Why not get an armchair fan next if top coaches haven't worked out. In fact why not go for cricket players to fill the midfield since the last two football midfielders we bought didn't work out.
Would you sack or keep Ole? (Poll reopened)
- Thread starter MrSingh2002
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Spurs will probably sack Poch before we sack Ole. It's a sack race!
I would give him till Oct/Nov 2020.
Sack, Manchester United is an elite club and needs to be managed by an elite manager, we have an ex Cardiff and Molde manager that previously struggled at this level , his tactics are shocking , the football even worse , get Hiddink until the end of the season and get Poch at all costs next season.
Keep, giving him another summer to get more players in and seeing how he does towards Christmas 2020.
Damn right he is! Let's be real Ole was a gamble that hasn't paid off, he's now obviously finished. Of course they are planning to replace him. Welcome Allegri.
No , but they would be coached a hell of a lot better
Do you want to see us relegated? Performances or results don't interest you huh?
All about that Ole at the wheel sentimentality, or maybe you just want to see the club burn... who knows...
I don't know. Football's not that important to me, I follow the team and what they do, hope they win a game, then get on with my life. Truth is, you're acting as if your opinion on what United do next matters, and it doesn't. My opinion, your opinion, they're totally irrelevant. So it doesn't matter how much you care. I'd rather see him given time, based on liking his signings so far.
Anyway, United are clearly not going to get relegated, that's obvious nonsense.
Interested to see how the votes change over the next few games.
Is this even a debate? The only question that should be asked is "When do we sack him? Now or at the end of the season?"
Let's look at our players: Shaw who made a resurgence last year, has already stagnated and started to decline again. Rashford looks more like Welbeck and Heskey with every single match, Lingard hasn't scored or assisted in 19 games. After ironing them out last year, Lindelof started making the same mistakes again. Pogba is playing like Mourinho never left(didn't Ole say that he was being wasted as part of double pivot and needs to be moved up the pitch?). And yet I'm supposed to believe that the actual coaching and tactics aren't to blame, but all the players went to shit in a matter of 2 seasons. Players who haven't even reached their peak yet!
Look, for me this is Moyes Mk.II written all over it. We start the season with high expectations and an unexpected 4-0 win(Swansea vs Chelsea). It gets to our head and we think we are the dog's bollocks. We hit a snag early on and bad results start to pile up. We shift the expectations from a Top 4 finish to a Top 6. Results still aren't improving. Instead of becoming pro-active like all the major teams are, we become reactive. On field tactics are in shambles, resorting to simply putting crosses and hoping that our attacking players will find space instead of actively coaching them to look and exploit it.
We pin our hopes on a talented and up and coming youngster and consistently rely on him to bail us out(Januzaj vs Greenwood). The players looks clueless and the manager doesn't know what to do. Every single post match interview has the exact same feel. The only solution that is being touted is "More time". Experienced squad leaders who started their decline "suddenly" fall of the cliff and aren't good enough.(Matic vs Ferdinand and Vidic). Goal posts get shifted from a top 6 finish to we need a rebuild of 2-3 years(we aspire to be like City interview) and spend more money on players so the manager can have his own team. Simply way to many similarities.
Don't get me wrong, I love Ole and will still love him even if relegates us. The man is a club legend and likeable bloke. But as a manager he simply is not good enough to manage Manchester United. It's not a matter of character, but ability. He simply doesn't know how to get the max out of this squad. Getting him even more players isn't going to fix the glaring issues that I mentioned above.
And for those of you who still believe that he needs time answer this simple question:What will miraculously change and make us a better team?
To better illustrate my point, let's look at 2 other managers who took other at the exact same time Ole did. Rodgers at Leicester and Hasenhüttl at Soton.
Both of these managers were appointed in December 2018. They have already imprinted their playing style upon their team greatly improving them tactically and improving the players as well. So what is stopping Ole to do the same here? The only answer I can come up with is simply ineptitude.
