Who you rate the highest Pep, Klopp or Tuchel?

Regulus Arcturus Black said:
That’s not exactly scientific though, considering Tuchel took over an infinitely better squad than Klopp.
A new manager coming into United now and quickly turning us around and making us consistent wouldn’t be proof either of “turning it around quicker”.
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@RedRonaldo has a point I think. Tuchel is the most flexible regarding the style of play he implements, he will find a way to get something out of any squad. Guardiola and Klopp do have a bit more "identity" to their teams and may require some transfers to change the squad.
 
Has there ever been a coach as dominant as Pep?

I know he hasn't won many CLs but purely in terms of dominating any opponent (even direct rivals), is there anyone his equal?
 
Dr. StrangeHate said:
Has there ever been a coach as dominant as Pep?

I know he hasn't won many CLs but purely in terms of dominating any opponent (even direct rivals), is there anyone his equal?
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Do mean in terms of tactics? He’s probably the most possession obsessed coach I can think of as I’m too young to have known Cruyff, LVG, Michels in their pomp.

His head to heads are actually quite poor when you think he’s always in the best seat. For his domestic rivals he’s got an inferior record versus Tuchel and Klopp & was even with Ole…I guess he’s now even with Poch at PSG.
 
tomaldinho1 said:
Do mean in terms of tactics? He’s probably the most possession obsessed coach I can think of as I’m too young to have known Cruyff, LVG, Michels in their pomp.

His head to heads are actually quite poor when you think he’s always in the best seat. For his domestic rivals he’s got an inferior record versus Tuchel and Klopp & was even with Ole…I guess he’s now even with Poch at PSG.
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Tactics and eye test basically. I have rarely seen Pep properly outplayed.
 
Dr. StrangeHate said:
Tactics and eye test basically. I have rarely seen Pep properly outplayed.
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Yeah it’s super rare, although it depends on how you define being outplayed because it almost never happens that he won’t have the most possession but, for example, Real beat his Bayern team 5-0 on aggregate in the CL.
 
Dr. StrangeHate said:
Tactics and eye test basically. I have rarely seen Pep properly outplayed.
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I mean, just this season, he's gone to Anfield and Stamford Bridge, and for vast periods in both games, made the home teams (world class, elite sides with elite managers) look like Stoke hanging on for a point.

For all his flaws and valid criticisms (can he do it at Norwich is not one of them), it's something that's stood out to me as a distinct quality of his. You get it with Barcelona, he has prime Messaviesta... go look at his current team and tell me they have a divine right to dictate play to such extent, with a straight face. Yeah, that Rodri fella from Simeone's Atletico and Silva guy from Jardim's Monaco... So good at strangling possession. Whatever he does in training (rondos!!!), it works.
 
Unfortunately Klopp and it's not even close. He has done way more with a more limited squad of players
 
Yet I don't think any supporter of these clubs would swap their manager for one of the others.
 
They are all psycho but yeah it’s Klopp for me. Think you need to be a little bit psycho to be the very best.
 
It fully depends on the squad.

I think if Pep was coaching these United players he’d quickly be carried out of Carrington in a straitjacket chanting “so happy, so happy” over and over.
 
KingCavani said:
It fully depends on the squad.

I think if Pep was coaching these United players he’d quickly be carried out of Carrington in a straitjacket chanting “so happy, so happy” over and over.
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They'll be playing a way better brand of football and would have won trophies IMO.
 
Gringo said:
Yet I don't think any supporter of these clubs would swap their manager for one of the others.
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I know a few city fans who would. But they are an odd bunch. I doubt I could find any Chelsea or Liverpool fans who would though.
 
I have to say that no manager has ever impressed me as Tuchel. Pep and Klopp are great, but Tuchel is amazing. I just hope that Tuchel is not great for a long time as players get sick of him and start to rebel. That's our only hope or Tuchel will reign supreme at Chelsea for foreseeable future.
 
adexkola said:
I mean, just this season, he's gone to Anfield and Stamford Bridge, and for vast periods in both games, made the home teams (world class, elite sides with elite managers) look like Stoke hanging on for a point.

