Why is everyone so certain that DDG will be a starter under ETH?




People still cling to this notion that DDG is somehow a guaranteed starter at the beginning of the season just because he is on 375k a week or he used to be an insanely good shot stopper 5 years ago.

ETH is all about principles. He will sacrifice formations and change tactics as long as his principles are respected. One of his key principles is a high line.

As we've seen last year and this year as well, DDG is not suited for a team with a high line. He was dropped from the Spanish NT for this exact reason.

As contrast we had the 5th defensive line height last season, and 2nd highest when Henderson was in goal.

While Hendo isn't the answer to our prayers, I'll be very surprised if he isn't the one who isn't No. 1 by the start of the season.
 
Caesar2290 said:



People still cling to this notion that DDG is somehow a guaranteed starter at the beginning of the season just because he is on 375k a week or he used to be an insanely good shot stopper 5 years ago.

ETH is all about principles. He will sacrifice formations and change tactics as long as his principles are respected. One of his key principles is a high line.

As we've seen last year and this year as well, DDG is not suited for a team with a high line. He was dropped from the Spanish NT for this exact reason.

As contrast we had the 5th defensive line height last season, and 2nd highest when Henderson was in goal.

While Hendo isn't the answer to our prayers, I'll be very surprised if he isn't the one who isn't No. 1 by the start of the season.
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Henderson was close to leaving ManUtd on loan or on permanent transfer, we are linked with 0 GKs, De Gea is not linked with any club.

It's easy assumption or easy logic to see why people think De Gea will start as #1.
 
The agenda against our PPOTY is pretty funny!

Whilst we’re at it…
  • Let’s drop Ronaldo for not being able to mark his man at corners
  • Let’s sell Varane because he doesn’t score 30 yarders
  • Let’s sack Ten Hag because he isn’t Spanish or has massive teeth
 
spe88 said:
The agenda against our PPOTY is pretty funny!

Whilst we’re at it…
  • Let’s drop Ronaldo for not being able to mark his man at corners
  • Let’s sell Varane because he doesn’t score 30 yarders
  • Let’s sack Ten Hag because he isn’t Spanish or has massive teeth
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It's not really an agenda.

It's looking at a player and his overall effectiveness and contribution to the team.

He makes really good saves but also this season has made many mistakes that have cost goals. And at the same time he's one of the worst keepers in the league at everything else required from a goalkeeper.
 
Wibble said:
DDG will obviously start for us next season. Henderson will only be here if we can't sell.him. fairly pointless debating as even if one of the very few world class keepers were available we have far greater priorities.
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Really? Henderson wants games and will be pushing for a move if he’s not going to be guaranteed them. If we can’t sell him for a decent fee (which is actually what I’m expecting to happen), that indicates one of two things: either the people involved in our transfer business are even more incompetent than we already thought, or ETH believes that he’s worth giving a go.
 
I think 100% De Gea will be the first choice at the start of Ten Hag's reign, like Ronaldo he is a world-class at what he does, even if what he doesn't necessarily fit with the style of football Ten Hag is known for.
If your Ten Hag next season, with only likely to be a few players coming in and a very short spring season he isn't going to be able to make dramatic tactical changes that are going to be a slow process. So his best bet is to play the top players he has at his disposal in a system that suits them. Which is pretty much what he has said in interviews.

I would suspect over a few seasons (if Ten Hag is given the time) we will end up with a more sweeper-keeper taking over from De Gea. But that is no way a certainty as lots of rumors of De Gea getting a new deal.
 
Revaulx said:
Really? Henderson wants games and will be pushing for a move if he’s not going to be guaranteed them. If we can’t sell him for a decent fee (which is actually what I’m expecting to happen), that indicates one of two things: either the people involved in our transfer business are even more incompetent than we already thought, or ETH believes that he’s worth giving a go.
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Henderson is ok but nowhere near as good as DDG. He isn't the best keeper in the world but far from a priority to replace.
 
Wibble said:
Henderson is ok but nowhere near as good as DDG. He isn't the best keeper in the world but far from a priority to replace.
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Yeah I’m not sure. Maybe our flaky central defence could do with a more helpful keeper behind it as well as a less porous midfield ahead of it.