Let's look at our players: Shaw who made a resurgence last year, has already stagnated and started to decline again. Rashford looks more like Welbeck and Heskey with every single match, Lingard hasn't scored or assisted in 19 games. After ironing them out last year, Lindelof started making the same mistakes again. Pogba is playing like Mourinho never left(didn't Ole say that he was being wasted as part of double pivot and needs to be moved up the pitch?). And yet I'm supposed to believe that the actual coaching and tactics aren't to blame, but all the players went to shit in a matter of 2 seasons. Players who haven't even reached their peak yet!
Look, for me this is Moyes Mk.II written all over it. We start the season with high expectations and an unexpected 4-0 win(Swansea vs Chelsea). It gets to our head and we think we are the dog's bollocks. We hit a snag early on and bad results start to pile up. We shift the expectations from a Top 4 finish to a Top 6. Results still aren't improving. Instead of becoming pro-active like all the major teams are, we become reactive. On field tactics are in shambles, resorting to simply putting crosses and hoping that our attacking players will find space instead of actively coaching them to look and exploit it.
We pin our hopes on a talented and up and coming youngster and consistently rely on him to bail us out(Januzaj vs Greenwood). The players looks clueless and the manager doesn't know what to do. Every single post match interview has the exact same feel. The only solution that is being touted is "More time". Experienced squad leaders who started their decline "suddenly" fall of the cliff and aren't good enough.(Matic vs Ferdinand and Vidic). Goal posts get shifted from a top 6 finish to we need a rebuild of 2-3 years(we aspire to be like City interview) and spend more money on players so the manager can have his own team. Simply way to many similarities.
Don't get me wrong, I love Ole and will still love him even if relegates us. The man is a club legend and likeable bloke. But as a manager he simply is not good enough to manage Manchester United. It's not a matter of character, but ability. He simply doesn't know how to get the max out of this squad. Getting him even more players isn't going to fix the glaring issues that I mentioned above.
And for those of you who still believe that he needs time answer this simple question:What will miraculously change and make us a better team?
To better illustrate my point, let's look at 2 other managers who took other at the exact same time Ole did. Rodgers at Leicester and Hasenhüttl at Soton.
Both of these managers were appointed in December 2018. They have already imprinted their playing style upon their team greatly improving them tactically and improving the players as well. So what is stopping Ole to do the same here? The only answer I can come up with is simply ineptitude.
Keep
Think about this. Usually when a manager is sacked, its because the atmosphere is so toxic and the mood so negative that they simply have to go. Yes, our results have been atrocious but I think removing Ole would simply lower morale even more - we've spent so long buying into this project to get rid now would be another backwards step.
The problem currently isn't the manager - its a cohort of very average players and many individual mistakes (2x missed pens , defensive errors leading to dropped points, awful finishing).
We don't need a master tactician to break into the top 4 - we need better players and better individual performances.
Think about this. Usually when a manager is sacked, its because the atmosphere is so toxic and the mood so negative that they simply have to go. Yes, our results have been atrocious but I think removing Ole would simply lower morale even more - we've spent so long buying into this project to get rid now would be another backwards step.
The problem currently isn't the manager - its a cohort of very average players and many individual mistakes (2x missed pens , defensive errors leading to dropped points, awful finishing).
We don't need a master tactician to break into the top 4 - we need better players and better individual performances.
Suprised so many want to keep him in
Just like they did with Moyes I would assume.
From:
“Give him time you spoilt glory hunters, I’d give him at least 4 transfer windows to sort us out”
To:
“He needs to do better but the core of the team needs replacing, lets see what he does in the transfer market”
To:
“Get this fraud the feck out of this club” when it was way too late.
Some were still supporting him when we were getting shat on by City and Liverpool at home, ala @whatshisname63 probably.
We were better (for a while at least) when Jose was sacked and Ole came. I can't really see why "there is no way that we would be better if we sack him now."
Yes everyone knew that we had a thin squad but the thing that troubles everyone is that we're not actually playing football. A total mess in defence (though improved), a total mess in attack. We just run around like headless chickens, and trying to counter attack. I remember people were complaining about Jose tactics and counter attacks blah,blah,blah..
Pochetino has 0 trophies but he actually created this team and improved massively most of the players. He is responsible for taking Tottenham to the next level with almost a Champions league. Similar to Klopp in Dortmund.