For all his flaws and valid criticisms (can he do it at Norwich is not one of them), it's something that's stood out to me as a distinct quality of his. You get it with Barcelona, he has prime Messaviesta... go look at his current team and tell me they have a divine right to dictate play to such extent, with a straight face. Yeah, that Rodri fella from Simeone's Atletico and Silva guy from Jardim's Monaco... So good at strangling possession. Whatever he does in training (rondos!!!), it works.
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He has a supreme set of training methods, which tend to dominate the opposition but he has also an almost unlimited ability to stack his squad and find the right players (i.e it gives him multiple chances and solutions) to implement it.

Imagine if Klopp was able to replace Wijnaldum with Rodri, Milner with Grealish, Matip with Dias, Shaqiri with Sane/Silva/Mahrez etc season after season.

I'm not sure Pep's team would fair so well against Klopp (who has his number anyways) or others if the spending playing field was level.

At any other club, Pep's current team today would be still be relying on Bernado Silva, Laporte, Fernandinho and KDB as the first choice squad and not the names mentioned above who are certified replacements and/or first class rotation options.
 
Tuchel even the players Chelsea would have considered fringe he's making use out of them. Chelsea look a typical well drilled, well coached and disciplined team. Not the most possession crazy football but very effective in attacking phases. Out of the German newcomers Tuchel has blown Naglesman and Rose out the park. Best manager in world football today.

Klopp I feel would be more effective if allocated more resources. It's not mentioned much but I think FSG give the Glazers are close run for inept management.
 
criticalanalysis said:
He has a supreme set of training methods, which tend to dominate the opposition but he has also an almost unlimited ability to stack his squad and find the right players (i.e it gives him multiple chances and solutions) to implement it.

Imagine if Klopp was able to replace Wijnaldum with Rodri, Milner with Grealish, Matip with Dias, Shaqiri with Sane/Silva/Mahrez etc season after season.

I'm not sure Pep's team would fair so well against Klopp (who has his number anyways) or others if the spending playing field was level.

At any other club, Pep's current team today would be still be relying on Bernado Silva, Laporte, Fernandinho and KDB as the first choice squad and not the names mentioned above who are certified replacements and/or first class rotation options.
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I know City squad is bigger with better quality but Liverpool have their Rodri, Dias, Grealish in Fabinho, Konate, Thiago, Naby Keita, etc.

People always try to paint that Liverpool squad as similar to the Watfords of this world. I’m not having that.
 
passing-wind said:
Tuchel even the players Chelsea would have considered fringe he's making use out of them. Chelsea look a typical well drilled, well coached and disciplined team. Not the most possession crazy football but very effective in attacking phases. Out of the German newcomers Tuchel has blown Naglesman and Rose out the park. Best manager in world football today.

Klopp I feel would be more effective if allocated more resources. It's not mentioned much but I think FSG give the Glazers are close run for inept management.
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When did this happen?
 
P-Ro said:
I know a few city fans who would. But they are an odd bunch. I doubt I could find any Chelsea or Liverpool fans who would though.
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To be fair I can understand them. They want the CL title and Pep has not won that in a long time, Tuchel and Klopp recently have.
 
passing-wind said:
Tuchel even the players Chelsea would have considered fringe he's making use out of them. Chelsea look a typical well drilled, well coached and disciplined team. Not the most possession crazy football but very effective in attacking phases. Out of the German newcomers Tuchel has blown Naglesman and Rose out the park. Best manager in world football today.

Klopp I feel would be more effective if allocated more resources. It's not mentioned much but I think FSG give the Glazers are close run for inept management.
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Completely different ownership models and approaches. FSG get some online abuse (Twitter crybabies) for not forking out regularly on big signings but they work very well with Klopp and the Director of Football, Michael Edwards. The data-driven approach has reaped rewards - steeped in a long-term strategy; less inclined to go for sticking plater solutions. This can frustrate fans who use transfer windows as the mark of success rather than on-field performance.