I’ll have no complaints if DDG is starting and Henderson is sold for a decent fee. I’m also not convinced that the former is incapable of improving if given clear instructions; I suspect it’s too late to get him coming off his line, but surely he can be told to cut out the aimless long punts that invariably lead to lost possession. He only started to do these by default under Jose, presumably by instruction as Jose didn’t care about keeping the ball.

I do reckon that discussions about what ETH will and won’t do have been driven by whether we like certain players or not. I’m not at all sure that the players that will improve under him are going to be those with large personal fan clubs. If it’s Dalot and Maguire instead of (say) Rashford and Sancho I can see it getting bloody on here.
 
I think you need a ball playing goalkeeper to compliment ETH's way of playing. Luckily enough there's a guy available at Chelsea for the right price.
 
I really don't understand our almost cult like mentality that supporters have for DDG. He is the GK version of Wan Bissaka, yet for some reason he gets a free pass because he was here for 10 years. Well duh, on those wages even the likes of Pogba have wasted the prime of their careers at our dead end club.

At the same time the idea that Henderson might be our No. 1 next season is viewed as a crazy idea. To me that is absolutely insane considering he was supposed to start our current season as the No. 1 if not for covid. Not saying he is the next VDS or Schmeichel, but at this point he is definitely an upgrade on De Gea.

I'm telling you people, De Gea will not survive past matchday 5 as an option. ETH is very uncompromising when it comes to his principles. He even bought a 38 year old Pasaveer last season when Stekeleburg got injured and Onana was suspended simply because the man wanted a GK that can sweep and distribute from the back.
 
Honestly the only argument against DDG at this point is his wages, yeah they are criminal but that's a United problem. Fair enough he doesn't fit ETH at all but neither do all of our full backs, midfielders, half our wingers, strikers or centre backs. At this point it really would be like prioritising a smoke alarm when the house is on fire.

Not his biggest fan personally and was against his big contract as it was during his horrendous 18 month form - but then realistically in this context his replacement is 2 or 3 summer windows away and buying one that can sweep and distribute may even have the opposite effect and make us worse if they can't actually stop shots, just look how many times he has saved the defense this season its inumerable.
 
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Newtonius said:
Honestly the only argument against DDG at this point is his wages
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Seriously?

Literally amongst the worst in the league
Claiming aerial balls
Dominating his box
Willingness to play as a sweeper-keeper, which helps the defence play a high line
Distribution
Communication with his defenders (based on both watching on tv myself and what people in the crowd have said)

One of the best in the league
Shot-stopping

That's it. He's fantastic at one aspect of goalkeeping (and even that he's not as good as he once was), while being poor or even downright terrible at every other aspect. There's many more arguments against DDG than just his wages (personally, while we are obviously overpaying him that doesn't come into it at all for me).
 
This is the most amazing thing I hear about DeGea that he is not coming out to sweep or for high balls. Yes he is weak in the air but if DeGea is instructed to come out, then he will come out or else he is gone. We have not played under a coach who wants to play the way the top coaches want to play.
DeGea passing it to Lindelof, Maguire, McTominay or Fred would give any coach a heart attack. 9 times out of 10 they are going to lose it. Thank God he doesn't try to pass to them.
 
Foxbatt said:
This is the most amazing thing I hear about DeGea that he is not coming out to sweep or for high balls. Yes he is weak in the air but if DeGea is instructed to come out, then he will come out or else he is gone. We have not played under a coach who wants to play the way the top coaches want to play.
DeGea passing it to Lindelof, Maguire, McTominay or Fred would give any coach a heart attack. 9 times out of 10 they are going to lose it. Thank God he doesn't try to pass to them.
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Come on, I think we can make a case for David without putting those guys down. Especially when they are better passers at their positions than De Gea. Maguire who I'm not a fan of for instance is so much better of a ballplayer than De Gea it's not even funny. If anyone is bringing anyone down it's more likely to be the other way round.
 
Goalkeeper is the last of the new managers worries.
 