As for Zidane (I dont personally rate him) but there is a number of reasons for the Real Madrid shit.
Typical Ole fanboy response. Ignore the actual article written while was still in charge of Cardiff and spoke about how after 25 games he had developed no strike of play, was confused and tactically clueless, and a poor manager.
Yeh let’s wait until 2045 in League 1.
I agree that in the grand scheme of things it's meaningless. Personally, seeing the club in this situation due to multiple reasons, it hurts and a perceived flippant comment by yourself (likely unintentional) is going to get to me. For that i do apologise. Fair enough everyone is free to follow the club/football how they like, but i do think this is a very serious situation we are in and people should treat it with a bit more respect.
Right now, i really believe sentimentality is a poison to the club when added to indifference. If we act like the situation doesn't matter so who cares, have at it Ole... we will suffer the consequences.
Being near the relegation places after the end of this month is likely actually, no matter how absurd it feels like.
We've got a hard run coming up this month. 3/4 matches away with the one at home being Liverpool. We are on a club record 7 Premier League matches without an away win. 2 wins in last 12 Premier League matches. 0 clean sheets away from home in any competition since Ole's permanent appointment. Scored more than 1 goal just once in last 15 matches... What does that tell you? We already are showing relegation form.
We are 17th in the league for big chances created (https://www.premierleague.com/stats/top/clubs/big_chance_created?se=274). 1 more than Newcastle (currently bottom) who have already played Arsenal, Tottenham away, Liverpool away & Leicester away.
If that form continues, we definitely will be near the relegation places, then who knows what will happen. The fact we can't rule it out should say it all about the seriousness of the situation.
One of the best Right Wingers in the world was replaced with an almost unknown 18 year old skinny Portuguese kid around 15 years ago.
Look, I didn’t want him to get the job in the first place (might want to check the original poll when he was interim manager). Thought the club gained nothing by rushing the appointment (didn’t see any other club swooping in for Ole in Feb/March) but they went ahead and made him permanent manager.
Once appointed on March 28, the club has to give him some time to fix the mess. He did ok in the transfers in, we don’t know how much input he’s had on the transfers out. Ole’s been in charge of the club for 3-months (excluding the summer hiatus), so let’s reevaluate in December / January.
Sack please. Sometimes it's just clear when someone isn't good enough, like that poor dumb kid at the back of class.
Moyes was this, so is Ole. These things don't change overnight.
The longer we hold on to him for sentiment's sake, the lower we sink. He is completely out of his depth and seems to lack even basic tactical nous.
Moyes was this, so is Ole. These things don't change overnight.
The longer we hold on to him for sentiment's sake, the lower we sink. He is completely out of his depth and seems to lack even basic tactical nous.
Yep some for some reason can’t see the car crash happening right in front of our eyes
Ole is not manager quality. end of.
There are good players in there for sure, but there's lots of gaps. Losing Herrera without replacement has weakened us. Lukaku wasn't great under Ole, but he plugged a gap, often on the right of the attack where we have nobody. I wasn't a fan of him, but given the choice I'd rather have kept him than let him go without replacement.
Its a thin squad that is often an injury or two away from struggling. That's what I mean by poorly planned. 3 or 4 more bodies in there and we look decent again, but I think a lot of managers would struggle to get us up and running instantly.
I can see Ed trying to get him in as Ole’s permanent successor.
Ed will be able to claim that the strategy the club has embarked upon (young British core, hard working players etc.) was all his own idea and is going well, the only problem being Ole’s crappy execution of it. Southgate ticks all the boxes, having the right experience for this sort of thing.
At least he seems able to get players to buy into a system of play. Whether or not the system is any good is another matter.
Until December/January at least.
question for the sackers... whom would you appoint, and what criteria would you use to select the next united manager?
I voted sack.
At the end of last season there were a bunch of posters saying we should get rid after his really poor run. I said it was unfair as he didnt get a proper transfer window and get to buy his own players. He just inherited a mess from Mourinho and got a lot more out of the players for a spell, before having that poor form than Mourinho managed.
