? Why?
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I wasn't comparing it to Ole's. YOU were the one saying Ole was winging it. I wanted some perspective so asked your opinion on Lampard and Arteta. YOU said they were doing a good job.

My simple question to you was simply why did you feel Ole was winging it yet they were doing a good job even though they both finished below him in the league.

It's not rocket science or a trick question. Ffs!
 
RedPed said:
I wasn't comparing it to Ole's. YOU were the one saying Ole was winging it. I wanted some perspective so asked your opinion on Lampard and Arteta. YOU said they were doing a good job.

My simple question to you was simply why did you feel Ole was winging it yet they were doing a good job even though they both finished below him in the league.

It's not rocket science or a trick question. Ffs!
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Did I not explain why I thought Ole was winging it?

Tell me I never?
 
UNITED ACADEMY said:
Someone else would. You are going to hope the freak 15/16 season all over again for Jose to win the league in 17/18.



Point means nothing without knowing why and how they achieve it.

For example. Last season we achieved 66 points which exactly the same as this season. So how did we finish top 4 while last season we didn't? Because this season we beat our competitors (Chelsea 2x, Leicester 2x, Spurs 1x & draw). If we didn't beat Leicester & Chelsea twice but beat other teams instead, we wouldn't make top 3 with 66 points this season.

Every seasons & eras are different. 12/13 or post are different to prior.

Sir Alex won the league with 89 points in 12/13. Are you telling me that 12/13 squad is better than 98/99? If Sir Alex can won the league with 89 points with Cleverley, Jones, 39 years old Giggs, Young & Valencia in 12/13 which is the beginning of the, imagine what he can do with proper players in nowdays era.
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Alex Ferguson was an exceptional manager though. We went for Moyes which lowered the expectations. I'm not bashing managers like Moyes, Roy Hodgson, etc, but they are 5th place managers at best.

We should have waited and went for Klopp. Don't listen to the fake news Klopp would never have turned down United.
 
Fussball13251 said:
Alex Ferguson was an exceptional manager though. We went for Moyes which lowered the expectations. I'm not bashing managers like Moyes, Roy Hodgson, etc, but they are 5th place managers at best.

We should have waited and went for Klopp. Don't listen to the fake news Klopp would never have turned down United.
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Mourinho, Benitez, Wenger, Ancelotti and etc.
 
UNITED ACADEMY said:
Mourinho, Benitez, Wenger, Ancelotti and etc.
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They were champions. Klopp and Pep are the top in the modern era.

Send either to Barca and Barca would quickly be back to being the best in Eueope.

Wenger is too old.

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Yes he would, but Klopp and Pep are exceptional like him and so it wouldn't be as easy. Pep and Klopp are on the same Level as Alex Ferguson. Ferguson and Pep would quickly have Liverpool winning the league, too.

Let Ferguson, Klopp and Pep manage West Ham and they would be challenging for league titles within about 5/6 years.

There's the the average, there's the good, and there's the elite.
 
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Fussball13251 said:
They were champions. Klopp and Pep are the top in the modern era.
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And you don't think a manager like Sir Alex who was able to adapt different era of football cannot top this modern era?

89 points in 12/13 season with Cleverley, Jones, 39 yo Giggs, Anderson & Welbeck. That wasn't far from 2020.
 
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