Lets say that we chose to get rid of De Gea, who would you have there insted? I cant come up with one GK that is better and a realistic target. Specielly not when we need a CM, CDM, RB, CB, FWD and RW. He was togheter with Ronaldo our best player last season. This would be like trying to change the color on your car when the engine wont start.
 
SWE-Chucky said:
Lets say that we chose to get rid of De Gea, who would you have there insted? I cant come up with one GK that is better and a realistic target. Specielly not when we need a CM, CDM, RB, CB, FWD and RW. He was togheter with Ronaldo our best player last season. This would be like trying to change the color on your car when the engine wont start.
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How many goals did he concede last season?

Obviously he was not our best player last season.
 
Will be interesting to see ETH's approach if indeed De Gea is the #1 as expected this season.

Do you alter the way you play and basically lose a year of implementing one of your key principles in order to adapt to the GK you currently have to try and eliminate risk?

Or do you make him try to fit in with your style of play and risk it going badly and it impacting short-term success as a result?
 
devips said:
How many goals did he concede last season?

Obviously he was not our best player last season.
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Lets say we let teams shot at our goal 1000 times and he concedes 100 goals, and for example Ederson concedes 11 goal out of 100 shots. Is Ederson 10 times better?

Him conciding goals tells you very little, our defense was a joke last season, 3 out of 4 in our defense that we before the season began were sure would be in the starting eleven (AWB, Maguire and Shaw) had their worst season ever probably and the world class CL Varane picked up a injury every 4-5 weeks.

De Gea ball stopping abilites are still world class, even though he had 2 bad years before last season. Our and his biggest problem with Ten Hag as a manager will be his passing skills because Ten Hag values that very high and thats De Geas weakest part of the game.
 
devips said:
How many goals did he concede last season?

Obviously he was not our best player last season.
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Which player consistently came out for interviews after those losses you suffered and all those poor performances? Who owned up to mistakes and regularly admitted it wasn’t good enough? It wasn’t your captain.

Sure he is not anywhere near his peak but he is still a decent keeper. You concede goals as a team and when you have clowns in front of you then you are going to concede more. I fail to see any keeper in the World looking good during the season you just had.

He will be number one next season and it’s delusional to think otherwise.
 
He’ll be the only first team keeper in the squad
 
I'd love to see the club monitoring the young Irish keeper Gavin Bazunu, who Southampton have just bought from Man City.

He's only turned 20 a few months ago, and he's gonna be a great one imo.
 
Caesar2290 said:
On the interesting things I noticed on the caf recently is that most people predict that DDG will be the starting GK under ETH. I don't understand this logic. You either haven't watched ETH's teams or you vastly overstate DDG's abilities.
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Given, I'm presuming, ETH has watched a lot of his own teams. One must also presume that he vastly overrates DDG now right?

 
The 2017-18 season saw the side’s xGA increase dramatically (look at the big spike between the 10th and 30th games of that campaign). United got away with it thanks to the brilliance of De Gea, who, statistically, performed at all-time-great levels. They would have likely conceded 14 extra goals and finished fifth that season if they had a league-average goalkeeper.
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I know it's a while ago but the bolded part. People forget just how good a keeper he is and can be. 14 points saved. I reckon over several seasons since, he's saved minimum of 6-9 per season.
 
Murder on Zidane's Floor said:
I know it's a while ago but the bolded part. People forget just how good a keeper he is and can be. 14 points saved. I reckon over several seasons since, he's saved minimum of 6-9 per season.
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He was very good in 17/18 (his best ever season IMO), but in the three seasons after that I'd be very surprised if he wasn't a net negative. He cost us so many goals and played a big part in knocking us out of so many competitions in those three years it was terrible, and that's not even going into all the things like dealing with crosses, sweeping, distribution, controlling his box, etc, which would have reduced the amount of shots that he would have faced.
 
dinostar77 said:
Yep, its idiotic. We have a world class keeper. But some folk are never happy.
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Oh, we'll see how much this world class keeper will shine when he will have to deal with crosses into the box, sweep behind the high line, etc

Just because EtH is giving everyone a clean slate, doesn't mean Jones is going to be our starter CB. Who's to say he won't do a Malacia once he realizes who is between the sticks. Let's wait and see.