But now hes had his time, he's had his money and made his changes to the squad. And we're worse. So yes he's had his chance and failed as far as I'm concerned. A great caretaker manager for us, a poor manager for us
At the end of last season there were a bunch of posters saying we should get rid after his really poor run. I said it was unfair as he didnt get a proper transfer window and get to buy his own players. He just inherited a mess from Mourinho and got a lot more out of the players for a spell, before having that poor form than Mourinho managed.
But now hes had his time, he's had his money and made his changes to the squad. And we're worse. So yes he's had his chance and failed as far as I'm concerned. A great caretaker manager for us, a poor manager for us
There was also a time when a genius Portuguese winger was replaced with Obertan.
Allegri is available!
Yeah this is pretty much where I am. I didn’t want him as interim; looking backwards is never a good idea. The moment he got some good results it was obvious Ed was going to take the line of least resistance and make the appointment permanent.
The Caf has fallen into two opposing camps regarding the disaster of the summer window. Ole-outers are adamant that it was all down to him; Ole-inners place all the blame on Ed. Given Ed’s previous record I’m inclined to give Ole the benefit of the doubt on this occasion, and hope that Ed sees that he screwed up and we strengthen at least modestly in January. If things improve thereafter, great. If we strengthen and there’s no improvement, Ole needs to go at the end of the season. If we don’t strengthen, then God knows what’ll happen.
Fanboy, are you six?
I read the article fresh off the press and thought it was shite at the time, and on second viewing it ain't any better, that clown should realise he's talking about Cardiff City who spent most of their existence languishing in the lower reaches of the football League, and were not some European juggernaut who had fallen on hard times and needed somebody/anybody to blame.
I wrote that when Real were losing 2-0 to Brugge at home
Fortunately for the muppets, he managed to draw, so he's not getting the sack this weekend.
No no... In all honesty I wouldn't want Allegri, i want to watch football I enjoy. But come on.. Ole is a pathetic manager and if Allegri was in charge right now top 4 would be secure.
You’re absolutely right. Expecting a manager to be competent at managing and coaching is expecting far too much
Shiite so much easier to digest when your sipping champagne everyday day.
What do you know about Allegri? What's his philosophy? Relationship with the board? How does he setup his team? How does he deal with a poorly assembled squad? What's his record at Milan when the team was gutted (similar to us)?
Or are you just throwing a brand name coach out there?
I didn’t think he should have got the job in the first place, but we are where we are. I’m of the opinion that this squad is so seriously weak that no better manager is likely to turn this around right now. I’d line up the replacement, Allegri, Poch, whoever, give them time to evaluate what needs to be done and SERIOUSLY back them in the market next summer. We’ve screwed up this summer and this season is going to be a write-off whatever happens imo. It’s clear we need at least 4 additions, 5 if Pogba goes.
Are we really worse? I'd say we're pretty much where we were at this time last season and comparing results from the equivalent last year, we're actually doing better results-wise. I know it's scant consolation, but facts are facts - we were shit on a stick with Mourinho a supposedly world class coach.
Drew w/ Arsenal both seasons
Bettered Chelsea +2
Lost to CP vs a draw last year -1
Beat LCFC both seasons
Drew at Soton both seasons
Lost to West Ham both seasons
Drew at Wolves, vs losing last year +1
Let’s look at history. Moyes window was a disaster. We know that even at Everton Moyes was known for “dithering” and even know years later he talks about trying to sign Bale, Ronaldo, Fabregas in his first summer at United. Players who didn’t want to move or wanted to go to another club. Also he rejected Thiago, and panicked buy Fellaini at the last minute.
Under LVG, a very assertive and self confident man, first transfer window was extremely successful even if the players flopped. By successful I mean we got the players we wanted.
Same thing with Mourinho first window; and second window, but last window the board rejected certain things due to club values.
Now Ole, first window a disaster. It’s more then likely Ole just lacked the confidence... it takes balls to put your name and rep on deals that cost millions and it takes a certain mindset to ignore all the options and choose just one player , especially when shopping in a market where you’re not going after the stand out individual or obvious choice.
Example. Rodri.. replacement for Fernandinho... cost £60m. Wasn’t the obvious choice or stand out individual was probably one of 5-10 players City could have signed in that position and that style and at £60m or under.
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