FSG bought Liverpool for a song after the debacle of the last owners and have added incredible value to the football club, revolutionising the commercial side for things as well as 'being there' when on-field fortunes have turned around markedly. Anfield is a totally different ground to what it was when they took it over - very different to the relic that Old Trafford has become due to the lack of investment in the structure (this is not a cheap dig, I'm basing it on what match-going Utd fans say).

The pernicious elements of the Glazer's - imposing debt onto the clubs, taking huge dividends etc - are not key characteristics of FSG. That said, FSG have made some big missteps over the year - Super League being the main one - but comparisons with the Glazers seems a bit lazy when you analyse how they operate and run the clubs. FSG are much 'healthier' owners.
 
stefan92 said:
To be fair I can understand them. They want the CL title and Pep has not won that in a long time, Tuchel and Klopp recently have.
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Most of them say they don't even care about the CL. They just think he's a bellend and the fact that he's mentioned empty seats in his interviews has really pissed them off.
 
Bearded One said:
I know City squad is bigger with better quality but Liverpool have their Rodri, Dias, Grealish in Fabinho, Konate, Thiago, Naby Keita, etc.

People always try to paint that Liverpool squad as similar to the Watfords of this world. I’m not having that.
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Yup, Thiago missed 35% of his games at Bayern due to injuries, Konate in the last 2 years has missed 46 games due to injuries and Chamberlain if I'm not mistaken also missed a lot at Arsenal due to injuries. They're problem is they've target players who had injury concern and now are dealing with that, which they're scouting department should've notice, either they bought them because of Klopp or both parties agreed on these targets.
 
P-Ro said:
Most of them say they don't even care about the CL. They just think he's a bellend and the fact that he's mentioned empty seats in his interviews has really pissed them off.
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And that he constantly talks up Barca. Like with the Agüero move.
 
norm87cro said:
Unfortunately Klopp and it's not even close. He has done way more with a more limited squad of players
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And he spent 40M on Konate who played just 4 times in PL+CL so far. YOu can have all the money in the world but that won't you gurantee success (Ole).
 
Tuchel is not in this contest for me. His teams are much more playable. They are not as intense out of possession and it inevitably allows you to get more of a foothold in the game.

on their day, both Klopp and Pep canrun you ragged both in and out of possession for 90 minutes. Neither coach accommodates ego and demands work rate and commitment all across the pitch First. Watching players with the talent of Bernardo and Mahrez etc busting a gut in the 70th minute of a match last nightreally highlighted our basic limitations. We look tired after 20 minutes in comparison. Klopp and Pep make thoroughly ordinary players into integral parts of a jigsaw...we make incredibly talented players look lazy and ineffective.

Tuchel seems more functional as a coach with teams less likely to go to war for him. However in a one off final, Tuchel‘s adaptability would cause me more concern. At least with Pep and Klopp you know exactly what you’re coming up against.
 
captaincantona said:
Tuchel is not in this contest for me. His teams are much more playable. They are not as intense out of possession and it inevitably allows you to get more of a foothold in the game.

on their day, both Klopp and Pep canrun you ragged both in and out of possession for 90 minutes. Neither coach accommodates ego and demands work rate and commitment all across the pitch First. Watching players with the talent of Bernardo and Mahrez etc busting a gut in the 70th minute of a match last nightreally highlighted our basic limitations. We look tired after 20 minutes in comparison. Klopp and Pep make thoroughly ordinary players into integral parts of a jigsaw...we make incredibly talented players look lazy and ineffective.