P.S. A world class GK that can't get into his national side ahead of some rando's grom Brighton and Hove. :lol:
 
Caesar2290 said:
Oh, we'll see how much this world class keeper will shine when he will have to deal with crosses into the box, sweep behind the high line, etc

Just because EtH is giving everyone a clean slate, doesn't mean Jones is going to be our starter CB. Who's to say he won't do a Malacia once he realizes who is between the sticks. Let's wait and see.

P.S. A world class GK that can't get into his national side ahead of some rando's grom Brighton and Hove. :lol:
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Honestly baffled at people calling De Gea world class. He's bottom of the PL for defensive actions outside of his box, crosses dealt with, and distribution. How can you be world class when you're awful at multiple fundamentals for a goalkeeper?

De Gea's reactive goalkeeping style and his lack of/poor involvement in the play is a big problem for us.
 
CloneMC16 said:
Honestly baffled at people calling De Gea world class. He's bottom of the PL for defensive actions outside of his box, crosses dealt with, and distribution. How can you be world class when you're awful at multiple fundamentals for a goalkeeper?

De Gea's reactive goalkeeping style and his lack of/poor involvement in the play is a big problem for us.
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I've posted numerous stats on here for a quiet a while, but we look better as a defensive unit with Henderson between the sticks. That should tell you something about DDG's world class status when an average PL GK makes the team better than you.

Now imagine if we actually had a really good GK. I'm fairly certain a lot of our defensive issues that have been plaguing us for the last 10 years would be fixed over night.

Alas, we're not there yet. There is still hope. According to new reports, EtH already wants to offload 9 players, so who knows...
 
MadDogg said:
He was very good in 17/18 (his best ever season IMO), but in the three seasons after that I'd be very surprised if he wasn't a net negative. He cost us so many goals and played a big part in knocking us out of so many competitions in those three years it was terrible, and that's not even going into all the things like dealing with crosses, sweeping, distribution, controlling his box, etc, which would have reduced the amount of shots that he would have faced.
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I really never saw this, I just think his level regressed to the league average but as he was playing such a high level, the difference was shocking so we think he was rubbish. Plus the team was utterly pony most weeks, the man can only do so much.

I get he isn't prime Neuer but the disrespect on the guy is insane.
 
I'm concerned by the GK situation, I was hoping ETH might at least look at Henderson before signing of on a loan deal for him, looks like ETH has commited to De gea being the number one this season and that spells the usual wobbly defensive issue that we have seen throughout De Gea's time here a problem that will be massively exaggerated if we play with a high line which we saw last season.

I wonder how long de gea will last as no1? The problem is if we don't sign another quality GK, we don't really have a good enough replacement to take over as No1.

Looks like I am resigned to another season of asking where the feck is de gea numerous times a game, wondering why were getting penned in by average teams as our defenders attempt to clear evey ball into the box with de gea stood on the line shouting AWAY! at a ball he should be dealing with. Can't wait.
 
Murder on Zidane's Floor said:
I really never saw this, I just think his level regressed to the league average but as he was playing such a high level, the difference was shocking so we think he was rubbish. Plus the team was utterly pony most weeks, the man can only do so much.

I get he isn't prime Neuer but the disrespect on the guy is insane.
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Nah, he was a huge issue for us during those three seasons.

18/19 his form was average most of the season, then his utter collapse in the last month or two of the season was probably the biggest reason we didn't overtake the stuttering Tottenham and Arsenal for the 4th CL position.
19/20 he was quite poor in the league and made huge mistakes for 3 of the 5 goals he conceded in the FA Cup and Europa League semi-finals that we proceeded to lose.
20/21 he was poor in the league again, and also made a huge mistake in the 3rd goal we conceded against Leipzig (the goal that ultimately knocked us out of the CL). His positioning was poor for the first goal in that game as well, but it wasn't as clear-cut a mistake as the others.

He was somewhat back to form last season, but the three seasons before that even his shot-stopping was below average. Considering every other aspect of his game is poor, he caused us so many problems those seasons.
 
Absurd thread. Dave will be our regular starting keeper this season, quite deservedly so.
 
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