Tuchel seems more functional as a coach with teams less likely to go to war for him. However in a one off final, Tuchel‘s adaptability would cause me more concern. At least with Pep and Klopp you know exactly what you’re coming up against.
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This thread just include tuchel to just belittle him. He will get eligibility to come into it only after winning the pl. So no comparison as of now. Yet I won't take either pep or Klopp to manage chelsea right now.

Tuchel more suited to our over all set up. Has adaptability and aim is to win now and improving the squad he got.

I don't know what you are talking about intense and chelsea are playable but Klopp or pep not.On our day we too unplayable not even allow opponents a shot on target. City found it in cl final liverpool found it last season. So not sure what do you mean.
 
Klopp and Pep are better than Tuchel.

Playing attacking football and still being this good defensively is a lot more difficult than what people like to believe.
 
I think Pep is an absolute machine. His intensity and ability to make his players understand a system is unmatched. He'll go down as an absolute great. He could do with winning a couple more Champions Leagues though - he's maybe missing that cutting edge sometimes.. He almost needs to just suck it up and buy a couple of total cnuts - a Ronaldo or Haaland up front would make such a difference to his City team.

Klopp is like a modern day SAF in my mind. A man manager with a system based as much on determination and belief as it is tactics.

Hard to choose between them - prefer Klopp's style of management, but totally respect how Pep has revolutionised (is that going too far?!) the game.

Tuchel I don't really know much about. Carrick is obviously up there too....
 
Dr. StrangeHate said:
Has there ever been a coach as dominant as Pep?

I know he hasn't won many CLs but purely in terms of dominating any opponent (even direct rivals), is there anyone his equal?
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It’s an interesting question. But he’s won two CLs. That’s as much as any manager in history apart from 3 guys. So I wouldn’t say that he hasn’t won many CLs. I mean he’s won more than Klopp and Tuchel for starters.
 
Rajiztar said:
This thread just include tuchel to just belittle him. He will get eligibility to come into it only after winning the pl. So no comparison as of now. Yet I won't take either pep or Klopp to manage chelsea right now.

Tuchel more suited to our over all set up. Has adaptability and aim is to win now and improving the squad he got.

I don't know what you are talking about intense and chelsea are playable but Klopp or pep not.On our day we too unplayable not even allow opponents a shot on target. City found it in cl final liverpool found it last season. So not sure what do you mean.
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Honestly, I wouldn't think too much about it. The simple fact that he has forced Chelsea into the same sentences as City and Liverpool in the short period of time he has been with us is a testament of the awesome work he has done so far and his managerial capabilities. Tuchel will always be underrated regardless of what he achieves, fine by us, as long as we are the ones benefiting from those achievements.
 
Rajiztar said:
This thread just include tuchel to just belittle him. He will get eligibility to come into it only after winning the pl. So no comparison as of now. Yet I won't take either pep or Klopp to manage chelsea right now.

Tuchel more suited to our over all set up. Has adaptability and aim is to win now and improving the squad he got.

I don't know what you are talking about intense and chelsea are playable but Klopp or pep not.On our day we too unplayable not even allow opponents a shot on target. City found it in cl final liverpool found it last season. So not sure what do you mean.
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First- I am in no way criticising Tuchel...Definitely on Chelseas day they are unplayable but they will not dictate the game against City or Liverpool...they will not dominate...they will set up to counter the approach of the other team. Klopp and Pep just go out and play their own game regardless of the opponent for the part...

So maybe that could be seen as a limitation and I guess has been one of the few valid criticisms of Pep...that he has no plan B...where as Tuchel will adapt and find a way...Klopp and Pep are stubborn and play their ways regardless.

but when your way of playing is that good...it would seem silly not to trust it.

As regards Tuchel specifically...it’s early days...very early days...and his personality is not easy to live with when things don’t go to plan ( plenty of documented incidents of this) and so while I enjoy watching Chelsea now...if success doesn’t continue and Abramovich starts getting antsy...we might see a different Tuchel and a different Chelsea. You’re still in your honeymoon period...just enjoy it!
 
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